Reports Saints in for Chris Masten

[Laurie]

Are we St.Kilda or the St.Vinmies of football recycling anyone that is available.
Apart from Hill thats if we get him the others being Ryder and Jones are totally short term options and are not players for the future.
Our football department and ZIG and ZAG are slowly but surely destroying our club and i really cannot see any success for quite sometime if any.
TOP clubs have the right people running them we have people the John West of Admin.
Absolute joke so over it.
We WILL be screwed again this draft period why would a Ben King and Co want to come to such a rabble.

[fugazi]

Me, I will use my own judgement and have an opinion about football.

At some point though, you need to ask yourself why you're a failed sportsman and a hack coach at suburban level.

You need to face reality that you yourself, have no clue and no ability.

And that in reality many, many people know far, far more than you do.

If you were any good, and were that astute - you'd actually be employed to use tbat wisdom that you think you have.

But you're not.


And BM - most of us have reached that conclusion. We have accepted that we had our chance - and we were sub-standard. We are now merely watching from afar, whilst people who have demonstrated more ability and knowledge than us are now in positions of influence and authority at AFL clubs (not shithole local clubs like the rest of us) and are doing things that the rest of us could not.

You're no good. You're old, and failed. You're not smart. If you were, you'd be more than a s*** carter at suburban level.

So you basically are like rest of us - except that you're delusional.

We don't agree with everything the club does, and have differing views of how things should be done.

In some cases, we agree with the club. In some cases we blindly accept that people smarter than us and better qualified than us, are better equipped to make decisions than us.


It's actually called being open minded. Accepting that you're not the smartest person in the room and that maybe, just maybe people at the club know more than you.

You know, experienced AFL people that have played, coached and administrated at the highest level might know more than a spud who couldn't make it as a player or a coach beyond the suburbs?

Barry, did you watch the trade day video when our brains trust is trying to deal with Adelaide?
Where one of the recruiters is trying to explain to another one the draft order?
What would you say the average IQ was around that table?
I was shocked at the incompetence and lack of knowledge that those blokes had about what was their primary job.
Yes most on here have obviously not been elite sports people, but don't imagine that those running the club are some species of lofty genius. They simply are not. We have made some gargantuan errors at draft, at selection, at resignings , at coach selection at general club strategy (lets move to Seaford FFS!) and at the trade table.
If anything we don't get angry enough with the f#ck ups.

[Lyon Tamer]

Why do people get so up in arms about “decisions” that haven’t and most likely won’t be made.

It’s very unlikely that Masten will even be considered!

As for Ryder, he is coming cheap and will be a perfect backup ruckman if the unthinkable happens and Marshall goes down. it’s pretty obvious that you need a player like that on your list

[fugazi]

Bruce out Ryder in...bookmark it and see how we feel about that in 3 years.

[SaintPav]

Why do people get so up in arms about “decisions” that haven’t and most likely won’t be made.

It’s very unlikely that Masten will even be considered!

As for Ryder, he is coming cheap and will be a perfect backup ruckman if the unthinkable happens and Marshall goes down. it’s pretty obvious that you need a player like that on your list

First part is correct.

Ryder isn't just going to be a backup.

[barneyboyz]

Me, I will use my own judgement and have an opinion about football.

At some point though, you need to ask yourself why you're a failed sportsman and a hack coach at suburban level.

You need to face reality that you yourself, have no clue and no ability.

And that in reality many, many people know far, far more than you do.

If you were any good, and were that astute - you'd actually be employed to use tbat wisdom that you think you have.

But you're not.


And BM - most of us have reached that conclusion. We have accepted that we had our chance - and we were sub-standard. We are now merely watching from afar, whilst people who have demonstrated more ability and knowledge than us are now in positions of influence and authority at AFL clubs (not shithole local clubs like the rest of us) and are doing things that the rest of us could not.

You're no good. You're old, and failed. You're not smart. If you were, you'd be more than a s*** carter at suburban level.

So you basically are like rest of us - except that you're delusional.

We don't agree with everything the club does, and have differing views of how things should be done.

