Damning Post on Richo

[groupie1]

Well as you know I have been a harsh critic of Richo's outdated Gameplan for a long time.

This post by one of the well regarded Club Insiders that posts on BF is damning stuff and shows why we are rooted if Richo stays.

I’ve tried to bite my tongue on this topic for 2 years now but I honestly think Richo is getting worse, not better. Some of his pig headedness (particularly at selection) has been astounding. Players knowing that some of their teammates get a free pass on certain aspects of Richo’s “gameplan” while others are ridiculed in front of everyone.

The absolutely farcical gameplan that Richo came up with over summer that was identical to the previous years, even though everyone knows that it won’t work. Then over the whole pre season we can see that it’s not working but we don’t fine tune, we just keep rolling along.

The game in Geelong where Richo was petrified of a hiding so he played 1-2 extras around the footy all game, giving us absolutely no hope at all of winning from the first bounce. To see him chuffed that we were winning clearance but bombing it long to Paddy vs 3 Cats defenders was embarrassing. We continued with this crap all game to lose by 50 points while kicking 7 goals. This was the final nail in the coffin for me, seeing our youngsters running around clearly frustrated, clearly knowing they were being given no hope to win by their coach. Players were pleading to line coaches at the breaks to at least even the numbers up in front of the footy only to be ignored. Line coaches being ignored when pleading to change set ups as it wasn’t working.

Only a few in the media really highlighted the worst tactical effort from an AFL coach that I’ve ever seen, and Robbo was one of them.

How can our youngsters ever hope to learn when that is the way they are being asked to play?

I have nothing personal against Richo, he’s a decent bloke as we all know, but I can’t stay silent and let him ruin players careers. Our club is in crisis and if we do indeed keep Richo for at least another year then I shudder to think where our footy club will be at. I won’t say anymore, I’m just so upset with where my club is at and where it’s headed.

Bloody heartbreaking.

Sure you can argue about the quality of the players that we have acquired, but Richo with his Gameplan has made them worse.

It must be very difficult being a player at present when you know you have to go out each week to try and push s*** up a hill.

Hang on just a minute... Richardson publicly stated "we got that wrong" after that game, in relation to not enough numbers ahead of the ball. So the pigheadedness and refusal to change referred to here is not entirely accurate (although the same problem has bobbed up in other games, I concede, and he didn't change it IN THAT GAME, I also concede). We need to be a bit objective about some of the things we read.

[groupie1]

Wasn't there some sort of player plead to Richo mid season or before regarding some tweaking of this game plan.
If I remember correctly the players responded immediately.
What happened to all that.

Sadly, MG’s original BF post is not really new news. A version of it was reported in The Age some months ago.

What actually happened re: players and coach is that at half time in the Geelong game; Ross and Steven went to Richo and pleaded with him to give them an extra in front of the ball to kick to (ie instead of 1 extra around the ball). You’ll all remember Tom Stewart taking the piss that night taking uncontested mark after mark. Paddy was basically 1 on 3 all night.

So - what we have is the players actively taking the game plan apart - disrespecting it - and wanting to re-construct it to make it workable. Mid game. Let that sink in. Mid game. The players did that - not the Coach(es). You might also recall the vision of what looked like Richo and Kingsley arguing in the box that night. Mmmmm ... damning.

The next week was GWS. And the players just went and played as they had in early 2017 ... zero regard for the 2018 game plan. Almost pinched it.

Largely downhill thereafter (bar Melbourne).

As for Richo and his favourites ... I think all of us know that ... and it both burns and amazes us as to how he gets away with it. Weller, Newnes, Lonie, Gilbert. Persisting with Billings for a month after he should have dropped him. White, Rice and Sinclair the 1st ones dropped. Neither blooding talent and building for the future nor going full Ross Lyon and playing all the role players. To quote a new term ... zero selection integrity.

As for crucifying young players careers - if Richo hasn’t done that with his 1 dimensional “pressure”game plan then, he’s sure as hell done that overseeing a despicable development program.

