I need help

[plugger66]

Im sure everyone knows that but can someone explain why Longer is still playing and poor Hickey gets subbed 2 weeks in a row. Hickey isn't a forward and the coaches surely know that but if you play him then keep him playing or don't play him at all. If injured I apologise. In the mean time Longer gets his 7 possessions a game and we get nothing from him around the ground. One has to go and I reckon its really harsh on Hickey as he is being played out of position. And for those who say it doesn't matter this year as we are getting games into Longer well that's fine but we aren't getting games into Hickey in his rightful position.

[ROLS-LEE]

I agree Plugger. Ceglar smashed us. Hickey last year before injury was very good. We need him back at that level.

[borderbarry]

The number of relatiely easy marks Hickey has dropped over the last two games has not helped his cause.

[plugger66]

The number of relatiely easy marks Hickey has dropped over the last two games has not helped his cause.

As opposed to Longer just taking them all.

[noob]

Hickey does more around the ground. Longer's strength is his ruckwork and lost today. We shouldn't just gift games to Longer. Let him earn it.

[SainterK]

As opposed to longer, has he taken a contested mark Baz?

I don't get it either.

Hickey should seek a trade.

If you've forgotten, watch rd 1-3 last year before he got injured.

Like p66 I will apologise if injured or it's discipline.

Otherwise I just think Alan prefers Bill, that's not Bills fault though, so I'm careful not to sound like I'm bagging him.

[RW&B]

It has gotten quite a bit of coverage lately that David Armitage sat down with Richo and spoke about emulating Jordan Lewis and it has done wonders for Armo. I think Richo/Skrobalak/Kingsley could do worse than sit down with Bill and go through Todd Goldstein's tapes. I think Billy has the ability and skill set to be a Goldstein type down the track.

For the purpose of this thread, I'd rest Billy and ruck Hickey next week.

[BackFromUSA]

I agree Plugger66. 100%.

[saintjake]

It has gotten quite a bit of coverage lately that David Armitage sat down with Richo and spoke about emulating Jordan Lewis and it has done wonders for Armo. I think Richo/Skrobalak/Kingsley could do worse than sit down with Bill and go through Todd Goldstein's tapes. I think Billy has the ability and skill set to be a Goldstein type down the track.

For the purpose of this thread, I'd rest Billy and ruck Hickey next week.

I think Longer is more the Darren Jolly type ruckman and Hickey is the Goldstein

[saintspremiers]

Hickey was hobbling and appeared a bit injured.

Maybe we need to go back to playing one ruckman.

If Gilbo comes back in next week, it least it's a tall for a tall.

[falka]

Longer is very average.
I am not a fan. Gives away frees and whines with that stupid goatie then drops a mark! Repeat
Agree re Hickey being treated unfairly.

[whiskers3614]

At last,
a thread title that unites us all!

[jonesy]

Because they're putting games into both to get the trade value up for one of them...

[magnifisaint]

I don't think Ceglar smashed Longer at all. He just has better players around him. Hickey will play again next week unless he's injured.

[samuraisaint]

Agree with Plugger66 here. There was an element of acceptance that we had to minimise damage about Hickey coming off; that we conceded we couldn't win. Hickey may have had a slight injury though because he came off with something lat last week as well. Would like to see Hickey ruck all game against Dees next week.

[plugger66]

Because they're putting games into both to get the trade value up for one of them...

Is their value going up by both playing only fairly. I don't see how that can happen.

[cwrcyn]

Longer has been awful in the past few games. Terrible below his knees and lacks the mobility required for the modern game. He would have suited 1970s football beautifully. Right now I would say that Holmes would probably provide the same output, but get more taps.

[Toy Saint]

Both Hickey and Longer have been dissapointing the past 5 weeks, perhaps we should be looking at the next option. It appears Holmes is a great tap ruckman but is lost around the ground, but he is improving.

It was counterproductive to see Bruce in the ruck in the final quarter yesterday, he was awful and it burned his petrol tickets; he was too knackered up forward. Two average rucks is not ideal, but we have no backup. Last year we had Stanley, so we could play ruck, but this year we have no backup. It's a pity the Hickey/foward trial has failed.

