Looking to 2015

[citywest]

Why would I even bother having a discussion with you when you have the vocabulary of a grade 3 student. Your English is abysmal.

If you're going to pick on someone's English skills, you should probably do it somewhere other than in a sentence in which you have written three as a numeral instead of a word............

Correct English would be "a grade three student"......

Point taken.

[barwonsaint]

I have just been looking on this site for a while,missing the footy and just being amused and interested in the passion some of the members have agreeing with some and disagree with others,but happily keeping to myself,as a saints supporter and member for 50 years i have to respond to that idiot citywest.
Damirnc posted a very thoughtfull insight into our clubs future and after reading the crap that citywest posted i am not going on to this site anymore so dont worry about slaging off at me as i wont be reading it you f----wit.

[magnifisaint]

It would be nice to win 7 games in 2015

[magnifisaint]

It would be nice to win 7 games in 2015

[Dave McNamara]

... f----wit.

Four blanks c/f three barwin...? Better hope TB's not watching.

But hey, disagreeing with one post from one poster isn't a reason to quit this site. Maybe you could reconsider?

[Austinnn]

No I agree with Barwon Saint, Damien started one of the most interesting threads in weeks, and it immediately got hijacked by our resident <edited by mod> with the same braindead suggestion he's continously postulated to a unanimously negative reaction, but still keeps on insisting. It seriously is the <edited by mod> idea, whichbis ironic given your name. Reminds me of another ex-poster with a very descriptive name that - like a lonely mental dog - just used to bark forever.

<edited by mod>west, We won't trade Steven and Armo. We would be mad to. It won't happen. Clear enough? Now move on. If this is your indicator of the failure of a club, leave us to our failure and start a new life as a GWS fan. You are an irritant, <edited by mod> you never have anything close to anything of value to say and you have once again succeeded in derailing an interesting discussion. No wonder people are leaving this site.

Please, let's get back to the op. I'm interested to know more about people's observations of Rich as a coach and how it will differ from our most recent directions and also how our game plan will differ from our rivals, quality of players notwithstanding.

I posted my dream for Petrenko to be Milney II and that seems to chime with what Damien wrote. It seems like all our rookies this time will be second hand mature age players, probably a good thing, it's not like we don't have enough new kids coming through. I'd like to know more about how people see Richo's game plan, as distinct from his coaching, although I'm interestedin that too. Let's stay on track, and save the trade talk for next year.

<warning issued for swearing and abuse>

[samuraisaint]

The most important thing in 2015 is of course getting more games into the youngsters. However something just as important is to continue our list strategy. For me it is all centred on Jack Steven and David Armitage. Best case scenario IMHO would be Steven leave as a FA and we get pick 2 as compo (assuming we will finish last again), and Armitage traded for a pick around 15(ish).

This would achieve a couple of things. It would probably ensure that we finish bottom 2 again in 2016 and it would also give us another 2 high end talents coming through together with Petracca, Billings, Dunstan and Acres. By 2018 we would be the envy of the AFL exactly like it was when we burst out of the blocks in 2004 with the first 10 wins of the season.

Ridiculous mate. In 2004 we still had the likes of Aussie Jones and Robert Harvey on the list, not to mention Lenny who had been playing several years by then. We won't get anywhere by trading Jack Steven. We are going to finish probably last again next year, and with the retirements of Montagna, Fisher, Dempster and Schneider, possibly even Roo, all in one go at the and of 2015 we will be bottom two in 2016 anyway. Without Armitage and Steven we would struggle to win even one game. Those guys are our only successfull draft picks during Lyon's entire time at the club and you want to offload them?

We could start to improve in 2017, but maybe not if we have a bad run with injuries or luck. I cannot see a return to finals action before 2019 the earliest.

[samuraisaint]

It would be nice to win 7 games in 2015

Won't happen.
We may win 5 if Essendon players receive long bans, 4 if they receive bans for the first half of the year, otherwise 3 max.

[plugger66]

It would be nice to win 7 games in 2015

Won't happen.
We may win 5 if Essendon players receive long bans, 4 if they receive bans for the first half of the year, otherwise 3 max.

Yep im a 1-3 man. Worse side than this year so not expecting much. If Armo and Jack went at the end of next year I would expect anywhere between no wins and no wins in 2016.

[samuraisaint]

The most important thing in 2015 is of course getting more games into the youngsters. However something just as important is to continue our list strategy. For me it is all centred on Jack Steven and David Armitage. Best case scenario IMHO would be Steven leave as a FA and we get pick 2 as compo (assuming we will finish last again), and Armitage traded for a pick around 15(ish).