Nonetheless, it all just makes me sick and sad. And I suspect most other long-term, rusted on supporters too.

Just rip the band aid off and get it over with. For all our sanity.

This is a really good post; measured, detailed and reads as most likely to be accurate in this thread. Hats off to you, sir.

[saintsRrising]

Hang on just a minute... Richardson publicly stated "we got that wrong" after that game, in relation to not enough numbers ahead of the ball. So the pigheadedness and refusal to change referred to here is not entirely accurate (although the same problem has bobbed up in other games, I concede, and he didn't change it IN THAT GAME, I also concede). We need to be a bit objective about some of the things we read.

??? We are not just talking about one game here. The Cat's Game is but one example.

And yes Richo's post-game interpretations are often an "alternative" view of the game.

Did you watch Richo's explanation of the Doggies game on 360? After that tell me how you rate the wise one. All I I heard was spin trying to justify himself.

[saintsRrising]

Look, as has been well discussed our current state is not just Richo. It has been from many things coalescing including this seasons poor injury run. But even with all players available we have an ordinary list with an even more ordinary head coach.

Poor decisions have been compounding and my great fear is that we will enter into next season after having made another batch of poor decisions.

There needs to be some real thought into how the club can recover, and it will not be a one year process like some think happened at Richmond (and Richmond was not a one year resurrection. They played finals, dipped, but still had a core of elite talent and then made some astute calls.

I fear that our powers at be are just going to try and ape Richmond completing ignoring that the state of the two clubs is quite different. We need people with good football judgement and so far all we have boosted that with two guys in Lethlean and our new List Manager who have no real history is assessing talent. So that then falls back on our existing recruiting team with input from Richo and that makes me very, very nervous.

I mean what is the St Kilda Plan now?

Hopefully sanity will prevail and the club will admit and focus on that we essentially have to remould our list (While we do have many decent players on our list, but just not enough quality and in particular in the midfield). IMO that does not mean an all youth policy as even GWS and the Suns with early picks beyond what we will ever have will struggle with.

Development needs to be enhanced, football nous both in coaching and recruitment ditto. Talent spotting also needs to be enhance. I just do not see a few new assistant coaches being enough given the low football IQ of our two newest football operation appointments.

That nous I just see as lacking and so I am fearful of what may be coming. But one thing I am certain of is that we need a head coach who can get the most out of our playing list, and I just do not see Richo as being that man.

[groupie1]

Hang on just a minute... Richardson publicly stated "we got that wrong" after that game, in relation to not enough numbers ahead of the ball. So the pigheadedness and refusal to change referred to here is not entirely accurate (although the same problem has bobbed up in other games, I concede, and he didn't change it IN THAT GAME, I also concede). We need to be a bit objective about some of the things we read.

??? We are not just talking about one game here. The Cat's Game is but one example.

And yes Richo's post-game interpretations are often an "alternative" view of the game.

Did you watch Richo's explanation of the Doggies game on 360? After that tell me how you rate the wise one. All I I heard was spin trying to justify himself.

Read what I wrote, and then respond.

[maverick]

We had been playing without a forward line for the first 4 weeks after a terrible pre season

Shocking games against north, Sydney, hawthorn and now the bulldogs is just unacceptable

Players gave up in the 3rd quarter, richo has lost them.

I am a big fan of keeping coach stability but not on this occasion.

We will lose 10k in members if we don't do something.

[samuraisaint]

Lose by 35 to a side with 9 blokes under 50 games playing for them.
Richo pats himself on the back for a job well done.

Very similar to the Geelong game in that regard. Was it 8 players with under 10 games experience or something similar?

[SaintPav]

We got flogged in both the 2nd and 3rd quarters.

It was obvious.

Richo is becoming embarrassing.

[oh when the]

For the years under Richo our game style does not change when a team gets a goal run on.
We do not change to stop them scoring the 3rd + goals, until it swings back our way. This is Richos fault.

