St Kilda are the laughing stock of the AFL

[samoht]

"“One of the most special tall forwards in years.”

"One of the most special?" ... seriously? Did a pre-schooler write this?
It's either "the most special" or "one of the special" .... talk about butchering the King's English.

[saynta]

"“One of the most special tall forwards in years.”

"One of the most special?" ... seriously?
It's either "the most special" or "one of the special" .... talk about butchering the King's English.

He's a footy journo.

[kosifantutti]

So SMS is back.

[outside66]

I think the comp would've laughed at us if we didn't pick up a player who was widely considered to be worthy of a top pick. It's delicious to think that within two years there's every chance that we'll get Ben off the Suns.

Regarding midfield class, I would say that these blokes on our list have the potential to become that class we need in the middle; Clark, Coffield, Phillips, Acres, Billings, Gresh

IF these blokes fire up and compliment Steven, Ross, Steele, and Hannebery, then bloody look out I say!

Not sure why posters are hanging their hat on the brother coming from the suns to the saints. It wasn't a 2 for 1 deal FFS. He hasn't even got there yet and already he is coming to the saints. So that implies clever recruiting does it? Lets work with picking some good midfielders from the picks we have left and then we will see how good our recruiters really are.

Some "posters" prefer to find potential positives wherever possible I suppose. If you actually read my post then you'd note that I said there's every chance that we can snag Ben - not a lock but a chance. Also, you're bitching on about midfield class and when some conversation is put up to perhaps indicate that we might already have some on our list you'd rather revert to sooking it up to no one in particular...

[saynta]

There is also more than a very good chance that Ben Paton will step up next year. Then there is Doulton Langlands who is an excellent kick with tons of pace.

We actually have an abundance of mids already.

All they need is some good coaching.

[chico2001]

Not quite a beast yet, that is going to far, be a few years before that happens. At the moment he is a kid with a knee injury that is healing and that is about it. With some luck he may play early in the season. With his agility they can play him anywhere. Cant see him pushing out the incumbents in the forward line just yet though.

[Harvey To Hayes]

Blind Freddie can see we are screaming out for midfield class. What do we do? We draft a 204 cm bean pole with a bung knee. Mark my words, even though I have taken great delight smashing Carlton and watching them win spoon after spoon lately, they are now miles ahead of us. In fact, I can see them winning their 17th flag in the next 5 years while we are still waiting for McCartin to come good.

You seem to idolise the Blues, please stop posting such utter drivel here and go barrack for them...

[samoht]

There is also more than a very good chance that Ben Paton will step up next year. Then there is Doulton Langlands who is an excellent kick with tons of pace.

We actually have an abundance of mids already.

All they need is some good coaching.

Quantity vs quality. Paton and Langlands were never genuine midfielders, were they?
Did they step up at the junior level?
It's a big ask.

Can you coach players to step up and become elite skilled, genuine midfielders - at AFL level?

[chico2001]

There is also more than a very good chance that Ben Paton will step up next year. Then there is Doulton Langlands who is an excellent kick with tons of pace.

We actually have an abundance of mids already.

All they need is some good coaching.

Quantity vs quality. Paton and Langlands were never genuine midfielders, were they?
Can you coach players to become elite skilled, genuine midfielders?

I wouldn't think so. It never worked for me;)
Obviously these guys have ability but are unproven. You would suspect that they would have shown a bit by now to be classed as genuine midfielders. Paton played one game I think and Doulton nil and as for being genuine midfielders..mm...maybe one of our gurus can provide recruitment info on that. A player would have to have a fair bit of proven ability to go past Ross, Steven and co

[saynta]

From AFL Record.

"Overlooked by every club in 2016. Paton was drafted last year after playing in the backline for Murray Bushrangers. However a glut of midfielders at his TAC Cup side was part of the reason he was stationed in defence . St Kilda sees Paton as a wingman with quality foot skills on both sides of his body, an impressive leap and heaps of speed .

Yes, he is a true outside mid .

So is Doulton, who has an impressive tank with tons of acceleration and speed.

He was previously a member of the GWS Academy.

Both players are highly regarded by the Saints.

[magnifisaint]

I can't stop laughing at this thread. I'm sure ListManager is the janitor at the Herald Sun. One really bright spark.

[samoht]

From AFL Record.

"Overlooked by every club in 2016. Paton was drafted last year after playing in the backline for Murray Bushrangers. However a glut of midfielders at his TAC Cup side was part of the reason he was stationed in defence . St Kilda sees Paton as a wingman with quality foot skills on both sides of his body, an impressive leap and heaps of speed .

