UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

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Re: CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825700Post saintsRrising »

CQ SAINT wrote: Mon 23 Sep 2019 9:38am This thread is gonna make for an interesting discussion in 11 months time if we do trade him.
Well we are also awaiting what the actual price for him is. If he a cheap in terms of trade cost back up ruck, as seems likely then I am ok with it. We had to get someone that can ruck


However the logic behind Bruce going is yet to be reveal. What we gain back, and how it is used.
The trade value gained for Bruce should far exceed Ryder.

Our strategy for key forwards in 2020 if Bruce goes will be interesting. Though perhaps the trade will set us up better to gain B King. Who knows.

Once all the trading is done we will be in a position to better assess. Until them we are all guessing.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825703Post maverick »

So if not Ryder who do we play as the 2nd ruck
Rather than be a hindsight hero, call it out now
Should be interesting


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825705Post Ghost Like »

Thanks for the post sRr, I think it is a no brainer as will cost us very little. I doubt the recruitment of Ryder and Bruce possibly leaving are linked. Both separate machinations in my view.

One AFL ready ruck on our list, thank god an exceptional one but that's it. We still need another couple in my opinion.

The Bruce thing is intriguing. When / How did it come about? When was Bruce's manager approached? I sense it was well before season's end. Whenever it gained traction, it appears that StK has been offered something so as not to emphatically discount it.

Our ruck situation was already in motion, one did not dictate the other.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825706Post B.M »

2nd ruck? Who cares... Marshall rucks about 80% of the time... rather a good Forward, than a good ‘second ruck’

Who is GWS second ruck?

Who was Collingwoods second ruck?

Richmond played two rucks, Nankervis was rubbish.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825725Post Pundit »

A second ruck is so outdated, rucking is one of the most boring parts of the game, it's up there with the scrum in NRL and Union.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825733Post 1966 »

A 2nd ruck becomes critical if Marshall gets injured.
To suggest we don’t need a back up ruckman on our list is ridiculous.
We will need another ruck option on our list in addition to Marshall and Ryder.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825736Post saintsRrising »

B.M wrote: Mon 23 Sep 2019 7:18pm 2nd ruck? Who cares... Marshall rucks about 80% of the time... rather a good Forward, than a good ‘second ruck’

Who is GWS second ruck?

Who was Collingwoods second ruck?

Richmond played two rucks, Nankervis was rubbish.

Though in the Richmond example Nankervis is the first ruck, but on the day the second ruck Soldo was better.

Tigers are also the aberration as they are basically playing two less mobile first rucks, plus they had two true big specialist forwards in Lynch and Riewoldt.

Pies but for injury would have had Cox who is an ok rather than good key forward.


GWS...well I think this year ruckwise they were just making do. But with mids like their you can do that.



All in all, there is more than one way to skin a cat.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825748Post B.M »

Ruckwork is so critical as seen in the Coll v GWS prelim

78 hit outs to 16

Lost clearance by 20


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825771Post Spinner »

Love the referencing of one game where a ruckman dominates but team loses the game.

Should teams not play a ruck at all given this one game outcome?

Who needs a bigger sample anyways.

There probably is a name for this type of decision making.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825776Post BarryGrogan »

Grundy was unbelievable in the last quarter. He nesrly dragged them over the line himself.


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Re: CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825780Post freely »

Enrico_Misso wrote: Mon 23 Sep 2019 1:14am Would hate to see King reduced to a broken down hack by forcing him to play ruck!
I hear you but we said this about Stanley. Not that he's been great but he's held that spot most of the year with the minor premiers.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825802Post B.M »

It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825807Post The Fireman »

B.M wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 9:46am It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.
well my Jury is out on Nic Naitanui .. I value his hitouts in correlation to clearances.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825832Post Pundit »

B.M wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 9:46am It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.
and even more capable midfielder which is where the logic evolution of the game is heading, ruck contests are one of the most boring aspects of the game and it's no wonder the two ruck (aka dinosaur) system is quickly phasing out. :? :? :?


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825852Post The Barometer »

Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 11:03am
B.M wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 9:46am It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.
and even more capable midfielder which is where the logic evolution of the game is heading, ruck contests are one of the most boring aspects of the game and it's no wonder the two ruck (aka dinosaur) system is quickly phasing out. :? :? :?
Richmond? West coast? Both play two rucks...