This would achieve a couple of things. It would probably ensure that we finish bottom 2 again in 2016 and it would also give us another 2 high end talents coming through together with Petracca, Billings, Dunstan and Acres. By 2018 we would be the envy of the AFL exactly like it was when we burst out of the blocks in 2004 with the first 10 wins of the season.

Im a bit worried about your footy knowledge. Imagine our midfield from this year without Lenny, Armo and Jack. The young kids would be smashed. We would lose every game by a minimum of 10 goals. maybe its best you don't make us laugh to much.

With another year of experience for our whole list the loss of Steven and Armitage in 12 months time will not be huge. In fact it will be quite minimal when you consider Petracca, Billings, Dunstan and Acres will be that much older and experienced. Not to mention Eli, Mav and a host of other talented youngsters that we have. Once again you are showing off your short-sightedness again plugger.

Rubbish. How good did we look this year with Armo or Steven injured for the season at different times? We weren't even competitive. Massive ins for us next year when they're fit and injury-free again.

[BackFromUSA]

CityWest I have to agree with many here. This idea of yours lacks full thought. Those two players are central to our rebuild and will be still in their peak with 150 to 200 games of experience when we compete again for a flag. They are starting midfielders who have the hardened bodies ready for full contested footy and the skills to be attacking threats. Our recent draftees need them. There are many ways to build a list now and trading out players will not be a priority from now on and that is why Pelchen is no longer required. We shall automatically have 2 high draft picks next year and that will achieve the stated objective of 8 low draft picks in 3 years. We shall continue to use the draft thereafter without trading our first 2 draft picks as an ongoing strategy. From next year we shall start to use free agency and the only way we will lose players like Steven or Armitage will be by players choice. I am not saying other players will not get traded, dropped or even released by the club like Gwilt this year but if Steven goes it will be his choice and to be honest even pick 2 will mean our finals and premiership ambitions will be put back a year or two.

[samuraisaint]

It would be nice to win 7 games in 2015

Won't happen.
We may win 5 if Essendon players receive long bans, 4 if they receive bans for the first half of the year, otherwise 3 max.

Yep im a 1-3 man. Worse side than this year so not expecting much. If Armo and Jack went at the end of next year I would expect anywhere between no wins and no wins in 2016.

Exactly.

[citywest]

CityWest I have to agree with many here. This idea of yours lacks full thought. Those two players are central to our rebuild and will be still in their peak with 150 to 200 games of experience when we compete again for a flag. They are starting midfielders who have the hardened bodies ready for full contested footy and the skills to be attacking threats. Our recent draftees need them. There are many ways to build a list now and trading out players will not be a priority from now on and that is why Pelchen is no longer required. We shall automatically have 2 high draft picks next year and that will achieve the stated objective of 8 low draft picks in 3 years. We shall continue to use the draft thereafter without trading our first 2 draft picks as an ongoing strategy. From next year we shall start to use free agency and the only way we will lose players like Steven or Armitage will be by players choice. I am not saying other players will not get traded, dropped or even released by the club like Gwilt this year but if Steven goes it will be his choice and to be honest even pick 2 will mean our finals and premiership ambitions will be put back a year or two.

I see your point BackFromUSA however the proof will be in the pudding. Our strategy for the last 3 years has been to sacrifice 1 good to very good player in order to gain another pick between our first and second picks. BJ, Dal, Big Boy, Stanley. I honestly see this continuing next year with either Steven or Armitage. I did say that losing both is probably over the top but I would consider it depending on the compensation. You have to remember that if we don't think outside the square we have no hope in competing with GWS and GCS in 5 years time when all 3 teams (including the Saints) are at the top. IMHO, we have to sacrifice players with value to be stronger in 5 years time. With another 12 months experience to our whole list I am sure that the impact of losing Steven next year would be minimal.

I think I saw a post on here (or it might have been on BIGFOOTY), if we don't think outside the square and just go to the draft every year we will never catch the top teams. The reason for this is quite simple. There are no more priority picks so a team that finishes last has basically the same picks as the premiership team.....except for the first pick. eg (dismissing compensation picks) St Kilda have picks 1, 19, 37,55...Hawthorn 18, 36, 54. Do you see what I mean!!!!!?????

