Why did we pass brayshaw?

[Rosco]

we passed on brayshaw because we took paddy. end thread/

[Teflon]

Though if you are not a Tanker (Blessed Be Thy Game)....then I think the sentiment at the time was that all three players at the top were potentially very good. Most ranked McCartin or Petracca as No1, though some liked Brayshaw. I was plumping for Petracca.

Last year it was probably not a bad year to have picks 2 or 3.

could not have taken that insight out of the Herald Sun any better...

[saintsRrising]

This kids is an absolute gun.. Why didn't we pick him? Looks to be the best player of the draft excluding Petracca

Not possible. The Tankers have assured me that Pick 1 is always better than Pick 3. And that No1 is then evidently a guaranteed flag. So start polishing the cup.

yes except you cant produce the tankers post that says that so you just lie once again...
doesnt matter, youve explained to us that 20 footballing cliches is worth number 1 pick any day..
carry on...

Good to see that at last you are admiting to be a Tanker. Admission is the first step on the path to recovery.

We will have you back barracking for wins in no time with progress like that.

Now repeat after me:
I want the Saints to defeat the Bulldogs
I want the Saints to defeat the Dons
I want the Saints to defeat the Demons.

[Teflon]

This kids is an absolute gun.. Why didn't we pick him? Looks to be the best player of the draft excluding Petracca

Not possible. The Tankers have assured me that Pick 1 is always better than Pick 3. And that No1 is then evidently a guaranteed flag. So start polishing the cup.

yes except you cant produce the tankers post that says that so you just lie once again...
doesnt matter, youve explained to us that 20 footballing cliches is worth number 1 pick any day..
carry on...

Good to see that at last you are admiting to be a Tanker. Admission is the first step on the path to recovery.

We will have you back barracking for wins in no time with progress like that.

Now repeat after me:
I want the Saints to defeat the Bulldogs
I want the Saints to defeat the Dons
I want the Saints to defeat the Demons.

More lies......youre odd
Again, please show me where I admitted to being a tanker?
Youre a 'tanker' with a W...

[saintsRrising]

This kids is an absolute gun.. Why didn't we pick him? Looks to be the best player of the draft excluding Petracca

Not possible. The Tankers have assured me that Pick 1 is always better than Pick 3. And that No1 is then evidently a guaranteed flag. So start polishing the cup.

yes except you cant produce the tankers post that says that so you just lie once again...
doesnt matter, youve explained to us that 20 footballing cliches is worth number 1 pick any day..
carry on...

Good to see that at last you are admiting to be a Tanker. Admission is the first step on the path to recovery.

We will have you back barracking for wins in no time with progress like that.

Now repeat after me:
I want the Saints to defeat the Bulldogs
I want the Saints to defeat the Dons
I want the Saints to defeat the Demons.

More lies......youre odd
Again, please show me where I admitted to being a tanker?
Youre a 'tanker' with a W...

Amusing is it not.

I make a comical reference to the Tankers.

Up pops Teflon taking umbrage even though he was not addressed (unless of course he is a Tanker).....and then say's who me?

[The Fireman]

Good thread. Nearly got Im torn covered.

you are one of that threads biggest contributors.

[HitTheBoundary]

Good thread. Nearly got Im torn covered.

you are one of that threads biggest contributors.

He is every threads biggest contributor.


(Not sure what those thingies mean - just covering my bases.)

[felix]

More lies......youre odd
Again, please show me where I admitted to being a tanker?
Youre a 'tanker' with a W...[/quote]

Twanker is a good word !

[Bunk_Moreland]

Yes should have chosen Brawshaw over McCartin, should have taken Bont over Billing, also should have taken every other player playing good football over players we chose.

So as a response, what other clubs should have taken Lonie, Dunstan, Sinclair, Bruce etc over.

So for the record. We took McCartin so in 4 years we dont have to pay 800-900 thousand a year like the Bulldogs did for Boyd

[saintsRrising]

Yes should have chosen Brawshaw over McCartin, should have taken Bont over Billing, also should have taken every other player playing good football over players we chose.

So as a response, what other clubs should have taken Lonie, Dunstan, Sinclair, Bruce etc over.

So for the record. We took McCartin so in 4 years we dont have to pay 800-900 thousand a year like the Bulldogs did for Boyd

Agreed. What matters not is any one pick.

What matter is what you do with the balance of your picks and trades, and in the last two periods by that measure the Saints have absolutely nailed it!!!

If we could draft/trade like the last two years every year would would have an amazing team.

