Gameplan - Our Downfall

[saintsRrising]

Success comes from doing many things well. At present I think the Saints are doing a number of things poorly and I will not go into those other factors in this post, but IMO our gameplan is akey reason for our current lack of competitiveness.

Unfortunately the Saints start the game each week with a deeply flawed and antiquated gameplan that in multiple elements means that our players are having to compete each game with an increased degree of difficulty.

Againts ANY team that plays its gameplan well we are:
1/powerless to prevent scoring
2/powerless to score

Furthermore having such a bad gameplan saps confidence that causes the the players skill and execution to drop including but not limited to aspects such as our kicking at goal.

So we are only competitive against poor teams, or better teams having a bad day.

IMO we are under-achieving with the list we have. Not saying that we should be Top 4 or anything fanciful like that as we lake star-power. But we should be more competitive than we are.

Case in point. Maddies Match this year and last. Last season the Tigers mentally did not turn up and the Saints were free to run like Richo would like them too. With the pressure off our skill level was high and our path to goal easy. Yesterday the Tigers turned up to play and played THEIR gameplan ruthlessly. We were a joke.

WHY OUR GAMPELAN SUCKS

Richo is anchored in the past. Half a decade back we would have been more competitive with it. However the football world has moved on and knows how to combat it.

The switch and kicking backward:

This USED to be a good thing as it USED to allow you to create hole (space) to attack through when there was none. Today well organised teams are a wake up and so when teams switch they just hold their defensive zones so that know gaps open up. With each kick backwards they just press you back.

Now by contrast the Tigers are RELENTESS at pushing forwards quickly. They do this even when they do not have the numbers, because they have the faith to know that they will soon have superior numbers as the Tiger Wave just surge forward. Several times yesterday I watached a Tiger punch the ball forward. Initially I though WTF as it was towards (but not to a Saint), but more often than no as the Tigers surged forward they had superior numbers and won the ball.

Whereas the Saints often look backwards. We often go backwards even when there is a option forward in space. Our sideways and backwards motion more often than not closes up the play, rather than opens up. We end up sooner of later kicking in a panic to a contest where the ball is turned over.

The Saints do not seek to move the ball quickly and directly down the ground the ground. It is made worse as our gameplan has the players favouring moving the ball down the boundary and this means that our players are normally crowded for space and options to release to.

OUR SHORT HANDBALL GAME

I think Richo is way to influenced by the Dog's Premiership Year. A year of great success, but after which with wised-up opposition they have been terrible.

Our players are clearly instructed to handball quickly. This unfortunately is virtually always just to the nearest St Kilda jumper. Our players swarm AT the ball to receive. The opposition know this and so push in crowding us. Result is that we turn the ball over as each player in the chain has less and less time to use the ball.

The Tigers by contrast last night handball OUT the contest to a player in space. They do not all swarm at the ball and instead will structure up at the contest so that they always create an option in space they can release too. So with the Tigers last night you saw long handballs out to players in space. With the Saints you saw short handballs to flat footed team mates with now where to go.

CORRALLING

Too often the Saints will try and corral the ball carrier, rather than to immediately tackle them. Result is that the ball carrier has time to think and users the ball better. With the immediate tackle the ball carrier, even if not tackled, has to get rid of the ball more quickly and is more likely to cause a turn over.

THE BOMB

Too often the way forward for the Saints is to bomb it to a marking contest. Last night you saw how the Tigers continually structured up with an unmarked forward option. When they do bomb, their small crumbers all know it and swarm at the foot of the bombsite so that crumbing goals result. Whereas at the Saint's bombsite we normally lack this so that the ball is just spoilt and cleared.

I could go on. But the reality is that we have gameplan is ineffective in multiple ways, that saps players confidence and exacerbates any skill deficiencies.

The meek may well inherit the earth. But in AFL today it is the bold, attacking and the quick than win matches.

With our current gameplan we are are in a three-legged race while our opponents are free to sprint.

If Richo survives, and it seems he will, I sadly expect too more of the same in 2019 that we have all seen in 2018.

[Impatient Sainter]

Excellent and concise post SaintsRising I couldnt agree more whole heartedly. The frustrating thing is laymen like you and me can see it, WHY cant our coach and miriad of assistants work it out?

[Linton Lodger]

I appreciate your post, thoughtful and posing questions, but I don't think last night was gameplan. We played or tried to, the same way we did against Melbourne and last week. There was nothing wrong with the plan then.

