Seb Ross

[BarryGrogan]

Barry,

If you believe EFL and A Grade Ammos is Park footy you are are clueless. Best footy outside the VFL (semi professional) in Victoria

I played with and against numerous ex or soon to be AFL players and a lot of players on up to $1000 a game (and that was 20 years ago). And I played in the TFL, WAFL and SFL in the early to mid 90s and Teal Cup.

Not exactly Park Footy

Did you ever have a kick?

I seriously doubt you ever played a game of competition footy because you haven’t got the first idea

EFL and the ammos are park footy.


I actually find it really sad when old blokes talk about their footy 'careers' like playing park footy actually holds any relevance to anything.

It's genuinely sad. It says a lot about a person.

<1 day ban for baiting>

[The_Dud]

Barry,

If you believe EFL and A Grade Ammos is Park footy you are are clueless. Best footy outside the VFL (semi professional) in Victoria

I played with and against numerous ex or soon to be AFL players and a lot of players on up to $1000 a game (and that was 20 years ago). And I played in the TFL, WAFL and SFL in the early to mid 90s and Teal Cup.

Not exactly Park Footy

Did you ever have a kick?

I seriously doubt you ever played a game of competition footy because you haven’t got the first idea

I actually find it really sad when old blokes talk about their footy 'careers' like playing park footy actually holds any relevance to anything.

It's genuinely sad.

Just wait til he starts on his park cricket career!

<1 day ban for baiting>

[The_Dud]

Last couple of things on Seb

Coaches votes
Those mentioned are Top 10 players in comp that has 400 players running around every week. They are the very Elite!

Coaches votes are normally led by either absolute Jets or players from winning teams as they get the most votes.

I would say that Seb again being 1 vote from the highest stk vote getter and polling 35 in a team that won 9 shows his impact? Sort of consolidates my position?!

And, Nearly all replies are
IMOs and are based on perceptions of fans with little evidence of their conclusion. Other than their judgement, which lacks evidence and information.

ANY team would consider a player that gets 28 at 72% with 3 clangers and 6 clearances 9CP and 19UP as a more than good player and he would walk into any team. His actual output ranks him with most AFL Mids, just his profile does not, because we are not a power club.
If a fourth or fifth mid at any club got those numbers, bloody hell.

He is not elite, as they are consistently genuine match winners. But he is a consistently good inside mid, who gets his job done most weeks (along with Steele)

Very underrated and unappreciated

As we can see reading some of the replies on this thread!!!

More dancing around 2 simple arguments, that’s a white flag if I’ve ever seen one!

Alarmingly low goals per game numbers automatically rule him out of A-grade talk. Solid B-grader tho, and will benefit when some stars come in / emerge and he doesn’t have to be the top dog anymore.

Case closed

[The Barometer]

Last couple of things on Seb

Coaches votes
Those mentioned are Top 10 players in comp that has 400 players running around every week. They are the very Elite!

Coaches votes are normally led by either absolute Jets or players from winning teams as they get the most votes.

I would say that Seb again being 1 vote from the highest stk vote getter and polling 35 in a team that won 9 shows his impact? Sort of consolidates my position?!

And, Nearly all replies are
IMOs and are based on perceptions of fans with little evidence of their conclusion. Other than their judgement, which lacks evidence and information.

ANY team would consider a player that gets 28 at 72% with 3 clangers and 6 clearances 9CP and 19UP as a more than good player and he would walk into any team. His actual output ranks him with most AFL Mids, just his profile does not, because we are not a power club.
If a fourth or fifth mid at any club got those numbers, bloody hell.

He is not elite, as they are consistently genuine match winners. But he is a consistently good inside mid, who gets his job done most weeks (along with Steele)

Very underrated and unappreciated

As we can see reading some of the replies on this thread!!!

So basically you agree with most on this thread that Seb is a good player but not elite.
What I don’t get is that you still think he is under appreciated and underrated. Can you provide some examples?

[saynta]

Last couple of things on Seb

Coaches votes
Those mentioned are Top 10 players in comp that has 400 players running around every week. They are the very Elite!