[Johnny Favier]

CityWest I have to agree with many here. This idea of yours lacks full thought. Those two players are central to our rebuild and will be still in their peak with 150 to 200 games of experience when we compete again for a flag. They are starting midfielders who have the hardened bodies ready for full contested footy and the skills to be attacking threats. Our recent draftees need them. There are many ways to build a list now and trading out players will not be a priority from now on and that is why Pelchen is no longer required. We shall automatically have 2 high draft picks next year and that will achieve the stated objective of 8 low draft picks in 3 years. We shall continue to use the draft thereafter without trading our first 2 draft picks as an ongoing strategy. From next year we shall start to use free agency and the only way we will lose players like Steven or Armitage will be by players choice. I am not saying other players will not get traded, dropped or even released by the club like Gwilt this year but if Steven goes it will be his choice and to be honest even pick 2 will mean our finals and premiership ambitions will be put back a year or two.

I see your point BackFromUSA however the proof will be in the pudding. Our strategy for the last 3 years has been to sacrifice 1 good to very good player in order to gain another pick between our first and second picks. BJ, Dal, Big Boy, Stanley. I honestly see this continuing next year with either Steven or Armitage. I did say that losing both is probably over the top but I would consider it depending on the compensation. You have to remember that if we don't think outside the square we have no hope in competing with GWS and GCS in 5 years time when all 3 teams (including the Saints) are at the top. IMHO, we have to sacrifice players with value to be stronger in 5 years time. With another 12 months experience to our whole list I am sure that the impact of losing Steven next year would be minimal.

I think I saw a post on here (or it might have been on BIGFOOTY), if we don't think outside the square and just go to the draft every year we will never catch the top teams. The reason for this is quite simple. There are no more priority picks so a team that finishes last has basically the same picks as the premiership team.....except for the first pick. eg (dismissing compensation picks) St Kilda have picks 1, 19, 37,55...Hawthorn 18, 36, 54. Do you see what I mean!!!!!?????

We seriously need a facepalm icon for times like these....but for now, will have to do...

[plugger66]

CityWest I have to agree with many here. This idea of yours lacks full thought. Those two players are central to our rebuild and will be still in their peak with 150 to 200 games of experience when we compete again for a flag. They are starting midfielders who have the hardened bodies ready for full contested footy and the skills to be attacking threats. Our recent draftees need them. There are many ways to build a list now and trading out players will not be a priority from now on and that is why Pelchen is no longer required. We shall automatically have 2 high draft picks next year and that will achieve the stated objective of 8 low draft picks in 3 years. We shall continue to use the draft thereafter without trading our first 2 draft picks as an ongoing strategy. From next year we shall start to use free agency and the only way we will lose players like Steven or Armitage will be by players choice. I am not saying other players will not get traded, dropped or even released by the club like Gwilt this year but if Steven goes it will be his choice and to be honest even pick 2 will mean our finals and premiership ambitions will be put back a year or two.

I see your point BackFromUSA however the proof will be in the pudding. Our strategy for the last 3 years has been to sacrifice 1 good to very good player in order to gain another pick between our first and second picks. BJ, Dal, Big Boy, Stanley. I honestly see this continuing next year with either Steven or Armitage. I did say that losing both is probably over the top but I would consider it depending on the compensation. You have to remember that if we don't think outside the square we have no hope in competing with GWS and GCS in 5 years time when all 3 teams (including the Saints) are at the top. IMHO, we have to sacrifice players with value to be stronger in 5 years time. With another 12 months experience to our whole list I am sure that the impact of losing Steven next year would be minimal.

I think I saw a post on here (or it might have been on BIGFOOTY), if we don't think outside the square and just go to the draft every year we will never catch the top teams. The reason for this is quite simple. There are no more priority picks so a team that finishes last has basically the same picks as the premiership team.....except for the first pick. eg (dismissing compensation picks) St Kilda have picks 1, 19, 37,55...Hawthorn 18, 36, 54. Do you see what I mean!!!!!?????

You still fail to see we lose a player in an important age group. As good as the GWS players were rated before the draft they haven't performed as well as they probably should have because of lack of experience. Over the last 2 years GWS have decided to get more experienced players to help the young kids. You are wanting to get rid of one maybe 2 of our most experienced players to get more young guys. We will be to young and have a very bad age profile. They may leave but it wont be our choice. And we don't have PP anymore but we do have FA and we will have a huge amount in our SC at the end of the next 2 seasons.

[Jacks Back]

It would be nice to win 7 games in 2015

Won't happen.
We may win 5 if Essendon players receive long bans, 4 if they receive bans for the first half of the year, otherwise 3 max.

Yep im a 1-3 man. Worse side than this year so not expecting much. If Armo and Jack went at the end of next year I would expect anywhere between no wins and no wins in 2016.

Exactly.

