Second Ruck for 2020 and beyond

[evertonfc]

For the first time in a while, an interesting market for second-string ruckmen has emerged.

Lots of clubs are writing off their second ruckmen (including us it seems) and will be on lookout for new clubs.

Expensive:
- Todd Goldstein is obviously the one we're keenest on, but he's super expensive and wants three years without performance-extension triggers (which would take him to 35 years old). Will want to be the #1 ruck ahead of Marshall.

Mid-high range:
- Josh Jenkins has been frozen out at Adelaide but is talented, can play forward, does have a fairly lucrative contract.

Bargain-basement options as a 2nd option include:
- Zac Smith has hugely fallen out of favour at Geelong (six games in two years) but was the reason Gold Coast offloaded Tom Hickey to us. Can still ruck extremely well.
- Braydon Preuss has talent but not had a great year at Melbourne and doesn't work with Gawn. Has shown he can handle first-choice duties and will look for a club who can offer that.
- Nathan Vardy has had an inconsistent year at West Coast after doing well in a Premiership-winning team last year. But at Geelong, I thought he showed talent as a forward with a fantastic pair of hands. Concern about injuries and does get beaten by #1 ruckmen, but would be cover for both Marshall and Bruce. Cheaper than Jenkins but not as good, either.
- Andrew Phillips can ruck competitively. But Carlton are unlikely to let him go as he has shown he can win hit-outs in the absence of the ageing/injury-prone Kreuzer, who turns 31 next year.

Cheapest option:
- Keep Billy Longer or Lewis Pierce and hope one of them kicks on or at least becomes fit enough on a regular basis to cover Marshall.
- Find a VFL/SANFL star and take him through the draft (always an option I like for ruckmen, but I don't know enough about them).

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I'm warming to Jenkins as a really good option. Preuss is the best long-term option there, but he won't want to play 2nd string at a 3rd club.

Goldstein will be a great teacher for Marshall...but is it overkill having two "#1 ruckmen"? Same with considering Sam Jacobs.

The reason that Gawn and Preuss didn't work was well-covered off during the week by Terry Wallace - Preuss can't go forward, which is where he spends 80% of his time if he's playing in the same team as Gawn.

At least with Jenkins, you get somebody who can cover Marshall and Bruce for the next two-three years, which is quite handy given both have a genuine bash-and-crash style.

[B.M]

We have three tall forwards for next year

Can’t have a second Ruck resting there and not providing Forward half pressure

3 small at least are a must

Jenkins is not much chop

[The_Dud]

With a team consisting of Marshall, Bruce, Membrey, King, Carlisle, Battle and Brown I don’t think there’s room for another tall, especially a slow lumbering one.

I’m happy for Bruce/Carlisle giving Marshall the occasional chop out, not sure how Goldy would fit into the side.

[Legendary]

Agree with above two posts. Plan for 2020 and beyond will have King in the side with Bruce and Membrey. Although they are all fairly mobile, a resting ruckman would be too much in my view.

Ideally we would find a utility who can play ruck and give Marshall a chop out. The modern Jason Blake. If Carlisle didn't have his back issues, he could play this role. King will end up being too good as a forward to play 10 min a quarter as a ruckman.

If we do go for someone mature, Paddy Ryder would be my preference.

[saintsRrising]

OPTION B: None of those listed in the OP.

We do not need a No 1 Ruck. We need a back up No 1 Ruck.

Just either find a State Leauge level ruck who will be grateful to play at Sandy with the occasional seniors game hoping that he can impress.

Ora young, but cheap ruck option to be developed and fill in for Marshall if injured.

Remember that Marshall was a rookie.

[bigcarl]

With a team consisting of Marshall, Bruce, Membrey, King, Carlisle, Battle and Brown I don’t think there’s room for another tall, especially a slow lumbering one.

I’m happy for Bruce/Carlisle giving Marshall the occasional chop out, not sure how Goldy would fit into the side.

That’s okay as long as Marshall doesn’t fall over. What happens - God forbid - if he has a season ending injury.

Not sure Carlisle could or would do it full time. Nor Bruce.

We need a backup for Roma. Scour the state leagues for a start. Surely there’s a mobile, able bodied ruckman somewhere.

[The_Dud]

With a team consisting of Marshall, Bruce, Membrey, King, Carlisle, Battle and Brown I don’t think there’s room for another tall, especially a slow lumbering one.

I’m happy for Bruce/Carlisle giving Marshall the occasional chop out, not sure how Goldy would fit into the side.

That’s okay as long as Marshall doesn’t fall over. What happens - God forbid - if he has a season ending injury.

Not sure Carlisle could or would do it full time. Nor Bruce.

We need a backup for Roma. Scour the state leagues for a start. Surely there’s a mobile, able bodied ruckman somewhere.

Yep definitely need a backup, but the likes of Goldy and Jenkins aren’t going to come over to play for Sandy.

Pierce showed something so maybe keep him, and don’t we have a few other developing ruckman?

[evertonfc]

Plan for 2020 and beyond will have King in the side with Bruce and Membrey.

FWIW, I don't see King as a viable ruck option until he's 22 or so (currently 19).Young ruckmen get battered, bruised and never last as long as those who build their bodies up.

That's why VFL ruckmen are often excellent bargains late in the national draft or in the rookie draft.

Max has a long, long way to go before he should get sent to the middle IMO. I'm very wary about what could happen to him up there when I think his biggest impact with us will be as a forward.

