Saints homeward bound!!

[ausfatcat]

How does the location (Jo Moorabbin) really effect the club? in real terms not nostalgia?





I say this as Hawks went to Wacerly and quadrippled in size, do we expect them to drop in membership when they move to Dingley? Did Essendon's profile or members drop with the move to Tullamarine?

Surely if it is reasonable close to the city (ie not Seaford) it's the actual quality of the facilities not the location that matters.

[samuraisaint]

And Richmond train at Craigieburn now. How's that working out for them?

Blaming Seaford for all of our woes was, and is, definitely counter-productive. Like sacking coaches. It doesn't work. Blaming something, or someone, for not being successful is what losers do.

[Dave McNamara]

And Richmond train at Craigieburn now. How's that working out for them?

Blaming Seaford for all of our woes was, and is, definitely counter-productive. Like sacking coaches. It doesn't work. Blaming something, or someone, for not being successful is what losers do.

Hi SS, I reckon that you're misrepresenting the point somewhat with that argument. None of those things you listed are really what this thread is about. No point my reinventing the wheel so to speak. So, if you ever get a few spare minutes, please just have a little look back through the pages of this thread. All the reasons-why are there.

But, basically the St Kilda Bowling Club was about to fold, but they turned it all around (big time) by leveraging their location... St Kilda. We can, and need to do the same...

- Get back to the grooviest suburb in Melbourne (arguably, in Australia).
- Tap into that 'vibe'.
- Tap into the marketing (sponsors, international tourists, grand prix crowds, St Kilda Music Festival crowds... the list goes on).
- Establish a boutique venue (and make money c/f paying out $75K for a 26,000 home crowd - Richmond train over summer somewhere halfway to Canberra, but not during the footy season... and they don't play home games there.)
- Make our home games 'an event'.
- Get that social club rocking again. (If the St Kilda bowlo' can do it, we sure can!)
- St Kilda stands alone amongst 17 vanilla same-same football teams. We are unique. We don't do vanilla. That's marketable.
- This is way way more important than winning our next premiership, because...
- Do this right, and we can become the best known Australian sporting club... both domestically, and... internationally.
- And premierships will follow.




Or... we could continue on living hand to mouth, constantly at risk bankruptcy and hence having to do the bidding of the AFL like a good little lap dog, and hey, occasionally rising up to the ladder, before crashing down again... empty handed.

[Saint 58]

And Richmond train at Craigieburn now. How's that working out for them?

Blaming Seaford for all of our woes was, and is, definitely counter-productive. Like sacking coaches. It doesn't work. Blaming something, or someone, for not being successful is what losers do.

Hi SS, I reckon that you're misrepresenting the point somewhat with that argument. None of those things you listed are really what this thread is about. No point my reinventing the wheel so to speak. So, if you ever get a few spare minutes, please just have a little look back through the pages of this thread. All the reasons-why are there.

But, basically the St Kilda Bowling Club was about to fold, but they turned it all around (big time) by leveraging their location... St Kilda. We can, and need to do the same...

- Get back to the grooviest suburb in Melbourne (arguably, in Australia).
- Tap into that 'vibe'.
- Tap into the marketing (sponsors, international tourists, grand prix crowds, St Kilda Music Festival crowds... the list goes on).
- Establish a boutique venue (and make money c/f paying out $75K for a 26,000 home crowd - Richmond train over summer somewhere halfway to Canberra, but not during the footy season... and they don't play home games there.)
- Make our home games 'an event'.
- Get that social club rocking again. (If the St Kilda bowlo' can do it, we sure can!)
- St Kilda stands alone amongst 17 vanilla same-same football teams. We are unique. We don't do vanilla. That's marketable.
- This is way way more important than winning our next premiership, because...
- Do this right, and we can become the best known Australian sporting club... both domestically, and... internationally.
- And premierships will follow.




Or... we could continue on living hand to mouth, constantly at risk bankruptcy and hence having to do the bidding of the AFL like a good little lap dog, and hey, occasionally rising up to the ladder, before crashing down again... empty handed.