It's too late to kick goals after the game is shot and claim we have played well.

When will this Club stop being a Feelgood Community Club and become a PROFESSIONAL FOOTBALL CLUB.

[saintsRrising]

Hang on just a minute... Richardson publicly stated "we got that wrong" after that game, in relation to not enough numbers ahead of the ball. So the pigheadedness and refusal to change referred to here is not entirely accurate (although the same problem has bobbed up in other games, I concede, and he didn't change it IN THAT GAME, I also concede). We need to be a bit objective about some of the things we read.

??? We are not just talking about one game here. The Cat's Game is but one example.

And yes Richo's post-game interpretations are often an "alternative" view of the game.

Did you watch Richo's explanation of the Doggies game on 360? After that tell me how you rate the wise one. All I I heard was spin trying to justify himself.

Read what I wrote, and then respond.

I have already. Firstly my apologies if I misunderstood the point you were trying to make.

However my point, to make it more clear, is that I do not believe now anything that Richo's says post game. The commentary he dished up last night about the Dogs Game was just rubbish.

Do I believe Richo vs another source? = I will go with the other source.


I think the loss I in faith of Richo that I have now, is also what the players have.

I am sure that in life we have all worked for someone where you know that person just does not really understand what they are doing, and it is as frustrating as all hell for you, and the organisation, trying to perform well.

[saintsRrising]

We got flogged in both the 2nd and 3rd quarters.

It was obvious.

Richo is becoming embarrassing.

Even in the first quarter the size of our lead was due to them missing some very gettable goals. We were hardly dominating play.

[CarlD]

Hang on just a minute... Richardson publicly stated "we got that wrong" after that game, in relation to not enough numbers ahead of the ball. So the pigheadedness and refusal to change referred to here is not entirely accurate (although the same problem has bobbed up in other games, I concede, and he didn't change it IN THAT GAME, I also concede). We need to be a bit objective about some of the things we read.

??? We are not just talking about one game here. The Cat's Game is but one example.

And yes Richo's post-game interpretations are often an "alternative" view of the game.

Did you watch Richo's explanation of the Doggies game on 360? After that tell me how you rate the wise one. All I I heard was spin trying to justify himself.

Some wishy-washy answers given by Richo. Heavy focus on the 7 minutes that the Bulldogs got off the chain and kicked 6 goals and patting the boys on the back for fighting back in the last (after the 3/4 time "bake" I presume). These runs have happened so often a plan should already have been in place to halt the rot BUT rest assured the coaching staff and players will be working on it this week.

Robbo noted that the Bulldogs had not been able to kick goals over the last month or so in second halves yet they did so with ease against the Saints. Why? Good question, indeterminate answer.

No convincing response why Johannisen was allowed to do as he liked.

Paul Roos (On The Couch) also slammed Lethlean's comments in comparing the Saints current position to Richmond of a couple of years ago. Jonathan Brown stuck his oar in - essentially Richmond had a core group of A grade players that provided the base for a quick rebound - St. Kilda have none.

[samoht]

Too much focus on the coach (sure he’s made mistakes and the biggest is not giving some of our youngsters a go).
It’s almost becoming a witch hunt or a Rich hunt. This thread is disturbing, full of innuendo, and I bet off the mark.

Reality is ——
St Kilda has no A grade players, has too many players with below average skills and has recruited inside midfielder after inside midfielder when we needed skilful outside midfielders to balance things up. To top it all off, we’ve suffered disruptive injuries to players - including to players who are important to structure. Roberton alone was a big blow.
Our expectations need to be lowered accordingly ... and we need to stare reality in the face.

Richo may have expected a lot more from our team —- but the injuries haven’t helped things — and we were a very average team to start off with, anyway.

We need to nail our recruiting - that should be our focus - we need skilful outside midfielders and Steven is getting on - we can’t leave it all up to him.
We need to recruit skill and outside run - and I’d trade all our surplus inside midfielders for one decent A grade inside midfielder!

