2015 - Draft & Trade Thread

[matrix]

Lol
Who in their right mind would trade picks 9 and 13 for pick 5?

Utter stupidity

[older saint]

Not sure that Adelaide would trade 9 & 13 for pick 5 alone, suspect they would want our second pick as well. If that were the case the Saints would have to re-work a Freeman trade.

maybe a third rounder not second though - point system gives a pretty good guide now- shows why Essendon is dreaming about 5 whilst comparing it to Ryder. Bains on radio talked about trying to upgrade 2nd round pick to put that in Carlisle deal

[SuperDuper]

I am strongly in favour of doing a deal with Adelaide. After losing Dangerfield they will be determined to land a SA kid with their first pick (Francis or Milera) so will need pick 5 to guarantee that.

From our point of view - there is no realistic way we can get Carlisle and also keep pick 5 - but pick 9 is still a very good pick. The chances of a gun slipping to pick 9 are quite high if we have done our homework. 13 for Carlisle is about right.

Lets do this deal!

clearly 5+24 for 9+13 would suit us..
I just am not convinced Adelaide will do it.
They most likely wont get Francis at 5, and could get Milera at 9.. and maybe even at 13
They may have another target in mind at 5...... but they may also be very happy to take Burton at 13..

So they cant get Francis even if they upgrade to 5 (at least wont be relying on it) but could get Miera + Burton or some such combo of they stick with 9 and 13

They will be certainly be in heavy discussions with their recruiting team on how they rate various players

But I imagine the recruiting team will advise sticking with 9+13

[Playon]

Not sure that Adelaide would trade 9 & 13 for pick 5 alone, suspect they would want our second pick as well. If that were the case the Saints would have to re-work a Freeman trade.

Well which is better this years pick 9 or next years second rounder, It would be 9 in the draft, 13 Carlisle, and next years 2nd pick for Freeman. That would be the worst scenario, we may downgrade elsewhere yet. GWS

I still think 13 is too high for Carlsile but we seem to REALLY want him, Is there a clause built in that if we lose Carlisle for a season we get Essendons second rounder that year? Don't think so. Keeping in mind we'll have egg on our faces if he is suspended

[SaintWal]

my thoughts would be to give them Seb Ross and our round two pick. I like Ross but I like Carlisle more. Then possibly trade our second round from next year for freeman

[derby Street]

The word in Adelaide is 13 & 28 for Saints 5#. No thanks, they are delusional.

[saintjake]

Where is Jaxsons or tony74?

[bigred]

probably scared off by clowns being asshats.

[matrix]

I heard the word in sa is pick 5 and our second rounder for 9 and 14

14 goes to essendon and we go to the draft with 9.
Third rounder for Freeman I guess , but will prob need a cherry on top as well.

???

[To the top]

Given the "value" on high profile players who have already shifted clubs, Carlisle being "worth" the Number 5 Selection in the up-coming AFL Draft is sheer madness.

What is his record? How many Club B&F's has he won 9or even top 10 finishes)? How many All- Australian recognitions does he have?

If Essendon are so bloody minded (or drug crazed?) to insist on the Number 5 Selection in exchange then St Kilda should say "Thank you, but no thanks" and see what plays out later because Carlisle is an un-contracted player who does not want to remain at a dysfunctional Essendon.

If we get him, we get him.

If we don't, we don't.

Thank you for nominating St Kilda as your preferred Club.

Simply, if we do not get the key defender we are obviously short of currently (given Fisher's age, and he is playing for another year) to support the developing Goddard then we have another year or 2 to Draft or Trade or otherwise acquire the required player.

We are in no immediate rush - and we can build a forward line around Mc Cartin and Hickey as the tall options releasing Bruce to defence in the case of need.

We always have Roo for the next season or so.

So, again, why the rush?

If Essendon want to stick to a totally unreasonable requirement, let them.

What did they get for the contracted Ryder 12 months ago by comparison - and Ryder was contracted?

Carlisle can always take legal advice re the position the administration at Essendon has put him (and the rest of their list) in, where the threat of de-regulation remains for the players, whose reputations have been tarnished

Essendon may then say "just go and forget you were ever here".

[bigred]

I heard the word in sa is pick 5 and our second rounder for 9 and 14

14 goes to essendon and we go to the draft with 9.
Third rounder for Freeman I guess , but will prob need a cherry on top as well.

???

I really hope they don't do that.

[ace]

my thoughts would be to give them Seb Ross and our round two pick. I like Ross but I like Carlisle more. Then possibly trade our second round from next year for freeman

I don't like either of them but I want Carlilse playing for my team.
But only if we don't pay overs.

[ace]

Pick 24 was worth 785 points and pick 42 worth 395 points = 1,180 points but the AFL is downgrading our picks as it hands out free agent compensation.
1180 points is worth pick 14.
If we are to upgrade pick 24 to around 1,400 points we would need to trade a player out worth 629 points to secure pick 30 first.