+1
The Richmond/Craigieburn/Premiership point is not looking at the big picture, we need to expand & grow
Everything points to the JO.

[Saint 58]

And Richmond train at Craigieburn now. How's that working out for them?

Blaming Seaford for all of our woes was, and is, definitely counter-productive. Like sacking coaches. It doesn't work. Blaming something, or someone, for not being successful is what losers do.

Hi SS, I reckon that you're misrepresenting the point somewhat with that argument. None of those things you listed are really what this thread is about. No point my reinventing the wheel so to speak. So, if you ever get a few spare minutes, please just have a little look back through the pages of this thread. All the reasons-why are there.

But, basically the St Kilda Bowling Club was about to fold, but they turned it all around (big time) by leveraging their location... St Kilda. We can, and need to do the same...

- Get back to the grooviest suburb in Melbourne (arguably, in Australia).
- Tap into that 'vibe'.
- Tap into the marketing (sponsors, international tourists, grand prix crowds, St Kilda Music Festival crowds... the list goes on).
- Establish a boutique venue (and make money c/f paying out $75K for a 26,000 home crowd - Richmond train over summer somewhere halfway to Canberra, but not during the footy season... and they don't play home games there.)
- Make our home games 'an event'.
- Get that social club rocking again. (If the St Kilda bowlo' can do it, we sure can!)
- St Kilda stands alone amongst 17 vanilla same-same football teams. We are unique. We don't do vanilla. That's marketable.
- This is way way more important than winning our next premiership, because...
- Do this right, and we can become the best known Australian sporting club... both domestically, and... internationally.
- And premierships will follow.




Or... we could continue on living hand to mouth, constantly at risk bankruptcy and hence having to do the bidding of the AFL like a good little lap dog, and hey, occasionally rising up to the ladder, before crashing down again... empty handed.

+1
The Richmond/Craigieburn/Premiership point is not looking at the big picture, we need to expand & grow
Everything points to the JO.

[samuraisaint]

No problem with the Junction Oval Dave - as posted on this site in the past, I saw some fantastic games there against Fitzroy 40 years ago as a kid. Loved the place. Grew up going to Moorabbin in the 70s too, and have many happy, fond memories of some amazing times there.

But I think the possibility of us going back to St. Kilda to train and play is gone. Moorabbin will happen and as it turns out we probably should never have left there when we did to go to Waverley. However, as I have posted on this site before, the problem we had at St. Kilda was the storied issues with the cricket club, and now Cricket Victoria, and at Moorabbin it was disputes with the council (although I have to admit I hate the pokies too).

My point is that we as a club have uprooted from several grounds, and will now leave a perfectly good training facility at Seaford to move back to Moorabbin, and in the past have sacked coaches when we shouldn't have (Kenny Sheldon, Stan and Thommo), and I just want a bit of stability at the club.

[Numpty]

I like this JO, believe me. But it needs a wall. #makingthejunctionovalgreatagainwithawall

[HardSaint]

- Get back to the grooviest suburb in Melbourne (arguably, in Australia).

Sorry Dave - have you been down there in the last 10 years? I get your sentiment, but the days of the Seaview Ballroom, the Prince of Wales, 3am at Topolino's, scoring smack at Leos or Cleopatra's and the grimy edginess of the old St Kilda are long gone (sadly) - junkies and hookers on Grey Street, while giving the place a groove, arent quite the groove that the marketeers see "traction" in

but yeah, the appeal of the "edge" seeking gentrifiers, who've succeeded in totally sanitising the place into a buffed facsimile of our beloved broken girl does have currency with the money trail. The flop houses which were home to the crazies and characters are now over run with English backpacker lads and lasses.

call it what you want - but please dont call it groovy.... leave that to your beloved hipsters in Thornbury, and apparently Reservoir is coming along these days too

- St Kilda stands alone amongst 17 vanilla same-same football teams. We are unique. We don't do vanilla. That's marketable.

we were never vanilla - we were always Neopolitan - even if some ice cream makers had the pink on the right sand the chocolate on the left. Mum always bought Bulla, cos they had the chocolate and strawberry where the black and red should have been

[asiu]

we were never vanilla - we were always Neopolitan - even if some ice cream makers had the pink on the right sand the chocolate on the left. Mum always bought Bulla, cos they had the chocolate and strawberry where the black and red should have been


haha

not that i was ever into neopolitan
but Bulla is good
'n mum of HS is a legend

good work that woman !!

