Petracca v McCartin

[saint64]

I realise people have already posted about this in other topics, but it deserves its own thread.
We have screwed up.
Petracca is a gun who will be a superstar of the competition for the next dozen years. McCartin is an injury-prone, under-sized key forward who doesn't kick goals. He can take a great grab, but does little else. We are having to try to turn him into a lead-up forward because he isn't good enough in the goalsquare.
I know hind sight is a beautiful thing, but there have been few more important decisions that the club has had to make over the last 6-7 years. It was crucial that we picked well at the 2014 draft. With the number one pick it was our biggest opportunity to pick up a star for the next generation: our next Riewoldt, Goddard or (dare I say it) Judd.
From the media reports at the time Petracca was the clear number one choice in the lead up to that draft. If we were drafting on ability instead of perceived need it was a no-brainer. I understand our logic - we thought we needed a key forward - but McCartin is no Tony Lockett.
I say this with all due respect to McCartin himself who seems a great young guy, and to our recruiting team who has generally done a great job over the last five years, but sometimes mistakes are made, and when they are we have to recognise them, deal with them, and only then can we move on.
I think McCartin can and probably will be a really good player for us, but he won't give us what Petracca would have.
As ever, I am happy to be proven wrong.

[The Fireman]

I realise people have already posted on this ??????? then why post more ?

They are just premature observations.

[Myron Gaines]

It was always going to be Petracca but at the last minute we shat ourselves when the Western Bulldogs shelled out big for Tom Boyd.

[samoht]

It was always going to be Petracca but at the last minute we shat ourselves when the Western Bulldogs shelled out big for Tom Boyd.

Our recruiters wanted to load up on inside midfielders. You can't have too many. Petracca didn't fit the plan.

[wally]

We were screaming out for a midfielder at time.

From memory at that time Bruce was playing back, Stanley didn't look the goods,we didn't have much up forward besides Roo,
Bruce ended up having a breakout year up forward, but I think has fallen away and the second ruck duties are too much.

Take Bruce and Roo out of the forward line, doesn't leave a lot perhaps we should give Lee another shot

[Jacks Back]

Billings instead of Nick Dal Santo's cousin The Bont. Just another drafting mistake (or is that pistake) by us.

[mullet]

Maybe they were guns and we turn them into average players

[Myron Gaines]

Billings instead of Nick Dal Santo's cousin The Bont. Just another drafting mistake (or is that pistake) by us.

Bont is a freak however only two clubs rated him top 10. He was a bolted & no one accept the Dogs & Pies expected him to be this good. He went under the radar.

Josh Kelly is the guy we dreadfully wanted & rumour has it we had a nice deal on the table to swap pick 3 & a player for pick 2 so we could get him. Then GWS with all the elite talent & concessions came over the top with a better deal.

Paddy over Petracca is different. There was a poll on the AFL website & 16 clubs rated Petracca the best...1 club Heeney & 1 club Paddy (presumably us). It was an insult that our recruiters overlooked Petracca. Paddy will be ok though but Pettraca is best in the comp talent. What a f*** up.

[magnifisaint]

Looks like we got it wrong

[saint-stu]

Do people rate Tom Boyd higher than McCartin?

Tom Hawkins didn't really get going until his 6th year.

Yes, Petracca may be a gun, but midfielders are much easier to come by. So the club was probably thinking we could trade for some down the track.

[saintsRrising]

I realise people have already posted on this ??????? then why post more ?

They are just premature observations.

Or perhaps premature e-speculation


Though current signs are not good.

ERROR ONE

The clubs stated reason at the time seemed to be that we took Paddy over Petracca was that key forwards are hard to get. Rather than us taking the best available talent.

However the bigger the young player it would seem to be that the less certain that they will end up very good players. The Doggies paid bigtime for Boyd to play FF, and while yes he played the game of his life in the GF as a follower against so so rucks he is let to show much at to suggest that he will ever be a gun key forward. He seems more destined to be a useful ruck/forward in the No2 role rather than likely to be a gun forward which is what the Dogs paid the premium for.

ERROR TWO

With the birth of Free Agency the Saints were of the belief that we would accumulate draft picks first and then later add some elite FA Talent later when we were ready. Problem is that the way that FA has turned out FA looks to have been a false dawn with it now apparently very unlikely that the club will actually be able to gain an elite FA Gun. A restricted FA at best, but to gain a gun it really will need to be a trade now.



Let us hope that Paddy comes good. Though the bigger problem remains to me that lack of elite midfield talent at the club, and Pretracca would have helped to address that.

[Con Gorozidis]

They obviously didnt run an 'awareness' test on McCartin because he would have scored bottom 1%.
Not sure what his current injury is but probably walked in to a street post.

I agree with others. It was always Petracca but we shat ourselves over the Tom Boyd contract and panicked in the last few days.
The club of course will never admit to this.

[saintsRrising]

They obviously didnt run an 'awareness' test on McCartin because he would have scored bottom 1%.
.

Maybe Paddy is the new Kosi?

[ROLS-LEE]

Imagine Petracca and bont instead of McCartin and Billings. 2 very wrong selections there.

