Saintsational Fan Forum - A passionate community of St Kilda Football Club fans discussing news, history, players, trade rumours, results, AFL stats and more.
True Believer wrote:
bulls*** - You are not discussing anything, you are berating anyone that does not agree with you! And this is after lecturing everyone on what constitutes an addict and how everyone should behave towards addicts. I have extensive personal experience with addiction and will thank you to keep your sermons to yourself.
Complete rubbish TB re sermons. It's been a very interesting, and spirited debate. If you mentally put IMO in front of everyones sentences on the internet, then 90% of your angst will disappear. I just lost my bottle at Bunk's pathetic whinging "won't you pleeeeeeeeeasse stop talking about this" crap. The "stop talking about this" is just such a pathetic, sad, control freak card to play. I didn't really have a lot more to say on the matter and just made a silly throwaway pun (addict/dick) before Bunk began crying like a baby. Now I know what strings I can pull to make these puppets dance I may very well continue as its fun to know I can make them jerk around in hysteria. That's what you get for being a control freak
Should we talk about Ross Lyon and Luke Ball some more? Carlisle is a guy we lost pick 5 for. It's a current and interesting matter and obviously lots of people have feeling about it as it impacts on our club's future heavily. WE should be capable of having a mature, open debate about it. But the hysteria towards one word has been societally and generationally fascinating to me.
I love your salty salty tears.
Hilarious, telling lies now. Never said stop talking about it, I said show some corroborated evidence, which you have been unable to do.
You have made a fool of yourself, but hey don't let me stop you, seems like everyone on here is having a good laugh at your silly little episode.
Let me guess, he missed the last bus from the methadone clinic, right?
Immature guy with issues. Drugs are symptom of that. Having scumbag friends who rat you out is a symptom of that. Lying to people is a symptom of that. Punching people who confront you about not going at things 100% is a symptom of that. Playing one great game and 5 ordinary games is a symptom of that. Arriving late to training after promising you will do everything right is a symptom of that.
Those who thought is was "one moment of madness" have had their superficial analysis displayed for all to see. We have a time bomb on our hands. We need to defuse it asap.
Let me guess, he missed the last bus from the methadone clinic, right?
Immature guy with issues. Drugs are symptom of that. Having scumbag friends who rat you out is a symptom of that. Lying to people is a symptom of that. Punching people who confront you about not going at things 100% is a symptom of that. Playing one great game and 5 ordinary games is a symptom of that. Arriving late to training after promising you will do everything right is a symptom of that.
Those who thought is was "one moment of madness" have had their superficial analysis displayed for all to see. We have a time bomb on our hands. We need to defuse it asap.
What about people who go on, and on, and onnnnnnn about the same thing.
Until everyone else in the room is bored shitless.
HitTheBoundary wrote:
What about people who go on, and on, and onnnnnnn about the same thing.
Until everyone else in the room is bored shitless.
What's that a symptom of?
Denial - yours, not mine. The truth is always beautiful, not matter how uncomfortable. Lets look at what we have - good and bad. Lets not bury our heads in the sand. The club won't be.
HitTheBoundary wrote:
What about people who go on, and on, and onnnnnnn about the same thing.
Until everyone else in the room is bored shitless.
What's that a symptom of?
Denial - yours, not mine. The truth is always beautiful, not matter how uncomfortable. Lets look at what we have - good and bad. Lets not bury our heads in the sand. The club won't be.
lol. What exactly am I denying?
You're like a little boy that stands in the corner of the room and screams his lungs out whenever anyone else tries to speak.
I get your point of view - and it's valid.
But you've already posted the same thing 1000 times.....
HitTheBoundary wrote:
What about people who go on, and on, and onnnnnnn about the same thing.
Until everyone else in the room is bored shitless.
What's that a symptom of?
Denial - yours, not mine. The truth is always beautiful, not matter how uncomfortable. Lets look at what we have - good and bad. Lets not bury our heads in the sand. The club won't be.
HitTheBoundary wrote:
What about people who go on, and on, and onnnnnnn about the same thing.
Until everyone else in the room is bored shitless.
What's that a symptom of?
Denial - yours, not mine. The truth is always beautiful, not matter how uncomfortable. Lets look at what we have - good and bad. Lets not bury our heads in the sand. The club won't be.
"Agenda driven" Yes I am the President of the "Anti-Jake Carslisle League (AJCL). What is nauseous dribble is your inability to put together any sort of interesting comment to actually add to this debate. Come on, try and say something beyond seven words full of inane, idotic buzz words. I'll be waiting but to be honest I'm not expecting much.