It seems to me that we need a good tap ruckman who can run all day, with a bit of support from a couple of big types at either end. We've got Membrey and Lee in the seconds that are built like 2nd rucks from the 1960's. Then there is Goddard & McCartin, both big but young. I've actually got a theory that you should not use the prized thoroughbred in the ruck, that's the job for the draft horse.

[plugger66]

Both Hickey and Longer have been dissapointing the past 5 weeks, perhaps we should be looking at the next option. It appears Holmes is a great tap ruckman but is lost around the ground, but he is improving.

It was counterproductive to see Bruce in the ruck in the final quarter yesterday, he was awful and it burned his petrol tickets; he was too knackered up forward. Two average rucks is not ideal, but we have no backup. Last year we had Stanley, so we could play ruck, but this year we have no backup. It's a pity the Hickey/foward trial has failed.

It seems to me that we need a good tap ruckman who can run all day, with a bit of support from a couple of big types at either end. We've got Membrey and Lee in the seconds that are built like 2nd rucks from the 1960's. Then there is Goddard & McCartin, both big but young. I've actually got a theory that you should not use the prized thoroughbred in the ruck, that's the job for the draft horse.

Of course Hickey has been disappointing. He isn't ever going to be a forward. I feel for him. I really hope he has a slight injury so he cant ruck but then would be wondering why the hell he is playing.

[CURLY]

Like Longer in the ruck and at 21 is still LEARNING his role. Gives us more than a contest each time which is what you want as a mid fielder.

[felix]

Richo talks about Hickry and Longer a little in his post game presser doesn't enlighten a lot but seems he will persevere with trying to make Hickey a forward , said Longer has been ok got beaten today but he is our ruck for now.

[Freebird]

Im sure everyone knows that but can someone explain why Longer is still playing and poor Hickey gets subbed 2 weeks in a row. Hickey isn't a forward and the coaches surely know that but if you play him then keep him playing or don't play him at all. If injured I apologise. In the mean time Longer gets his 7 possessions a game and we get nothing from him around the ground. One has to go and I reckon its really harsh on Hickey as he is being played out of position. And for those who say it doesn't matter this year as we are getting games into Longer well that's fine but we aren't getting games into Hickey in his rightful position.

The reason is obvious - Longer is the better ruckman and Hickey is sub-standard in most areas. Longer not great but > Hickey

[saint-stu]

Richo said himself that the ruck combination didn't work yesterday. Hickey did OK for a few weeks in that position but he really doesn't look at all like a forward. It is a shame because he looked really good as the no.1 ruckman after McEvoy left.

I know it's extremely unlikely and we would need another injury which we don't want, but I desperately want to see Holmes get a run in the seniors. He dominates in the ruck each week at VFL level. Yes, he is still learning basic skills, but I don't think our senior rucks are offering much other than tap work anyway. And I suspect Holmes will be better than both of them at that.

He has that x-factor. I only wish we rookied him a bit earlier as he's already in his prime (age wise) and is still learning.

[Milne]

I agree about the coaching situation with Hickey, but let's give Longer a bit more of a chance. He has come a long way since last year and is only young.

[plugger66]

Im sure everyone knows that but can someone explain why Longer is still playing and poor Hickey gets subbed 2 weeks in a row. Hickey isn't a forward and the coaches surely know that but if you play him then keep him playing or don't play him at all. If injured I apologise. In the mean time Longer gets his 7 possessions a game and we get nothing from him around the ground. One has to go and I reckon its really harsh on Hickey as he is being played out of position. And for those who say it doesn't matter this year as we are getting games into Longer well that's fine but we aren't getting games into Hickey in his rightful position.

The reason is obvious - Longer is the better ruckman and Hickey is sub-standard in most areas. Longer not great but > Hickey

Longer taps the ball more often but isn't anywhere near Hickey around the ground. His last 6 games he has averaged about 7 possessions a game and more importantly the opposition ruckman usually has their best game for the year. If Longer is a better overall ruckman than Hickey then Hickey has no real trade value. I cant see it myself. Think Hickey clearly has Longer covered.