In some cases, we agree with the club. In some cases we blindly accept that people smarter than us and better qualified than us, are better equipped to make decisions than us.


It's actually called being open minded. Accepting that you're not the smartest person in the room and that maybe, just maybe people at the club know more than you.

You know, experienced AFL people that have played, coached and administrated at the highest level might know more than a spud who couldn't make it as a player or a coach beyond the suburbs?

Without wanting to stifle Marty's right to implode on these things (again), I know that I can at times, but this sums it all up pretty much really.

I was at a Grand Final breakfast where the great man Clarko was guest speaker. Among other things I came away thinking that he had a very pragmatic approach to recruitment, where it seemed that list turnover was as much important as getting stars.

He used Kennedy from Sydney as an example. They knew they were losing alot of club history, but it balances out.

Chris Masten might just be what we need, if he comes cheap and as someone mentioned in another thread, he might bring a superior training ethic?

[BarryGrogan]

Yes most on here have obviously not been elite sports people, but don't imagine that those running the club are some species of lofty genius. They simply are not.

I don't think that.

[gringo]

Are we St.Kilda or the St.Vinmies of football recycling anyone that is available.
Apart from Hill thats if we get him the others being Ryder and Jones are totally short term options and are not players for the future.
Our football department and ZIG and ZAG are slowly but surely destroying our club and i really cannot see any success for quite sometime if any.
TOP clubs have the right people running them we have people the John West of Admin.
Absolute joke so over it.
We WILL be screwed again this draft period why would a Ben King and Co want to come to such a rabble.

The list management this trade period seems totally idiotic. I really worry about the influence of Lethlean, he's been put in by the AFL because he was too embarrassing to keep there. I'm no moralist but he was sacked because he was sleeping with his much younger underlings on work time using AFL assets to perform his deeds. He was a media manager at head office and with no experience he's taken control of most aspects of the footy department including doing a review which he had no experience in. Rumours are he doesn't like Josh Bruce, he set up the Hannerbury trade and also overruled our head recruiter to take King over Rozee.

Brisbane had a soft take over and got super experienced operators like David Noble. We seem to have got the left overs. We seem to have no sense of urgency, continually picking players with injuries who are slow burns and seemingly basing our future list build around Ben King who we haven't even got on our list yet. Most fans have been calling for genuine gun mids for years and the one area the club seems determined to not go after are elite mids or even drafting them. We have a heap of HBFs and are going after Jones who is a HBF, but we plan on making him a mid. Also going after small forwards with links to Grey. Ryder is a ruck which we don't have but he's at a strange age for us to target.

I just hope like f*** we have some luck and find some guns are already on our list.

[gringo]

Me, I will use my own judgement and have an opinion about football.

At some point though, you need to ask yourself why you're a failed sportsman and a hack coach at suburban level.

You need to face reality that you yourself, have no clue and no ability.

And that in reality many, many people know far, far more than you do.

If you were any good, and were that astute - you'd actually be employed to use tbat wisdom that you think you have.

But you're not.


And BM - most of us have reached that conclusion. We have accepted that we had our chance - and we were sub-standard. We are now merely watching from afar, whilst people who have demonstrated more ability and knowledge than us are now in positions of influence and authority at AFL clubs (not shithole local clubs like the rest of us) and are doing things that the rest of us could not.

You're no good. You're old, and failed. You're not smart. If you were, you'd be more than a s*** carter at suburban level.

So you basically are like rest of us - except that you're delusional.

We don't agree with everything the club does, and have differing views of how things should be done.

In some cases, we agree with the club. In some cases we blindly accept that people smarter than us and better qualified than us, are better equipped to make decisions than us.


It's actually called being open minded. Accepting that you're not the smartest person in the room and that maybe, just maybe people at the club know more than you.

You know, experienced AFL people that have played, coached and administrated at the highest level might know more than a spud who couldn't make it as a player or a coach beyond the suburbs?

Without wanting to stifle Marty's right to implode on these things (again), I know that I can at times, but this sums it all up pretty much really.