2013 and 2014 DRAFTS AND TRADE ACQUISITIONS

Xxxxx Delaney Xxxxx
Savage Goddard McKenzie
Xxxxx Acres Dunstan
Lonie Bruce Billings
Membrey McCartin Sinclair

Longer
Weller
Templeton

...there are actually more but that is the best of them.

[samoht]

Initially I was disappointed that we had overlooked Petracca (or Brayshaw), as I thought they would potentially impact from the word "go" - from their first year - which Brayshaw has indeed done.

But, I've now come to realise that the time needed to develop McCartin (and Goddard) by playing them in the VFL, etc.. is actually helping our cause - which is (or should be) to finish as close to the bottom of the ladder as possible, without tanking - over the next couple of years - and to thus give ourselves the best chance of picking up the best young midfielders in the upcoming drafts.

It's all about timing and the big picture and maximising our chances of drafting young talented talls as well as midfielders - so I can see the logic behind what we've done!

[ace]

Get real.

It's like saying why didn't I pick the 6 straight numbers in the Tattslotto 22 million draw

one swallow doesn't make a summer

You didn't pick the six numbers in Tattslotto because you were confronted with a completely random situation.
I hope the club does not think that players in the draft are completely random.
I hope they have a little insight.
My concerns with McCartin are two fold - his height and his diabetes.

At 194cm he is a short key position player for someone of his generation.
That can be OK of he bulk and also multiple fast leads.
Tony Lockett at 190 cm was on the short side at full forward but it never hampered him.
He had the body to move opponents out of the way in the goal square and no full back could stay with him on the lead.

But that type 1 diabetes will have me concerned until I see him run around like Riewoldt.
Diabetes and elite athlete are oxymorons.

[ace]

Initially I was disappointed that we had overlooked Petracca (or Brayshaw), as I thought they would potentially impact from the word "go" - from their first year - which Brayshaw has indeed done.

But, I've now come to realise that the time needed to develop McCartin (and Goddard) by playing them in the VFL, etc.. is actually helping our cause - which is (or should be) to finish as close to the bottom of the ladder as possible, without tanking - over the next couple of years - and to thus give ourselves the best chance of picking up the best young midfielders in the upcoming drafts.

It's all about timing and the big picture and maximising our chances of drafting young talented talls as well as midfielders - so I can see the logic behind what we've done!

We are already playing too well to get a number one draft pick midfielder.
Gold Coast, Brisbane and Carlton will not win enough games to overtake us.
And we may need to tank to force Melbourne above us.
The best we can hope for is pick 4 or 5 and that requires no free agent compensation picks to sneak beneath us.
Then there is Essendon.
We can't trust the king of the drug cheats.
He could easily tank below us.

[Old Mate]

Get real.

It's like saying why didn't I pick the 6 straight numbers in the Tattslotto 22 million draw

one swallow doesn't make a summer

You didn't pick the six numbers in Tattslotto because you were confronted with a completely random situation.
I hope the club does not think that players in the draft are completely random.
I hope they have a little insight.
My concerns with McCartin are two fold - his height and his diabetes.

At 194cm he is a short key position player for someone of his generation.
That can be OK of he bulk and also multiple fast leads.
Tony Lockett at 190 cm was on the short side at full forward but it never hampered him.
He had the body to move opponents out of the way in the goal square and no full back could stay with him on the lead.

But that type 1 diabetes will have me concerned until I see him run around like Riewoldt.
Diabetes and elite athlete are oxymorons.

With all due respect Ace, height isn't everything with regards to key forwards, I could name a number of quality ones around the same height as Paddy. It's also worth mentioning that we don't see many extreme tall quality key forwards, Buddy the real game changer at that extreme height. Boyd, Patton, Daniher, etc are the new breed of extreme talls and are all unproven. Jesse Hogan the best of the bunch is more the traditional height at around Paddy's height.

Anyway, getting back to height not being the only factor, it's worth noting that Paddy is a massive frame, and naturally looks much bigger standing next to Nick Riewoldt, though not as tall. As a 16 year old playing for Vic Country he crunched the year older Dom Sheed (now plays for West Coast) busting his ACL and Dom said afterwards "Paddy was the biggest bloke out there" (as a bottom-Ager).

Paddy will be fine. Great character, natural football player and surprisingly has some very good athletic traits for such a big bloke. Very agile, extremely quick off the mark, as we saw in his brief AFL experience. He just needs time and for the supporters to be patient. Will he be better than Brayshaw? Who knows but it means little as long as Paddy becomes a good forward for the Saints and is one small piece in the puzzle to a premiership winning team.