And then we'll have the problem of any good players we do pick up wanting to leave a sinking ship. We can't be down for too long in this age of players breaking contracts.

[Armagizmo]

It would be nice to win 7 games in 2015

Won't happen.
We may win 5 if Essendon players receive long bans, 4 if they receive bans for the first half of the year, otherwise 3 max.

Yep im a 1-3 man. Worse side than this year so not expecting much. If Armo and Jack went at the end of next year I would expect anywhere between no wins and no wins in 2016.

Exactly.

And then we'll have the problem of any good players we do pick up wanting to leave a sinking ship. We can't be down for too long in this age of players breaking contracts.

Yep agree. The only possible reason I could see for trading Steven is if we have pick 1, and receive compensation pick 2, which we package in a trade for Dangerfield, Cameron or some other star playing interstate. I wouldn't mind that.

Note: I'm not saying trade pick 1 and 2, I'm saying trade one pick and one mid tier player.

[spert]

The only experienced players you keep are ones who are consistently up there in our best players, otherwise move 'em on. A losing team full of under-performing, uncompetitive experienced players is a dead loss and doesn't give any constructive example to young players. I would rather have a team of consistently good younger footballers who can be competitive and even win

[gringo]

Well I'm going to one up City west and suggest we should actually sack anyone who shows any promise and make ourselves so horrendously bad that the AFL feel sorry for us and give us outrageous concessions which we can then trade away in the hope of getting even more average players. The way of the future is to just keep loading up with shitness while selling off anyone who looks half decent. What we all want is a bit of mediocrity. When we look like challenging again we should swap the good players for monkeys who would be much cheaper but only slightly higher maintenance. This pressure to be successful is too much for most of us we should be the first team to take tank enhancing drugs. Get Rooey and Steven on some psychedelics to amuse us as they kneel down in the race licking small areas of concrete for no apparent reason.

[citywest]

Well I'm going to one up City west and suggest we should actually sack anyone who shows any promise and make ourselves so horrendously bad that the AFL feel sorry for us and give us outrageous concessions which we can then trade away in the hope of getting even more average players. The way of the future is to just keep loading up with shitness while selling off anyone who looks half decent. What we all want is a bit of mediocrity. When we look like challenging again we should swap the good players for monkeys who would be much cheaper but only slightly higher maintenance. This pressure to be successful is too much for most of us we should be the first team to take tank enhancing drugs. Get Rooey and Steven on some psychedelics to amuse us as they kneel down in the race licking small areas of concrete for no apparent reason.

Listen gringo, I don't know you and you sure as hell don't know me but I feel that you should refrain from this sort of posting. The moderators on this site work their arse off to stop this bickering only for you to post this gem. If you don't like my style of posting then place me on your ignore/foe list.

[Austinnn]

Well I'm going to one up City west and suggest we should actually sack anyone who shows any promise and make ourselves so horrendously bad that the AFL feel sorry for us and give us outrageous concessions which we can then trade away in the hope of getting even more average players. The way of the future is to just keep loading up with shitness while selling off anyone who looks half decent. What we all want is a bit of mediocrity. When we look like challenging again we should swap the good players for monkeys who would be much cheaper but only slightly higher maintenance. This pressure to be successful is too much for most of us we should be the first team to take tank enhancing drugs. Get Rooey and Steven on some psychedelics to amuse us as they kneel down in the race licking small areas of concrete for no apparent reason.

Hahaha! Exactly! Just keep that churn going over, yeah? I reckon once Billings, Acres and Dunstall get about 50 games into them, we should shop them around and get about 5 top 20 draft picks, and let's just keep doing it. By 2030, we should be able to get our hands on the ENTIRE top 20 of the National Draft, and therefore the 2036-40 flags will be a shoe-in for our dynasty!

Reckon we should also pounce on Hird if he leaves the Dons, he knows how to get the best stuff. Director of Football and Head Procurer.

It's easy, this footy caper!

[stinger]

Well I'm going to one up City west and suggest we should actually sack anyone who shows any promise and make ourselves so horrendously bad that the AFL feel sorry for us and give us outrageous concessions which we can then trade away in the hope of getting even more average players. The way of the future is to just keep loading up with shitness while selling off anyone who looks half decent. What we all want is a bit of mediocrity. When we look like challenging again we should swap the good players for monkeys who would be much cheaper but only slightly higher maintenance. This pressure to be successful is too much for most of us we should be the first team to take tank enhancing drugs. Get Rooey and Steven on some psychedelics to amuse us as they kneel down in the race licking small areas of concrete for no apparent reason.