8 Years of failure - WORST period since the 80s

[kaos theory]

Who takes responsility for this extended period of misery inflicted on us saints supporters? No finals in 8 seasons and mostly finishing in bottom section of the ladder.

What makes it worse is that we came off one our most sucessful periods at end of 2011 (from 1991 to 2011). You would think that there woud be enough culture, knowledge, experience and desire ingrained into the place to engineer a re-birth.

But instead we have seen:
- 2 terrible head coach selections and poorly run coaching department
- Crazy unwarrented contract extensions for coaches and players
- Terrible recuiting program with emphasis placed on selecting 'nice' people rather than players first
- Terrible player development program with skilled players going nowhere through insipid programs and an eroding culture
- Loss of toughness in spirit and character
- Indulgence in stupid and pointless gestures with nothing to do with good football club (e.g. gender neutral toilets)

For me, its always a problem created by people at the top. Our board and senior management has been a disgrace. From Summers/Nettefold to Summers/Finnis and now a new combo of Basset/Finnis.

The key 'attributes' these boards & management seem to display are:
- Ignorance : They seemed completely oblivious to the decay that happened at our club over the years (like Nero fiddling while Rome burns). No one seems to understand what makes a sucessful football club or how to create it.
- Timidity : For example, fear to recuit quality players that had strong characters, and our capitulation after the Murphy affair in the Carlton game. This seems to have occured becuase of the M&M, st.kilda school girl and other incidents that scared the club. Instead of saying, 'no f u, we did nothing wrong and we will focus on building a strong club', instead we rolled over and submitted to everyone...

The return to moorabbin was great, BUT that was mostly due to AFL and state government and change of local council, not the club.

So where to from here? A new head coach, (3rd time lucky?), a player clean out....BUT same board and CEO... we had changes in recuiting dept, head of football last year, but is that enough???

[B.M]

Chris Pelchen

His list management strategy was ridiculous

[kaos theory]

Chris Pelchen

His list management strategy was ridiculous

And yet the management/board believed everything he said... I've got know idea if he did infact have anything of value to add, but I'd expect the people running the club should know.

[B.M]

Saintsational members believed everything he said also.

There were very few who were against his decisions, the few who did were howled down

Then he got sacked and it became in vogue to criticise him, especially since it became obvious that his decisions were a mistake.

[The Recruit]

Too many on here live in the past...it must be exhausting for you

[evertonfc]

Saintsational members believed everything he said also.

There were very few who were against his decisions, the few who did were howled down

Then he got sacked and it became in vogue to criticise him, especially since it became obvious that his decisions were a mistake.

I can't believe how many non-St Kilda people have been allowed to ruin our club.

Baines, Elshaug, Pelchen...added to the well-meaning but inept Richardson. Now Matt Finnis has a mission to turn us into a cardboard cutout of a football club, chasing all sorts of personal career causes which distract us from winning games of footy.

(hold fire on Gubby, Lethlean and Gallagher - they're all inside 12 months)

Heartbreaking. They've destroyed the list, burned several champions and we still don't even have a VFL team.

But we have $11 million in debt, a pride thing and a failed venture in China.

They keep wondering why members are disenchanted and disenfranchised. FMD - look in the mirror. It's not our club anymore.

It's been hijacked by the most inept group of mid-tier career-ists you'd ever like to meet, none of who give a damn about our footy club.

Please - please - if you're reading this Andrew, move heaven and earth to bring St Kilda people back into our club. Or at least people (like Ratten) who are willing to give everything to this place and become one of us.

[kaos theory]

Too many on here live in the past...it must be exhausting for you

Really? How long do you keep saying this? Same again next year? After another 5 years of failure? When do we examine what's failed, and say we need to learn from it and change?

If you don't examine the past, you are destined to repeat it....

The impression I get from this management/board is 'nothing to see here...move along... here is another 5 year plan to keep you quiet'

Need more change over the summer....

[kaos theory]

Saintsational members believed everything he said also.

There were very few who were against his decisions, the few who did were howled down

Then he got sacked and it became in vogue to criticise him, especially since it became obvious that his decisions were a mistake.

I can't believe how many non-St Kilda people have been allowed to ruin our club.

Baines, Elshaug, Pelchen...added to the well-meaning but inept Richardson. Now Matt Finnis has a mission to turn us into a cardboard cutout of a football club, chasing all sorts of personal career causes which distract us from winning games of footy.

(hold fire on Gubby, Lethlean and Gallagher - they're all inside 12 months)

Heartbreaking. They've destroyed the list, burned several champions and we still don't even have a VFL team.

But we have $11 million in debt, a pride thing and a failed venture in China.

They keep wondering why members are disenchanted and disenfranchised. FMD - look in the mirror. It's not our club anymore.

