Mcstake

[Waltzing St Kilda]

Paddy's major problem is that Josh Bruce (age 24) and Tim Membrey (age 22)
were picked up cheaply and at this stage are ahead of him. And Riewoldt is
indestructible. And Battle is coming through.

So we can persist with Paddy and hope that improves but at what cost? Do we
sacrifice Josh Bruce because he wasn't a number one pick?

For that matter, if bringing the ball to ground in the forward line is so important,
why not bring in Hickey? He's got a good tank for a big man and can probably bag
a goal or two while providing much-needed relief in the ruck.

[White Winmar]

Plugger was far from an elite athlete but the best footballer I have ever seen.

Give the kid a go.

I think I can safely say, Paddy ain't no Plugger. Not fit to tie his bootlaces. Plugger was a Coleman and Brownlow medallist at 21. At the same age, Paddy struggles to even get a game and struggles to impose himself at VFL level. The signs are not great. Three preseasons, overweight, lacking mobility, one position player with little endurance, injury prone and has a debilitating chronic disease, unreliable kick for goal, no second efforts. Apart from all that, he's killing it. I want Paddy to succeed. Desperately. He's a great young bloke.

Several of my colleagues in the recruiting game suggested, and unfortunately they appear to be on the money, there's nothing about him that made him an obvious number one pick. Some didn't even have him in their top dozen. I was hoping against hope they were wrong, but I'm starting to see they may have been right. The best we can hope for is he ends up like Jack Watts. A very good player, but not a great one, as your number one should be.

Jack Billings has copped plenty on here, but he showed glimpses of what he was capable of from the very beginning. A match winning effort against the WB in his second year, and now he's overcoming his injury issues, he's shown he can be a match winner, as a number 3 pick should be. Paddy has'nt even kicked three goals in a game yet. Not looking good. Meanwhile, Petracca continues to develop and deliver for the Dees.

So Mr Winmar, I reckon Collingwood would offer Paddy $1m for 5 years, and offer St Kilda their 1st round draft pick.

Interested?

At this point, I'd take that in a heart beat if it was a top five pick.

[Con Gorozidis]

I think if Paddy played say 15 years in a country league.
He might then get close to how many goals Plugger kicked in the AFL.

[BigMart]

I just googled Christian Petracca

Why is his body ripped, and he looks AFL fit and ready... and Paddy looks like the CHB for Mordialloc in the souther FL?

[magnifisaint]

I just googled Christian Petracca

Why is his body ripped, and he looks AFL fit and ready... and Paddy looks like the CHB for Mordialloc in the souther FL?

Because his name is Fatty McCartin.

[Mr Magic]

So do I have this correct?
A professional football Club that employs
Coaches
Medicos
Trainers
Dieticians
Sports Scientists
Nutritionists
Welfare officers
etc

knowingly allows a player they have invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in
to present himself unfit,
and allows it?
and supports him in his current state?
and selects him to play?

Sheesh there are a fair few posters on here with a very low opinion of the professionalism of our football club.
Maybe, just maybe, the Club is more aware of what Paddy is/isn't and can/cannot do?
Maybe they would know what his 'skinfolds' are and his fitness capabilities?
Certainly more than us armchair warriors casting opinions with no real actual knowledge.

I'm personally happy to allow our employed professionals the final (and only truly valid) say on whether Paddy is fat/ok and/or fit/unfit to play the way they want him to play.

[Joe Bloggs]

As if paddy is fat. May not have bulging muscles but he's not fat. Unless someone has a recent pic some of us arnt convinced.

[stonecold]

A big plus one to you magic man, maybe a little too much common sense for some posters though!!!!!
Anyone who knows the modern day professional football environment would know that if your skinfolds are not acceptable, then you don't play at any level until they are!!!!!

Shows the lack of knowledge of some on here!!!!!

As for you 'magnifisaint', disgraceful and distasteful comment about Paddy, hang you head in shame!!!!!

[longtimesaint]

I am tired of the hype about Petracca because IMO he is miles short of it in reality.
I have watched several of Melbourne games this year and I took particular note this week against North.
He did very little to suggest at this stage that he would justify number one any better than Paddy.
I think he believes his own publicity and has not delivered much.
Let's see how they both develop over the next year or two.

