Just GO!

[rodgerfox]

We should’ve sacked Richo earlier in the year and given Kingsley a go. Probably too late to go down that path and make a proper assessment of Kingsley.

My gut feel is that Kingsley is a bigger problem that Richardson.


It's the strategy that stinks. And my understanding is that it's pretty much Kinglsey's strategy.

If you are correct Richo must go.

If he is delegating strategy to an underling and fails to take control when it is ineffective he is not a leader and needs to be removed.

I think it may be naive 'leadership' and misplaced and misguided delegation.


So many of these footy guys have never ventured into the real world, the corporate world, and never actually lived and breathed the organisational structures and systems that they spruik.

Without sounding arrogant, I regularly sense that most of these guys simply don't really get it, and are grossly under qualified to 'walk the talk'.

They know the lingo, but not how to practice it.

Richo reeks of this.

[BenLong#21]

Hopefully the Lions win another game.
They deserve to finish above us.
We are down with Carlton and the Suns.

Remember when we just beat the Suns in a tight finish and the Cho was pumping his fists in the air like we just won the flag.

Says everything about the Cho.

[takeaway]

We should’ve sacked Richo earlier in the year and given Kingsley a go. Probably too late to go down that path and make a proper assessment of Kingsley.

My gut feel is that Kingsley is a bigger problem that Richardson.


It's the strategy that stinks. And my understanding is that it's pretty much Kinglsey's strategy.

If you are correct Richo must go.

If he is delegating strategy to an underling and fails to take control when it is ineffective he is not a leader and needs to be removed.

I think it may be naive 'leadership' and misplaced and misguided delegation.


So many of these footy guys have never ventured into the real world, the corporate world, and never actually lived and breathed the organisational structures and systems that they spruik.

Without sounding arrogant, I regularly sense that most of these guys simply don't really get it, and are grossly under qualified to 'walk the talk'.

They know the lingo, but not how to practice it.

Richo reeks of this.

It is all really SS guesswork on how things work or don't work at the club, so it's a case of the blind advising the club that it's blind. I guess that's a football forum in action.
I'm happy to leave it to the club and the Lethlean review.

[evertonfc]

Yeah, when the Jiggster - perhaps our most patient and loyal poster - loses faith, it's all over.

I suspect he IS thinking of his family Jiggster.
You only ever get one crack at being a senior AFL coach unless you achieve or come close to a premiership.
Your earning capacity falls in a hole once you are gone.
Hanging in there either forces the club to pay out his contract (reported to be 100% for 2019 & 25% for 2020) or persist with him.
Resignation would cost his family heaps.
The only way he is leaving is if the club pulls the trigger.

And this is absolutely correct.

You won't find an AFL coach to who walks. Honestly, of the last 100 to lose their jobs, I'd say less than five have resigned. It doesn't happen any more.

The money is too big. And Richardson's incredible salary is something he'll never see again, but I'd estimate that he's made $2 million from St Kilda and that is a fee that can set him up for the rest of his life.

And we owe Richardson absolutely nothing. He's gotten five years and hasn't even given us a sniff of improvement.

He's one of the club's longest serving coaches, which I find extraordinary. He's now coached us for as long as Ross Lyon did.

[roman]

so who do we want to coach?

That's a very good question !
Ratten ?

[Joffa Burns]

We should’ve sacked Richo earlier in the year and given Kingsley a go. Probably too late to go down that path and make a proper assessment of Kingsley.

My gut feel is that Kingsley is a bigger problem that Richardson.


It's the strategy that stinks. And my understanding is that it's pretty much Kinglsey's strategy.

If you are correct Richo must go.

If he is delegating strategy to an underling and fails to take control when it is ineffective he is not a leader and needs to be removed.

I think it may be naive 'leadership' and misplaced and misguided delegation.


So many of these footy guys have never ventured into the real world, the corporate world, and never actually lived and breathed the organisational structures and systems that they spruik.

Without sounding arrogant, I regularly sense that most of these guys simply don't really get it, and are grossly under qualified to 'walk the talk'.

