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saintspremiers wrote:
The responsible gambling crap is a forced government warning like having to read a PDS before buying insurance. It's all legal PC rubbish.
Gambling venues are businesses that try and make as much money as they can. Do you know that at Crown they deliberately move pokies around to always make the venue "fresh" and "different". It's all part of extracting as much as they can. Problem with small venues like ours is that it's much harder to do that with the small floor space and not many machines.
Crown use all sorts of tactics to get people to lose more money than they should.
I don't think it's a positive thing for society to encourage this sort of stuff. And I certainly wouldn't take any pleasure from the Saints being a 'big club' if I knew that they'd achieved it by tricking vulnerable people into losing their money and in most cases negatively impacting their own and their family's lives.
It doesn't matter if someone else will just step in and do it if we don't. That doesn't make it right.
As I said, we should be allowed to have them. And people should be allowed to play them if they want. But I don't think the Saints, nor anyone, should be allowed to operate 'venues' the way they're currently operated.
There is massive potential for the club to make BIG $$$$$$$$$ out of Food & Booze out of the Social Club, not just Pokies. It is in the perfect location where residential meets commercial/industrial and that potential can turn into $$$$$$$ for the club if it is done correctly !!
NEW scarf signature (hopefully with correct spelling) will be here as soon as it arrives !!
Playon wrote:In the end gambling is a choice isn't it?
Ah, the crux of the matter.
There's nothing wrong with the responsible gambling that many of us enjoy. Sadly, problem gamblers will find a way to squander their money with or without pokies at Moorabbin.
They should seek help. There is good help available.
This all reminds me of the argument that led to those barriers being put along the Westgate Bridge to prevent suicides. Now people throw themselves off the Bolte Bridge or under trains. That money would have been better spent on actually helping people with mental health issues.
We should push for as many machines as we can get and make it clear that, as a club, we support responsible gambling.
I worked at a major bookmaker/gambling company.
They preach 'responsible gambling' and are full on about it.
Yet at the same time, their business is based on trying to find ways to get people to gamble more.
The 'responsible gambling' thing is a crock. A myth. I've seen it first hand.
I think people should be allowed to bet, on whatever they want. Whenever they want. But it's a fact, that pokies venues aren't merely providing a service to people. They're specifically designed to get people to stay there for long periods of time, get drunk, and gamble more whilst being distracted by the fact that they're doing their dough. Ever noticed how most 'venues' now have the entrance to the pokies in a discreet place? That's no accident. They know problem gambers try to hide it, so they facilitate it.
They're a trap.
So I don't have an issue with pokies at all. But I don't like pokies venues and the way they operate. The club should be allowed to have pokies, but I don't like the concept of the club literally setting up a gambling business designed purely to get people to bet beyond their means and lose money they can't afford, just so we can go to work on Monday mornings and brag about how big and rich our footy club is.
Same with corporate bookies. It's a great service for punters and people should be allowed to use them. But I don't think they should be able to advertise openly.
I think the same rules that apply to cigarettes should apply to any other 'vice' that can cause significant damage to society.
Why do you keep saying silly things like people bragging how big and rich our footy club is. No one says that because we aren't. You seem to say that all the time for no reason. Other clubs may be because of pokies but this is a saints site and I cant see anyone one of our supporters ever saying that. The more I read from the you the more I wonder if you actually follow our club. You seem keen to knock them but don't seem keen to talk about them on the footy field. Its all very strange on a saints fan forum. Anyway it seems you are happy for us to have them. It all very wishy washy.
Eastern wrote:There is massive potential for the club to make BIG $$$$$$$$$ out of Food & Booze out of the Social Club, not just Pokies. It is in the perfect location where residential meets commercial/industrial and that potential can turn into $$$$$$$ for the club if it is done correctly !!
I agree. There is potentially a huge commercial opportunity there for retail/restaurant/cafe type setup which could take us totally away from the pokies revenue if done properly.
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in.
Some foresight and well planned execution could make all the difference.