If we trade pick 5 for Carlisle and Essendons pick 40 it would value Carlisle at 1449 points about pick 9.
Combine pick 40 & 42 gets pick 22 from Essendon
Pick 5 and 42 = 2273 points
Carlisle + pick 22 = 2273 (Carlisle value at 1428 points, approx pick 9)

Pick 24 gets us Freeman.
We use pick 22 in the draft.

We need to get both Carlisle and Freeman for pick 5 and 42 plus an upgrade of our 2nd round pick or we become losers.

[Con Gorozidis]

I heard the word in sa is pick 5 and our second rounder for 9 and 14

14 goes to essendon and we go to the draft with 9.
Third rounder for Freeman I guess , but will prob need a cherry on top as well.

???

I really hope they don't do that.

If we end up with pick 9, Carlisle and Freeman we have done very very well.

The challenge would be getting the Pies to accept pick 42 for Freeman.

[magnifisaint]

I heard the word in sa is pick 5 and our second rounder for 9 and 14

14 goes to essendon and we go to the draft with 9.
Third rounder for Freeman I guess , but will prob need a cherry on top as well.

???

I really hope they don't do that.

If we end up with pick 9, Carlisle and Freeman we have done very very well.

The challenge would be getting the Pies to accept pick 42 for Freeman.

Would you?

Con, I think you are dreaming

[ace]

I heard the word in sa is pick 5 and our second rounder for 9 and 14

14 goes to essendon and we go to the draft with 9.
Third rounder for Freeman I guess , but will prob need a cherry on top as well.

???

Pick 5 = 1878 points
Pick 24 = 785 points
Total = 2663 points

Pick 9 = 1,469 points
Pick 14 = 1,161 points
Total = 2630 points
Subject to free agency compensation interfering with draft numbers.

That deal is roughly fair
But how do we get Essendon to accept pick 14 for Carlisle when they know we have pick 9.

How do we get Collingwood to give us Freeman for pick 42 = 395 points instead of pick 24 = 785 points
We send them a tape recording of Neil Balme lecturing Brisbane on letting players play where they want and clubs not obstructing.

[saintsRrising]

Worrying about EFC or the Pies winning or losing is pointless. What matters is the Saints getting what we want. But it is not going to happen at ridiculous prices where the Dons and Pies lose badly.

Carlisle is worth more than out second pick and Freeman is probably worth more than our third.

I suspect the Dons will take a teens pick, but not our second pick with the type of steak knives we would be willing to through in. Moreso now that Luenberger is off to the Dons.

So the trick for our recruiting team is how they can get Carlisle and Freeman PLUS get in either another star player OR a pick good enough to land a good player (ie 9 or lower) without also losing a key player (ie Billings), but perhaps losing a up and comer.

We also potentially can use a pick from next year.

I suspect trading pick 5 will be a lot less painful than losing a player like Billings. Using a third party club may allow us to keep a lowish pick, but clubs are not going to be be charitable.

[Playon]

The Age
AFL trades 2015: Saints explore pick slide for Jake Carlisle

St Kilda are exploring ways of turning pick five into two first round draft selections, to try to deliver a pick to Essendon for Jake Carlisle while maintaining a first-round presence in the draft.

The Saints are not willing to sacrifice pick five in the draft for Carlisle alone, but have begun examining options that would effectively see them swap that pick for the key defender and another reasonably high selection.

Adelaide or the Gold Coast shape as the clubs most able to help break the stand-off between the clubs, but up to five teams have indicated some interest in pick five.

The Paddy Dangerfield deal to Geelong left the Crows holding four selections inside 35 - 9, 13, 28 and 32 - while the Suns could hold a similarly strong hand after trading Charlie Dixon and Harley Bennell.

The Suns want at least Port Adelaide's pick 10 this year - and reportedly the Power's first round pick next year as well - for Dixon. Fremantle would be likely to have to hand over pick 16 to the Suns for Bennell. That would leave Gold Coast with picks 3, 10, 16, 19 and 22 in the draft.

Complicating this plan would be Essendon's threat to take pick four to the same clubs in a bid to strike a similar pick-slide deal and one-up the Saints, and Collingwood's demands for uncontracted midfielder Nathan Freeman. Freeman is also headed for St Kilda, probably for a second-round pick.

Adelaide are unlikely to be prepared to trade their picks 9 and 13 for pick five alone, so any arrangement with the Saints would need to be sweetened somehow to gain traction. Gold Coast would be more likely to be prepared to bracket two first round picks to the Saints, and end up with picks 3 and 5 in this year's draft.