They know the lingo, but not how to practice it.

Richo reeks of this.

It is all really SS guesswork on how things work or don't work at the club, so it's a case of the blind advising the club that it's blind. I guess that's a football forum in action.
I'm happy to leave it to the club and the Lethlean review.

Fair point takeaway.

Richo has forgotten more about footy than I will ever know.

I do however employ over 300 people and know a bit about leadership.

In my humble opinion a leader must take responsibility, and it is clear externally Rich does not do this.

A leader instills belief and confidence in his charges and unites them, again the team
Performance indicates this is not happening.

FWIW I like stability and would prefer to work with someone’s weaknesses than move them on, but I now believe Richo must go.

[saynta]

When the Jiggster gets to this point, you know things are bad

why? he's been a member less years than my wife who knew nothing of footy until we got married. Just because you dance when we win doesn't make you a great supporter, just makes you a weak ass front runner. There are posters on here who have suffered for decades but still pay memberships year after year and certainly don't leave at half time when you are only 23 points down

Ain't that the truth.

[SaintPav]

Hopefully the Lions win another game.
They deserve to finish above us.
We are down with Carlton and the Suns.

Remember when we just beat the Suns in a tight finish and the Cho was pumping his fists in the air like we just won the flag.

Says everything about the Cho.

We were down by 39 points at one stage against that rabble.

[SaintPav]

We should’ve sacked Richo earlier in the year and given Kingsley a go. Probably too late to go down that path and make a proper assessment of Kingsley.

My gut feel is that Kingsley is a bigger problem that Richardson.


It's the strategy that stinks. And my understanding is that it's pretty much Kinglsey's strategy.

If you are correct Richo must go.

If he is delegating strategy to an underling and fails to take control when it is ineffective he is not a leader and needs to be removed.

I think it may be naive 'leadership' and misplaced and misguided delegation.


So many of these footy guys have never ventured into the real world, the corporate world, and never actually lived and breathed the organisational structures and systems that they spruik.

Without sounding arrogant, I regularly sense that most of these guys simply don't really get it, and are grossly under qualified to 'walk the talk'.

They know the lingo, but not how to practice it.

Richo reeks of this.

It is all really SS guesswork on how things work or don't work at the club, so it's a case of the blind advising the club that it's blind. I guess that's a football forum in action.
I'm happy to leave it to the club and the Lethlean review.

Agree, there is a massive information gap as well as a gap between perception and reality but still, your last sentence is a bit passive, not that we can actually do anything about it.

Lethlean has publicly stated that they are sticking with Richo. They have signed him on until 2020.

Still happy to leave it to the club?

[axcellence]

We should’ve sacked Richo earlier in the year and given Kingsley a go. Probably too late to go down that path and make a proper assessment of Kingsley.

My gut feel is that Kingsley is a bigger problem that Richardson.


It's the strategy that stinks. And my understanding is that it's pretty much Kinglsey's strategy.

If you are correct Richo must go.

If he is delegating strategy to an underling and fails to take control when it is ineffective he is not a leader and needs to be removed.

I think it may be naive 'leadership' and misplaced and misguided delegation.


So many of these footy guys have never ventured into the real world, the corporate world, and never actually lived and breathed the organisational structures and systems that they spruik.

Without sounding arrogant, I regularly sense that most of these guys simply don't really get it, and are grossly under qualified to 'walk the talk'.

They know the lingo, but not how to practice it.

Richo reeks of this.

It is all really SS guesswork on how things work or don't work at the club, so it's a case of the blind advising the club that it's blind. I guess that's a football forum in action.
I'm happy to leave it to the club and the Lethlean review.

Fair point takeaway.

Richo has forgotten more about footy than I will ever know.

I do however employ over 300 people and know a bit about leadership.

In my humble opinion a leader must take responsibility, and it is clear externally Rich does not do this.

A leader instills belief and confidence in his charges and unites them, again the team
Performance indicates this is not happening.

FWIW I like stability and would prefer to work with someone’s weaknesses than move them on, but I now believe Richo must go.