Last night we were smashed at stoppages, it started with Hickey (who was insipid Nankervis just pushed him out of the way) and our whole midfiled was decisively beaten. There isn't much that can be done when that happpens. In fact I don't know how we contained the damage to 52 points, Richmond really bashed us up in midfield. You could say we should have been better preapred, we got a taste of that sort of pressure against Port, but last night was another level.

The fact that we tried to handball ourselves out of pressure in defence, I doubt was the plan, I think that was a matter of players panicking under pressure. We certainly haven't played that way recently, we've effectively kicked out of defensive 50, then moved the ball by hand.

Regardless whatever our gameplan is now, it will need to change. The AFL seem determine to get rid of congestion, hopefully the Rule changes are decided before teams start pre-season or indeed the draft and trade period. Any decongestion measures will suit our List and ironically render Richmond's gameplan redundant.

[st.byron]

Great post sRr.

[Con Gorozidis]

Terrific post SR.
Well done.
One of the POTY imo.

[rodgerfox]

I appreciate your post, thoughtful and posing questions, but I don't think last night was gameplan. We played or tried to, the same way we did against Melbourne and last week. There was nothing wrong with the plan then.

Therein lies the problem.

I think that the club gets sucked in by certain wins or 'gallant defeats' and hangs their hat on them.

As SrR rightly pointed out in the OP, we can only beat s*** teams with our game plan, or good teams having a really bad day.

Melbourne had 62 Inside 50s to our 50. Regardless of the actual end result, the post-mortem from that game really should have been 's*** we were lucky', not 'see! The game plan works!'

Melbourne should have killed us, and would have if they'd been only slightly more efficient going forward.

You can't allow a team 62 Inside 50s and concede 117 points and point to it as an example of a good game plan.

The biggest concern, is that that is exactly what the club appears to do.

They still talk about Richmond and GWS last year, and the GWS draw this year as signs that we're awesome! Now we add in the Melbourne game, which in reality was statistically a nightmare.

It's utter delusion.


It's been the same case for 3 years.....

Either the game plan is fundamentally flawed, or the players are ignoring direction.

Either way, it's totally unacceptable.

[portosaint]

Its all Tom Hickey's fault.

Should have played that big, bullocking tough guy.

[Con Gorozidis]

There is a strange mentality that if we occasionally get close to a top 8 team it is a good result.
Lind of like we accept that we are under 12s and the other teams are under 14s.
It is a troubling mentality.

[The Barometer]

We also love to handball backward out of packs which plays into the hands of teams like tigers and cats who love to swarm forward and base there game plan around this. As someone pointed out this is footy 5 years ago and is not only our blantantly obvious game plan it’s also playing to a side like Richmond’s strength who love nothing more than continually push the ball forwards.

[The Barometer]

Interesting to see in the tracker stats that the saints collectively ran 7 km more than the tigers last night. T me this supports the op of being badly coached. Where are they running to? In what patterns?

[saintsRrising]

I appreciate your post, thoughtful and posing questions, but I don't think last night was gameplan.

I am talking status quo. My post is on the gameplan aspect, but as I stated there are many other factors too.

Last night just hammered it home as the Tiges were doing everything including, but not limited to, gameplan oh so very well.

[Spud]

We also love to handball backward out of packs which plays into the hands of teams like tigers and cats who love to swarm forward and base there game plan around this. As someone pointed out this is footy 5 years ago and is not only our blantantly obvious game plan it’s also playing to a side like Richmond’s strength who love nothing more than continually push the ball forwards.

Importantly GWS were able to beat Richmond (only just) by reducing they handball to kick ratio and quickly kick the ball out of the area involving a Richmond swarm of ensuing tackles. Handball happy St Kilda overpossesed allowing them to tackle us and ‘stream forward’ as you said. We did put them under pressure with tackling but not to any great advantage.