[spert]

Too much focus on the coach (sure he’s made mistakes and the biggest is not giving some of our youngsters a go).
It’s almost becoming a witch hunt or a Rich hunt. This thread is disturbing, full of innuendo, and I bet off the mark.

Reality is ——
St Kilda has no A grade players, has too many players with below average skills and has recruited inside midfielder after inside midfielder when we needed skilful outside midfielders to balance things up. To top it all off, we’ve suffered disruptive injuries to players - including to players who are important to structure. Roberton alone was a big blow.
Our expectations need to be lowered accordingly ... and we need to stare reality in the face.

Richo may have expected a lot more from our team —- but the injuries haven’t helped things — and we were a very average team to start off with, anyway.

We need to nail our recruiting - that should be our focus - we need skilful outside midfielders and Steven is getting on - we can’t leave it all up to him.
We need to recruit skill and outside run - and I’d trade all our surplus inside midfielders for one decent A grade inside midfielder!

It would be nice to have "A graders", but at the same time, in my younger playing days, seen many a struggling team, turn it around with a change of coach. We can't go out and pick these A grade players off a tree, but we can at least get another coach in with a fresh style and ideas, then work on the player recruitment. Currently we are doing nothing either way, I would hope the club gets bloody ruthless at the end of our season.

[Saintmatt]

So Richo reckons we were pretty good aside from just a 7 minute period.


And therein lies the problem.

And the fwit said we outscored them 7 shots to 2 in the last saying we responded well.

RICHO IS A FRAUD AND IS ROBBING OUR CLUB OF MONEY AND DESTROYING OUR SOUL.

I’m very close to sending a ballastic email to Finnis.

I donated a very large sum of money towards Moorabbin so quite possibly will get a decent hearing as a result (saying that money shouldn’t buy you the ability to be heard!!).

I just don’t know if I should do it. Emotions may get the better of me and I could get a bit vocal in my anger towards this pathetic situation our CEO and president has put us in.

Send it. In fact maybe start a petition, I'll be the first to sign it. Maybe if they know just how pissed off all the fans are, they'll be forced to make change.

+1 ... send it. At some point, overwhelming evidence-based logic makes situations untenable. It took Essendoom members shedding in droves before they had to act and remove Knights (admittedly that didn't end so well with the next bloke but at least the club acted decisively)

[Cairnsman]

Too much focus on the coach (sure he’s made mistakes and the biggest is not giving some of our youngsters a go).
It’s almost becoming a witch hunt or a Rich hunt. This thread is disturbing, full of innuendo, and I bet off the mark.

Reality is ——
St Kilda has no A grade players, has too many players with below average skills and has recruited inside midfielder after inside midfielder when we needed skilful outside midfielders to balance things up. To top it all off, we’ve suffered disruptive injuries to players - including to players who are important to structure. Roberton alone was a big blow.
Our expectations need to be lowered accordingly ... and we need to stare reality in the face.

Richo may have expected a lot more from our team —- but the injuries haven’t helped things — and we were a very average team to start off with, anyway.

We need to nail our recruiting - that should be our focus - we need skilful outside midfielders and Steven is getting on - we can’t leave it all up to him.
We need to recruit skill and outside run - and I’d trade all our surplus inside midfielders for one decent A grade inside midfielder!

You have nailed how I am viewing things from my cheap seat. Way too much focus on the coach bordering on a witch hunt.

The smart way forward is to hold your nerve and focusing on improving ALL of the areas not performing to expectation.

Sacking the coach won't fix things like injuries or recruitment and all it will serve to do is set the next coach up for sacking.

The smart way forward is to work with Richo and help him improve while the other areas of the club in need of improvement are worked on. The sum of all parts.

[spert]

Too much focus on the coach (sure he’s made mistakes and the biggest is not giving some of our youngsters a go).
It’s almost becoming a witch hunt or a Rich hunt. This thread is disturbing, full of innuendo, and I bet off the mark.