[stonecold]

I am tired of the hype about Petracca because IMO he is miles short of it in reality.
I have watched several of Melbourne games this year and I took particular note this week against North.
He did very little to suggest at this stage that he would justify number one any better than Paddy.
I think he believes his own publicity and has not delivered much.
Let's see how they both develop over the next year or two.

Here, here, as I've stated before, Christian is all about Christian, that's part of the reason we didn't pick him, let's maybe use our energy to support St.Kilda footballers!!!!!

[BigMart]

No one is suggesting he is fat... but he is clearly not fit enough and/or presented well enough. He is in an elite, professional sporting environment and is not as fit as he needs to be, its mind boggling?!

This can be seen in his physique, in his running ability at training, in his game play... he has clearly still got puppy fat? It is staggering how an elite footballer, paid to train and play is not in elite condition.

He is in the worst 3 athletes on the list.

[magnifisaint]

A big plus one to you magic man, maybe a little too much common sense for some posters though!!!!!
Anyone who knows the modern day professional football environment would know that if your skinfolds are not acceptable, then you don't play at any level until they are!!!!!

Shows the lack of knowledge of some on here!!!!!

As for you 'magnifisaint', disgraceful and distasteful comment about Paddy, hang you head in shame!!!!!

C'mon Stonecold we're all allowed some level of bulls***. Otherwise this forum would never survive.

[stonecold]

A big plus one to you magic man, maybe a little too much common sense for some posters though!!!!!
Anyone who knows the modern day professional football environment would know that if your skinfolds are not acceptable, then you don't play at any level until they are!!!!!

Shows the lack of knowledge of some on here!!!!!

As for you 'magnifisaint', disgraceful and distasteful comment about Paddy, hang you head in shame!!!!!

C'mon Stonecold we're all allowed some level of bulls***. Otherwise this forum would never survive.

Fatty is not an acceptable word these says, people just need to get off Paddy'a back a little, IMO!!!!!

He is working harder than anyone at the club towards improving, I carnt waiting till he makes some posters on here look like even bigger Dickheads!!!!!

Cause, mark my words, it won't be long before it happens!!!!!

I have the list of names ready to go!!!!!

[Joffa Burns]

So do I have this correct?
A professional football Club that employs
Coaches
Medicos
Trainers
Dieticians
Sports Scientists
Nutritionists
Welfare officers
etc

knowingly allows a player they have invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in
to present himself unfit,
and allows it?
and supports him in his current state?
and selects him to play?

Sheesh there are a fair few posters on here with a very low opinion of the professionalism of our football club.
Maybe, just maybe, the Club is more aware of what Paddy is/isn't and can/cannot do?
Maybe they would know what his 'skinfolds' are and his fitness capabilities?
Certainly more than us armchair warriors casting opinions with no real actual knowledge.

I'm personally happy to allow our employed professionals the final (and only truly valid) say on whether Paddy is fat/ok and/or fit/unfit to play the way they want him to play.

Yes you are correct Mr Magic, but to a point IMO.

I have someone close to me who is in an elite sporting program and hopes to be an Olympian.
Through this person I have seen a wide array of elite athletes and training programs.
I certainly believe the club is doing everything professionally with Paddy and the lad himself would be working his butt off.

My concern is that Paddy while doing everything within his power has potentially hit a ceiling with his athleticism, fitness and development and may very well have plateaued and already reached his limit. This happens to athletes at different stages.

I have watched an athlete for a few years who is a multiple national record holder and was touted as a future Olympian from 10 YO. He has just recently quit his sport at age 20 with the realisation he will not make the Olympics. Kids who could not get near him 3 or 4 years ago now account for him comfortably. He peaked at 16 or 17 and could pot improve no matter how hard he worked.

Clubs recruit on upside and the comments attributed to Trout (in the published article) had a lot of upside for Paddy with his fitness and running capability. It also mentioned Paddy was working with his own PT before the draft and was starting to get muscle definition. Yes he will get fitter and will improve, but will he get to the level to be an AFL gun?

The Saintsational armchair experts do not know as much as the club paid professionals, but if Paddy was in form, fit and on track he would not be in and out of the team. No one can deny his lack of meters covered on the ground and lack of repeat efforts in a contest, blind Freddy can see that.