[cwrcyn]

Setting up with a five man forward line fails every time, yet we continue with it. It's especially useless because of our slow ball movement from half back and our poor skills when kicking to inside 50 targets. The opposition mops up with glee. We also have this situation around the ball where all our mids are clustered in a narrow radius around the ball. No point having three or four players trying to get the football. When one of them does, he handballs it to a guy standing next to him. There is no wide receiver, so it's a clumsy scramble or back-pedal to try to find space. Hence, there is no quick release and forward momentum from any stoppage. The other thing that is beyond comprehension, is how we crowd our own forward line at stoppages within our forward 50, obviously believing it's all about numbers. There are rarely players sitting outside 50 to stop the opposition streaming out and linking up. The number of goals we get scored against us like this is embarrassing. It was interesting watching Richmond yesterday. Their players moved in formation, like jets at an airshow. Over a 50 to 70 metre range the formation was held, with no player lagging behind or breaking the formation. Every player knew exactly where their team mate was and there was absolutely no hesitation in their decision making because of it. Conversely, our players were haphazard in the same situation, with players lagging behind, two or three players within 10 metres of each other, leaving heap of space either side. Once Richmond won possession, there were huge holes they could work through. There was one incredible moment in the first quarter, when McIntosh was running along the boundary line at right half back, with 5 of our players tracking him, all with 10 metres of him. Now, my maths isn't PhD level, but when you have 5 players tracking a single running player, doesn't that mean we are outnumbered by four players in the rest of the field? The comical and tragic thing was that none of the payers tracking McIntosh could catch him. Once the ball was kicked forward, we were hopelessly outnumbered and our defenders had no chance. Goal

[Linton Lodger]

We also love to handball backward out of packs which plays into the hands of teams like tigers and cats who love to swarm forward and base there game plan around this. As someone pointed out this is footy 5 years ago and is not only our blantantly obvious game plan it’s also playing to a side like Richmond’s strength who love nothing more than continually push the ball forwards.

Importantly GWS were able to beat Richmond (only just) by reducing they handball to kick ratio and quickly kick the ball out of the area involving a Richmond swarm of ensuing tackles. Handball happy St Kilda overpossesed allowing them to tackle us and ‘stream forward’ as you said. We did put them under pressure with tackling but not to any great advantage.

Agreed. That's how we played against Melb and where Ross was a huge asset in defence. Admittedly Melb's pressure was a level or two below Richmond's. I don't think going handball mad in our back half last night was planned, it was reactive panic due to Richmond's pressure. On top of that Big Jake had a dirty night, the worst game I've seen him play easily and quite frankly Hickey was utterly insipid. Also, it took us about a half to realise that we simply weren't going to get the time on the ball that Carlton (& Melb) allowed us.

[Cairnsman]

Pressure. We lacked it severely and thes Tiges game is built on it. Tiges had strong pressure in defence and offense. Boys against men. It's a simple game and game plans are rendered useless if you can't muscle up. The two teams playing last night are at polar opposite ends of the physicality and premiership cylce. Try not to overthink it.

[Con Gorozidis]

Pressure. We lacked it severely and thes Tiges game is built on it. Tiges had strong pressure in defence and offense. Boys against men. It's a simple game and game plans are rendered useless if you can't muscle up. The two teams playing last night are at polar opposite ends of the physicality and premiership cylce. Try not to overthink it.

Lol.
It's the afl mate.
All teams apply pressure.
Pressure is not a game plan.

[To the top]

The stats on the game show that our 2 rucks has 32 possessions between them and 38 hit outs

Again I am of the view some are looking in the wrong direction in trying to identify why we are languishing

And I agree that Coaching and selection are problems

As I have put on here many times

[Linton Lodger]

Pressure. We lacked it severely and thes Tiges game is built on it. Tiges had strong pressure in defence and offense. Boys against men. It's a simple game and game plans are rendered useless if you can't muscle up. The two teams playing last night are at polar opposite ends of the physicality and premiership cylce. Try not to overthink it.

Lol.
It's the afl mate.
All teams apply pressure.
Pressure is not a game plan.

And the Premiers are usually the one's who deliver the most.

[Linton Lodger]

The stats on the game show that our 2 rucks has 32 possessions between them and 38 hit outs

Again I am of the view some are looking in the wrong direction in trying to identify why we are languishing

And I agree that Coaching and selection are problems

As I have put on here many times

C'mon, Hickey just got pushed out the way. Wasn't interested in using his body.