Reality is ——
St Kilda has no A grade players, has too many players with below average skills and has recruited inside midfielder after inside midfielder when we needed skilful outside midfielders to balance things up. To top it all off, we’ve suffered disruptive injuries to players - including to players who are important to structure. Roberton alone was a big blow.
Our expectations need to be lowered accordingly ... and we need to stare reality in the face.

Richo may have expected a lot more from our team —- but the injuries haven’t helped things — and we were a very average team to start off with, anyway.

We need to nail our recruiting - that should be our focus - we need skilful outside midfielders and Steven is getting on - we can’t leave it all up to him.
We need to recruit skill and outside run - and I’d trade all our surplus inside midfielders for one decent A grade inside midfielder!

You have nailed how I am viewing things from my cheap seat. Way too much focus on the coach bordering on a witch hunt.

The smart way forward is to hold your nerve and focusing on improving ALL of the areas not performing to expectation.

Sacking the coach won't fix things like injuries or recruitment and all it will serve to do is set the next coach up for sacking.

The smart way forward is to work with Richo and help him improve while the other areas of the club in need of improvement are worked on. The sum of all parts.

You can't polish a turd

[samoht]

Yes but have you zeroed your turd radar -- adjusted it for injuries, for no A graders, for an average list and for poor recruiting over the years?
You might be getting a false reading

[saintsRrising]

Way too much focus on the coach bordering on a witch hunt.

The smart way forward is to hold your nerve and focusing on improving ALL of the areas not performing to expectation.

Sacking the coach won't fix things like injuries or recruitment and all it will serve to do is set the next coach up for sacking.

And just who has claimed this? Just who has advocated such an approach of only sacking the head coach as the method to address our current poor position ?

The smart way forward is to work with Richo and help him improve while the other areas of the club in need of improvement are worked on. The sum of all parts.

No one is saying that the only thing we need to do is to replace Richo. Absolutely no one.

Read through this and other forums (including this thread) and you will see plenty of discussion on all aspects of the club that need addressing.

Everyone is saying that we need to address ALL of the club. Everyone.

With Richo he has had 5 years. 5 years to have shown that he has the right stuff.

Ok let us turn it around, please list what Richo brings to the table for why he should be kept and supported?

Why do you see him as the best man for the job?

Player Development?
Strategy and Gameplan?
Match day coaching?

[saintsRrising]

Yes but have you zeroed your turd radar -- adjusted it for injuries, for no A graders, for an average list and for poor recruiting over the years?
You might be getting a false reading

So why is the turd not a turd? What do you see in Richo?

[samoht]

Yes but have you zeroed your turd radar -- adjusted it for injuries, for no A graders, for an average list and for poor recruiting over the years?
You might be getting a false reading

So why is the turd not a turd? What do you see in Richo?

I see flaws (for instance, his reluctance to give some of our youngsters a go), but I also see factors outside of Richo, too, which have had a much greater influence on where we're at. Coaches are not the be all and end all - there are bigger factors at play -- and the point I'm trying to make is these factors will remain in play - our poor recruiting for instance -- if we don't fix them - and if we treat the coach as if he's the alpha and the omega - the repository of all our good or evil. As a crude analogy - coaches (their inanimate namesakes) are pulled along by horses - so you better recruit the best horses.

[The Craw]

From what I have seen I really think we have the A graders required at the club.

The problem is that there is no structure.
No structure around the ball set ups, no structure up forward. I believe the backline is ok but can’t cope with the speed when the ball rebounds on turnover. The set up then breaks down.

The problem is we definitely do not have no leadership on the ground.

A damning observation is the lack of talk at stoppages by the players.
The forward line has no communication what so ever.

The thing that struck me at the Sydney game was the amount of talk coming from Dane Rampe.

Things like …..when they had a stoppage possession …… take the sting out of it take the sting out of it. Need a plus one. Spread to the fat side. Get it and move it quick etc.