It's been hijacked by the most inept group of mid-tier career-ists you'd ever like to meet, none of who give a damn about our footy club.

Please - please - if you're reading this Andrew, move heaven and earth to bring St Kilda people back into our club. Or at least people (like Ratten) who are willing to give everything to this place and become one of us.

100%

[Wayne42]

Too many on here live in the past...it must be exhausting for you

Really? How long do you keep saying this? Same again next year? After another 5 years of failure? When do we examine what's failed, and say we need to learn from it and change?

If you don't examine the past, you are destined to repeat it....

The impression I get from this management/board is 'nothing to see here...move along... here is another 5 year plan to keep you quiet'

Need more change over the summer....

A lot more change is required.

[saintsRrising]

Chris Pelchen

His list management strategy was ridiculous

What about the guy that started 6 months before him and left years aferwards? And no I do not mean Trout.

[saintsRrising]

Then also CEOs like Archie and Nettlefold.

Plus Wasteaway probably one of our worsts Presidents ever who instead of capitalising on a period of success that should have been the platform for improving us offield instead just pissed it all up against the wall.

[Wayne42]

Chris Pelchen

His list management strategy was ridiculous

What about the guy that started 6 months before him and left years aferwards? And no I do not mean Trout.

Who do you mean saintsRrising ?

[B.M]

I reckon he means Ameet Bains

And

There is living in the past and there’s learning from the past.

What have we learned?

[saintsRrising]

Bottom line is that we have had an inedpt recruiting department since the mid to early Naughties. It was well and truly in a parlous state before Pelchen arrived, and remained so after he left..

Beveridge was an ok recruiter for his day. The problem was that as other clubs moved on our recruiting remained in the 70's and "gut-feel" recruiting'.

Bevo had a penchant for the smokies and his successors like Trout followed his lead. The right hand-guy of the Geelong Recruiter we hired turn out to be a dud and not a Master's Apprentice.

Bain started and while he fixed the contract mess that GT put in of the too few being paid too much, he then overstepped his abilities by living out his fan-boy dreams by meddling in the actual draft.

6 months after Bains started Pelchen came in with his plan, but the actual recruiters were still dismal, and so you had a plan with no ability to actually pick the right players. His multi-players swaps in particular in the main were flops.

Bain got rid of Pelchen, but continued on his Merry Way with Trout. The FA Big Fish Pipedream remained strong and even when it should have been crystal clear that it was just not going to happen and after Pelchen had departed on the club marched. The Non-Recruiters were in charge and merrily rubbing each others egos about what geniuses they all where.

The FA pipe dream remained that as star players did not want to join bottom clubs, BUT was well and truly blown out of the water when St Kilda having spent a few years building up a "War Chest" were blown out of the water as with the new TV Rights deal it mean that virtually every club was suddenly cashed.

Over a decade of poor list management and recruiting is why we are where we are at. GT's over generous contracts to too few was the start of the rot. Poor player choices since then compounded and continued that problem to make an even bigger mess.


We are where we are at because on an overall nonperformance by many in our List Management? recruitment since the early Naughties.

It remains to be seen if the latest wave is any better. The current group certainly like going for long-shots.

[saintsRrising]

I reckon he means Ameet Bains

And

There is living in the past and there’s learning from the past.

What have we learned?

Nothing for over decade.

The current group are all over the place with a mix bag of recruiting where they cannot seem to make up their mind if they were topping up for a GF push (we shouldn't have been) or are rebuilding (we should be).

They following Bains lead love to try and be too clever with picks. Ego before logic seems to be the mantra.

[saintsRrising]

Chris Pelchen

His list management strategy was ridiculous

What about the guy that started 6 months before him and left years aferwards? And no I do not mean Trout.

Who do you mean saintsRrising ?

Bains.

[Wayne42]

Chris Pelchen

His list management strategy was ridiculous

What about the guy that started 6 months before him and left years aferwards? And no I do not mean Trout.

Who do you mean saintsRrising ?

Bains.

Ah yes, Bains, i bet he has nothing to do with Recruiting or List Management at the Bulldogs.

[saintsRrising]

Talking of List Management/ Recruiting...if we rip off the super adds and "Compare the Pair"

Look at The Doggies in recent years compared to the Saints. Similar picks, but one young list is really progressing and one has been going backwards. Even their mistake in Boyd worked out as he stood up on GF Day and helped win them a flag


Like the add says " Its not too late'". But if we land players like Ryder then I will know that our recruiters are still off with the fairies.

[HarryM]

Welcome to the Trout Legacy....he was employed never been a ''recruiter before' having NO eye for talent ….and didn't have a clue what he was doing .

Bains and him ran the Football Department and it was Amateur hour at best....Pelchen was a target....not hard to connect the dots.