[magnifisaint]

So back to the Junction we go

[Ellaandjohn]

So back to the Junction we go

Surely we aren’t if we are spending this money on Moorabbin


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[saynta]

So back to the Junction we go

Never in a million years and thank your god for that.

It was a dump and we were mere tenants to a slum lord.

[Numpty]

I've been speaking to Jared about this JO, and he agrees with me. We just need to build a wall, a great wall. And nobody knows about great walls like I do, not even the Chinese, believe me. So we will build a great great wall around the JO. Then we'll move our embassy in there. I really like this Jerusalem Oval, believe me. #makingjerusalemovalgrateagain

[Numpty]

And my great plans, really great plans, don't stop there folks, believe me. Today I issued a wonderful proclamation, a simply wonderful proclamation, believe me, to free up the land around the Jerusalem Oval and the Albert Park Lake for more public use. (But not the towely Muslim Mexican public, no way, believe me folks.) This land will now be available to patriots for hunting, ranching, and coal mining. I love coal mining, believe me. #makingranchingandcoalmininggrateagain

[Dave McNamara]

Some interesting (and no doubt some rubbery also) numbers...

2017 AFL & Club Annual Reports

Revenue
Hawthorn – $70,742,464
Essendon – $65,165,407
Richmond – $65,164,372
Geelong – $57,804,052
Brisbane – $52,060,420
Melbourne – $51,988,711
St Kilda – $47,952,666

Profit/loss
St Kilda – $5,267,414
Essendon – $5,054,186
Hawthorn – $4,933,128
Richmond – $3,063,298
Melbourne – $1,363,060
Geelong – ($339,849)
Brisbane – ($2,261,990)

Gaming & Social Revenue
Hawthorn – $19,087,366
Brisbane – $15,687,630
Essendon – $13,351,296
Melbourne – $11,641,049
Geelong – $10,537,358
Richmond – $7,180,170
St Kilda – $1,934,045

Gaming Profit
Brisbane – $3,744,228
Melbourne – $3,720,679
Essendon – $2,276,154
Richmond – $942,060
St Kilda – $616,340 (In other words, in the grand scheme of things... SFA. )
Hawthorn – Too ashamed to say.

Revenue without Gaming
Richmond – $57,984,202
Essendon – $51,814,111
Hawthorn – $51,655,098
Geelong – $47,266,694
St Kilda – $46,018,621
Melbourne – $40,347,662
Brisbane – $36,372,790

Profit/Loss without Gaming
St Kilda – $4,651,074
Essendon – $2,778,032
Richmond – $2,121,238
Melbourne – ($2,357,619)
Brisbane – ($6,006,218)
Hawthorn – Not available
Geelong – not available.

Membership, Reserved seating
Geelong – $16,039,108 (includes gate reciepts)
Hawthorn – $12,446,104
Essendon – $11,971,985
Melbourne – $8,057,900 (includes fundraising)
St Kilda – $7,477,148
Brisbane – $5,530,944
Richmond – Not Available

Revenue per member
Hawthorn – $164.49 per member
Essendon – $176.66 per member
St Kilda – $177.81 per member
Melbourne – $190.80 per member (includes fundraising)
Brisbane – $258.92 per member (includes gate)
Geelong – $292.40 (includes fundraising)
Richmond – Not available

Gate takings
Melbourne – $5,366,974
Hawthorn – $5,117,239
Essendon – $2,368,742
St Kilda – $1,525,634
Brisbane – included in Membership
Richmond – Not available
Sponsorship & Marketing
Geelong – $14,535,577 (inc fundraising) (Looks like having one's own boutique stadium works out ok... )
Essendon – $14,326,352
Hawthorn – $14,155,211
Richmond – $13,638,619
Melbourne – $9,399,004 (inc Mt Hotham, Falls Creek & Mt Buller carpark fees)
Brisbane – $8,889,077
St Kilda – $6,170,905

