Rhys Stanley for Pick #21

[Johnny Member]

I'd like some clarity around Pelchen's role at the club. Not that it matters what I think - clearly as long as those at the club are Ok with the structure then that is the only relevant point.

As for the list management strategy.....I can't argue with it. The football department presented the 'blueprint' to the board, and it's been ticked off.

So whether we agree with it or not, the 'club' that has been voted in has locked it in as the strategy going forward.


We all knew what we wanted out of this trade period, and we got it. That's got to be a big tick.

Someone had to go to get that additional pick in the first round, and considering that I reckon we only have 3-4 guys on our entire list that would entice a first round pick, to get one for a guy that I don't think is one of those - is an amazing effort really.


I was always a Rhys believer. But someone had to go.

Out of Steven, Joey, Billings and Dunstan (the only 4 that I reckon could get a 1st round pick) or Rhys, I'd have to say as much as I was a Rhys fan, I'd pick him to be the one to leave.



Obviously, the other option was to trade out Petracca for two other picks. Although if you look at it like that, it does make the overall trade period open for debate - Petracca and pick 21 & 22, versus Rhys and pick 4 & 7 & 22.

[Bunk_Moreland]

Yes well like the Mac trade, we wont know the relative success or failure of the Stanley trade for at least a season, probably more.

As it stands both Hawks and Saints seemed to have won on the Mac trade - they have a ruckman who contributed positively to a premiership win, which is exactly what they were after.

Saints gained Savage (started to look the goods after an indifferent start) Acres (bit of an unknown but the wraps are very good) and Dinstan who was second only to Bontempelli in first year player individual honours. Not bad from a player in a team who were very much a wooden spoon team.

Keeping pick #1 is something I am very comfortable with especially if, as is highly likely we select Petracca. I would have watched Petracca like I watched Judd and always wondered what could have been.

#21 for Stanley well we don't even know whom 21 will be so it is moot at the moment. The selectors have a strategy, and the players on the available list had little currency for a first round dp, especially after two real possibilities, Steven and Armo were definitely off the table.

Like JM, I believe the recruiters during TW made the best off the opportunities offered.

Got Membrey, apparently a solid small mid with a huge and accurate kick, cost us little

Kept #1 after the offers were inadequate (4#7 FFS). Petracca is apparently a gun.

Got #21 for Stanley. On initial reflection probably overs, but time will tell.

Tried for Jaksch and JOR and missed out

Looked into Boyd but would not offer the ridiculous and desperate money the Bulldogs did.

All in all pretty reasonable in the circumstances and in line with the stated strategy.

Cant really see the issues at the moment.

[tony74]

Why develop someone only to trade him and start the whole process again

The Cats don't get it wrong too often, either. Chances are they've pulled the right reign here. Bad call Saints.

This is also what concerns me... if it was Carlton, you would be confident that 21 was overs.. but Geelong don't make too many mistakes at drafting time...

time will tell, but I am concerned that this may have been a mistake by the saints

No, he'll be good with the Cats foot skills but come the pressure of September he won't be seen.

Never leave our club because once you do you are a failure. You are positive in anything Saints but he left so he will fail in finals. Is that based on his previous finals experience Tony? Seriously.

Plugger, I know you have contacts at the club and know a couple of players and ex players personally. ( I'm not being a smart Alec here, I know that's a fact ). I'd be curious the next time you have a coffee with them if you could ask them a few questions re Rhys.
1. Do they think he had the football ability to help our team get to the next level?
2. Did he have the mental aptitude to perform when things got really tough?
3. Did he have leadership qualities?
4. Was he able to teach the new crop coming through important facets of senior football ( Both on and off the field )?

Rhys was never really talked about as trade material, but when the Cats showed real interest in him and offered a deal we thought too good to be true I think the club looked at those 4 points above and made the decision.
I'd be very curious in their responses.

[Con Gorozidis]

All sounds like a lot of subjective corporate speak nonsense.

The only question is can the guy play good regular AFL footy?

I am not convinced he can read the play well enough or be decisive enough to ever be a really good footy player at any level - let alone AFL.

