Bucky's top ten draft picks

[asiu]

from 2nd to 13th then 15th then back to 5th
is not milking the system !!

ok

[Crossy66]

I agree that there are always good options other than number one. But I don't think it is realistic we will come dead last now but I hope we don't come 4th or 5th last, 3rd woudl be great and second, amazing. Lets look at the 2004 draft for example. Yes Buddy is the best at pick 5 (pick 2 but 3 priority picks) Why didn't Richmond get him or Roughhead instead of Tambling or Deledio? Because they needed 2 mids more than forwards hence they got 2 mids not 2 forwards or one of each. So you need to factor in club needs. Also how many clubs had a shot at Buddy? Only 3 clubs. I know you can find other players that were great and overlooked by every club at least once but I think you see my points.

Terry Wallace said on radio recently that they were getting Roughead with their 2nd pick and had it all arranged. But then Hawthorn stitched them up. They didn't want two mids. They wanted Deledio and Roughead.

DJ even if we came 4th or fifth last in the year you have nominated, we would still have had the option for Buddy or Jordan Lewis. We have now looked over 15 years of draft history and the fact remains that anywhere in the top 5 will give you a good chance at netting a very good player and that the number one selection statistically doesnt end up being the number one player. If this draft is so strong in the first round, then as long as we do our homework we will get a good player.


BTW, how do you think we would have gone with Buddy in the RWB in '09 and '10?

[Crossy66]

I agree that there are always good options other than number one. But I don't think it is realistic we will come dead last now but I hope we don't come 4th or 5th last, 3rd woudl be great and second, amazing. Lets look at the 2004 draft for example. Yes Buddy is the best at pick 5 (pick 2 but 3 priority picks) Why didn't Richmond get him or Roughhead instead of Tambling or Deledio? Because they needed 2 mids more than forwards hence they got 2 mids not 2 forwards or one of each. So you need to factor in club needs. Also how many clubs had a shot at Buddy? Only 3 clubs. I know you can find other players that were great and overlooked by every club at least once but I think you see my points.

Terry Wallace said on radio recently that they were getting Roughead with their 2nd pick and had it all arranged. But then Hawthorn stitched them up. They didn't want two mids. They wanted Deledio and Roughead.

DJ even if we came 4th or fifth last in the year you have nominated, we would still have had the option for Buddy or Jordan Lewis. We have now looked over 15 years of draft history and the fact remains that anywhere in the top 5 will give you a good chance at netting a very good player and that the number one selection statistically doesnt end up being the number one player. If this draft is so strong in the first round, then as long as we do our homework we will get a good player.


BTW, how do you think we would have gone with Buddy in the RWB in '09 and '10?

BTW, where i differ in opinion most is around your comment that "it would be amazing if we achieved second last". In other words the more we lose the happy you will be. .

[rodgerfox]

from 2nd to 13th then 15th then back to 5th
is not milking the system !!

ok

Agree that 'tanking' in order to get multiple top 10 picks when you're fundamentally still a good side is a great way to rort the system! Ask Joel Selwood.

But once you're a genuinely s*** side, and already have a top 5 pick - there's no evidence that the higher the pick you have, the better player you get.

Therefore, there's clearly no justification to potentially fray your culture by tanking for it.

[Teflon]

I think it's universally accepted that kids develop best when surrounded by experienced senior players though. Just 'getting games into them' doesn't equal development. In fact it often stifles it.

Agree with that but not really the point. If we have a choice between playing a young player who is ready now over an older player i.e. Armo or a fringe player that has had multiple chances but not delivered i.e. Lonie you pick the younger player who may have a future. They may not be as good now but it will help in their development. I am a huge Brown fan but if they do not have a monster forward Logan gets a run. Those kind of choices should be made and is what I was referring to.

Thanks DJ
You got the point and nailed it

So Teflon, Friday July 13 Saints v Blues - who are you hoping wins?

Since we’re dealing in hyperbole here’s one for you Crossy66

Lose against Blues - Land Nick Riewoldt at 1
Win against Blues - Land J Kositchke

Go!

How u like them apples?

Teffers i have worked you out. You absolutely avoid answering anything or deal in facts preferring to fire back generalisations rather than"owning" and defending your view. By being general, nothing sticks.....like teflon really
Its not a complicated question - simply pick one of two teams. Actually its even simpler, for most supporters there can only be one answer

Thanks Crossy for your analysis of me, as always it’s always black and white and so sadly misses the margins of life which in reality are often grey....
I’m an old woman Crossy to old to keep arguing with you ( that and the mods have now got me on warning number 3 so I need to resist tit for tat apparently...)
I don’t agree with you
I don’t think winning is now our 1 aim this season
I don’t think a loss or 4 is really going to damage our psyche more than we are damaging it now
IF we lose and collect a better draft selection I’m ok with that
IF along the way we rid our entire coaching panel of the obvious deadwood we have I’m ecstatic
IF we beat up every low life side from now till seasons end you will be ecstatic, I won’t be as I’ll know we will paper over cracks and that will only send us backwards in the long run
I’m tired of going backwards, meeting out tiny little wins in what is an overall miserable history
Im only inte4ested in a flag and would do whatever it takes to get it - short term pain included.