[plugger66]

Get real.

It's like saying why didn't I pick the 6 straight numbers in the Tattslotto 22 million draw

one swallow doesn't make a summer

You didn't pick the six numbers in Tattslotto because you were confronted with a completely random situation.
I hope the club does not think that players in the draft are completely random.
I hope they have a little insight.
My concerns with McCartin are two fold - his height and his diabetes.

At 194cm he is a short key position player for someone of his generation.
That can be OK of he bulk and also multiple fast leads.
Tony Lockett at 190 cm was on the short side at full forward but it never hampered him.
He had the body to move opponents out of the way in the goal square and no full back could stay with him on the lead.

But that type 1 diabetes will have me concerned until I see him run around like Riewoldt.
Diabetes and elite athlete are oxymorons.

Diabetes type one will not effect you at all as an athlete. More hope of asthma effecting you. Its a pretty silly comment coming from someone that may not have knowledge of the disease. And maCartin isn't short for a forward. If anything others maybe to tall. Maybe height and champion forward is an oxymoron.

[Old Mate]

Adding to the above, see below leading goal kickers for the season and their height (excluding smalls)

Josh Kennedy 194cm
Jeremy Cameron 196cm
Buddy Franklin 196cm
Travis Cloke 196cm
Josh Bruce 197cm
Cameron McCarthy 193cm
Jack Riewoldt 195cm
Taylor Walker 194cm
Jay Schulz 193cm
Jake Stringer 191cm
Jarryd Roughead 193cm
Jesse Hogan 195cm
Jack Gunston 193cm

From the list above, 3 players 196-197cm, 2 195cm and 7 194cm and below. Paddy at 194cm is no problems.

[St Ick]

Paddy was selected due to the fact this year was always going to be a midfielders draft. Which sounds quite silly considering the top three could be Francis, Wietering and Schache.

Rest assured though, if we get Parish, he will be twice the player Petracca and Brayshaw ever will be, would be a clear #1 last year.

The price on Boyd's head, and subsequently Cameron, wouldve forced us to pull the trigger on Paddy, who will be a gun when given time to develop.

[magnifisaint]

Get real.

It's like saying why didn't I pick the 6 straight numbers in the Tattslotto 22 million draw

one swallow doesn't make a summer

You didn't pick the six numbers in Tattslotto because you were confronted with a completely random situation.
I hope the club does not think that players in the draft are completely random.
I hope they have a little insight.
My concerns with McCartin are two fold - his height and his diabetes.

At 194cm he is a short key position player for someone of his generation.
That can be OK of he bulk and also multiple fast leads.
Tony Lockett at 190 cm was on the short side at full forward but it never hampered him.
He had the body to move opponents out of the way in the goal square and no full back could stay with him on the lead.

But that type 1 diabetes will have me concerned until I see him run around like Riewoldt.
Diabetes and elite athlete are oxymorons.

The analogy here is that hindsight is a wonderful thing. Wait until McCartin has played a couple of seasons before making judgement.

[4ever_saint]

Why didn't GWS take Bontempelli (#4) or even Billings (#3) with either pick 1 or 2 instead of Tom Boyd (#1, GONE) and Josh Kelly (#2) in 2013?
Why didn't GWS or Melbourne take one of Jake Stringer (#5) or Ollie Wines (#7) instead of Whitfield (#1), O'Rourke (#2, GONE), Plowman (#3), Toumpas (#4) with either Picks 1, 2, 3 or 4 in 2012?
Why didn't Melbourne take Nic Naitanui (#2) instead of Jack Watts (#1) in 2008?
Why didn't Carlton take Trent Cotchin (#2) instead of Matthew Kreuzer (#1) in 2007?
Why didn't Carlton take Joel Selwood (#7) or Jack Riewoldt (#13) or Travis Boak (#5), instead of Bryce Gibbs (#1), in 2006?
Why didn't Carlton take Scott Pendlebury (#5) instead of Marc Murphy (#1) in 2005?
Why didn't Richmond take either Buddy Franklin (#5) or Jordan Roughead (#2) instead of Deledio (#1) or Richard Tambling (#4, GONE) in 2004? If you consider the Tambling pick and his contribution to Richmond (108 games, 16 with Adelaide), you could add Jordan Lewis in at #7 (223 games at Hawthorn).

and everyone's favourite....