[evertonfc]

Yep definitely need a backup, but the likes of Goldy and Jenkins aren’t going to come over to play for Sandy.

Pierce showed something so maybe keep him, and don’t we have a few other developing ruckman?

I wonder if that makes Nathan Vardy an option as a very cheap back-up for 2-3 years. Offers cover in both forward and ruck and will fall right down the order once Natanui returns.

That’s okay as long as Marshall doesn’t fall over. What happens - God forbid - if he has a season ending injury.

We presently have no plan to deal with this, outside of hoping Billy Longer comes back to AFL football (somewhat unlikely) or Lewis Pearce develops extensively over summer (very unlikely).

[sunsaint]

I dont think clubs are dropping the two ruck options unless you are thinking about the old dinosaur Longer type of player
Clubs are definitely hot for the 1 primary and second forward type but the 2nd must be good as a ruck also - its one reason why the combo worked very well for collingwood
For us thats not Bruce Acres or Carlisle
IF the young KIng can handle the pounding then he is the obvious choice 2nd ruck
If we end up with two Kings then the options open right up

[skeptic]

I think the reality is that the only way we fit two rucks into the team is if ruck number two displaces one of Bruce or Carlisle.
After that it’s just depth seeking

[Impatient Sainter]

Bruce can continue to play the role we just need backups for Marshall if he is ever injured.

[PADDLEPOP1001]

Billy Nicholls from GC would come very cheap!

[fugazi]

Jason Blake mobile utility good below needs with huge engine., might be good. How tall is Tomlinson and does he ever spend time in the ruck?

[St DAC]

Paddy Ryder from PA might be getable. And he's a similar type of player to RoMa ... they could rotate through the FP & provide a tall option giving Skunk license to roam far and wide.

[saintsRrising]

I think the reality is that the only way we fit two rucks into the team is if ruck number two displaces one of Bruce or Carlisle.

Well Tomlinson chops out for the GWS rucks. Has won more HOs than Bruce. We are rumoured to be picking him up as a FA, and if so giving Marshall a chop out might be part of his match day duties.

While we still need a genuine back up ruck, for our best 22 it could be Marshall, supported by Tomlinson with Max taking some tapwork up forward, and Carlisle some down back.

[saynta]

We have three tall forwards for next year

Can’t have a second Ruck resting there and not providing Forward half pressure

3 small at least are a must

Jenkins is not much chop

Agreed.

[sunsaint]

Bruce can continue to play the role we just need backups for Marshall if he is ever injured.

Been done to death
It broke him

[sunsaint]

He's been mentioned by Devilhead he's out of contract and CAN play the dual role
Mabior Chol

[Shaggy]

He's been mentioned by Devilhead he's out of contract and CAN play the dual role
Mabior Chol

Max King plays a dual role also.

[Scollop]

He's been mentioned by Devilhead he's out of contract and CAN play the dual role
Mabior Chol

A guy like Chol reminds me of Aliir Aliir from the Swans. Very versatile. Can play ruck, forward, or in defense.

Would be a fantastic coup and a wise decision for us to target Chol in light of us probably recruiting Biggy in November. One of them could take over from Carlisle when he retires.

https://www.saints.com.au/news/2018-10- ... impressive

https://www.saints.com.au/news/2018-07- ... -for-biggy

[saintbob]

I’d go knocking on Tom Boyd’s door, offer him a 2yr deal on reasonable money (whatever we pay Longer) and see if he enjoys his footy without the weight of a huge contract

Give Gubby the job to go out and convince him

[bigcarl]

I’d go knocking on Tom Boyd’s door, offer him a 2yr deal on reasonable money (whatever we pay Longer) and see if he enjoys his footy without the weight of a huge contract

Give Gubby the job to go out and convince him

Not a bad thought

[saint6709]

He's been mentioned by Devilhead he's out of contract and CAN play the dual role
Mabior Chol

A guy like Chol reminds me of Aliir Aliir from the Swans. Very versatile. Can play ruck, forward, or in defense.

Would be a fantastic coup and a wise decision for us to target Chol in light of us probably recruiting Biggy in November. One of them could take over from Carlisle when he retires.

https://www.saints.com.au/news/2018-10- ... impressive

https://www.saints.com.au/news/2018-07- ... -for-biggy

Agree 100% on chol and have posted on him before - alir alir in 30 mins I watched last night smacked Gawn - smaller versatile ruck like the role he played last night is what we need to work in tandem with Marshall - I can agree with other posters saying that to ruck a Goldstien type with Marshall leaves us too tall and slow - and also agree with those who say that Marshall almost gives us another midfielder - so can we get another bloke who plays a bit like Marshall ie contributes around the ground ? - Chol looks the type who could do that

[Ghost Like]

Agree with sRr, if we are lucky enough to sign up Tomlinson, then he supports Marshall on the ground. I'm not a fan of Carlisle or Bruce doing it, they both have very important jobs already rather than getting caught at stoppages.

Agree we should keep King (hopefully both of them) away from the ruck until 2025! Let them bulk up and give the oppo headaches at either end of the ground.

I believe Membrey is very mobile, actually looks faster and more mobile than some of our smalls. This is why Paddy Ryder & Marshall could rotate through the ruck / forward pocket / interchange.

If we don't get a Ryder, then we do need to bank a couple of rucks, Nicholls or Knoll, at Sandy.

Forget Pierce & Longer, that's the past. We have a great chance now to dictate our future.