I have never employed anyone under me except couple of interns. But even I can tell Richo's coaching performance is shizen.

No genius required

[dragit]

Hopefully the Lions win another game.
They deserve to finish above us.
We are down with Carlton and the Suns.

Remember when we just beat the Suns in a tight finish and the Cho was pumping his fists in the air like we just won the flag.

Says everything about the Cho.

The lions might deserve it, but we really want Gold Coast to snag a win as they'll be getting another pick after their first.

[SaintPav]

Hopefully the Lions win another game.
They deserve to finish above us.
We are down with Carlton and the Suns.

Remember when we just beat the Suns in a tight finish and the Cho was pumping his fists in the air like we just won the flag.

Says everything about the Cho.

The lions might deserve it, but we really want Gold Coast to snag a win as they'll be getting another pick after their first.

We can’t even bottom out properly these days.

[BenLong#21]

Hopefully the Lions win another game.
They deserve to finish above us.
We are down with Carlton and the Suns.

Remember when we just beat the Suns in a tight finish and the Cho was pumping his fists in the air like we just won the flag.

Says everything about the Cho.

The lions might deserve it, but we really want Gold Coast to snag a win as they'll be getting another pick after their first.

True and good point.
Suns v Lions next week will sort it out.

[samuraisaint]

Yeah, when the Jiggster - perhaps our most patient and loyal poster - loses faith, it's all over.

I suspect he IS thinking of his family Jiggster.
You only ever get one crack at being a senior AFL coach unless you achieve or come close to a premiership.
Your earning capacity falls in a hole once you are gone.
Hanging in there either forces the club to pay out his contract (reported to be 100% for 2019 & 25% for 2020) or persist with him.
Resignation would cost his family heaps.
The only way he is leaving is if the club pulls the trigger.

And this is absolutely correct.

You won't find an AFL coach to who walks. Honestly, of the last 100 to lose their jobs, I'd say less than five have resigned. It doesn't happen any more.

The money is too big. And Richardson's incredible salary is something he'll never see again, but I'd estimate that he's made $2 million from St Kilda and that is a fee that can set him up for the rest of his life.

And we owe Richardson absolutely nothing. He's gotten five years and hasn't even given us a sniff of improvement.

He's one of the club's longest serving coaches, which I find extraordinary. He's now coached us for as long as Ross Lyon did.

The Great Allan Jeans - 332 games - 58% winning rate + 1 Premiership + 3 GF Appearances + 1 Top of the Ladder Finish
Grant Thomas (a personal favourite of mine) - 123 games - 52% winning rate + 2 Prelims.
Ross The Boss Lyon - 121 games - 64% winning rate + 3 GF Appearances + 1 Top of the Ladder Finish
Stan The Man Alves - 115 games - 48% winning rate + GF Appearance + 1 Top of the Ladder Finish
Alan Richardson - 108 games - 34% winning rate
Kenny Sheldon - 89 games - 54.5% winning rate + 2 Finals Appearances + First Finals Win for the Club in 19 years.

[BenLong#21]

The Great Allan Jeans - 332 games - 58% winning rate + 1 Premiership + 3 GF Appearances + 1 Top of the Ladder Finish
Grant Thomas (a personal favourite of mine) - 123 games - 52% winning rate + 2 Prelims.
Ross The Boss Lyon - 121 games - 64% winning rate + 3 GF Appearances + 1 Top of the Ladder Finish
Stan The Man Alves - 115 games - 48% winning rate + GF Appearance + 1 Top of the Ladder Finish
Alan Richardson - 108 games - 34% winning rate
Kenny Sheldon - 89 games - 54.5% winning rate + 2 Finals Appearances + First Finals Win for the Club in 19 years.

This pretty much highlights how absolutely bat s*** crazy the decision to give him the 2 year extension was.
Absolutely bizarre.

[Jacks Back]

It is all really SS guesswork on how things work or don't work at the club, so it's a case of the blind advising the club that it's blind. I guess that's a football forum in action.
I'm happy to leave it to the club and the Lethlean review.

