Same forward line entries

[bigred]

Can I mention how rooted our backline is?

[spert]

Pelchen never should have been employed in the first place

Watters should have made Lenny captain and the club should have had the balls to go to Rooy and get him to be a leader and take the initiative on a paycut. The players on big momey were more interested in retaining their huge salaries rather than trying to win a premiership for St Kilda

The board needed to say to the chosen bunch that their contracts needed to be adjusted or that the club had no option but to do a rebuild. Watters should have been retained or when he was sacked (due to the powerbrokers and the tail wagging the dog) they should have had the courage to go with the madman in Choco rather than a 'Yes' man in Richo

+1

[saynta]

With injuries, resulting lack of experience we have become very predictable.
Is it the mids who are delivering poorly or forward line who can't catch a ball.

Bit of both imho.

[scallopsroe]

I've been to both interstate games this year.In total the Saints have kicked, in the combined first quarters, 3 goals 2 behinds against our opponents total 11 goals 4 behinds. This is not acceptable and shows that we are uncompetitive away from Melbourne. This has been an underlying theme for some years, a lack of heart when interstate. Yes we currently have injuries, but there is still eighteen players against eighteen players on the paddock. I don't accept we are that bad, it's infuriating to watch. Is it the players not having a go, uninspired coaching, lack of leadership on and off the ground, poor preparation and strategy before the game??

[Scollop]

I've been to both interstate games this year.In total the Saints have kicked, in the combined first quarters, 3 goals 2 behinds against our opponents total 11 goals 4 behinds. This is not acceptable and shows that we are uncompetitive away from Melbourne. This has been an underlying theme for some years, a lack of heart when interstate. Yes we currently have injuries, but there is still eighteen players against eighteen players on the paddock. I don't accept we are that bad, it's infuriating to watch. Is it the players not having a go, uninspired coaching, lack of leadership on and off the ground, poor preparation and strategy before the game??

Great observation grasshopper.

It has to come back to coaching. I would have thought that the footy department needs to provide simple instructions to the players and ensure that they're mentally and physically prepared. I would have thought that it helps you build team spirit by playing away. Do we have a fundamental problem with team spirit?

I think if we did have an issue with these sort of intangibles, then once again that comes down to coaching and direction from the footy department. But maybe it's more to do with having the confidence to attack your opponents on their home turf. It's about building belief. It's like revving up soldiers for their battles in unfamiliar territory. You are away from home and you are outside your comfort zone so you need to know that you can trust your generals and your leaders to come up with the right strategy to get the job done.

If we have been poor, as your statistics show then changes to management personnel need to be made. What role does Sexton play in the organisation of players and coaches for these away games? What role do the assistants play and how influentual is the head coach's role?

You look at some of our competitors and you see much better results when they play away.

Port Adelaide, West Coast, Geelong, Hawthorn and Sydney have been performing well for many years. A team like Collingwood seem to gell and bond more when they play away and their win rate away has been huge. That means the head coach and the leaders of the organisation are on top of every aspect of the away trip imo. I think their discipline and their ability to motivate their troops is better.

Is it just money and resources where our competitors have an advantage or is it something else? Even teams like Brisbane and Gold Coast have had really good wins playing outside their home States the last 2 years. I think Carlton and North Melbourne have been better than us.

[samoht]

There might be some truth in what you're saying, scollop, but this "something else" isn't just the coach.
5% might be attributable maybe - I reckon 1% tops, personally?
Those teams you mentioned have been landing proven, uncontracted A graders with elite skills at a regular/monotonous rate over the years - and we haven't been - they are not relying on just the draft (which is too hit and miss - e.g., McCartin, etc..).

We've missed out on all these proven A graders. These A graders are seasoned, elite players who do well on any ground - and probably came across, in most cases, from interstate clubs (Mitchell, O'Meara, Burgoyne, etc..) - and so are used to travelling and playing away every second week.
So they are stronger teams (given their A grade talent) who are more used to playing away (which is a bonus).