Merchandise
Hawthorn – $2,088,983
Geelong – $2,065,559
Melbourne – $1,085,881
Brisbane – $771,375
St Kilda – $710,803
Richmond – Not Available

Merchandise (drugs and associated paraphernalia)
Essendon – $2,066,030

AFL Distributions
Brisbane – $20,932,600
St Kilda – $20,602,885
Melbourne – $15,713,629
Richmond – $13,627,896
Essendon – $12,945,389
Geelong – $12,116,718
Hawthorn – $10,861,443

Football Department spending
Geelong – ($25,981,512)
Melbourne – ($24,223,494)
Brisbane – ($24,712,245)
St Kilda – ($23,715,001)
Essendon – ($23,687,766)
Hawthorn – Not Available
Richmond – Not Available

AFLW Cost
Melbourne – ($699,970)

Assets
Hawthorn – $66,430,723
Essendon – morally bankrupt
Geelong – $38,218,519
Richmond – $37,332,992
St Kilda – $22,121,016
Melbourne – $18,012,858
Brisbane – $9,299,059

Liabilities
Geelong – $28,627,386
Brisbane – $22,432,913
Hawthorn – $19,898,341
St Kilda – $17,488,177
Essendon – $12,854,759
Melbourne – $11,810,162
Richmond – $10,178,623

Equity
Hawthorn – $46,532,382
Essendon – $32,507,785
Richmond – $27,154,369
Geelong – $9,591,133
Melbourne – $6,202,696
St Kilda – $4,632,839
Brisbane – ($13,133,854)


http://www.footyindustry.com/?page_id=4121

[Dave McNamara]

So, looking at the above figures... get to JO, do it right, and we can humongous-massive-ginormously improve our figures in areas like...
Gate takings.
Marketing.
Press coverage.
Social club takings.
Merchandise.
Memberships.
Cool-factor.
Attractiveness to potential players.

Cups in that display cabinet.

[Dave McNamara]

And Saintas, get rid of those pokies!!!


They bring in $SFA.

They have actually cost us millions!!! (And almost certainly two flags... at least. )

Get rid of them and we further raise our cred', which opens up further 'earning' opportunities.



(I note that the shamefully misnamed 'family club' was too ashamed to publish how much its pokies gouge out of lower socio-economic areas. But based on previously years, $20+ million would be in the VFL Ball Park Waverley.)

[ausfatcat]

And Saintas, get rid of those pokies!!!


They bring in $SFA.

They have actually cost us millions!!! (And almost certainly two flags... at least. )

how? and 2 mil aint sfa

[Dave McNamara]

And Saintas, get rid of those pokies!!!


They bring in $SFA.

They have actually cost us millions!!! (And almost certainly two flags... at least. )

how? and 2 mil aint sfa

Hi AFC, it's a lot of figures to trawl through, so I've removed a few to simplify things. (Please see below.)

We made $616,340 from gambling. And IMHO, in the grand scheme of things that is SFA.

The pokies are why we moved to outer Siberia. (Thanks Archie bloody Fraser. ) That move has cost us millions in lost sponsorship (sure, Kimmy D hardly helped either), millions in the lost opportunity to say "up yours Collo" and play home games at Moorabbin again, and millions in lost relevance.

Move to JO and we could turn the club around... and become what we always should have been. However, Port Phillip council, and the community there in general, would not accept our pokies. Therefore, throw even more untold millions into the cost-equation for having those pokies... in more lost opportunity.

Oh, and then there's also that nagging little moral issue. (We need the late and great Pluggsy back on here. He was a great campaigner against the scourge of the poker machine. Maybe his folks could persuade him to return...? They're such nice people. )

2017 AFL & Club Annual Reports

Gaming & Social Revenue
Hawthorn – $19,087,366
Brisbane – $15,687,630
Essendon – $13,351,296
Melbourne – $11,641,049
Geelong – $10,537,358
Richmond – $7,180,170
St Kilda – $1,934,045

Gaming Profit
Brisbane – $3,744,228
Melbourne – $3,720,679
Essendon – $2,276,154
Richmond – $942,060
St Kilda – $616,340 (In other words, in the grand scheme of things... SFA. )
Hawthorn – Too ashamed to say.