Coaches votes are normally led by either absolute Jets or players from winning teams as they get the most votes.

I would say that Seb again being 1 vote from the highest stk vote getter and polling 35 in a team that won 9 shows his impact? Sort of consolidates my position?!

And, Nearly all replies are
IMOs and are based on perceptions of fans with little evidence of their conclusion. Other than their judgement, which lacks evidence and information.

ANY team would consider a player that gets 28 at 72% with 3 clangers and 6 clearances 9CP and 19UP as a more than good player and he would walk into any team. His actual output ranks him with most AFL Mids, just his profile does not, because we are not a power club.
If a fourth or fifth mid at any club got those numbers, bloody hell.

He is not elite, as they are consistently genuine match winners. But he is a consistently good inside mid, who gets his job done most weeks (along with Steele)

Very underrated and unappreciated

As we can see reading some of the replies on this thread!!!

So basically you agree with most on this thread that Seb is a good player but not elite.
What I don’t get is that you still think he is under appreciated and underrated. Can you provide some examples?

Exhibit 'A' this thread.

f****** Internet. Everyone has an opinion and everyone thinks they are an expert.

Will be the death of civil communications as we know them to be. Oh for the good old days when "supporters" truly supported their team and only put s*** on other teams but not their own.


sigh.

[happy feet]

Last couple of things on Seb

Coaches votes
Those mentioned are Top 10 players in comp that has 400 players running around every week. They are the very Elite!

Coaches votes are normally led by either absolute Jets or players from winning teams as they get the most votes.

I would say that Seb again being 1 vote from the highest stk vote getter and polling 35 in a team that won 9 shows his impact? Sort of consolidates my position?!

And, Nearly all replies are
IMOs and are based on perceptions of fans with little evidence of their conclusion. Other than their judgement, which lacks evidence and information.

ANY team would consider a player that gets 28 at 72% with 3 clangers and 6 clearances 9CP and 19UP as a more than good player and he would walk into any team. His actual output ranks him with most AFL Mids, just his profile does not, because we are not a power club.
If a fourth or fifth mid at any club got those numbers, bloody hell.

He is not elite, as they are consistently genuine match winners. But he is a consistently good inside mid, who gets his job done most weeks (along with Steele)

Very underrated and unappreciated

As we can see reading some of the replies on this thread!!!

So basically you agree with most on this thread that Seb is a good player but not elite.
What I don’t get is that you still think he is under appreciated and underrated. Can you provide some examples?

Exhibit 'A' this thread.

f****** Internet. Everyone has an opinion and everyone thinks they are an expert.

Will be the death of civil communications as we know them to be. Oh for the good old days when "supporters" truly supported their team and only put s*** on other teams but not their own.


sigh.

It’s why I very rarely visit this forum or post anymore. It’s been hijacked by a couple of posters who are over opinionated, are never wrong and a constantly on here. For goodness sake get a life, go and volunteer and help someone less fortunate if you have so much time.

[To the top]

You have to feel for BM

From a legend in his own back yard to living on an internet site

On an Internet site with anonymity you can present as whatever

Hence you do not

[happy feet]

You have to feel for BM

From a legend in his own back yard to living on an internet site

On an Internet site with anonymity you can present as whatever

Hence you do not

Careful, you will get a threatening and abusive email.

[To the top]

And to state to me what is the bleeding obvious, as a side with the record of St Kilda, we need to improve

And you improve by improving your player resource

The first steps are to have our Captain and B&F winner recognised also as being among the elite players of the competition

[The Barometer]

Barry,

If you believe EFL and A Grade Ammos is Park footy you are are clueless. Best footy outside the VFL (semi professional) in Victoria

I played with and against numerous ex or soon to be AFL players and a lot of players on up to $1000 a game (and that was 20 years ago). And I played in the TFL, WAFL and SFL in the early to mid 90s and Teal Cup.

Not exactly Park Footy

Did you ever have a kick?

