Bye all

[BackFromUSA]

And furthermore, as was finally publically admitted in the OP by P66, he has given a hell of a lot to the St Kilda FC. How many can say the same?? I put in over 10 years with them, and that's just a pee in the ocean compared to the contribution of this bloke.

He might be an annoying poster. So the hell what? Ignore him if you wish.

Simon, you continually shoot off about your contribution to the club and that dinner with Bevo all those years ago. I know of your contribution but P66 has you covered. I know you, even though you don't know it. Do you actually know who you have just banned???

Hi SENsei

I have no doubt that plugger66 has made wonderful contributions to the club over many years by boarding players and his wife was recognised for her contribution. I congratulate him for his part in this valuable service. My contributions to the club are completely irrelevant to this matter.

Our contributions to the club has nothing to do with our roles on Saintsational. The fact is that he continually ignored the forum rules but when requested to change via PM, through warnings, through bans - all he offered was abusive, condescending and insulting responses and a willingness to argue his innocence (most of the time which comprised the defence that others break the same rules therefore he shouldn't be warned - note - others were warned but mostly took it well) ... The bottomline he refused to change. He received his last and final warning a few weeks ago. It was specific. He didn't change his ways and in the past week his behavioural breaches accelerated again. It left me with no choice.

I personally value his footy knowledge and for the common sense approach that he mostly brings to the table but I am administering a community here and part of that is that each member should treat others within a minimum set of standards.

I have given what I believe to be a fair penalty. His IP is not banned. As a person he is welcome to register under another name. His historic posts remain. His new posts will be judged on their merit - if they are within the rules then there is no issue at all.

The punishment could have been much more severe.

He has just lost the name Plugger66.

And over time, with improved behaviour, he could even regain that.

I have nothing against the individual.

It is purely that he cannot continue to breach rules of the forum and even defy them without impacting on the enjoyment of others - without some penalty.

This penalty leaves the window open for the individual to contribute under another Nic in a more appropriate manner.

[SENsei]

I hear what you are saying Simon, I just disagree. I have seen appalling behaviour on the site from some who still post here. P66 never got to that level yet is banned while some of those others remain. I think it was heavy handed and that you did have a choice, many choices, before a permanent de-registering was awarded.

[Armoooo]

People don't post here cause they're on twitter and Facebook, the club has got better at this stuff and there is banter and footy discussion on social media these days.

Blaming plugs for driving people away is a little weird IMHO, and a little convenient.

People have confirmed that they left this site because of plugger... They have specifically named him. I'm sure a lot of the people have lost interest or migrated to Facebook/twitter but quite a lot of people left because of plugger, anybody who denies this is just plain wrong.

[Armoooo]

The site may lose some activity but it should come from a more diverse range of users now so while we may have less posts we should get more opinions.

So in a bar, if you don't like that bloke who speaks a lot and always has an opinion, you turf him out the door so someone else can have a say? Is that the way it works? I don't think so.

People always have a CHOICE. Read or not read. Ignore or not ignore. This is an appalling act in a situation where the action was not warranted. SImple as that. If you don't like someone, just kick him to the curb so you can have more people that you like. Really appalling and largely an immature outlook. Everyone has the CHOICE TO IGNORE.

It's not rocket surgery!!!

If one bloke runs from conversation to conversation yelling over the top of everyone else then yeah you probably would turf his out... Common sense

[Armoooo]

Yeah 5 posters with no clue about forums.
The place would've shut down in 5 mins
Good one stinger
Here's a ffs, just for old times sake

Armooo
Didn't bother reading what u last posted
Can't be added

In fact I hope this mod wipes my whole history.
In fact I'm asking him to do it

Ban me too.
But do a good job this time not some half assed s*** attempt like what happened with plugger

Go the saints


Then I might cure my addiction of posting on here and get some gardening done.

Wow. True colours coming out.

[SENsei]

The site may lose some activity but it should come from a more diverse range of users now so while we may have less posts we should get more opinions.

So in a bar, if you don't like that bloke who speaks a lot and always has an opinion, you turf him out the door so someone else can have a say? Is that the way it works? I don't think so.

People always have a CHOICE. Read or not read. Ignore or not ignore. This is an appalling act in a situation where the action was not warranted. SImple as that. If you don't like someone, just kick him to the curb so you can have more people that you like. Really appalling and largely an immature outlook. Everyone has the CHOICE TO IGNORE.

It's not rocket surgery!!!