I've made informed comments from the get go that I think Jake has issues. Thats ok, we all all have issues. But lets not be as idiotic as Essendon suporters with their #standbyhird burying their head in the sand. I still think as Jake gets some psychological therapy to deal with his issues and drug usage, we can see a maturing of him. I think Richo will be a great support for him as a father figure. It won't happen over night but I hoping it will happen. This dream that the guy who lied to our club before the trade will suddenly bet this amazing dude is blown out of the water. The kid has talent, Watching his highlight reel, there is one moment where he is out of position and the ball is about to go over his head to a forward. He does this Michael Jordan double pump thing jumping in the air and then punches the ball away. It is amazing display of athletic creativity he is capable of
But what he doesn't have at the moment is the psychological stability to back it up. Lets not pretend, yet again, this is just one of those things. He promised he would do everything right. Well rent a flat close to training so you KNOW you will get there with no dramas. Give yourself heaps of time because accidents/traffic jams happen in Melbourne all the time. Lets not excuse this away which is what has happened for him every time. Time to take responsibility Jake. Time to grow up.
Part of being an adult is also knowing when you have become a bore.
Not because the quality of your argument is poor.
But because you cannot stop repeating the same thing.
It was interesting that a few posts back that you stated that we LOST pick 5 for Carlisle not traded pick five for him. Did you have a favourite kid at that pick and its ruined draft night for you ?
Part of being an adult is also knowing when you have become a bore.
Not because the quality of your argument is poor.
But because you cannot stop repeating the same thing.
What are you talking about. You've lost the plot. This happened today. We are reacting to something that happened TODAY. You say "its a bore" because you don't want to hear it. If you are bored put me on ignore and you don't need to read my boring stuff. Simple hey. My arguments are totally on point and its an interesting debate from both sides. You sound as boring and as control freak as Bunk "please don't talk about his I'm going to cry I want to control what is talked about wah wah wah". We paid big for this dude and he can't get to training on time? Seriously? Is that not a red flag from a guy who just promised to do everything right after he screwed up so big?
evo wrote:It was interesting that a few posts back that you stated that we LOST pick 5 for Carlisle not traded pick five for him. Did you have a favourite kid at that pick and its ruined draft night for you ?
No but we gave up a shot at some genuine elite young talent at pick 5. Ok we may still get a great young player at 14 (or 17 or 18 it turns into). But why is everyone so panicked to look at exactly what we got with CArlisle, good and bad? He could yet be a superstar - B Goddard said that and I respect his opinion. But lets not ignore SO MANY signs that he is a deeply immature young man. It doesn't change anything. It's what the club is doing. They are looking at things as they are, not some romantic dream. Money plus celebrity plus psychological faults plus youth can result in serious, serious problems. It's happened many, many, many times in the sport and entertainment fields.
The good thing is that he is getting rehab for his problems - and this is another example of why he should. He has lacked a father figure and don't underestimate that for young men. It can throw your compass out totally, lacking a sense of self and security. This idea that you can just fix yourself when you might need some serious psychological/emotional help is a big problem with anxiety, depression and mental illness in general. If your leg is hurting do you just try and fix yourself? No you get help from experts. I'm really hoping Richo will take Jake under his wing and make him feel secure and safe that he probably didn't have at Essendon wanting to treat him like a human pin cushion.
I like talking with you Evo, but next time don't insult me with throw away words. I don't appreciate that. I think about things deeply. Thats who I am. Idiots like Bunk take cheaps shots. I don't expect that of you. You can disagree with me, but don't disrespect me.
evo wrote:It was the ongoing rant that finally got to me but yes, that was a bit disrespectful of me as I am sure that you love the club.
Thanks Evo. I appreciate that. I know I've come across as a negative nelly but really I just feel I've given another perspective on Jake and even perhaps a deeper one. No one would be happier to see Jake become the brilliant, talented, dangerous (in a good way) backman that becomes the foundation stone of our Premiership denseness. He has the ability no doubt. I don't see it at all as an "ongoing" rant. What about the "get around Jake" talk. That is much more an ongoing rant without a lot of basis.
I go to the footy every week, and like I've said before I will cheer when Jake does something well because he's in a Sainters jumper. And after a few expensive Etihad beers I will probably be screaming like crazy when he pulls in a huge mark and proclaim him our saviour that will lead us to the promised land. But I need to see a long period of solid display from him before I trust him when I am sober. I think he has issues, but that is not uncommon for dudes in their twenties, especially for guys who haven't have a solid father figure. It's kind of like we have spun the roulette wheel with this guy. Will it end up landing on black or red (and then a bit white ). I have a lot of faith in Richo who has shown he can connect with players in a real dad way - authoritative but with a genuine, straight shooting, honest way. The more Jake spends with Richo the better. Which is why I'm disappointed that Jake isn't getting to raining 2 hours early just so he can hang out with Richo and pick his brain during this quiet time.