Why didn't St Kilda take Chris Judd (#3) instead of Luke Ball (#2) in 2001?

BUT the one that takes the cake (thanks Richmond)...

Why did Richmond take Aaron Fiora (#3, LONG GONE) instead of Matthew Pavlich (#4) in 1999?

Hindsight is 20/20. That's the answer.

Drafting isn't an exact science, hence not every single rebuild goes smoothly (ex. Melbourne has been rebuilding for what feels like 10 years). I highly doubt recruiters deliberately choose an inferior player for the fun of it (unless they are drafting for necessity).

We took McCartin because we needed a key forward and, after Boyd went to WBD for the amount of money he did and Patton did his knee, we realised how hard it was going to be to buy one. So we drafted one instead. McCartin wasn't the #1 player in the draft- Petracca was. We took McCartin because that's what we needed at the time. This year they'll recruit elite mids.

One last thing...

Why didn't Melbourne take Nat Fyfe (#20) with Pick 1 or 2 instead of Scully (#1, GONE) and Trengove (#2) in 2009?

Here are all the clubs that passed on Fyfe: Melbourne (passed four times), Richmond (three times), Fremantle (once before taking him with Pick #20), North Melbourne, Sydney (twice), West Coast, Port Adelaide (twice), Essendon, Carlton, Adelaide, Western Bulldogs and Geelong.

Hindsight is 20/20. Also, perhaps wait until McCartin's played more than 2 games before asking these questions. He's a key forward and, historically, they take longer to come on.

[Teflon]

This kids is an absolute gun.. Why didn't we pick him? Looks to be the best player of the draft excluding Petracca

Not possible. The Tankers have assured me that Pick 1 is always better than Pick 3. And that No1 is then evidently a guaranteed flag. So start polishing the cup.

yes except you cant produce the tankers post that says that so you just lie once again...
doesnt matter, youve explained to us that 20 footballing cliches is worth number 1 pick any day..
carry on...

Good to see that at last you are admiting to be a Tanker. Admission is the first step on the path to recovery.

We will have you back barracking for wins in no time with progress like that.

Now repeat after me:
I want the Saints to defeat the Bulldogs
I want the Saints to defeat the Dons
I want the Saints to defeat the Demons.

Where in the above do I condone tanking ?
Again your delusion knows no bounds!
Start reading The Age to get some new cliches...

[matrix]

Good thread. Nearly got Im torn covered.

you are one of that threads biggest contributors.

and then starts a new one askign the same shite he already knows the answers to to just bait
i mean i know we had no game this week, and yeah ive been bored too but geez a lou, you gotta try harder and be a little more subtle

[plugger66]

Good thread. Nearly got Im torn covered.

you are one of that threads biggest contributors.

and then starts a new one askign the same shite he already knows the answers to to just bait
i mean i know we had no game this week, and yeah ive been bored too but geez a lou, you gotta try harder and be a little more subtle

You still commented. Probably shows where you are at. Disappointing for those who know you.

[Megamaguire]

I got the feeling that the more the club scrutinised Pady Mc the more they found it impossible to not pick him. I have no problem believing that the first 3 picks of the 2014 Draft could well be seriously talented and 'productive' players. I'm also thinking back to that older draft that produced a top 3 of Judd, Hodge & Ball. All were very good - I think 2 were excellent. Paddy apparently really impressed the Saints' recruiters with his mental approach to the game as well as his 'natural' football brain. Like Hugh Goddard Paddy is on the development conveyer belt so we'll see. They both deserve as much time as they need.
Way to early to be casting nasturtians!
How a team gels and the natural professionalism of its' individual parts has a huge influence on where it is going.
We are still developing (pretty well I believe) & building. Too early to get overly competitive about the future.
I trust in AR.
Melb with its's win over the cats have had a real injection of confidence but us Sainters are not without our own confidence in the direction we are going. I was glad Melb. had a good day at the cattery (makes the ladder a more interesting proposition) but not feeling glum that Brayshaw is looking good for them.

G O S A I N T S

[Dr Spaceman]

Can't take 'em all.

If Petracca makes a full recovery and comes out next year and wins the Rising Star - "Why did we pass on Petracca?"

If McCartin comes out next year and does a Hogan - "Why did we pass on McCartin?"

Only had the one pick; could only pick one of the many talented kids.

Can't pick 'em all

[Johnny Favier]

The Boyd mega deal IMO had a load to do with the ultimate choice. The cost of a quality Full Forward has become ridiculous.

That's it in a nutshell pretty much.