I couldnt give two flying hoots about his leadership or teaching qualities. Thats why we have a million coaches. Its not a scout jamboree.

[Bunk_Moreland]

All sounds like a lot of subjective corporate speak nonsense.

The only question is can the guy play good regular AFL footy?

I am not convinced he can read the play well enough or be decisive enough to ever be a really good footy player at any level - let alone AFL.

I couldnt give two flying hoots about his leadership or teaching qualities. Thats why we have a million coaches. Its not a scout jamboree.

So young players learn nothing from older players?

if that's the case whey did we keep Riewoldt?

[FQF]

All sounds like a lot of subjective corporate speak nonsense.

The only question is can the guy play good regular AFL footy?

I am not convinced he can read the play well enough or be decisive enough to ever be a really good footy player at any level - let alone AFL.

I couldnt give two flying hoots about his leadership or teaching qualities. Thats why we have a million coaches. Its not a scout jamboree.

You can think what you like about 'subjective corporate speak nonsense' but the entire football industry disagrees with you. That's why every club will interview every potential draftee multiple times. Are they going to figure out how good they are at footy by having a chat in their living room? That's why there is a captain on the field, and a leadership group, and player mentors. Was Dunstan speaking nonsense when he praised the influence that Lenny had on him? That's why experts and followers of the sport recognise that some players have the mental edge to go that extra level - or could any player of Goddard's footy ability have played through a GF with a broken collarbone?

You can think in binaries - "can the guy play good regular AFL footy" - if you like, but you're on your own.

[Con Gorozidis]

All sounds like a lot of subjective corporate speak nonsense.

The only question is can the guy play good regular AFL footy?

I am not convinced he can read the play well enough or be decisive enough to ever be a really good footy player at any level - let alone AFL.

I couldnt give two flying hoots about his leadership or teaching qualities. Thats why we have a million coaches. Its not a scout jamboree.

You can think what you like about 'subjective corporate speak nonsense' but the entire football industry disagrees with you. That's why every club will interview every potential draftee multiple times. Are they going to figure out how good they are at footy by having a chat in their living room? That's why there is a captain on the field, and a leadership group, and player mentors. Was Dunstan speaking nonsense when he praised the influence that Lenny had on him? That's why experts and followers of the sport recognise that some players have the mental edge to go that extra level - or could any player of Goddard's footy ability have played through a GF with a broken collarbone?

You can think in binaries - "can the guy play good regular AFL footy" - if you like, but you're on your own.

You must know a heck of a lot if you speak for 'the entire footy industry'.
And Goddard was always known to be tough by everyone as was Dunstan. Dunstan was SA Capt of the winning side in the national champs way before the Saints every chatted with him.
http://www.scpaige.com.au/draftees-in-f ... e-dunstan/
· July 12, 2013 Dunstan is the type of player who has the attributes to one day lead an AFL club as captain

This was a known known. Everyone in the world knew it.
Now of course there are multi variables in whether someone is a good player or not - many more than two. I am saying there is a large variance in personality types in champion players. Thats my entire point - variation. Not one 'model personality type'.
But hey go with your rant.

[plugger66]

Why develop someone only to trade him and start the whole process again

The Cats don't get it wrong too often, either. Chances are they've pulled the right reign here. Bad call Saints.

This is also what concerns me... if it was Carlton, you would be confident that 21 was overs.. but Geelong don't make too many mistakes at drafting time...

time will tell, but I am concerned that this may have been a mistake by the saints

No, he'll be good with the Cats foot skills but come the pressure of September he won't be seen.

Never leave our club because once you do you are a failure. You are positive in anything Saints but he left so he will fail in finals. Is that based on his previous finals experience Tony? Seriously.

Plugger, I know you have contacts at the club and know a couple of players and ex players personally. ( I'm not being a smart Alec here, I know that's a fact ). I'd be curious the next time you have a coffee with them if you could ask them a few questions re Rhys.
1. Do they think he had the football ability to help our team get to the next level?
2. Did he have the mental aptitude to perform when things got really tough?
3. Did he have leadership qualities?
4. Was he able to teach the new crop coming through important facets of senior football ( Both on and off the field )?