If one bloke runs from conversation to conversation yelling over the top of everyone else then yeah you probably would turf his out... Common sense

Are you seriously saying that is what was happening here? Really?

In a pub, in your example, absolutely he would get a short shrift by probably ignoring him and getting security if he was aggressive. No doubt.

So you are saying that P66's posts were so aggressive, so abhorrent, so abusive that there was no way to ignore them?? Is that your contention?

[sunsaint]

And I do really love our club. 16 players have lived in our house over the years so I have done my job in supporting our great club. Hopefully with the return to Moorabbin I can help again.

Sorry plugs, but you had to go, you were disrespectful to a critical matter affecting the broader outcome of Australian Rules Football.

The post above confirms my suspicions that you were more involved in the game than I thought.

and you Sir have not added to the discussion - you have instead misdirected it, obfuscated it, and well hijacked it in a manner that you are accusing plugger of doing
Plugger has given more to "our" football than you - still you find fault in that - go figure

[sunsaint]

oh and mods - what chance that we could rookie Plugger66 in a sub-forum?

[Armoooo]

The site may lose some activity but it should come from a more diverse range of users now so while we may have less posts we should get more opinions.

So in a bar, if you don't like that bloke who speaks a lot and always has an opinion, you turf him out the door so someone else can have a say? Is that the way it works? I don't think so.

People always have a CHOICE. Read or not read. Ignore or not ignore. This is an appalling act in a situation where the action was not warranted. SImple as that. If you don't like someone, just kick him to the curb so you can have more people that you like. Really appalling and largely an immature outlook. Everyone has the CHOICE TO IGNORE.

It's not rocket surgery!!!

If one bloke runs from conversation to conversation yelling over the top of everyone else then yeah you probably would turf his out... Common sense

Are you seriously saying that is what was happening here? Really?

In a pub, in your example, absolutely he would get a short shrift by probably ignoring him and getting security if he was aggressive. No doubt.

So you are saying that P66's posts were so aggressive, so abhorrent, so abusive that there was no way to ignore them?? Is that your contention?

Aggressive? No. Abhorrent? No.

Incessant, belligerent, obnoxious? Yes

Plugger wasn't banned on a whim he has had close to a decade of warnings.

If we could limit him to 10 posts a day I'd be more than happy to bring him back but if he were to continue to get away with drowning out everyone else with his usual bulls*** then he would still turn away more and more people.

How many users need to completely give up on this site because of one poster before you'd admit this place is better without him?

I would have seen a dozen or so people name him as their reason for leaving while I was a mod, I've seen plenty on Bigfooty(not sure how much overlap there is)... Who knows how many just slipped quietly into the night after getting fed up with his crap.

[bigcarl]

Apparently it's all part of a cunning plan to drive people away from BigFooty and back to the good ship Saintsational.

[SENsei]

Incessant, belligerent, obnoxious? Yes

And none of those are bannable offences. There is an ignore button. It's how people don't listen to people that do now want to, not watch tv shows they don't want to, not watch movies that don't want to.

Simple fact is that everyone has a choice to ignore and let anyone else they don't wish to read go through to the keeper.

Rather than use censorship. Just ignore the poster who do not wish to read.

I hazard a guess that most people loved to argue with him and plainly he was just better at it than them!!

[Armoooo]

Incessant, belligerent, obnoxious? Yes

And none of those are bannable offences. There is an ignore button. It's how people don't listen to people that do now want to, not watch tv shows they don't want to, not watch movies that don't want to.

Simple fact is that everyone has a choice to ignore and let anyone else they don't wish to read go through to the keeper.

Rather than use censorship. Just ignore the poster who do not wish to read.

I hazard a guess that most people loved to argue with him and plainly he was just better at it than them!!

Lol censorship, I love the emotive, powerful language we need to use for a bloody forum.

Fwiw I had no issues with him after I put him on ignore but it doesn't change the fact that people were leaving the site purely because of him.

[BackFromUSA]

Incessant, belligerent, obnoxious? Yes

And none of those are bannable offences. There is an ignore button. It's how people don't listen to people that do now want to, not watch tv shows they don't want to, not watch movies that don't want to.

Simple fact is that everyone has a choice to ignore and let anyone else they don't wish to read go through to the keeper.

Rather than use censorship. Just ignore the poster who do not wish to read.

I hazard a guess that most people loved to argue with him and plainly he was just better at it than them!!

But in his arguments did he belittle, badger, tease, mock or bait another poster, OR repeatedly revisit past disagreements causing or creating an ongoing dispute between one or more posters?

If so each time HE BREACHED THE RULES!