I was at a Grand Final breakfast where the great man Clarko was guest speaker. Among other things I came away thinking that he had a very pragmatic approach to recruitment, where it seemed that list turnover was as much important as getting stars.

He used Kennedy from Sydney as an example. They knew they were losing alot of club history, but it balances out.

Chris Masten might just be what we need, if he comes cheap and as someone mentioned in another thread, he might bring a superior training ethic?

The Hawks couldn't fit him in though, they had Sam Mitchell, Lewis and several inside outside options. Kennedy was too much of a slow inside extractor so it was him or Mitchell. They ironically got Tom Mitchell nearly the same way years later.

Good list management is trading away players who are excess to needs. We are trading away a player who is still required with no-one with exposed form ready to take his place.

[B.M]

Barry, interesting you can come to those conclusions without knowing a thing about me... btw, I had to stop reading your post after the first bit of dribble.

I could just as easily say you're a fanboi who has no idea about footy and thinks StK are a good club

[Rubyjo]

Me, I will use my own judgement and have an opinion about football.

At some point though, you need to ask yourself why you're a failed sportsman and a hack coach at suburban level.

You need to face reality that you yourself, have no clue and no ability.

And that in reality many, many people know far, far more than you do.

If you were any good, and were that astute - you'd actually be employed to use tbat wisdom that you think you have.

But you're not.


And BM - most of us have reached that conclusion. We have accepted that we had our chance - and we were sub-standard. We are now merely watching from afar, whilst people who have demonstrated more ability and knowledge than us are now in positions of influence and authority at AFL clubs (not shithole local clubs like the rest of us) and are doing things that the rest of us could not.

You're no good. You're old, and failed. You're not smart. If you were, you'd be more than a s*** carter at suburban level.

So you basically are like rest of us - except that you're delusional.

We don't agree with everything the club does, and have differing views of how things should be done.

In some cases, we agree with the club. In some cases we blindly accept that people smarter than us and better qualified than us, are better equipped to make decisions than us.


It's actually called being open minded. Accepting that you're not the smartest person in the room and that maybe, just maybe people at the club know more than you.

You know, experienced AFL people that have played, coached and administrated at the highest level might know more than a spud who couldn't make it as a player or a coach beyond the suburbs?

Barry Grogan.. Jesus what is wrong with you?

[samoht]

The "more qualified than us" tag belongs to the clubs that are going about things the right way and have managed to sustain their success and retain their coaches.

Compare our recruiting with that of the successful clubs - Richmond, Collingwood, Hawthorn , Geelong - you can't.

Let's also see what we get back for Steven and Bruce.

[takeaway]

The "more qualified than us" tag belongs to the clubs that are going about things the right way and have managed to sustain their success and retain their coaches.

Compare our recruiting with that of the successful clubs - you can't.

Let's also see what we get back for Steven and Bruce.

Why can't you compare? Without an actual comparison making such statements is pointless. Whilst it is true that the bigger clubs are able to attract the better players more easily and hence are seen as better recruiters, my impression is that we have done OK with recruiting say over the last 10 years, particularly as a smaller club. I look forward to a detailed analysis proving the opposite.

[samoht]

You can do your own analysis, takeaway.

Hawthorn was a minnow club that was about to fold.... we could have used their recruiters and decision makers that turned it around for them.
We need the same calibre of people, with sharp minds and long term visions right now, who can leave a legacy - not seat-warmers focussed just on the here and now, who see us as a stopover.

We have some great facilities now - we just need to make the right recruiting decisions.

[SMS]

If that’s the case... I’m definitely out!

That’s if I’m not already... seriously need to consider why I waste my energy on such a joke of a club

I’m filthy with

Trading Bruce
Losing Steven for FA
Recruiting Ryder
Recruiting Zac Jones
Recruiting Sam Gray


Seriously, who the f*** is making these decisions

SAM GRAY IS A GUN

WE need jones and ryder. great pick ups.

steven wants OUT and BRUCE we can get currency now for snd have no need due to king bros, membrey battle marsgal/ryder. bruce dont ruck or defend.

[samoht]

Steven wants out - but we need to get something worthwhile out of it.