Rhys was never really talked about as trade material, but when the Cats showed real interest in him and offered a deal we thought too good to be true I think the club looked at those 4 points above and made the decision.
I'd be very curious in their responses.

I would never ask any other of those questions to any player, if I knew any because its none of my business and they are pretty tough and personal questions. I still say there is no way you would make that comment if he was still at the club and IMO I don't like it. I sure others couldn't give a stuff as he has left the club.

[FQF]

All sounds like a lot of subjective corporate speak nonsense.

The only question is can the guy play good regular AFL footy?

I am not convinced he can read the play well enough or be decisive enough to ever be a really good footy player at any level - let alone AFL.

I couldnt give two flying hoots about his leadership or teaching qualities. Thats why we have a million coaches. Its not a scout jamboree.

You can think what you like about 'subjective corporate speak nonsense' but the entire football industry disagrees with you. That's why every club will interview every potential draftee multiple times. Are they going to figure out how good they are at footy by having a chat in their living room? That's why there is a captain on the field, and a leadership group, and player mentors. Was Dunstan speaking nonsense when he praised the influence that Lenny had on him? That's why experts and followers of the sport recognise that some players have the mental edge to go that extra level - or could any player of Goddard's footy ability have played through a GF with a broken collarbone?

You can think in binaries - "can the guy play good regular AFL footy" - if you like, but you're on your own.

You must know a heck of a lot if you speak for 'the entire footy industry'.
And Goddard was always known to be tough by everyone as was Dunstan. Dunstan was SA Capt of the winning side in the national champs way before the Saints every chatted with him. This was a known known. Everyone in the world knew it.
Now of course there are multi variables in whether someone is a good player or not - many more than two. I am saying there is a large variance in personality types in champion players. Thats my entire point - variation. Not one 'model personality type'.
But hey go with your rant.

Whether or not Goddard or Dunstan were known to be tough is completely irrelevant - nothing to gain from making a strawman.

You are posting a lot at the moment about how you can't stand those with the 'rate or don't rate' attitude, and yet here you are going down that exact path. If clubs couldn't give two flying hoots about leadership qualities then it wouldn't matter whether Dunstan was SA Captain.

[dragit]

Yes well like the Mac trade, we wont know the relative success or failure of the Stanley trade for at least a season, probably more.

As it stands both Hawks and Saints seemed to have won on the Mac trade - they have a ruckman who contributed positively to a premiership win, which is exactly what they were after.

Saints gained Savage (started to look the goods after an indifferent start) Acres (bit of an unknown but the wraps are very good) and Dinstan who was second only to Bontempelli in first year player individual honours. Not bad from a player in a team who were very much a wooden spoon team.

Keeping pick #1 is something I am very comfortable with especially if, as is highly likely we select Petracca. I would have watched Petracca like I watched Judd and always wondered what could have been.

#21 for Stanley well we don't even know whom 21 will be so it is moot at the moment. The selectors have a strategy, and the players on the available list had little currency for a first round dp, especially after two real possibilities, Steven and Armo were definitely off the table.

Like JM, I believe the recruiters during TW made the best off the opportunities offered.

Got Membrey, apparently a solid small mid with a huge and accurate kick, cost us little

Kept #1 after the offers were inadequate (4#7 FFS). Petracca is apparently a gun.

Got #21 for Stanley. On initial reflection probably overs, but time will tell.

Tried for Jaksch and JOR and missed out

Looked into Boyd but would not offer the ridiculous and desperate money the Bulldogs did.

All in all pretty reasonable in the circumstances and in line with the stated strategy.

Cant really see the issues at the moment.

I'm pretty confident we are the winners in the McEvoy trade... Let's be honest, they would have comfortably won the flag with Ceglar or even Lowden rucking. They will need a lot more out of McEvoy to justify that trade IMO, which they may well get. McEvoy may go on to win a brownlow, but at this point I don't feel that he is a lot better than he was 2 years ago, his numbers are are worse than 3 or 4 years ago.

They could have won the flag plus added a future 200 game captain Dunstan.

On Membrey, I don't think you would call him a small mid, he's an under sized full forward, but he will be a big mid if plays there.