I seriously doubt you ever played a game of competition footy because you haven’t got the first idea

EFL and the ammos are park footy.


I actually find it really sad when old blokes talk about their footy 'careers' like playing park footy actually holds any relevance to anything.

It's genuinely sad. It says a lot about a person.

Absolutely. There are smart intelligent analytical types struggled to actually play the game as they aren’t naturally sportspeople.
On the flip side there are of people who played the game but are poor analysts who struggle to piece together an intelligent and persuasive argument.

[The_Dud]

Last couple of things on Seb

Coaches votes
Those mentioned are Top 10 players in comp that has 400 players running around every week. They are the very Elite!

Coaches votes are normally led by either absolute Jets or players from winning teams as they get the most votes.

I would say that Seb again being 1 vote from the highest stk vote getter and polling 35 in a team that won 9 shows his impact? Sort of consolidates my position?!

And, Nearly all replies are
IMOs and are based on perceptions of fans with little evidence of their conclusion. Other than their judgement, which lacks evidence and information.

ANY team would consider a player that gets 28 at 72% with 3 clangers and 6 clearances 9CP and 19UP as a more than good player and he would walk into any team. His actual output ranks him with most AFL Mids, just his profile does not, because we are not a power club.
If a fourth or fifth mid at any club got those numbers, bloody hell.

He is not elite, as they are consistently genuine match winners. But he is a consistently good inside mid, who gets his job done most weeks (along with Steele)

Very underrated and unappreciated

As we can see reading some of the replies on this thread!!!

So basically you agree with most on this thread that Seb is a good player but not elite.
What I don’t get is that you still think he is under appreciated and underrated. Can you provide some examples?

Exhibit 'A' this thread.

f****** Internet. Everyone has an opinion and everyone thinks they are an expert.

Will be the death of civil communications as we know them to be. Oh for the good old days when "supporters" truly supported their team and only put s*** on other teams but not their own.


sigh.

Gee whiz, and people call the current generation snowflakes...

There’s nothing wrong with a bit of constructive criticism and not accepting mediocrity. The modern day footballer knows they’re going to be challenged.

The one who cracked the sads and started to get personal was BM (and his hangers-on) when a few people dared to not agree with his opinion... talk about some fragile egos.

[skeptic]

It simply never ceases to amaze me how ppl can be so against the expression of opinions on a fan forum...

The death of civil communication... bloody hell Saynta.

This has actually all in all been a civil discussion where people have generally discussed Ross’ ability/performance without actively attacking him or getting personal.

I would say the death of civil communication would be bashing a POV and making broader statements about the internet and society because opinions are different to yours whilst not actually contributing yourself... like how you’ve done this thread

[Secret Kiel]

Does anyone think Seb could be captain?

[The_Dud]

Does anyone think Seb could be captain?

Yep, like I said earlier he was my pick before last season.

But ideally another young leader will emerge who can lead the Saints for the next decade, like Roo did.

[The Barometer]

Does anyone think Seb could be captain?

Yes. I reckon he should be this years captain.

[CQ SAINT]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

What it proves objectively, is that the coaches, both ours and the opposition, don't rate Seb Ross any higher than most of our top ten contributors when it comes to performance in
games. The bulk of his votes came in 3 outstanding performances in which we beat lower ranked teams decisively with better midfield play from our whole group. Wow!.
It also indicates that the idea that he is an A grade footballer is childish and the incessant bleating that the coaches think he is, is ill informed and naive.
It is also a childish reaction to deflate all the players efforts because Ross's isn't voted as outstanding.
If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

[saynta]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

If one looks "objectively at the number of coaches votes Seb received and the number of votes he received to win the B and F it is obvious to all but the dullards amongst us that Seb is a consistently good footballer across the whole season. To critisise his performances to win those awards over the past three years reflects badly on the author, not on Seb.

[magnifisaint]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

BM brings it upon himself.
Loves an argument and wont back down. Is very timesone to see messages quoted and requoted.

[saynta]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

BM brings it upon himself.
Loves an argument and wont back down. Is very timesone to see messages quoted and requoted.