[White Winmar]

I just googled Christian Petracca

Why is his body ripped, and he looks AFL fit and ready... and Paddy looks like the CHB for Mordialloc in the souther FL?

I take exception to that remark. One of my mates used to play CHB for Mordialloc and Black Rock and even twenty years after retirement he looks fitter than Paddy!

[White Winmar]

So do I have this correct?
A professional football Club that employs
Coaches
Medicos
Trainers
Dieticians
Sports Scientists
Nutritionists
Welfare officers
etc

knowingly allows a player they have invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in
to present himself unfit,
and allows it?
and supports him in his current state?
and selects him to play?

Sheesh there are a fair few posters on here with a very low opinion of the professionalism of our football club.
Maybe, just maybe, the Club is more aware of what Paddy is/isn't and can/cannot do?
Maybe they would know what his 'skinfolds' are and his fitness capabilities?
Certainly more than us armchair warriors casting opinions with no real actual knowledge.

I'm personally happy to allow our employed professionals the final (and only truly valid) say on whether Paddy is fat/ok and/or fit/unfit to play the way they want him to play.

All you say is true MM. So I pose the question, knowing the risks and having many people cautioning them against taking a risk on him, why did they go ahead and do it? They knew the risks. He was not a speculative pick in the 40's. He was a number one. A franchise player. The man the club's pins it future to.

They were intoxicated by the thought of getting the next plugger. What they have now is a young man, whose chronic and debilitating condition prevents him from properly preparing for the rigours of a brutal sport like AFL. They were warned, but trout keeps assuring us that it's not a factor. Being an endocrinologist and an expert in the area, our trout From first hand experience, the "experts" clubs employ are sometimes anything but. Self included. We got this wrong. Terribly wrong. I hope the kid makes it and I think he's got potential, but he's more like Jack Watts than Roo or Plugger.

[saintspremiers]

Type 1 diabetics do have hypos. A severe hypo and they lose conscience. It does happen. I spoke to a well educated adult type diabetic who has hypo's (often minor) about once a week. It's just a fact of life they have to deal with. Not easy. Now imagine if you're an elite sportsman?

[saynta]

Bit of a worry that on talking crap on monday night, the ex doggie ruckman Darcy?, reckons that there is a big offer on the table for Paddy from a rival club.

Thought he had another year to go on his contract.

[magnifisaint]

Bit of a worry that on talking crap on monday night, the ex doggie ruckman Darcy?, reckons that there is a big offer on the table for Paddy from a rival club.

Thought he had another year to go on his contract.

I wonder what newspaper he's been reading?
I'd be happy if we swapped him for Schache

[ace]

Plugger was far from an elite athlete but the best footballer I have ever seen.

Give the kid a go.

I think I can safely say, Paddy ain't no Plugger. Not fit to tie his bootlaces. Plugger was a Coleman and Brownlow medallist at 21. At the same age, Paddy struggles to even get a game and struggles to impose himself at VFL level. The signs are not great. Three preseasons, overweight, lacking mobility, one position player with little endurance, injury prone and has a debilitating chronic disease, unreliable kick for goal, no second efforts. Apart from all that, he's killing it. I want Paddy to succeed. Desperately. He's a great young bloke.

Several of my colleagues in the recruiting game suggested, and unfortunately they appear to be on the money, there's nothing about him that made him an obvious number one pick. Some didn't even have him in their top dozen. I was hoping against hope they were wrong, but I'm starting to see they may have been right. The best we can hope for is he ends up like Jack Watts. A very good player, but not a great one, as your number one should be.

Jack Billings has copped plenty on here, but he showed glimpses of what he was capable of from the very beginning. A match winning effort against the WB in his second year, and now he's overcoming his injury issues, he's shown he can be a match winner, as a number 3 pick should be. Paddy has'nt even kicked three goals in a game yet. Not looking good. Meanwhile, Petracca continues to develop and deliver for the Dees.

So Mr Winmar, I reckon Collingwood would offer Paddy $1m for 5 years, and offer St Kilda their 1st round draft pick.

Interested?

At this point, I'd take that in a heart beat if it was a top five pick.