[Bluthy]

Did Petracca just win a brownlow and I missed it? He was pretty good yesterday but a long way to go. Is he a mid or a half-forward? That was the question on him. He played as a tall and big half-forward which let him dominate with his size and strength but whether he could transition into the midfield was a big question. He looks pretty skilled - good hands like they all had yesterday but didn't dominate by any means.

I'm staying on the Paddy train until it completely derails. It's just stuck in the station for maintenance at the moment (these big trains straight off the production line have some kinks to work out). When it gets momentum going I'm sure it will churn up that track. And in finals, the big unit will arrive with a huge payload

[longtimesaint]

Imagine Petracca and bont instead of McCartin and Billings. 2 very wrong selections there.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.
If we had chosen Judd instead of Ball we would probably have our second flag!

[SaintPav]

Did Petracca just win a brownlow and I missed it? He was pretty good yesterday but a long way to go. Is he a mid or a half-forward? That was the question on him. He played as a tall and big half-forward which let him dominate with his size and strength but whether he could transition into the midfield was a big question. He looks pretty skilled - good hands like they all had yesterday but didn't dominate by any means.

I'm staying on the Paddy train until it completely derails. It's just stuck in the station for maintenance at the moment (these big trains straight off the production line have some kinks to work out). When it gets momentum going I'm sure it will churn up that track. And in finals, the big unit will arrive with a huge payload

Like

[Joffa Burns]

Imagine Petracca and bont instead of McCartin and Billings. 2 very wrong selections there.

I don't recall too many if any posters on this site stating we should pick Bont over Billings prior to the draft.
It's a little easy to recruit with hindsight.

Petracca V Mc Cartin in another matter!
Many posters here myself included were filthy we chose Insulin Paddy over Petracca who could be the next Dangerfield.
At the time the knock on Petracca was his cockiness. A professional environment and leaders like Rooey would knock that out of him quickly.

A fair analysis is Petracca & Stanley verses McCartin & Goddard.
I know the pairing that works best in my opinion.

[BigMart]

Or taken either Frawley or J.Riewoldt over Armo

Or Danger or Rioli over McEvoy

Ouch

2008 we actually got it right (for once) but didn't give Lynch a game

Petracca was the obvious #1
If Tom Boyd even remotely came into our thinking, we are a basket case.

[Linton Lodger]

I realise people have already posted about this in other topics, but it deserves its own thread.
We have screwed up.
Petracca is a gun who will be a superstar of the competition for the next dozen years. McCartin is an injury-prone, under-sized key forward who doesn't kick goals. He can take a great grab, but does little else. We are having to try to turn him into a lead-up forward because he isn't good enough in the goalsquare.
I know hind sight is a beautiful thing, but there have been few more important decisions that the club has had to make over the last 6-7 years. It was crucial that we picked well at the 2014 draft. With the number one pick it was our biggest opportunity to pick up a star for the next generation: our next Riewoldt, Goddard or (dare I say it) Judd.
From the media reports at the time Petracca was the clear number one choice in the lead up to that draft. If we were drafting on ability instead of perceived need it was a no-brainer. I understand our logic - we thought we needed a key forward - but McCartin is no Tony Lockett.
I say this with all due respect to McCartin himself who seems a great young guy, and to our recruiting team who has generally done a great job over the last five years, but sometimes mistakes are made, and when they are we have to recognise them, deal with them, and only then can we move on.
I think McCartin can and probably will be a really good player for us, but he won't give us what Petracca would have.
As ever, I am happy to be proven wrong.

saint64 we may as well rename you the Richmond FC.

When a club is building its list, good KPP are a priority and you lock those away first. Midfielders are more abundant than good KPP particularly key forwards.

So if there's a good key forward available you must take them and not be tempted by possible gun midfielders. The Western Bulldogs built their last list (Eade's) without a key forward and that's why they didn't even get to a Grand Final. I'm sure they are aware that this was a fatal flaw in the building of their last list and is probably the reason they paid way overs for Tom Boyd and drove up the market value of key forwards. In fact if Ryan Griffen had not walked out on the Club, they wouldn't be Premiers now.

Then there is of course those fools the Richmond FC who took Brett Deledio and Tambling ahead of Buddy Franklin and J Roughhead. A spectacular piece of folly and they still haven't recovered from that decision. If we had taken Petracca ahead of McCartin, I personally would have lost all confidence in our list management team. Remember Melbourne already had Hogan, if they didn't they would've taken McCartin ahead of Petracca given the opportunity.

McCartin will be a gun, he plays a more difficult position than Petracca. Petracca is a gun, don't worry about that, but I think Jade Gresham is going to be better.

If we had drafted Petracca, I'm sure we'd all be excited now, but we'd still be wondering who would fill Riewoldt's large shoes and I don't think there are any really good key forwards that will be up for trade or free agency next year. Bruce & Membrey are good, but they're never going to be Nick Riewoldt. McCartin could very well be and possibly better.

[WellardSaint]

They obviously didnt run an 'awareness' test on McCartin because he would have scored bottom 1%.
.

Maybe Paddy is the new Kosi?