Profit/Loss without Gaming
St Kilda – $4,651,074
Essendon – $2,778,032
Richmond – $2,121,238
Melbourne – ($2,357,619)
Brisbane – ($6,006,218)
Hawthorn – Not available
Geelong – not available.

Nuff Nuff have no supporters, no facilities, and no relevance. Yet... they've been able to turn their debt-ridden finances around.

Nuff Nuff also have no pokies.

So if that yawn-invoking, vanilla-as mob can do that... think what the league's most 'out there', maverick and interesting club could do.

[samuraisaint]

North have a lot of supporters - as anyone who went to Boomer Harvey's big testimonial game can attest to. They outnumbered us 3:1 that night. I think they also made up about half the numbers at the game earlier that year in our home game when we played them. Their members did have reciprocal rights to enter the match on Nth Melb memberships that day though.
Their facilities are also very good. They received extremely generous government funding to get their training facilities centre completed some time back.

Having said all that, from a purely on field perspective I feel we've gone ahead of them, and I think we'll beat them twice again this year. But it won't be easy because one of our wins against them this year was on the back of emotion due to it being Riewoldt's last home game.

Onfield, it is going to be a very different looking St. Kilda team from now on, especially if Gilbert or Armo get injured at any stage. The personel is very different to the 2012-2016 Saints teams, and I think it highly likely that we'll beat both North and Hawthorn twice next year - and the Bulldogs too. With the two top ten picks this year it appears that the side finally has corrected some of the poor decisions of the past and we now have some depth, if lacking a bit of cream in the midfield, and if Paddy, Goddard, Rice and Freeman can make a solid contribution, as they should being high draft picks, we'll have a fair year I would imagine, if not making finals.

[Ellaandjohn]

Some interesting (and no doubt some rubbery also) numbers...

2017 AFL & Club Annual Reports

Revenue
Hawthorn – $70,742,464
Essendon – $65,165,407
Richmond – $65,164,372
Geelong – $57,804,052
Brisbane – $52,060,420
Melbourne – $51,988,711
St Kilda – $47,952,666

Profit/loss
St Kilda – $5,267,414
Essendon – $5,054,186
Hawthorn – $4,933,128
Richmond – $3,063,298
Melbourne – $1,363,060
Geelong – ($339,849)
Brisbane – ($2,261,990)

Gaming & Social Revenue
Hawthorn – $19,087,366
Brisbane – $15,687,630
Essendon – $13,351,296
Melbourne – $11,641,049
Geelong – $10,537,358
Richmond – $7,180,170
St Kilda – $1,934,045

Gaming Profit
Brisbane – $3,744,228
Melbourne – $3,720,679
Essendon – $2,276,154
Richmond – $942,060
St Kilda – $616,340 (In other words, in the grand scheme of things... SFA. )
Hawthorn – Too ashamed to say.

Revenue without Gaming
Richmond – $57,984,202
Essendon – $51,814,111
Hawthorn – $51,655,098
Geelong – $47,266,694
St Kilda – $46,018,621
Melbourne – $40,347,662
Brisbane – $36,372,790

Profit/Loss without Gaming
St Kilda – $4,651,074
Essendon – $2,778,032
Richmond – $2,121,238
Melbourne – ($2,357,619)
Brisbane – ($6,006,218)
Hawthorn – Not available
Geelong – not available.