Maybe. Sure BM doesn't accept that his opinions might be wrong and not widely shared, but neither do those who disagree with him. The offensiveness is not one sided nor restricted to BM as anyone who agrees with him is added to the insult list.

Not trying to be offensive myself but I don't know what "timesone "is. I suppose you mean "tiresome" which could apply to numerous posts in this thread.

i don't believe BM was trying to cause a s*** storm when he posted the OP.

"

[CQ SAINT]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

BM brings it upon himself.
Loves an argument and wont back down. Is very timesone to see messages quoted and requoted.

Maybe. Sure BM doesn't accept that his opinions might be wrong and not widely shared, but neither do those who disagree with him. The offensiveness is not one sided nor restricted to BM as anyone who agrees with him is added to the insult list.

Not trying to be offensive myself but I don't know what "timesone "is. I suppose you mean "tiresome" which could apply to numerous posts in this thread.

i don't believe BM was trying to cause a s*** storm when he posted the OP.

"

I'm not sure if BM has been offended by anything I have written. I doubt he has actually taken in a lot of what I have written. He hasn't said so, but with you to speak for him Saynta, he doesn't have to. I similarly am.not offended by anything BM has posted. Why would I be?

[CQ SAINT]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

If one looks "objectively at the number of coaches votes Seb received and the number of votes he received to win the B and F it is obvious to all but the dullards amongst us that Seb is a consistently good footballer across the whole season. To critisise his performances to win those awards over the past three years reflects badly on the author, not on Seb.

I never said that Seb wasn't a consistent good performer. That was never the argument. I reject the notion.that he is our best footballer or an A grade footballer or an AA representative. There is actual statistical analysis that supports my position on this. He is our most prolific disposal accumulator but clearly that, due to the analysis mentioned above, doesnt make him A grade or AA. it is really that simple. I wont retract that because it offends you or BM to have it pointed out.

[saynta]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

BM brings it upon himself.
Loves an argument and wont back down. Is very timesone to see messages quoted and requoted.

Maybe. Sure BM doesn't accept that his opinions might be wrong and not widely shared, but neither do those who disagree with him. The offensiveness is not one sided nor restricted to BM as anyone who agrees with him is added to the insult list.

Not trying to be offensive myself but I don't know what "timesone "is. I suppose you mean "tiresome" which could apply to numerous posts in this thread.

i don't believe BM was trying to cause a s*** storm when he posted the OP.

"

I'm not sure if BM has been offended by anything I have written. I doubt he has actually taken in a lot of what I have written. He hasn't said so, but with you to speak for him Saynta, he doesn't have to. I similarly am.not offended by anything BM has posted. Why would I be?

I didn' t particularly have you in mind because I have little memory of your posts replying to BM

I do however have certain views about the usual suspects who enjoy putting s*** on and denigrating BM 's sporting achievements in both football and cricket.

To me they are impressive and therefore give me some confidence that he has some idea about his subjects.

I would think some of his critics have never been on a sporting field in any capacity other than as a spectator in their lives.

I know BM doesn't need me to speak for him and I don't presume to do so, but I don't like any poster being ganged up on when their views are credible.

Also his views on Seb are more in keeping with mine.

[CQ SAINT]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

BM brings it upon himself.
Loves an argument and wont back down. Is very timesone to see messages quoted and requoted.

Maybe. Sure BM doesn't accept that his opinions might be wrong and not widely shared, but neither do those who disagree with him. The offensiveness is not one sided nor restricted to BM as anyone who agrees with him is added to the insult list.

Not trying to be offensive myself but I don't know what "timesone "is. I suppose you mean "tiresome" which could apply to numerous posts in this thread.

i don't believe BM was trying to cause a s*** storm when he posted the OP.

"

I'm not sure if BM has been offended by anything I have written. I doubt he has actually taken in a lot of what I have written. He hasn't said so, but with you to speak for him Saynta, he doesn't have to. I similarly am.not offended by anything BM has posted. Why would I be?