Yes, he is a true outside mid .

So is Doulton, who has an impressive tank with tons of acceleration and speed.

He was previously a member of the GWS Academy.

Both players are highly regarded by the Saints.

So they haven’t played “in the guts” at TAC level. Are they ball winners - or just receivers?
Bailey Smith wins his own ball and has pace.... that’s the difference.

[degruch]

There's no guarantee that any new young recruit will meet expectations- we need to give it time. No good having class midfielders who kick to the forwards who get outmarked by the opposition. There is just as much case for getting class in the midfield as there is getting a quality big forward.

We already have enough big, strong forwards who can take strong marks - Marshall, McCartin , Battle - even Membrey.
What we don't have is elite-skilled midfielders to deliver it lace-out to them on a consistent basis. We need quality entries.

The indiscriminate bombing into the forward line was not a flawed/misguided coaching idea - it was due to our poor kicking skills.

Which one of our midfielders is an elite kick?

Collingwood showed this year that big forward aren’t crucial

...right up until Kennedy and Darling got on top of them.

[spert]

There's no guarantee that any new young recruit will meet expectations- we need to give it time. No good having class midfielders who kick to the forwards who get outmarked by the opposition. There is just as much case for getting class in the midfield as there is getting a quality big forward.

We already have enough big, strong forwards who can take strong marks - Marshall, McCartin , Battle - even Membrey.
What we don't have is elite-skilled midfielders to deliver it lace-out to them on a consistent basis. We need quality entries.

The indiscriminate bombing into the forward line was not a flawed/misguided coaching idea - it was due to our poor kicking skills.

Which one of our genuine midfielders is an elite kick?

We don't seem to be able to kick decent scores with all that supposed marking power- the opposition backs seemed to be able the judge the ball better than most of our forwards in one-on-one contests. If King is a mobile big marking forward, rather than a mark or nothing forward like Paddy, then it's a win for us.

[samoht]

There's no guarantee that any new young recruit will meet expectations- we need to give it time. No good having class midfielders who kick to the forwards who get outmarked by the opposition. There is just as much case for getting class in the midfield as there is getting a quality big forward.

We already have enough big, strong forwards who can take strong marks - Marshall, McCartin , Battle - even Membrey.
What we don't have is elite-skilled midfielders to deliver it lace-out to them on a consistent basis. We need quality entries.

The indiscriminate bombing into the forward line was not a flawed/misguided coaching idea - it was due to our poor kicking skills.

Which one of our midfielders is an elite kick?

Collingwood showed this year that big forward aren’t crucial

...right up until Kennedy and Darling got on top of them.

Similarly ...
Marshall, Membrey , Battle, McCartin etc.. would be unstoppable with quality delivery.
Quality delivery is the key ,,, what we’re currently lacking.
It’s easy to reach across and spoil a poorly directed or skyed entry ... a defender can leave their immediate opponent and outnumber the area where the misdirected kick ends up going ... and there’s a 3 to 1 that our forwards need to contend with.
That’s why we struggle to kick our goals, while our opponents make it look easier - with their better entries. Our defenders have to defend against pin-point, bullet passes.

[rodgerfox]

There's no guarantee that any new young recruit will meet expectations- we need to give it time. No good having class midfielders who kick to the forwards who get outmarked by the opposition. There is just as much case for getting class in the midfield as there is getting a quality big forward.

We already have enough big, strong forwards who can take strong marks - Marshall, McCartin , Battle - even Membrey.
What we don't have is elite-skilled midfielders to deliver it lace-out to them on a consistent basis. We need quality entries.

The indiscriminate bombing into the forward line was not a flawed/misguided coaching idea - it was due to our poor kicking skills.

Which one of our midfielders is an elite kick?

Collingwood showed this year that big forward aren’t crucial

...right up until Kennedy and Darling got on top of them.

Similarly ...
Marshall, Membrey , Battle, McCartin etc.. would be unstoppable with quality delivery.
Quality delivery is the key ,,, what we’re currently lacking.
It’s easy to reach across and spoil a poorly directed or skyed entry ... a defender can leave their immediate opponent and outnumber the area where the misdirected kick ends up going ... and there’s a 3 to 1 that our forwards need to contend with.
That’s why we struggle to kick our goals, while our opponents make it look easier - with their better entries.

West Coast are hardly the poster boy for quality F50 delivery.

[samoht]

“West Coast are hardly the poster boy for quality F50 delivery”

You’re kidding, right? I think I’ve posted enough on this thread.