You know how De Gooey made up that story about his hand,
our guys have to lie the other way "I got into a fight"
because the true story wouldn't be believable

[spert]

Sorry, but I reckon Paddy will only be useful player for us at best- if he can string enough games together without some kind of injury. The occasional big clunking mark is not going to be enough. After yesterday, it was obvious the huge class difference between our mids and Melbourne's- therein lies a big problem for a team trying to crack the eight.

[CQ SAINT]

I realise people have already posted on this ??????? then why post more ?

They are just premature observations.

Or perhaps premature e-speculation


Though current signs are not good.

ERROR ONE

The clubs stated reason at the time seemed to be that we took Paddy over Petracca was that key forwards are hard to get. Rather than us taking the best available talent.

However the bigger the young player it would seem to be that the less certain that they will end up very good players. The Doggies paid bigtime for Boyd to play FF, and while yes he played the game of his life in the GF as a follower against so so rucks he is let to show much at to suggest that he will ever be a gun key forward. He seems more destined to be a useful ruck/forward in the No2 role rather than likely to be a gun forward which is what the Dogs paid the premium for.

ERROR TWO

With the birth of Free Agency the Saints were of the belief that we would accumulate draft picks first and then later add some elite FA Talent later when we were ready. Problem is that the way that FA has turned out FA looks to have been a false dawn with it now apparently very unlikely that the club will actually be able to gain an elite FA Gun. A restricted FA at best, but to gain a gun it really will need to be a trade now.



Let us hope that Paddy comes good. Though the bigger problem remains to me that lack of elite midfield talent at the club, and Pretracca would have helped to address that.

Perhaps the decision to make Geary captain was also going to be fixed by free agency or Paddy coming good.

Turns out it who was to be our No 1 pick was a really important decision based on a number of remote possibilities.

My head hurts thinking our leadership group consists of Geary, soon to be retirees and bargain basement inside mids. Ouch!!

[saint64]

I realise people have already posted about this in other topics, but it deserves its own thread.
We have screwed up.
Petracca is a gun who will be a superstar of the competition for the next dozen years. McCartin is an injury-prone, under-sized key forward who doesn't kick goals. He can take a great grab, but does little else. We are having to try to turn him into a lead-up forward because he isn't good enough in the goalsquare.
I know hind sight is a beautiful thing, but there have been few more important decisions that the club has had to make over the last 6-7 years. It was crucial that we picked well at the 2014 draft. With the number one pick it was our biggest opportunity to pick up a star for the next generation: our next Riewoldt, Goddard or (dare I say it) Judd.
From the media reports at the time Petracca was the clear number one choice in the lead up to that draft. If we were drafting on ability instead of perceived need it was a no-brainer. I understand our logic - we thought we needed a key forward - but McCartin is no Tony Lockett.
I say this with all due respect to McCartin himself who seems a great young guy, and to our recruiting team who has generally done a great job over the last five years, but sometimes mistakes are made, and when they are we have to recognise them, deal with them, and only then can we move on.
I think McCartin can and probably will be a really good player for us, but he won't give us what Petracca would have.
As ever, I am happy to be proven wrong.

saint64 we may as well rename you the Richmond FC.

When a club is building its list, good KPP are a priority and you lock those away first. Midfielders are more abundant than good KPP particularly key forwards.

So if there's a good key forward available you must take them and not be tempted by possible gun midfielders. The Western Bulldogs built their last list (Eade's) without a key forward and that's why they didn't even get to a Grand Final. I'm sure they are aware that this was a fatal flaw in the building of their last list and is probably the reason they paid way overs for Tom Boyd and drove up the market value of key forwards. In fact if Ryan Griffen had not walked out on the Club, they wouldn't be Premiers now.

Then there is of course those fools the Richmond FC who took Brett Deledio and Tambling ahead of Buddy Franklin and J Roughhead. A spectacular piece of folly and they still haven't recovered from that decision. If we had taken Petracca ahead of McCartin, I personally would have lost all confidence in our list management team. Remember Melbourne already had Hogan, if they didn't they would've taken McCartin ahead of Petracca given the opportunity.

McCartin will be a gun, he plays a more difficult position than Petracca. Petracca is a gun, don't worry about that, but I think Jade Gresham is going to be better.

If we had drafted Petracca, I'm sure we'd all be excited now, but we'd still be wondering who would fill Riewoldt's large shoes and I don't think there are any really good key forwards that will be up for trade or free agency next year. Bruce & Membrey are good, but they're never going to be Nick Riewoldt. McCartin could very well be and possibly better.

The sad thing is I am jealous of the Richmond FC Linton Lodger. They have 9 more premiership cups than we do. You make a point re Tambling, but I wouldn't call Deledio a bust. Petracca is a goal kicking midfielder/forward who would have complimented players like Bruce and Membrey. Our policy going in to that draft should have been to secure the best player possible. All the reputable scribes at the time were saying that Petracca was the best player available. We decided differently, so we have to wear the consequences if what I fear is correct - which is that we were wrong.

[twirlyhair]

Rubbish. Bruce is not a good mark and soft hands in front of goal. Mcartin can clunk them. Give him time as we need him. Can't rely on Bruce and much smaller Membrey.