Membership, Reserved seating
Geelong – $16,039,108 (includes gate reciepts)
Hawthorn – $12,446,104
Essendon – $11,971,985
Melbourne – $8,057,900 (includes fundraising)
St Kilda – $7,477,148
Brisbane – $5,530,944
Richmond – Not Available

Revenue per member
Hawthorn – $164.49 per member
Essendon – $176.66 per member
St Kilda – $177.81 per member
Melbourne – $190.80 per member (includes fundraising)
Brisbane – $258.92 per member (includes gate)
Geelong – $292.40 (includes fundraising)
Richmond – Not available

Gate takings
Melbourne – $5,366,974
Hawthorn – $5,117,239
Essendon – $2,368,742
St Kilda – $1,525,634
Brisbane – included in Membership
Richmond – Not available
Sponsorship & Marketing
Geelong – $14,535,577 (inc fundraising) (Looks like having one's own boutique stadium works out ok... )
Essendon – $14,326,352
Hawthorn – $14,155,211
Richmond – $13,638,619
Melbourne – $9,399,004 (inc Mt Hotham, Falls Creek & Mt Buller carpark fees)
Brisbane – $8,889,077
St Kilda – $6,170,905

Merchandise
Hawthorn – $2,088,983
Geelong – $2,065,559
Melbourne – $1,085,881
Brisbane – $771,375
St Kilda – $710,803
Richmond – Not Available

Merchandise (drugs and associated paraphernalia)
Essendon – $2,066,030

AFL Distributions
Brisbane – $20,932,600
St Kilda – $20,602,885
Melbourne – $15,713,629
Richmond – $13,627,896
Essendon – $12,945,389
Geelong – $12,116,718
Hawthorn – $10,861,443

Football Department spending
Geelong – ($25,981,512)
Melbourne – ($24,223,494)
Brisbane – ($24,712,245)
St Kilda – ($23,715,001)
Essendon – ($23,687,766)
Hawthorn – Not Available
Richmond – Not Available

AFLW Cost
Melbourne – ($699,970)

Assets
Hawthorn – $66,430,723
Essendon – morally bankrupt
Geelong – $38,218,519
Richmond – $37,332,992
St Kilda – $22,121,016
Melbourne – $18,012,858
Brisbane – $9,299,059

Liabilities
Geelong – $28,627,386
Brisbane – $22,432,913
Hawthorn – $19,898,341
St Kilda – $17,488,177
Essendon – $12,854,759
Melbourne – $11,810,162
Richmond – $10,178,623

Equity
Hawthorn – $46,532,382
Essendon – $32,507,785
Richmond – $27,154,369
Geelong – $9,591,133
Melbourne – $6,202,696
St Kilda – $4,632,839
Brisbane – ($13,133,854)


http://www.footyindustry.com/?page_id=4121

So if afl clubs don’t have pokies then individuals make the money. Surely it’s better that basically a not for profit company in other words footy clubs have them than a matherison.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dave McNamara]

Saint 58 - I believe that you may have a PM.

[Dave McNamara]

So if afl clubs don’t have pokies then individuals make the money. Surely it’s better that basically a not for profit company in other words footy clubs have them than a matherison.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hi Ella and John. It's great that you've been able to pass on to us a message from your son. And please pass on my best wishes, and that I hope to see him back on here one day soon. And also that I look forward to buying him (and Trev, and Sting) a beer (hell..., beers ) when we eventually do return to JO.

As for his point re Matherson, that's a very valid one, however one could make a similar point re a whole range of other legal, but morally dubious, sources of making an income.

And, forgetting for a moment the moral side of things, as explained above (and in other posts in this thread, and in other threads), there's also the sheer hard line/bottom line pragmatic consideration... having those pokies has cost us a net millions of dollars recently, and they also jeopardise us going forward.

They have to go! (And doing so doesn't seem to have hurt Nuff Nuff's bottom line.)



PS: If you guys are unsure what Nuff Nuff is, your son will know.

The JO is the GO

[Dave McNamara]

So back to the Junction we go

Surely we aren’t if we are spending this money on Moorabbin


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It'd certainly be an astute move to let things 'settle' for a period of time over the $$$ pumped into the Moorabbin redevelopment. Beyond that point though, it wouldn't matter.

Just like is/will soon be the case at outer Siberia, the money spent on the facilities isn't wasted, as local community groups simply move in in place of the Saintas. So, there'd be no issue re 'wasting' public money.

the JO is the GO

[saynta]

J O is thankfully, never going to happen. Moorabbin is our home. Physically and spiritually.