I didn' t particularly have you in mind because I have little memory of your posts replying to BM

I do however have certain views about the usual suspects who enjoy putting s*** on and denigrating BM 's sporting achievements in both football and cricket.

To me they are impressive and therefore give me some confidence that he has some idea about his subjects.

I would think some of his critics have never been on a sporting field in any capacity other than as a spectator in their lives.

I know BM doesn't need me to speak for him and I don't presume to do so, but I don't like any poster being ganged up on when their views are credible.

Also his views on Seb are more in keeping with mine.

That's funny, quite a few of your posts have quoted mine and you directly accused me of being offensive to BM. Bloody tricky this internetty webbo thing hey Saynta.

[saynta]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

If one looks "objectively at the number of coaches votes Seb received and the number of votes he received to win the B and F it is obvious to all but the dullards amongst us that Seb is a consistently good footballer across the whole season. To critisise his performances to win those awards over the past three years reflects badly on the author, not on Seb.

I never said that Seb wasn't a consistent good performer. That was never the argument. I reject the notion.that he is our best footballer or an A grade footballer or an AA representative. There is actual statistical analysis that supports my position on this. He is our most prolific disposal accumulator but clearly, due to the analysis mentioned above, doesnt make him A grade or AA. it is really that simple. I wont retract that because it offends you or BM to have it pointed out.

Nothing that you could possibly say would ever offend me.

Seb is obiously our BEST PERFORMED footballer having won the best and fairest two out of the past three years and being runner up in the one in the middle.

I have never said he is AA. I couldnt give a rats arse if you retract your views on Seb or not because those views are simply irrelevant to me.

The only views of relevance to me are what the coaches think of him. Obviously he is highly regarded. End of story afaic.

[saynta]

So saying the coaches didn't love Ross is also stating they didn't love Billings or Gresham with all three polling around the same amount of votes.

This is clearly bulls***.

And they must hate Marshall, Membrey and Dunstan if this line of crap is to be believed.

Also provides the reason Bruce was traded as the coaches must have absolutely despised him

f****** post of the year. NOT.

If this was a bar from a different era, my era being the 80's and 90's, this conversation would have ended a lot uglier than the sooky lala rantings of an ex-champion state league/VAFA park footballer, which I just find amusing. The internet is a safe environment for the world's sociopaths.

True, but you manage to be offensive towards BM all the same.

The internet might be a safe environment for sociopaths but it is not a safe environment for their victims. No wonder a number of prominent footballers and athletes have mental health issues.

BM brings it upon himself.
Loves an argument and wont back down. Is very timesone to see messages quoted and requoted.

Maybe. Sure BM doesn't accept that his opinions might be wrong and not widely shared, but neither do those who disagree with him. The offensiveness is not one sided nor restricted to BM as anyone who agrees with him is added to the insult list.

Not trying to be offensive myself but I don't know what "timesone "is. I suppose you mean "tiresome" which could apply to numerous posts in this thread.

i don't believe BM was trying to cause a s*** storm when he posted the OP.

"

I'm not sure if BM has been offended by anything I have written. I doubt he has actually taken in a lot of what I have written. He hasn't said so, but with you to speak for him Saynta, he doesn't have to. I similarly am.not offended by anything BM has posted. Why would I be?

I didn' t particularly have you in mind because I have little memory of your posts replying to BM

I do however have certain views about the usual suspects who enjoy putting s*** on and denigrating BM 's sporting achievements in both football and cricket.

To me they are impressive and therefore give me some confidence that he has some idea about his subjects.

I would think some of his critics have never been on a sporting field in any capacity other than as a spectator in their lives.

I know BM doesn't need me to speak for him and I don't presume to do so, but I don't like any poster being ganged up on when their views are credible.

Also his views on Seb are more in keeping with mine.

That's funny, quite a few of your posts have quoted mine and you directly accused me of being offensive to BM. Bloody tricky this internetty webbo thing hey Saynta.

My bad.
Just shows how quickly your posts are forgotten.