Saints or blues?

Is there a game on?

Riewoldt pick 1
Or
Kosi pick 2 ??

Saints or Blues?

Riewoldt or Kosi?

OK, so i ask you a factual question like who you will barrack for in two weeks and you keep responding by not answering but rather by asking me an irrelevant fantasy question that cant happen?
But i understand why you keep avoiding answering the question. See deep down you are a passionate saints fan, so when you are faced with the reality of what wanting to tank actually means. i.e. barracking for another team against yours, you just cant say or do it. Thats a good thing!
Keep the faith, i reckon our list is not too bad, just need a little luck with a few FA's and a top 5 draft pick, and a bit of a shake up with coaching and development.

Regarding the Riewoldt / kosi question you keep posting, thats easy. I would rather beat the blues as i dont think recruiting 36 year olds is a good idea.

I ask you a directly relevant question to the topic and still you avoid.

FWIW I’ll always barrack for saints....long term!!

[Crossy66]

I think it's universally accepted that kids develop best when surrounded by experienced senior players though. Just 'getting games into them' doesn't equal development. In fact it often stifles it.

Agree with that but not really the point. If we have a choice between playing a young player who is ready now over an older player i.e. Armo or a fringe player that has had multiple chances but not delivered i.e. Lonie you pick the younger player who may have a future. They may not be as good now but it will help in their development. I am a huge Brown fan but if they do not have a monster forward Logan gets a run. Those kind of choices should be made and is what I was referring to.

Thanks DJ
You got the point and nailed it

So Teflon, Friday July 13 Saints v Blues - who are you hoping wins?

Since we’re dealing in hyperbole here’s one for you Crossy66

Lose against Blues - Land Nick Riewoldt at 1
Win against Blues - Land J Kositchke

Go!

How u like them apples?

Teffers i have worked you out. You absolutely avoid answering anything or deal in facts preferring to fire back generalisations rather than"owning" and defending your view. By being general, nothing sticks.....like teflon really
Its not a complicated question - simply pick one of two teams. Actually its even simpler, for most supporters there can only be one answer

Thanks Crossy for your analysis of me, as always it’s always black and white and so sadly misses the margins of life which in reality are often grey....
I’m an old woman Crossy to old to keep arguing with you ( that and the mods have now got me on warning number 3 so I need to resist tit for tat apparently...)
I don’t agree with you
I don’t think winning is now our 1 aim this season
I don’t think a loss or 4 is really going to damage our psyche more than we are damaging it now
IF we lose and collect a better draft selection I’m ok with that
IF along the way we rid our entire coaching panel of the obvious deadwood we have I’m ecstatic
IF we beat up every low life side from now till seasons end you will be ecstatic, I won’t be as I’ll know we will paper over cracks and that will only send us backwards in the long run
I’m tired of going backwards, meeting out tiny little wins in what is an overall miserable history
Im only inte4ested in a flag and would do whatever it takes to get it - short term pain included.

Saints or blues?

Is there a game on?

Riewoldt pick 1
Or
Kosi pick 2 ??

Saints or Blues?

Riewoldt or Kosi?

OK, so i ask you a factual question like who you will barrack for in two weeks and you keep responding by not answering but rather by asking me an irrelevant fantasy question that cant happen?
But i understand why you keep avoiding answering the question. See deep down you are a passionate saints fan, so when you are faced with the reality of what wanting to tank actually means. i.e. barracking for another team against yours, you just cant say or do it. Thats a good thing!
Keep the faith, i reckon our list is not too bad, just need a little luck with a few FA's and a top 5 draft pick, and a bit of a shake up with coaching and development.

Regarding the Riewoldt / kosi question you keep posting, thats easy. I would rather beat the blues as i dont think recruiting 36 year olds is a good idea.

I ask you a directly relevant question to the topic and still you avoid.

FWIW I’ll always barrack for saints....long term!!

I know you will and that was my point. When you actually think about doing anything else you just cant do it, you'd rather a win!

[parkeysainter]

Plenty of yellow belly supporters on here.

I’d respond Parkey (there’s so much to say to you..)...but apparently I’d get done for baiting.....
Is that right Simon?

Say what you like. Some supporters have a bit of ticker and some don't during the tough times. I want the Saints to win to build culture within the group and these young fellas. Tanking has proved disastrous for other clubs.

[Teflon]

Plenty of yellow belly supporters on here.