There in lies the problem and this is all due to development, set up and game plan.

Perception from the club, all is ok just not following instructions …. (what instructions)

Reality from a keen observer, no structure, no accountability and definitely no leadership on or off the ground.
To me that is the Administrational and coaching short comings.
The Saints Board are delusional, and the club is in crisis at the moment.

[samoht]

From what I have seen I really think we have the A graders required at the club.

The problem is that there is no structure.
No structure around the ball set ups, no structure up forward. I believe the backline is ok but can’t cope with the speed the ball rebounds on turnover. The set up then breaks down.

The problem is we definitely do not have no leadership on the ground.

A damning observation is the lack of talk at stoppages by the players.
The forward line has no communication what so ever.

The thing that struck me at the Sydney game was the amount of talk coming from Dane Rampe.

Things like …..when they had a stoppage possession …… take the sting out of it take the sting out of it. Need a plus one. Spread to the fat side. Get it and move it quick etc.

There in lies the problem and this is all due to development, set up and game plan.

Perception from the club, all is ok just not following instructions …. (what instructions)

Reality from a keen observer, no structure, no accountability and definitely no leadership on or of the ground.
To be that is the Administrational and coaching short comings.
The Saints Board are delusional, and the club is in crisis at the moment.

Who are our A graders with A grade skills? It's one thing racking up possessions - you need skilful delivery/use of the ball.
Do we have the right balance of inside/outside midfielders? Have you taken into account the loss of structure due to injuries?
Have you taken into account the disruptive affect of injuries throughout the year ? The thing is even when players eventually return from injury - they've missed a lot of football and they have to get back into the swing of things
and their team mates around them need to also adapt.
These are not excuses - I'm just pointing out that the coach and admin aren't the be all and end all - and identifying much bigger factors outside of this. If we change the coach and admin and keep recruiting inside midfielders with average skills and no outside midfielders - and players with average skills in general - where will this get us?

[saintsRrising]

Yes but have you zeroed your turd radar -- adjusted it for injuries, for no A graders, for an average list and for poor recruiting over the years?
You might be getting a false reading

So why is the turd not a turd? What do you see in Richo?

I see flaws (for instance, his reluctance to give some of our youngsters a go), but I also see factors outside of Richo, too, which have had a much greater influence on where we're at. Coaches are not the be all and end all - there are bigger factors at play -- and the point I'm trying to make is these factors will remain in play - our poor recruiting for instance -- if we don't fix them - and if we treat the coach as if he's the alpha and the omega - the repository of all our good or evil. As a crude analogy - coaches (their inanimate namesakes) are pulled along by horses - so you better recruit the best horses.

Again I think 1/ we can all agree what the non-head coaching problems are and 2/ that they need to be addressed.

The question I have asked you is what do you see in Richo and why should he stay?


I personally cannot understand the argument of only addressing some problems, and that just because there are other problems that we ignore the problem that is our head coach.

Moreso when I see our head coach as one of the biggest problems as I personally believe it is a negative in:
- Poor development of the players we have = not making the most of what we have long-term
- Poor gameplan and strategies = not making the most of what we have now
- Poor Leadership = not motivating others to excel (ie the way we through our players under the bus post Blues game last year, post match comments about our players)

[st.byron]

Yes but have you zeroed your turd radar -- adjusted it for injuries, for no A graders, for an average list and for poor recruiting over the years?
You might be getting a false reading

I don’t buy the idea that out of all our players in the young but played enough games to have developed their craft cohort - Dunstan, Acres, Bruce, Billings, Sinclair, Steele, Membrey, Webster, White, Rice, Mackenzie, Minchington, Robertson - that there are no A graders amongst them. My question is why haven’t they developed to their potential and why have numerous of them gone backwards? And my conclusion about that is - coaching. The development of the players and their on-field performance has to rest at the coach’s door. Otherwise there is no accountability for his role.