Top 5 pick, DEAL.
Irrelevant what Collingwood pays him.

"The best we can hope for is he ends up like Jack Watts.'
It was not Jack Watts fault or Paddy's fault they were taken with pick No1.
That mistake belongs to the recruiters if anyone.
But I would point out that even in the super draft of 2013 only 4 of the top 12 draft picks made it into Landsberger's top 15 rerun.
Only the top 4 picks made it into his best 12.
You have a one in three chance of selecting one of the best 12 players if you have a top 12 pick.
It is even harder when you try to pick a key position forward.

[SuperDuper]

Plugger was far from an elite athlete but the best footballer I have ever seen.

Give the kid a go.

I think I can safely say, Paddy ain't no Plugger. Not fit to tie his bootlaces. Plugger was a Coleman and Brownlow medallist at 21. At the same age, Paddy struggles to even get a game and struggles to impose himself at VFL level. The signs are not great. Three preseasons, overweight, lacking mobility, one position player with little endurance, injury prone and has a debilitating chronic disease, unreliable kick for goal, no second efforts. Apart from all that, he's killing it. I want Paddy to succeed. Desperately. He's a great young bloke.

Several of my colleagues in the recruiting game suggested, and unfortunately they appear to be on the money, there's nothing about him that made him an obvious number one pick. Some didn't even have him in their top dozen. I was hoping against hope they were wrong, but I'm starting to see they may have been right. The best we can hope for is he ends up like Jack Watts. A very good player, but not a great one, as your number one should be.

Jack Billings has copped plenty on here, but he showed glimpses of what he was capable of from the very beginning. A match winning effort against the WB in his second year, and now he's overcoming his injury issues, he's shown he can be a match winner, as a number 3 pick should be. Paddy has'nt even kicked three goals in a game yet. Not looking good. Meanwhile, Petracca continues to develop and deliver for the Dees.

So Mr Winmar, I reckon Collingwood would offer Paddy $1m for 5 years, and offer St Kilda their 1st round draft pick.

Interested?

At this point, I'd take that in a heart beat if it was a top five pick.

Top 5 pick, DEAL.
Irrelevant what Collingwood pays him.

"The best we can hope for is he ends up like Jack Watts.'
It was not Jack Watts fault or Paddy's fault they were taken with pick No1.
That mistake belongs to the recruiters if anyone.
But I would point out that even in the super draft of 2013 only 4 of the top 12 draft picks made it into Landsberger's top 15 rerun.
Only the top 4 picks made it into his best 12.
You have a one in three chance of selecting one of the best 12 players if you have a top 12 pick.
It is even harder when you try to pick a key position forward.

yes.. and the recruiters get paid well to make the right calls and if they get it wrong... it needs to be called out as an error.

Paddy is not a "hindsight" error. It was well established in real time who was the no. 1 prospect that year

[Con Gorozidis]

When we look back at the 2014 draft I think the true pick 1 is going to be very clear. Jake Lever.
Peter Wright will be a clear number 2.

[WellardSaint]

a poster on here mentioned we were keen on O'Meara, and ran him past some specialists,
and our medicos said "in our informed opinion, we don't think he'd be a good pick-up"
so the club had second thoughts.

I am a wee bit disappointed that our same medicos let us use a strong pick on someone who needs such stringent management
and at this stage, appears to have not been such a good choice.
Hmm

[CURLY]

No one is suggesting he is fat... but he is clearly not fit enough and/or presented well enough. He is in an elite, professional sporting environment and is not as fit as he needs to be, its mind boggling?!

This can be seen in his physique, in his running ability at training, in his game play... he has clearly still got puppy fat? It is staggering how an elite footballer, paid to train and play is not in elite condition.

He is in the worst 3 athletes on the list.

All of this is just made up and just untrue.

To suggest he has puppy fat and unfit is just ridiculous.

[BigMart]

Well

I stood a metre away from him the other week in the VFL and he is carrying weight. Around the gut, on the triceps, he has no muscle definition to speak of...

I watched him closely in pre season running trials... he finished only in front of Pierce and Longer (last) ... his running is horrible.

I know he struggle to run defensively and give second and third efforts

Not sure how much of that is untrue? It's pretty obvious I would have thought?!