I’d respond Parkey (there’s so much to say to you..)...but apparently I’d get done for baiting.....
Is that right Simon?

Say what you like. Some supporters have a bit of ticker and some don't during the tough times. I want the Saints to win to build culture within the group and these young fellas. Tanking has proved disastrous for other clubs.

Which clubs have publicly stated they are tanking?
In the words of other esteemed posters - “I need evidence before I could attest to that”
Difference between ticker and brains...

[asiu]

no one uses the word 'tanking' except us supporter nuff nuffs ... get real

milk the system while we can
... silly not to.

[asiu]

imo

[DJ Higgins]

Guys, I never said tank what I said was it is a good time to start pumping games into newer players to give them game time if they are ready. That means that we don't necessarily have our best team on the field but it will be better long term. We should now focus on playing better again by getting newer players used to AFl as opposed to VFL. I would even try some players in different positions i.e. Paddy at CHB for a quarter here and there.
And if we lose games because of it the draft picks get better and if we win we win so there is no real down side.

Plus the higher draft pick is better than a lower draft pick debate is pretty much played out now. Id rather have the best hand I could when the draft starts and so would anyone else. If you make the wrong call that is on you.

By the way I read that Walsh teared it up again on the weekend

[Devilhead]

So anyone care to list Buckaneras Top 10 picks?

Can't be bothered to check if someone had done it on the first few pages

[Teflon]

no one uses the word 'tanking' except us supporter nuff nuffs ... get real

milk the system while we can
... silly not to.

Spot on
As Blues will do IF they use number 1 pick to land Shiel
THATS the power of a higher selection
Of course you still need to choose but before that give yourself best option and milk the system
Using the T word has never been something anyone’s done it’s fanciful beat the chest rubbish from supporters who don’t know how the system is used

[Teflon]

I think it's universally accepted that kids develop best when surrounded by experienced senior players though. Just 'getting games into them' doesn't equal development. In fact it often stifles it.

Agree with that but not really the point. If we have a choice between playing a young player who is ready now over an older player i.e. Armo or a fringe player that has had multiple chances but not delivered i.e. Lonie you pick the younger player who may have a future. They may not be as good now but it will help in their development. I am a huge Brown fan but if they do not have a monster forward Logan gets a run. Those kind of choices should be made and is what I was referring to.

Thanks DJ
You got the point and nailed it

So Teflon, Friday July 13 Saints v Blues - who are you hoping wins?

Since we’re dealing in hyperbole here’s one for you Crossy66

Lose against Blues - Land Nick Riewoldt at 1
Win against Blues - Land J Kositchke

Go!

How u like them apples?

Teffers i have worked you out. You absolutely avoid answering anything or deal in facts preferring to fire back generalisations rather than"owning" and defending your view. By being general, nothing sticks.....like teflon really
Its not a complicated question - simply pick one of two teams. Actually its even simpler, for most supporters there can only be one answer

Thanks Crossy for your analysis of me, as always it’s always black and white and so sadly misses the margins of life which in reality are often grey....
I’m an old woman Crossy to old to keep arguing with you ( that and the mods have now got me on warning number 3 so I need to resist tit for tat apparently...)
I don’t agree with you
I don’t think winning is now our 1 aim this season
I don’t think a loss or 4 is really going to damage our psyche more than we are damaging it now
IF we lose and collect a better draft selection I’m ok with that
IF along the way we rid our entire coaching panel of the obvious deadwood we have I’m ecstatic
IF we beat up every low life side from now till seasons end you will be ecstatic, I won’t be as I’ll know we will paper over cracks and that will only send us backwards in the long run
I’m tired of going backwards, meeting out tiny little wins in what is an overall miserable history
Im only inte4ested in a flag and would do whatever it takes to get it - short term pain included.

Saints or blues?

Is there a game on?

Riewoldt pick 1
Or
Kosi pick 2 ??

Saints or Blues?

Riewoldt or Kosi?

OK, so i ask you a factual question like who you will barrack for in two weeks and you keep responding by not answering but rather by asking me an irrelevant fantasy question that cant happen?
But i understand why you keep avoiding answering the question. See deep down you are a passionate saints fan, so when you are faced with the reality of what wanting to tank actually means. i.e. barracking for another team against yours, you just cant say or do it. Thats a good thing!
Keep the faith, i reckon our list is not too bad, just need a little luck with a few FA's and a top 5 draft pick, and a bit of a shake up with coaching and development.

Regarding the Riewoldt / kosi question you keep posting, thats easy. I would rather beat the blues as i dont think recruiting 36 year olds is a good idea.

I ask you a directly relevant question to the topic and still you avoid.

FWIW I’ll always barrack for saints....long term!!

I know you will and that was my point. When you actually think about doing anything else you just cant do it, you'd rather a win!

Correct a win....in the long run is what matters
Glad we agree on that!