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
Yeah it is a honey pot. It may not be an earth-shattering amount but still, It would to be difficult to replace that sort of cash. In the 2014 Annual Report the Social Club revenue was a bit over $2mil which I presume is nearly all pokies.
It would blow a 6.5% hole in revenue (recurring based on $30m total revenue) which drops straight off the bottom line less licensing costs.
I am not a pokies fan but losing that would be too much for our little club to cop right at this moment.
We need to find alternative streams of income and lessen the reliance before the club can get rid of the machines - I have just realised.
Actually the parlous state of the clubs finances makes me wonder where on earth we are going to find the $5m to kick in for the Moorabin relocation.
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
Yeah it is a honey pot. It may not be an earth-shattering amount but still, It would to be difficult to replace that sort of cash. In the 2014 Annual Report the Social Club revenue was a bit over $2mil which I presume is nearly all pokies.
It would blow a 6.5% hole in revenue (recurring based on $30m total revenue) which drops straight off the bottom line less licensing costs.
I am not a pokies fan but losing that would be too much for our little club to cop right at this moment.
We need to find alternative streams of income and lessen the reliance before the club can get rid of the machines - I have just realised.
Actually the parlous state of the clubs finances makes me wonder where on earth we are going to find the $5m to kick in for the Moorabin relocation.
So we want our club to be the moral crusader by selling the pokies to the other local clubs and pubs. Then our patrons go there and lose money but we feel better. The way I see it we are just moving the problem . We aren't helping anyone but we feel better. maybe if we had the pokies and had better control of the people losing the money it would be better for everyone concerned.
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
Yeah it is a honey pot. It may not be an earth-shattering amount but still, It would to be difficult to replace that sort of cash. In the 2014 Annual Report the Social Club revenue was a bit over $2mil which I presume is nearly all pokies.
It would blow a 6.5% hole in revenue (recurring based on $30m total revenue) which drops straight off the bottom line less licensing costs.
I am not a pokies fan but losing that would be too much for our little club to cop right at this moment.
We need to find alternative streams of income and lessen the reliance before the club can get rid of the machines - I have just realised.
Actually the parlous state of the clubs finances makes me wonder where on earth we are going to find the $5m to kick in for the Moorabin relocation.
So we want our club to be the moral crusader by selling the pokies to the other local clubs and pubs. Then our patrons go there and lose money but we feel better. The way I see it we are just moving the problem . We aren't helping anyone but we feel better. maybe if we had the pokies and had better control of the people losing the money it would be better for everyone concerned.
Now I'm frightened, very frightened. I find my self in total agreement with plugger on this issue. The Social Club should be run as a (successful) BUSINESS !!
NEW scarf signature (hopefully with correct spelling) will be here as soon as it arrives !!
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
Yeah it is a honey pot. It may not be an earth-shattering amount but still, It would to be difficult to replace that sort of cash. In the 2014 Annual Report the Social Club revenue was a bit over $2mil which I presume is nearly all pokies.
It would blow a 6.5% hole in revenue (recurring based on $30m total revenue) which drops straight off the bottom line less licensing costs.
I am not a pokies fan but losing that would be too much for our little club to cop right at this moment.
We need to find alternative streams of income and lessen the reliance before the club can get rid of the machines - I have just realised.
Actually the parlous state of the clubs finances makes me wonder where on earth we are going to find the $5m to kick in for the Moorabin relocation.
So we want our club to be the moral crusader by selling the pokies to the other local clubs and pubs. Then our patrons go there and lose money but we feel better. The way I see it we are just moving the problem . We aren't helping anyone but we feel better. maybe if we had the pokies and had better control of the people losing the money it would be better for everyone concerned.
The message is simple - the club cannot afford to take a highbrow, moral crusader position on the issue of pokies.
Darth Vader wrote:That's what you get for listening to the ABC.
ABC = All Bull & Cr@p
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
Yeah it is a honey pot. It may not be an earth-shattering amount but still, It would to be difficult to replace that sort of cash. In the 2014 Annual Report the Social Club revenue was a bit over $2mil which I presume is nearly all pokies.