We can't sell ourselves short/be taken advantage re: Bruce and Steven.

[st.byron]

If that’s the case... I’m definitely out!

That’s if I’m not already... seriously need to consider why I waste my energy on such a joke of a club

I’m filthy with

Trading Bruce
Losing Steven for FA
Recruiting Ryder
Recruiting Zac Jones
Recruiting Sam Gray


Seriously, who the f*** is making these decisions

SAM GRAY IS A GUN

WE need jones and ryder. great pick ups.

steven wants OUT and BRUCE we can get currency now for snd have no need due to king bros, membrey battle marsgal/ryder. bruce dont ruck or defend.

Sam Gray is a gun???? How so? Haven’t seen him play, but he’s hardly set the comp alight. I know stats can be a very flawed way of assessing a player, but his numbers aren’t that much better than Dean Kent.....Kent, three years.....jaysus

[B.M]

Sam Gray is 27yo averages 0.9 goals per game is 176cm and gets it about 16 times a game

Sound familiar?

[PADDLEPOP1001]

I think he got mixed up with Robbie Gray !

[saintsRrising]

I would note that no one has actually posted a source yet for the Masten Rumour.

[barneyboyz]

Me, I will use my own judgement and have an opinion about football.

At some point though, you need to ask yourself why you're a failed sportsman and a hack coach at suburban level.

You need to face reality that you yourself, have no clue and no ability.

And that in reality many, many people know far, far more than you do.

If you were any good, and were that astute - you'd actually be employed to use tbat wisdom that you think you have.

But you're not.


And BM - most of us have reached that conclusion. We have accepted that we had our chance - and we were sub-standard. We are now merely watching from afar, whilst people who have demonstrated more ability and knowledge than us are now in positions of influence and authority at AFL clubs (not shithole local clubs like the rest of us) and are doing things that the rest of us could not.

You're no good. You're old, and failed. You're not smart. If you were, you'd be more than a s*** carter at suburban level.

So you basically are like rest of us - except that you're delusional.

We don't agree with everything the club does, and have differing views of how things should be done.

In some cases, we agree with the club. In some cases we blindly accept that people smarter than us and better qualified than us, are better equipped to make decisions than us.


It's actually called being open minded. Accepting that you're not the smartest person in the room and that maybe, just maybe people at the club know more than you.

You know, experienced AFL people that have played, coached and administrated at the highest level might know more than a spud who couldn't make it as a player or a coach beyond the suburbs?

Without wanting to stifle Marty's right to implode on these things (again), I know that I can at times, but this sums it all up pretty much really.

I was at a Grand Final breakfast where the great man Clarko was guest speaker. Among other things I came away thinking that he had a very pragmatic approach to recruitment, where it seemed that list turnover was as much important as getting stars.

He used Kennedy from Sydney as an example. They knew they were losing alot of club history, but it balances out.

Chris Masten might just be what we need, if he comes cheap and as someone mentioned in another thread, he might bring a superior training ethic?

The Hawks couldn't fit him in though, they had Sam Mitchell, Lewis and several inside outside options. Kennedy was too much of a slow inside extractor so it was him or Mitchell. They ironically got Tom Mitchell nearly the same way years later.

Good list management is trading away players who are excess to needs. We are trading away a player who is still required with no-one with exposed form ready to take his place.

Interesting thoughts on the slow inside extractor as some people see Luke Dunstan as similar (well he aint fast), but it would be a shame if he left and became a long term player somewhere else

Good list management is many things, and not always the same. Hawks obviously saw benefit in the trade

It has to be said that the Saints don't always inspire confidence in this important area

[mad saint guy]

If we land him, Hill will be our best recruit in years but every other player we're linked to is just mind boggling. Masten would slot nicely into Armo's spot at Sandy

[kosifantutti]

I would note that no one has actually posted a source yet for the Masten Rumour.

Here it is from someone with less Twitter followers than me.

[Wayne42]

The Doc, he's not the one the Beatles sang about is he?

Reads like he's taken a drink from his special cup.

[B.M]

Are we comparing Luke Dunstan to Josh Kennedy?