[Yorkeys]

We may be flogging a dead horse worrying about a game plan before accepting the lack of coaching and playing talent is combined with a selection policy that defies foolishness. Of course Richo cannot coach and there must be powerful interests at play within the club who do not put team performance as a non negotiable that support him. We select too many players that do not have the necessary physical, technical or mental skill sets necessary and have demonstrated that often enough. John Kennedy couldn't coach the team put out to beat Richmond, but he would have made big changes to some match ups. Conservatively, 30% of the team do not have the necessary and will never play in a finals team. They drag the others down. Running at 70% makes it impossible to win many games. Unfortunately AR does not even have the intelligence to be able to use what limited resources he has. Gilbert, Savage, Sinclair, Weller, Hickey, Dunstan from Friday and throw in Longer and Lonie are not assets in my opinion. They need to go. All list cloggers. AR needs to go. Surely the rubbish being served is not sustainable. What on earth goes on in the Board room. You can't change what is done but change for the better could start now. Mercy.

[Con Gorozidis]

Pressure. We lacked it severely and thes Tiges game is built on it. Tiges had strong pressure in defence and offense. Boys against men. It's a simple game and game plans are rendered useless if you can't muscle up. The two teams playing last night are at polar opposite ends of the physicality and premiership cylce. Try not to overthink it.

Lol.
It's the afl mate.
All teams apply pressure.
Pressure is not a game plan.

And the Premiers are usually the one's who deliver the most.

Lol.
Just lol.
Why waste all that money on coaches and recruiters.
Just get some pressure barometer software and away you go.

[Moods]

Best post of the year SR. Nailed it. Was sitting there thinking the exact same thing, but couldn't work out why our game plan was so poor. You've articulated it perfectly.

Looks Tiges were faster, stronger, more skilful. But it was as much the game plan as anything else that was letting us down. We simply had no where to kick the ball and were killed on turnovers.

If the tiges didn't take their foot off our throats, this could easily have been a 100 point massacre. That's how much superior they were to us.

[Linton Lodger]

Pressure. We lacked it severely and thes Tiges game is built on it. Tiges had strong pressure in defence and offense. Boys against men. It's a simple game and game plans are rendered useless if you can't muscle up. The two teams playing last night are at polar opposite ends of the physicality and premiership cylce. Try not to overthink it.

Lol.
It's the afl mate.
All teams apply pressure.
Pressure is not a game plan.

And the Premiers are usually the one's who deliver the most.

Lol.
Just lol.
Why waste all that money on coaches and recruiters.
Just get some pressure barometer software and away you go.

Because if you cannot deliver pressure or withstand it, even the most brilliant gameplan falls to pieces.

Do you honestly think that pressure is easy to apply consistently? Do you think its easy to keep your focus and discipline under pressure? Its not just a matter of effort. What you think happened in 2009, Ross Lyon just gave us a good gee up?

By the way our problem isn't dishing out pressure, its one thing we're actually elite at when we're doing it well (admittedly we haven't seen much of it this year). Its maintaining our structures under pressure that's our problem. We lack leadership on the field and one or two jets in the midfield. That was the case last year and in 2016. The leadership issue has become worst with the retirements of Riewoldt, Montagna and Dempster.

[Moods]

EVERY team aims to apply pressure. Whether you can apply it often depends on your game plan. In 09 Ross Lyon revolutionised the game with his press and the suffocating pressure that ensued. Yeah we had stars in Roo, BJ Lenny and Dal (and a few others) but it was the game plan that delivered the results. All the top teams have stars. There's no real point of difference there. The game plan has to be sound and the team able and willing to execute it. The tiges taught us a few lessons last night, on and off the field (in the coaches box I mean)

[Cairnsman]

EVERY team aims to apply pressure. Whether you can apply it often depends on your game plan. In 09 Ross Lyon revolutionised the game with his press and the suffocating pressure that ensued. Yeah we had stars in Roo, BJ Lenny and Dal (and a few others) but it was the game plan that delivered the results. All the top teams have stars. There's no real point of difference there. The game plan has to be sound and the team able and willing to execute it. The tiges taught us a few lessons last night, on and off the field (in the coaches box I mean)

The Saints in 09 had the sum of all parts, they were physically stronger than most teams and so their pressure was greater than most teams as a result. Tigers in 2018 are where we were at in the cycle back in 09. As I said earlier in this post, Friday nights game was played by two teams at opposite ends of the cycle. Boys versus men, surely the pundit sees that?, aren't we reading way too much into it with all this game plan stuff and it's all Richos fault discussion? Do we really think Clarko or Hardwick would make a difference if they were coach of this list right now. We are short a couple of high end players and a couple of extra years of development. That's the way I see it.