[SENsei]

Another poster that had to have his username changed to get a clean slate on his appalling previous record?

[dragit]

So, he's not banned at all, he just needs to change his name?

Seems like weird posturing and mod-flexing to me…

[SENsei]

Incessant, belligerent, obnoxious? Yes

And none of those are bannable offences. There is an ignore button. It's how people don't listen to people that do now want to, not watch tv shows they don't want to, not watch movies that don't want to.

Simple fact is that everyone has a choice to ignore and let anyone else they don't wish to read go through to the keeper.

Rather than use censorship. Just ignore the poster who do not wish to read.

I hazard a guess that most people loved to argue with him and plainly he was just better at it than them!!

Lol censorship, I love the emotive, powerful language we need to use for a bloody forum.

Fwiw I had no issues with him after I put him on ignore but it doesn't change the fact that people were leaving the site purely because of him.

Exactly, it's only a bloody forum, to use your flair for the colourful.

So why was it so hard for those poor wretched souls forced out by Darth66 to use the ignore function provided to them? It's only a bloody forum afterall.

I hate this sort of stuff. It should never get to this situation. This whole give someone another name and a clean slate seems good in theory, but in the real world and on here, they are the same people and posters. It's just caused more problems particularly if P66 is getting his de-registration due to him baiting saynta as stinger (I assume) and yet I have seen another five posts today doing that exact same thing.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

And furthermore, as was finally publically admitted in the OP by P66, he has given a hell of a lot to the St Kilda FC. How many can say the same?? I put in over 10 years with them, and that's just a pee in the ocean compared to the contribution of this bloke.

He might be an annoying poster. So the hell what? Ignore him if you wish.

Simon, you continually shoot off about your contribution to the club and that dinner with Bevo all those years ago. I know of your contribution but P66 has you covered. I know you, even though you don't know it. Do you actually know who you have just banned???

Hi SENsei

I have no doubt that plugger66 has made wonderful contributions to the club over many years by boarding players and his wife was recognised for her contribution. I congratulate him for his part in this valuable service. My contributions to the club are completely irrelevant to this matter.

Our contributions to the club has nothing to do with our roles on Saintsational. The fact is that he continually ignored the forum rules but when requested to change via PM, through warnings, through bans - all he offered was abusive, condescending and insulting responses and a willingness to argue his innocence (most of the time which comprised the defence that others break the same rules therefore he shouldn't be warned - note - others were warned but mostly took it well) ... The bottomline he refused to change. He received his last and final warning a few weeks ago. It was specific. He didn't change his ways and in the past week his behavioural breaches accelerated again. It left me with no choice.

I personally value his footy knowledge and for the common sense approach that he mostly brings to the table but I am administering a community here and part of that is that each member should treat others within a minimum set of standards.

I have given what I believe to be a fair penalty. His IP is not banned. As a person he is welcome to register under another name. His historic posts remain. His new posts will be judged on their merit - if they are within the rules then there is no issue at all.

The punishment could have been much more severe.

He has just lost the name Plugger66.

And over time, with improved behaviour, he could even regain that.

I have nothing against the individual.

It is purely that he cannot continue to breach rules of the forum and even defy them without impacting on the enjoyment of others - without some penalty.

This penalty leaves the window open for the individual to contribute under another Nic in a more appropriate manner.

BFUSA,
While I understand that he would have got warnings (heck I've got them) why should he be held accountable to a set of rules yet others are not ? You mention belittling - there is a dedicated thread about "dealing with plucker66" ?!?!? Posters were all to quick to call him names they were all to quick to say he was an alco yet they remain (in fact gain protection) we have had on numerous occasions where posters have referenced past events to make a point in an argument but seems only some of us get warnings ... Now I understand that is because you have to respond to complaints but really you should be able to see the hypocrisy here...
Look I have nothing but praise for mods because to be honest it's a thankless job but I really think you made an error here

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Incessant, belligerent, obnoxious? Yes

And none of those are bannable offences. There is an ignore button. It's how people don't listen to people that do now want to, not watch tv shows they don't want to, not watch movies that don't want to.

Simple fact is that everyone has a choice to ignore and let anyone else they don't wish to read go through to the keeper.

Rather than use censorship. Just ignore the poster who do not wish to read.

I hazard a guess that most people loved to argue with him and plainly he was just better at it than them!!

Lol censorship, I love the emotive, powerful language we need to use for a bloody forum.

Fwiw I had no issues with him after I put him on ignore but it doesn't change the fact that people were leaving the site purely because of him.