matrix wrote:I think we should make him stand in the corner facing everyone at team meetings
You know Matrix, its easy to make these sort of throw away, supercilious comments - oooh he's a few minutes late to training - off with his head! You don't think its a red flag from a guy who promised to do everything right after a major screw up? Yes s*** happens, but alternatively if you are genuinely dedicated to something (such as rewarding St Kilda for taking a punt on you) you make sure you minimise the chances of s*** happening. This is an industry where premierships aren't necessarily decided by talent or ability. Instead its often decided by just how desperate and committed players are to get across the line no matter what. Is this a sign of just how committed Jake is to our goals? Or is he battling inner demons that suck up a lot of his energy?
evo wrote:It was interesting that a few posts back that you stated that we LOST pick 5 for Carlisle not traded pick five for him. Did you have a favourite kid at that pick and its ruined draft night for you ?
No but we gave up a shot at some genuine elite young talent at pick 5. Ok we may still get a great young player at 14 (or 17 or 18 it turns into). But why is everyone so panicked to look at exactly what we got with CArlisle, good and bad? He could yet be a superstar - B Goddard said that and I respect his opinion. But lets not ignore SO MANY signs that he is a deeply immature young man. It doesn't change anything. It's what the club is doing. They are looking at things as they are, not some romantic dream. Money plus celebrity plus psychological faults plus youth can result in serious, serious problems. It's happened many, many, many times in the sport and entertainment fields.
The good thing is that he is getting rehab for his problems - and this is another example of why he should. He has lacked a father figure and don't underestimate that for young men. It can throw your compass out totally, lacking a sense of self and security. This idea that you can just fix yourself when you might need some serious psychological/emotional help is a big problem with anxiety, depression and mental illness in general. If your leg is hurting do you just try and fix yourself? No you get help from experts. I'm really hoping Richo will take Jake under his wing and make him feel secure and safe that he probably didn't have at Essendon wanting to treat him like a human pin cushion.
I like talking with you Evo, but next time don't insult me with throw away words. I don't appreciate that. I think about things deeply. Thats who I am. Idiots like Bunk take cheaps shots. I don't expect that of you. You can disagree with me, but don't disrespect me.
You can mention he is getting rehab for his problems a thousand times but all that does is make you wrong a 1000 times. Are you a person that cant even say you got something wrong? Why am I asking that when it is so self evident. Sorry for that. Now lets look at being late for training this week. There was an accident on the freeway. Even if he leaves himself 30 extra minutes he could have still been late. How much time should he leave himself. One hour, two hours just in case of an accident?
As for thinking of things deeply well that maybe true but that doesn't mean you make sense. It just means you think of things deeply and as others have pointed out going on about things also doesn't make sense. Now just one question to you. Would you rather Carlisle fail so you can tell us a 1000 times you were right? Again I apologise for asking a question with an obvious answer.
This reminds me of the biblical parable, you know the one where the Pharisees and the angry mob bring a naked, bruised and beaten woman into the Temple for judgement by JC (No, not Jake Carlisle, but Jesus Christ). She had been caught in the act of adultery, which had, apparently, been witnessed by many of the baying crowd (What were they doing watching in the first place? Was this the ancient Middle Eastern, semetic version of porn?). Anyway, I digress. As the crowd handed her to JC, he declared "Judge ye not this woman. Yes, she has sinned, but let he amongst you who has not sinned cast the first stone. The crowd stood in stunned silence, until as if from nowhere, a rock flew out of the crowd and smashed the poor woman in the head, killing her instantly. And the Lord was heard to cry out,"Oh for God's sake mother! How many times have I told you not to come to these things! Here endeth the lesson. Go in peace, to love and serve the saints, my children.
I started with nothing and I've got most of it left!
This reminds me of the biblical parable, you know the one where the Pharisees and the angry mob bring a naked, bruised and beaten woman into the Temple for judgement by JC (No, not Jake Carlisle, but Jesus Christ). She had been caught in the act of adultery, which had, apparently, been witnessed by many of the baying crowd (What were they doing watching in the first place? Was this the ancient Middle Eastern, semetic version of porn?). Anyway, I digress. As the crowd handed her to JC, he declared "Judge ye not this woman. Yes, she has sinned, but let he amongst you who has not sinned cast the first stone. The crowd stood in stunned silence, until as if from nowhere, a rock flew out of the crowd and smashed the poor woman in the head, killing her instantly. And the Lord was heard to cry out,"Oh for God's sake mother! How many times have I told you not to come to these things! Here endeth the lesson. Go in peace, to love and serve the saints, my children.
I started with nothing and I've got most of it left!