It would blow a 6.5% hole in revenue (recurring based on $30m total revenue) which drops straight off the bottom line less licensing costs.
I am not a pokies fan but losing that would be too much for our little club to cop right at this moment.
We need to find alternative streams of income and lessen the reliance before the club can get rid of the machines - I have just realised.
Actually the parlous state of the clubs finances makes me wonder where on earth we are going to find the $5m to kick in for the Moorabin relocation.
So we want our club to be the moral crusader by selling the pokies to the other local clubs and pubs. Then our patrons go there and lose money but we feel better. The way I see it we are just moving the problem . We aren't helping anyone but we feel better. maybe if we had the pokies and had better control of the people losing the money it would be better for everyone concerned.
The message is simple - the club cannot afford to take a highbrow, moral crusader position on the issue of pokies.
Pokies ARE appropriate at footy venues.
Footy is a game of natural selection - the weak get beaten, the strong prosper.
Pokies are a game of natural selection - the weak get ripped off, the strong prosper.
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
Yeah it is a honey pot. It may not be an earth-shattering amount but still, It would to be difficult to replace that sort of cash. In the 2014 Annual Report the Social Club revenue was a bit over $2mil which I presume is nearly all pokies.
It would blow a 6.5% hole in revenue (recurring based on $30m total revenue) which drops straight off the bottom line less licensing costs.
I am not a pokies fan but losing that would be too much for our little club to cop right at this moment.
We need to find alternative streams of income and lessen the reliance before the club can get rid of the machines - I have just realised.
Actually the parlous state of the clubs finances makes me wonder where on earth we are going to find the $5m to kick in for the Moorabin relocation.
So we want our club to be the moral crusader by selling the pokies to the other local clubs and pubs. Then our patrons go there and lose money but we feel better. The way I see it we are just moving the problem . We aren't helping anyone but we feel better. maybe if we had the pokies and had better control of the people losing the money it would be better for everyone concerned.
The message is simple - the club cannot afford to take a highbrow, moral crusader position on the issue of pokies.
Pokies ARE appropriate at footy venues.
Footy is a game of natural selection - the weak get beaten, the strong prosper.
Pokies are a game of natural selection - the weak get ripped off, the strong prosper.
No one prospers with pokies, weak or strong but they are legal and are staying whether at our club or the sandbelt down the road.
stjay wrote:
Would love to know exactly how much they're making out of the machines. If we accept that we are not going to grow that revenue stream (or maybe slightly at the margin) then the PR win alone with the local community and members from getting rid of them could end being worth a multiple in value to the club to what they current pull in..
I think it was around the 2mil mark was mentioned in a article a while back or 15% of total revenue also that has to be considered the value of the licenses is one of our biggest assets. I doubt too many pubs or restaurants make that sort of money without pokies.
Pretty sure the machines might gross $2m but profit after taxes and gambling licenses are likely to be $250-300k. Just shows how likely you are to win! Not a game-changing amount.
Yeah it is a honey pot. It may not be an earth-shattering amount but still, It would to be difficult to replace that sort of cash. In the 2014 Annual Report the Social Club revenue was a bit over $2mil which I presume is nearly all pokies.
It would blow a 6.5% hole in revenue (recurring based on $30m total revenue) which drops straight off the bottom line less licensing costs.
I am not a pokies fan but losing that would be too much for our little club to cop right at this moment.
We need to find alternative streams of income and lessen the reliance before the club can get rid of the machines - I have just realised.
Actually the parlous state of the clubs finances makes me wonder where on earth we are going to find the $5m to kick in for the Moorabin relocation.
So we want our club to be the moral crusader by selling the pokies to the other local clubs and pubs. Then our patrons go there and lose money but we feel better. The way I see it we are just moving the problem . We aren't helping anyone but we feel better. maybe if we had the pokies and had better control of the people losing the money it would be better for everyone concerned.
The message is simple - the club cannot afford to take a highbrow, moral crusader position on the issue of pokies.
Pokies ARE appropriate at footy venues.
Footy is a game of natural selection - the weak get beaten, the strong prosper.
Pokies are a game of natural selection - the weak get ripped off, the strong prosper.