[loris]

I've been to both interstate games this year.In total the Saints have kicked, in the combined first quarters, 3 goals 2 behinds against our opponents total 11 goals 4 behinds. This is not acceptable and shows that we are uncompetitive away from Melbourne. This has been an underlying theme for some years, a lack of heart when interstate. Yes we currently have injuries, but there is still eighteen players against eighteen players on the paddock. I don't accept we are that bad, it's infuriating to watch. Is it the players not having a go, uninspired coaching, lack of leadership on and off the ground, poor preparation and strategy before the game??

Great observation grasshopper.

It has to come back to coaching. I would have thought that the footy department needs to provide simple instructions to the players and ensure that they're mentally and physically prepared. I would have thought that it helps you build team spirit by playing away. Do we have a fundamental problem with team spirit?

I think if we did have an issue with these sort of intangibles, then once again that comes down to coaching and direction from the footy department. But maybe it's more to do with having the confidence to attack your opponents on their home turf. It's about building belief. It's like revving up soldiers for their battles in unfamiliar territory. You are away from home and you are outside your comfort zone so you need to know that you can trust your generals and your leaders to come up with the right strategy to get the job done.

If we have been poor, as your statistics show then changes to management personnel need to be made. What role does Sexton play in the organisation of players and coaches for these away games? What role do the assistants play and how influentual is the head coach's role?

You look at some of our competitors and you see much better results when they play away.

Port Adelaide, West Coast, Geelong, Hawthorn and Sydney have been performing well for many years. A team like Collingwood seem to gell and bond more when they play away and their win rate away has been huge. That means the head coach and the leaders of the organisation are on top of every aspect of the away trip imo. I think their discipline and their ability to motivate their troops is better.

Is it just money and resources where our competitors have an advantage or is it something else? Even teams like Brisbane and Gold Coast have had really good wins playing outside their home States the last 2 years. I think Carlton and North Melbourne have been better than us.

2 very good posts. May I add an extra dimension to consider?

Does playing at an undercover ground so much have any influence?

Apart from one or maybe 2 games at the MCG, the majority of Saints games are under a closed roof. Sure they train outdoors, IMO that’s not the same pressure as playing for four points in an out door arena exposed to the elements.

Have the Saints lost (or never had) the ability to adjust to playing out in the elements? We seem to start poorly on many interstate games, then appear in later quarters to get our sxxx together when they seem to adjust to the conditions, ie wind, slippery surfaces.

It would be interesting to see if the other tenants (apart from North Melbourne) of Marvel stadium have such a dismal record as us when playing interstate.

Just a thought to add to your good points????

[loris]

Sorry for the double post folks. - system won’t let me delete it.

[sunsaint]

Just a thought to add to your good points????

yes and yes
not only that visiting teams dont have major problem adjusting to "local" indoor conditions ( maybe the noise if we could a crowd to a game)
so compounding our problems away from the dome we dont really have any home ground advantage

[saintadamski]

There might be some truth in what you're saying, scollop, but this "something else" isn't just the coach.
5% might be attributable maybe - I reckon 1% tops, personally?
Those teams you mentioned have been landing proven, uncontracted A graders with elite skills at a regular/monotonous rate over the years - and we haven't been - they are not relying on just the draft (which is too hit and miss - e.g., McCartin, etc..).

We've missed out on all these proven A graders. These A graders are seasoned, elite players who do well on any ground - and probably came across, in most cases, from interstate clubs (Mitchell, O'Meara, Burgoyne, etc..) - and so are used to travelling and playing away every second week.
So they are stronger teams (given their A grade talent) who are more used to playing away (which is a bonus).

Agree.
All I seem to hear on this forum is Richo this and Richo that. Our list is simply mediocre at best.

Look at Geelong and Collingwood...incredible lists, with champions and A grade draftees from end to end.

We are simply not in the same league, nor will we ever be until we start recruiting some serious talent.