Armoooo I don't dispute that some people blame plugger66 for why they don't post here but I reckon most of them don't have a problem with plugger66 just the fact he gets into a flame war with certain posters ... It takes two people to argue yet we are only blaming one .... Most flame wars start by a comment being made Plugger66 then responds and then it's on... Usually three or four jump in to try and knock plugger66 down not so much to prove the view of the original poster right but to just prove him wrong (playing the man not the comment) . If two people are fighting and three more jump in you can't single out one bloke as the problem

[BackFromUSA]

Posters got warnings for that behaviour too.

And just because other people rob banks or kill people with some being caught and punished and others escaping ... Doesn't mean that both have not breached laws AND certainly doesn't excuse anyone who also breaches those laws.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Another poster that had to have his username changed to get a clean slate on his appalling previous record?

And anyone who makes mention of that gets a warning so who is running the place ??

[saynta]

Incessant, belligerent, obnoxious? Yes

And none of those are bannable offences. There is an ignore button. It's how people don't listen to people that do now want to, not watch tv shows they don't want to, not watch movies that don't want to.

Simple fact is that everyone has a choice to ignore and let anyone else they don't wish to read go through to the keeper.

Rather than use censorship. Just ignore the poster who do not wish to read.

I hazard a guess that most people loved to argue with him and plainly he was just better at it than them!!

Lol censorship, I love the emotive, powerful language we need to use for a bloody forum.

Fwiw I had no issues with him after I put him on ignore but it doesn't change the fact that people were leaving the site purely because of him.

Exactly, it's only a bloody forum, to use your flair for the colourful.

So why was it so hard for those poor wretched souls forced out by Darth66 to use the ignore function provided to them? It's only a bloody forum afterall.

I hate this sort of stuff. It should never get to this situation. This whole give someone another name and a clean slate seems good in theory, but in the real world and on here, they are the same people and posters. It's just caused more problems particularly if P66 is getting his de-registration due to him baiting saynta as stinger (I assume) and yet I have seen another five posts today doing that exact same thing.

Hey, leave me out of it. I have ignored plugga for months. i just don't respond to his wanna be intimating posts. In more recent times, he has also ignored me.

I had nothing to do with him being banned. You guys are the pits, looking for someone to blame.

And for the record, why did you change your name,

To get away from your previous appalling behaviuor?

I resent your references to me. Really resent them. yeah other clowns have tried to bait me, but i haven't responded have I? It was the same with plugger.

[SENsei]

You are right stuck in the middle of it. Like it or not.

And I do not have to answer other queries to the likes of you.

[saynta]

You are right stuck in the middle of it. Like it or not.

And I do not have to answer other queries to the likes of you.

And I don't need to sit here and read your bulls***. i haven't responed to plugga for months and had nothing to do with the fool being banned.

You changed your nick. I can guess why, and I don't need your imput sensational.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Posters got warnings for that behaviour too.

And just because other people rob banks or kill people with some being caught and punished and others escaping ... Doesn't mean that both have not breached laws AND certainly doesn't excuse anyone who also breaches those laws.

Yes but let's stop beating round the bush if plugger calls Saynta stinger who we all know he is he gets a warning and is said to be belittleing him yet Saynta/stinger can call plugger plucker and say he is an alcoho and it's all fair ... I get a warning cause I bring up Stinger wanting to write a letter to the Ceo as I'm bringing up old stuff to a new argument yet Saynta/stinger can rehash an even older argument about Harbijan ?!?!? We have a poll on if this place is better without plugger66 and that's all good yet a poll asking the same about Saynta is swiftly locked?!?!?!? There's a thread about dealing with plucker/fighting with plugger and it's all good yet I post a pi55 take on dealing with stingers (with info on how to deal with jelly fish) and its Locked quicker than Jack Steven running into an open goal.....
No one sticks up for pluggers right to an opinion yet every one says those he argues with is entitled to their opinion ...
It's a double standard that has seen me post less and less over the years - it's not a fair fight when one party gets to hide behind the mods

[SENsei]

You are right stuck in the middle of it. Like it or not.

And I do not have to answer other queries to the likes of you.

And I don't need to sit here and read your bulls***. i haven't responed to plugga for months and had nothing to do with the fool being banned.

You changed your nick. I can guess why, and I don't need your imput sensational.

Yes I was escaping previous bad behaviour. Obviously that is why I put something in my signature to alert people. Very cunning plan don't you think.

Now off you go. We don't need your type around a mature conversation.