No one prospers with pokies, weak or strong but they are legal and are staying whether at our club or the sandbelt down the road.
Did you know that there is a limit on the number of pokies (electronic gaming machines).
30,000 in total with 2,500 of those in Crown.
Other venues limited to 105 and a club limited to 420.
So that means 4 venues of 105 or 5 venues average 84.
87% must be returned in winnings and special jackpots.
The number of spins per minute is limited to 28.
87% compounded 28 time leaves you with 2.67%.
Did you know that people who play pokies are losers.
The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.
If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
ace wrote:Did you know that there is a limit on the number of pokies (electronic gaming machines).
30,000 in total with 2,500 of those in Crown.
Other venues limited to 105 and a club limited to 420.
So that means 4 venues of 105 or 5 venues average 84.
87% must be returned in winnings and special jackpots.
The number of spins per minute is limited to 28.
87% compounded 28 time leaves you with 2.67%.
Did you know that people who play pokies are losers.
So why would you want our club to be full of losers? What would you want our proud club to fleece losers? Maybe we should make more money off losers in other ways, like having drive through garbage fast food restaurants for fatarses too lazy to go for a walk or cook something. Maybe we can get these losers to all pay money to sit in a chair eating overpriced garbage and watching talentless fools crack poor jokes.
Losers - that's what our club should be built on? That's what we are?
Just My Opinion
------------------------------------------------
ace wrote:Did you know that there is a limit on the number of pokies (electronic gaming machines).
30,000 in total with 2,500 of those in Crown.
Other venues limited to 105 and a club limited to 420.
So that means 4 venues of 105 or 5 venues average 84.
87% must be returned in winnings and special jackpots.
The number of spins per minute is limited to 28.
87% compounded 28 time leaves you with 2.67%.
Did you know that people who play pokies are losers.
So why would you want our club to be full of losers? What would you want our proud club to fleece losers? Maybe we should make more money off losers in other ways, like having drive through garbage fast food restaurants for fatarses too lazy to go for a walk or cook something. Maybe we can get these losers to all pay money to sit in a chair eating overpriced garbage and watching talentless fools crack poor jokes.
Losers - that's what our club should be built on? That's what we are?
Agree. Let's take the moral high ground and become feral vegan hippies and watch the club go broke.
i am Melbourne Skies - sometimes Blue Skies, Grey Skies, even Partly Cloudy Skies.
So how much do we make from Pokies if the social club revenue is $2 Million how much profit are we making on that revenue. Ultimately this is a side buisness it adds nothing to the club apart from the cash it contributes to the bottom line, and arguably tarnishes the brand. I would have to agree with the caller that having a Pokies venue at the new community hub of football in the South East is counter productive. You would want Moorabin to be a place familys gather to use the park and watch local footy of a variety of levels, see the Saints train and generally be a hub for the positive and healthy aspects of sport.
If Pokies are that important to our bottom line and we have to retain them for the revenue then I hope we could consider locating them somewhere else or leasing the licences to another operator or something like that. Making our social club a Pokies venue is likely to put many real members off going there I know I would avoid it like the plague, ultimately surely what we would want is a social club that feels like our home and that is full of St Kilda members. Where you can have a meal or a drink or a coffee and be immersed in the history of the club and discuss with the person sitting next to you where you were when Plugger kicked his ton against Footscray or Phil Carmen headbutted Umpire Carbury or when Winmar hit Lockett just before the siren for the game winning goal against Carlton. We should be aiming to be a footy club not a casino.
All this stuff of if we don't do it someone else will is complete rubbish the Pokies are a scourge on our community they tarnish the clubs brand and they keep Saints supporters away from the club. Open a Cafe instead with a quality Barista and the players latte sipping ways between sessions will more than make up for the lost Pokies Revenue.
so what all the non pokies lovers are sayin is if we dont have the pokies the community will be saved and better for it?
even tho if we dont get em someone else will get em down the road?
so
on that note, that pokies are bad
whats the alternatives to bring in the same revenue that the pokies wouldve brought in?