The Club needs to re-invent themselves..

[The Linton Street Flash]

Saintsational members believed everything he said also.

There were very few who were against his decisions, the few who did were howled down

Then he got sacked and it became in vogue to criticise him, especially since it became obvious that his decisions were a mistake.

I can't believe how many non-St Kilda people have been allowed to ruin our club.

Baines, Elshaug, Pelchen...added to the well-meaning but inept Richardson. Now Matt Finnis has a mission to turn us into a cardboard cutout of a football club, chasing all sorts of personal career causes which distract us from winning games of footy.

(hold fire on Gubby, Lethlean and Gallagher - they're all inside 12 months)

Heartbreaking. They've destroyed the list, burned several champions and we still don't even have a VFL team.

But we have $11 million in debt, a pride thing and a failed venture in China.

They keep wondering why members are disenchanted and disenfranchised. FMD - look in the mirror. It's not our club anymore.

It's been hijacked by the most inept group of mid-tier career-ists you'd ever like to meet, none of who give a damn about our footy club.

Please - please - if you're reading this Andrew, move heaven and earth to bring St Kilda people back into our club. Or at least people (like Ratten) who are willing to give everything to this place and become one of us.

Brilliant post!

[cwrcyn]

Two words sum up Chris Pelchen's recruiting strategy................. TOM LEE.

[Yorkeys]

Double double toil and trouble, fillet of Lyon, eye of Watters and toe of Richo, wool of Nettlefold, tongue of Westerway, Summer's sting, Pelchen's leg, and Trout's wing, scale of Finnis, for a charm of powerful trouble like a hell broth boil and bubble. Make the gruel thick and slab add a curse on Paddy and Robbo, cool it with a baboons blood, oft times play Mav and Newnes, then the charm is firm and good.

[Nick_BlueNRG]

Who takes responsility for this extended period of misery inflicted on us saints supporters? No finals in 8 seasons and mostly finishing in bottom section of the ladder.

What makes it worse is that we came off one our most sucessful periods at end of 2011 (from 1991 to 2011). You would think that there woud be enough culture, knowledge, experience and desire ingrained into the place to engineer a re-birth.

But instead we have seen:
- 2 terrible head coach selections and poorly run coaching department
- Crazy unwarrented contract extensions for coaches and players
- Terrible recuiting program with emphasis placed on selecting 'nice' people rather than players first
- Terrible player development program with skilled players going nowhere through insipid programs and an eroding culture
- Loss of toughness in spirit and character
- Indulgence in stupid and pointless gestures with nothing to do with good football club (e.g. gender neutral toilets)

For me, its always a problem created by people at the top. Our board and senior management has been a disgrace. From Summers/Nettefold to Summers/Finnis and now a new combo of Basset/Finnis.

The key 'attributes' these boards & management seem to display are:
- Ignorance : They seemed completely oblivious to the decay that happened at our club over the years (like Nero fiddling while Rome burns). No one seems to understand what makes a sucessful football club or how to create it.
- Timidity : For example, fear to recuit quality players that had strong characters, and our capitulation after the Murphy affair in the Carlton game. This seems to have occured becuase of the M&M, st.kilda school girl and other incidents that scared the club. Instead of saying, 'no f u, we did nothing wrong and we will focus on building a strong club', instead we rolled over and submitted to everyone...

The return to moorabbin was great, BUT that was mostly due to AFL and state government and change of local council, not the club.

So where to from here? A new head coach, (3rd time lucky?), a player clean out....BUT same board and CEO... we had changes in recuiting dept, head of football last year, but is that enough???

Things are only going to get worse if our recruiting department are not sacked. Making Godfather offers to 26 year olds is so stupid it is laughable. If it was that easy everyone would do it. YOU MUST HAVE A CORE OF AT LEAST 15 A TO B GRADE PLAYERS FIRST ALL UNDER 25 YEARS OLD BEFORE TRYING TO BRING IN OLDER PLAYERS. AND THE OLDER PLAYERS SHOULD BE BROUGHT IN VIA FREE AGENCY. WE STUPIDLY KEEP BURNING PRECIOUS DRAFT PICKS ON OLD PLAYERS. WHY?

Like I said, if the recruiting department are allowed to continue on their merry way we will spend another 8 years in the bottom half of the ladder and it doesn't matter who coaches us.

[saintspremiers]

Everton - please email your brilliant post to AB

[The Recruit]

There has been a heap of change over the last 18months

Also we would have made finals in 2017 easily if the ladder was as is now...proves that making 7-8 is just making up numbers so we have been around the mark of improvement apart from 2018.

We are building for top 4 and would say we have lost 2-3 years from poor recruiting and management...but I feel that has changed over the last 2-3 years and our off field is so much more professional now. Not sure what else the club can do....time machine?