I think Matty Parker, and Wilke are great pick ups...you can see their class and X factor immediately

But guys like Joyce etc....meh

[saynta]

I've been to both interstate games this year.In total the Saints have kicked, in the combined first quarters, 3 goals 2 behinds against our opponents total 11 goals 4 behinds. This is not acceptable and shows that we are uncompetitive away from Melbourne. This has been an underlying theme for some years, a lack of heart when interstate. Yes we currently have injuries, but there is still eighteen players against eighteen players on the paddock. I don't accept we are that bad, it's infuriating to watch. Is it the players not having a go, uninspired coaching, lack of leadership on and off the ground, poor preparation and strategy before the game??

Great observation grasshopper.

It has to come back to coaching. I would have thought that the footy department needs to provide simple instructions to the players and ensure that they're mentally and physically prepared. I would have thought that it helps you build team spirit by playing away. Do we have a fundamental problem with team spirit?

I think if we did have an issue with these sort of intangibles, then once again that comes down to coaching and direction from the footy department. But maybe it's more to do with having the confidence to attack your opponents on their home turf. It's about building belief. It's like revving up soldiers for their battles in unfamiliar territory. You are away from home and you are outside your comfort zone so you need to know that you can trust your generals and your leaders to come up with the right strategy to get the job done.

If we have been poor, as your statistics show then changes to management personnel need to be made. What role does Sexton play in the organisation of players and coaches for these away games? What role do the assistants play and how influentual is the head coach's role?

You look at some of our competitors and you see much better results when they play away.

Port Adelaide, West Coast, Geelong, Hawthorn and Sydney have been performing well for many years. A team like Collingwood seem to gell and bond more when they play away and their win rate away has been huge. That means the head coach and the leaders of the organisation are on top of every aspect of the away trip imo. I think their discipline and their ability to motivate their troops is better.

Is it just money and resources where our competitors have an advantage or is it something else? Even teams like Brisbane and Gold Coast have had really good wins playing outside their home States the last 2 years. I think Carlton and North Melbourne have been better than us.

2 very good posts. May I add an extra dimension to consider?

Does playing at an undercover ground so much have any influence?

Apart from one or maybe 2 games at the MCG, the majority of Saints games are under a closed roof. Sure they train outdoors, IMO that’s not the same pressure as playing for four points in an out door arena exposed to the elements.

Have the Saints lost (or never had) the ability to adjust to playing out in the elements? We seem to start poorly on many interstate games, then appear in later quarters to get our sxxx together when they seem to adjust to the conditions, ie wind, slippery surfaces.

It would be interesting to see if the other tenants (apart from North Melbourne) of Marvel stadium have such a dismal record as us when playing interstate.

Just a thought to add to your good points????

I was at Manuka Oval Loris. The conditions were perfect. Sun shinning little to no breeze and dry conditions.

The oval has one of the best surfaces in Australia.

The ground has the same dimensions as the MCG, where the Saints shined against Melbourne.

One of the problems was that we had no crumbers to keep the ball in our forward line. We really missed Jack Steven and little Lonie.

Coupled with the fact that more than half the side can't hit a target, we were really up against it.

Every time a goal was kicked by either side, we rotated our full forward. WTF is that all about ?

Anyway ,nice to see you posting.

[stkfc1]

Why aren't our midfielders having more shots on goal? When was the last time our midfield kicked multiple goals between them? Would love to see Ross and Steele get rested forward occasionally and try and snag a few. One thing I liked about Dunstan was he wasnt afraid to have a crack at the big sticks. Steele could be likely type up forward. Mix it up a bit.

[saynta]

Why aren't our midfielders having more shots on goal? When was the last time our midfield kicked multiple goals between them? Would love to see Ross and Steele get rested forward occasionally and try and snag a few. One thing I liked about Dunstan was he wasnt afraid to have a crack at the big sticks. Steele could be likely type up forward. Mix it up a bit.

Fair comments