[saynta]

From AFL Record.

"Overlooked by every club in 2016. Paton was drafted last year after playing in the backline for Murray Bushrangers. However a glut of midfielders at his TAC Cup side was part of the reason he was stationed in defence . St Kilda sees Paton as a wingman with quality foot skills on both sides of his body, an impressive leap and heaps of speed .

Yes, he is a true outside mid .

So is Doulton, who has an impressive tank with tons of acceleration and speed.

He was previously a member of the GWS Academy.

Both players are highly regarded by the Saints.

So they haven’t played “in the guts” at TAC level. Are they ball winners - or just receivers?
Bailey Smith wins his own ball and has pace.... that’s the difference.

Yes they have, Paton in 2016 and Dalton last year.

[santazzi]

In the years ahead, I pray that the King/Smith debate does not become as heated and as ever present as the Billings/Bonte one.

[Moods]

Similarly ...
Marshall, Membrey , Battle, McCartin etc.. would be unstoppable with quality delivery.

You serious? That's currently a very very average fwd line at best.

Marshall? Has great potential, but as of this stage has barely kicked a goal.
Membry? Our best fwd. But he's a 3rd tall. A very good one, but hardly a Darling type.
Battle? Once again. Has showed glimpses, but as yet has really done nothing. Looks promising. Also has barely kicked a goal in the AFL.
McCartin? TBH a massive disappointment so far in his career. Nothing to suggest he would be unstoppable and he has played lots more than the others.

[Premium89]

I think the comp would've laughed at us if we didn't pick up a player who was widely considered to be worthy of a top pick. It's delicious to think that within two years there's every chance that we'll get Ben off the Suns.

Regarding midfield class, I would say that these blokes on our list have the potential to become that class we need in the middle; Clark, Coffield, Phillips, Acres, Billings, Gresh

IF these blokes fire up and compliment Steven, Ross, Steele, and Hannebery, then bloody look out I say!

very delicious!!
Plus don't forget Ben Long - i reckon he'd do OK running a stint or two through the middle of the ground! Quick and loves a tackle.

[samoht]

Similarly ...
Marshall, Membrey , Battle, McCartin etc.. would be unstoppable with quality delivery.

You serious? That's currently a very very average fwd line at best.

Marshall? Has great potential, but as of this stage has barely kicked a goal.
Membry? Our best fwd. But he's a 3rd tall. A very good one, but hardly a Darling type.
Battle? Once again. Has showed glimpses, but as yet has really done nothing. Looks promising. Also has barely kicked a goal in the AFL.
McCartin? TBH a massive disappointment so far in his career. Nothing to suggest he would be unstoppable and he has played lots more than the others.

Sure I'm serious.
I'm trying to give some credit to our past recruiting efforts, I'm not writing these players off.
I'm trying to be a little positive and show some faith here.
One thing they all have going for them - if I'm going to credit them for anything, is they are all strong marks - and I know that they would all benefit from quality inside 50 entries, compared to the type of delivery they are getting right now.

Marshall would easily outmark King one-on-one, given he'll hold his ground with his 100kgs plus - King has a few years to get to where Marshall is already at, at the moment .. and Marshall missed a lot of shots at goal, otherwise he'd be a 30-40 goal a year goal kicker, right now, and possibly a 50 goal plus goalkicker if he had the ball delivered to him better.
Membrey is already there.
These two players have the potential to kick 100 goals between them - all that is missing is quality delivery inside 50.

[evo]

You seem to be pissed off that we did not draft your love child baily smith who you have been spruiking for some time ?

[samoht]

You seem to be pissed off that we did not draft your love child baily smith who you have been spruiking for some time ?

Well, it might seem that way to you.

Bottom line ---
I'm sure Max King will become a great player for us - but that doesn't mean that we have recruited according to our needs.
We haven't, again this year.

We could have Franklin in our forward line too - and even he'd struggle to get his 30 goals per year with our very average delivery into the F50.
So that's where we needed to improve most (and that's what I've been "spruiking"/advocating).

[guitars4]

Pretty much on script & blind Freddy could see we were always going to take Max King but in your defense I can see why you are angry as we are crying out for outside mids but unfortunately Rankine didn't make it to pick 4 . I really like Smith but he primarily an inside mid which we have so many of already & I would of been happy if we had picked him up . It's a fine line & hind sight is a wonderful thing but we will have to wait & see if we got it right. I have a good feeling about Max King let's hope I'm right