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825854Post Pundit »

The Barometer wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 12:50pm
Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 11:03am
B.M wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 9:46am It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.
and even more capable midfielder which is where the logic evolution of the game is heading, ruck contests are one of the most boring aspects of the game and it's no wonder the two ruck (aka dinosaur) system is quickly phasing out. :? :? :?
Richmond? West coast? Both play two rucks...
yep, we used to have ruck rovers too and the drop kick and no 50m arcs, and no two way running, and sports science and data tracking...whats your point.

Saturday's game will test out the ruck theories/argument vigorously.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825870Post Ghost Like »

I think their point was there's more than one way to structure up. Why limit yourself to one way if you've not got the cattle?


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825872Post The Barometer »

Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 1:00pm
The Barometer wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 12:50pm
Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 11:03am
B.M wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 9:46am It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.
and even more capable midfielder which is where the logic evolution of the game is heading, ruck contests are one of the most boring aspects of the game and it's no wonder the two ruck (aka dinosaur) system is quickly phasing out. :? :? :?
Richmond? West coast? Both play two rucks...
yep, we used to have ruck rovers too and the drop kick and no 50m arcs, and no two way running, and sports science and data tracking...whats your point.

Saturday's game will test out the ruck theories/argument vigorously.
point is they won the last two flags. Let me know the result of your vigorous test.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825879Post Pundit »

The Barometer wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 3:16pm
Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 1:00pm
The Barometer wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 12:50pm
Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 11:03am
B.M wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 9:46am It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.
and even more capable midfielder which is where the logic evolution of the game is heading, ruck contests are one of the most boring aspects of the game and it's no wonder the two ruck (aka dinosaur) system is quickly phasing out. :? :? :?
Richmond? West coast? Both play two rucks...
yep, we used to have ruck rovers too and the drop kick and no 50m arcs, and no two way running, and sports science and data tracking...whats your point.

Saturday's game will test out the ruck theories/argument vigorously.
point is they won the last two flags. Let me know the result of your vigorous test.
Did Richmond use 2 rucks in the 2017 flag?


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825881Post Pundit »

And what did west coast do with one of its rucks after they won the flag.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825895Post Joffa Burns »

Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 3:43pm And what did west coast do with one of its rucks after they won the flag.
They got Nic Nat back from injury?
They lost Lycett to FA?
They traded for Tom Reginald Hickey?
They persisted with Vardy?

Is one of above correct?


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825899Post Pundit »

Joffa Burns wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 5:16pm
Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 3:43pm And what did west coast do with one of its rucks after they won the flag.
They got Nic Nat back from injury?
They lost Lycett to FA?
They traded for Tom Reginald Hickey?
They persisted with Vardy?

Is one of above correct?
They didn't care to lose Lycett because they knew they were going to pick up a other backup ruckman in Hickey.

We've persisted with a few back up ruckman too. Pretty sure we are happy with Marshall and some backup stock.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825909Post The Barometer »

Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 3:42pm
The Barometer wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 3:16pm
Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 1:00pm
The Barometer wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 12:50pm
Pundit wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 11:03am
B.M wrote: Tue 24 Sep 2019 9:46am It was an example spinner, not an experiment.

The jury has been out forever about the value of hit outs and the correlation they have with clearances.

Marshall is a capable ruckman.
and even more capable midfielder which is where the logic evolution of the game is heading, ruck contests are one of the most boring aspects of the game and it's no wonder the two ruck (aka dinosaur) system is quickly phasing out. :? :? :?
Richmond? West coast? Both play two rucks...
yep, we used to have ruck rovers too and the drop kick and no 50m arcs, and no two way running, and sports science and data tracking...whats your point.

Saturday's game will test out the ruck theories/argument vigorously.
point is they won the last two flags. Let me know the result of your vigorous test.
Did Richmond use 2 rucks in the 2017 flag?
No they used Grigg in 2017. But using two this year and playing off in GF. These teams at the top use two. Clarkson uses two. Point there are different strategies but is it isn’t fading out.


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Re: UPDATE- Sam McClure as well as CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825914Post Pundit »

Grigg was as much a ruckman as Josh Bruce is so there is no way anyone can argue they went in with two geniune rucks. Not even close. Be like saying Marshal and Acres are two geniune rucks.


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Re: CH7 reporting that Ryder will join StKilda

Post: # 1825916Post ace »

Joffa Burns wrote: Sat 21 Sep 2019 10:49pm Maybe we could lure WOW Jones out if retirement or Lazar to be Marshall’s back up?
How about it Stonecold, you come out of retirement, a five year contract, $1 million a year, what do you say !!!!!


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