What kind of review omits the senior coach from it just because he is signed up for another 2 bloody years? Surely a review leaves no stone unturned!

What is best for us - Another 2 years of mediocrity and lower membership or new hope - a New Deal?

[takeaway]

We should’ve sacked Richo earlier in the year and given Kingsley a go. Probably too late to go down that path and make a proper assessment of Kingsley.

My gut feel is that Kingsley is a bigger problem that Richardson.


It's the strategy that stinks. And my understanding is that it's pretty much Kinglsey's strategy.

If you are correct Richo must go.

If he is delegating strategy to an underling and fails to take control when it is ineffective he is not a leader and needs to be removed.

I think it may be naive 'leadership' and misplaced and misguided delegation.


So many of these footy guys have never ventured into the real world, the corporate world, and never actually lived and breathed the organisational structures and systems that they spruik.

Without sounding arrogant, I regularly sense that most of these guys simply don't really get it, and are grossly under qualified to 'walk the talk'.

They know the lingo, but not how to practice it.

Richo reeks of this.

It is all really SS guesswork on how things work or don't work at the club, so it's a case of the blind advising the club that it's blind. I guess that's a football forum in action.
I'm happy to leave it to the club and the Lethlean review.

Agree, there is a massive information gap as well as a gap between perception and reality but still, your last sentence is a bit passive, not that we can actually do anything about it.

Lethlean has publicly stated that they are sticking with Richo. They have signed him on until 2020.

Still happy to leave it to the club?

Yes. He said sticking with him but didn't say until end 2020. If we finish the season with two 60+ hidings he may not last till next season. Most likely though he is here next year and if no improvement - gone.

[BenLong#21]

We all know the Cho has to Go.
The thing is, Finnis and the Board don't want to lose face by admitting they made a huge mistake with the 2019-2020 contract extension.
Therefore they will bumble along pretending they are holding firm to cover their own asses.
Meanwhile the ship is just sinking ever deeper.

[bobmurray]

If Kingsley survives Lethlean's extremely thorough review then clearly the club thinks he's not the problem.

Unless the club doesn't have a farkin clue.

[Joffa Burns]

It is all really SS guesswork on how things work or don't work at the club, so it's a case of the blind advising the club that it's blind. I guess that's a football forum in action.
I'm happy to leave it to the club and the Lethlean review.

What kind of review omits the senior coach from it just because he is signed up for another 2 bloody years? Surely a review leaves no stone unturned!

What is best for us - Another 2 years of mediocrity and lower membership or new hope - a New Deal?

So you think there is some upside then?

Mediocrity would be a massive improvement on the teams current performance.

[rodgerfox]

If Kingsley survives Lethlean's extremely thorough review then clearly the club thinks he's not the problem.

Unless the club doesn't have a farkin clue.

Kingsley might be a gun.

But he's been there 8 years, and we still suck arse.

So either he's a dud, or something or someone is standing in his way.

There is simply no way that both him and Richo can be great.

[Stephen Theodore]

Agree with you Jiggster re Richo, he’s had enough time, but don’t under estimate the lack of on field leadership, to say it’s been dismal would be an understatement. Geary tries his guts out from start to finish, but is too busy keeping his own end up, the rest of the senior support on field is bloody ordinary.

[Ape_Man]

I can understand an AFL coach not resigning to get a pay day. That makes sense and no one could chastise anyone for looking after their family.

But...

Everyone knows what the expectations are of an AFL coach. A premiership is the only expression of success. There can only ever be 1 per year.

If someone wants to join the club of 18, then they know the odds of success.

They also know the cost of failure.

Any thought that could be ‘pay day first’ would mean real trouble.

[thejiggingsaint]

Agree with you Jiggster re Richo, he’s had enough time, but don’t under estimate the lack of on field leadership, to say it’s been dismal would be an understatement. Geary tries his guts out from start to finish, but is too busy keeping his own end up, the rest of the senior support on field is bloody ordinary.

Spot on

[samuraisaint]

Shouldn't there be a performance clause in any coaching contract?