Essendon has argued that pick five is not as valuable as it would normally be, given two and possibly three northern academy players will be nabbed in the top five on draft night.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/a ... z3oMbmWcqM
Follow us: @theage on Twitter | theageAustralia on Facebook

[Playon]

Bains on Video

Bains ‘confident’ of Freeman and Carlisle trades
http://www.saints.com.au/news/2015-10-1 ... sle-trades

[Playon]

The Sun
Mediation looming for Carlisle trade
ESSENDON could be forced back to mediation after the latest Jake Carlisle meeting with St Kilda ended in more frustration on Monday. The two clubs remain as far apart as ever over Carlilse’s worth, with the Bombers still demanding pick No. 5

[magnifisaint]

The Sun
Mediation looming for Carlisle trade
ESSENDON could be forced back to mediation after the latest Jake Carlisle meeting with St Kilda ended in more frustration on Monday. The two clubs remain as far apart as ever over Carlilse’s worth, with the Bombers still demanding pick No. 5

Essendon can go and f*** themselves. Let Carlisle go into the draft and keep pick 5

[supersaints]

As I said on the carlise thread, I'm beginning to smell something fishy, have the Dopers and Carltank worked out a deal despite Carliles choice of the saints to ensure he goes to Carltank??
Here are a copy of my thoughts

I'm starting to ponder wether Carltank and the dopers have done a brown paper bag deal. If dildo does has he states and refuses a downgraded first round pick, then they know we will pass. Thus will allow Carlton to nab him in the pre season but I would expect the blues would do another trade very fa...

[supersaints]

Oops some of the thread did not copy but you can read it on the Carlilse thread if you like ... Sorry

[ace]

The Age
AFL trades 2015: Saints explore pick slide for Jake Carlisle

St Kilda are exploring ways of turning pick five into two first round draft selections, to try to deliver a pick to Essendon for Jake Carlisle while maintaining a first-round presence in the draft.

The Saints are not willing to sacrifice pick five in the draft for Carlisle alone, but have begun examining options that would effectively see them swap that pick for the key defender and another reasonably high selection.

Adelaide or the Gold Coast shape as the clubs most able to help break the stand-off between the clubs, but up to five teams have indicated some interest in pick five.

The Paddy Dangerfield deal to Geelong left the Crows holding four selections inside 35 - 9, 13, 28 and 32 - while the Suns could hold a similarly strong hand after trading Charlie Dixon and Harley Bennell.

The Suns want at least Port Adelaide's pick 10 this year - and reportedly the Power's first round pick next year as well - for Dixon. Fremantle would be likely to have to hand over pick 16 to the Suns for Bennell. That would leave Gold Coast with picks 3, 10, 16, 19 and 22 in the draft.

Complicating this plan would be Essendon's threat to take pick four to the same clubs in a bid to strike a similar pick-slide deal and one-up the Saints, and Collingwood's demands for uncontracted midfielder Nathan Freeman. Freeman is also headed for St Kilda, probably for a second-round pick.

Adelaide are unlikely to be prepared to trade their picks 9 and 13 for pick five alone, so any arrangement with the Saints would need to be sweetened somehow to gain traction. Gold Coast would be more likely to be prepared to bracket two first round picks to the Saints, and end up with picks 3 and 5 in this year's draft.

Essendon has argued that pick five is not as valuable as it would normally be, given two and possibly three northern academy players will be nabbed in the top five on draft night.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/a ... z3oMbmWcqM
Follow us: @theage on Twitter | theageAustralia on Facebook

See my post above we won't get pick 9 and 13 from Adelaide for pick 5 but throw in pick 24 and value is bang on.
Now pick 5 = 1,878 points
pick 10 = 1,395points
pick 16 = 1,067points
pick 19 = 948 points
pick 22 = 845 points

Gold Coast is probably more prepared than most clubs to lose points trading 2 picks for 1 super pick.
pick 10 + 16 = 2,462 points
pixk 10 + 19 = 2,343 points
pick 10 + 22 = 2.240 points
pick 16 + 19 = 2,015 points
pick 16 + 22 = 1,912 points

We could offer pick 5 for picks 16 and 22 to Gold Coast and then offer pick 16 for Carlisle.
Essendon will not even consider that offer until after we no longer have pick 5.
We must trade pick 5 away and then call Essendon's bluff.
They will probably reject pick 16 even after we no longer have pick 5.
Esendon then would demand pick 16 nd 22 = 1,912 points (more than pick 5 but less than pick 4)
They will probably trade Carlisle for pick 16 with 1 minute to go in the trade period when they realise that is the best they can get.
Refuse and they lose Carlisle to Carlton for nothing.
We then give pick 24 for Freeman and use pick 22 in the draft.

If Dildo is stubborn would end up with Freeman and picks 16 and 22 to use in the draft instead of pick 5.

[bigred]

I see that as just bending to the will of Essendon and it compromises our long term future.

Carlisle is only worth a second rounder and we all know it.

We should hang on to pick 5 at all costs.

In my opinion this is a huge moment for the club. They need to stand up to this rubbish.

Let em go to the PSD and we take our chances with both Freeman and Carlisle.