GWS to get pick 1

[Ghost Like]

I see no real damage. GWS will pay overs for Griffin, Doggies benefit. Our draft strategy this year doesn't pan out, we end up with Petracca & promising players (??) with picks 21 & 39 plus a decent player (?) from the PSD. Next year & 2016 we push for multiple top 20 picks, FAs & PSD selections...still on track for 2018.

No damage? Its the best thing that could happen. I hate the idea of downgrading picks to get more picks. Stars win you finals and you have more hope with higher picks. Multiple players is crap too IMO but it will happen as it seems its Pelchens way. To early to say if its the right or wrong way.

I very much agree with your sentiments P66. I really don't believe having multiple picks this year, in what most experts (up until a day ago) were saying was a shallow draft. We need best available this year, next year & the year after, then we can get creative with draft picks, FA & PSD to suit our needs.

[St Chris]

I see no real damage. GWS will pay overs for Griffin, Doggies benefit. Our draft strategy this year doesn't pan out, we end up with Petracca & promising players (??) with picks 21 & 39 plus a decent player (?) from the PSD. Next year & 2016 we push for multiple top 20 picks, FAs & PSD selections...still on track for 2018.

No damage? Its the best thing that could happen. I hate the idea of downgrading picks to get more picks. Stars win you finals and you have more hope with higher picks. Multiple players is crap too IMO but it will happen as it seems its Pelchens way. To early to say if its the right or wrong way.

I very much agree with your sentiments P66. I really don't believe having multiple picks this year, in what most experts (up until a day ago) were saying was a shallow draft. We need best available this year, next year & the year after, then we can get creative with draft picks, FA & PSD to suit our needs.

I find this attitude surprising, considering St Kilda's history of superstar players, but very little around them. Nowadays, more than ever, it's the top 30 guys on your list that gets you through a long season and on to glory.

I don't understand this Petracca mania either - 3 months ago he was rated around the 4-7 Pick mark, with KPP's like McCartin and Wright above him. All of a sudden he has a good couple of weeks at the U/18 Championships and he's the second coming?? The pressure on this kid for his whole St Kilda career will be crippling, given our messiah complex.

I really thought this was our year to pull something off that would be huge. We finally had some currency, something that everyone wanted, that wouldn't walk out the door the first chance it got. It's really difficult to "win" pick 1 with the like of Melbourne lurking around. Even this year we could have lost it going into round 23, which would have seen us drop to 3 with their compo pick.

On the back of Jaxons "hints" yesterday, I was thinking something along the lines of 3 inside 10, which, with 3 inside 20 last year, is the core of your side for the next decade.

Surely, whether its a strong draft or a weak one, it's better to have more picks near the top. I'd much rather be making my 4th selection with 21, than your 2nd.

[Ghost Like]

The deal was there until Griffin decided enough was enough, boo hoo, move on. Make the best of it, revise the strategy. I'd much rather take my chances with Petracca & so would a few clubs apparently. No messiah complex, personally I like the odds, no guarantees on picks 2 to 10 either but all would of been burdened with a typical StKilda stigma, aka messiah complex. Rather have one lindt ball than 3 Turkish delights.

[Dave McNamara]

Someone on another thread said that he went for the Fagpies

Hi mag, I didn't know Christian's issues were that serious!

However, I did know that he isn't a Saints supporter. I posted that he was, purely coz just like a JO reference...

And he's a Saint's supporter.

... works every time.

(Out of deference to Loris, I'm refraining from posting the sprung mousetrap pic.)

and secondly I hardly understood a word you wrote

Not sure I can help you there Pluggs... I only speak English.

I certainly would guess that the way you post if people thought McCartin was nearly a sure number then you would find more positives for him than Petracca.

Not sure I can help you there Pluggs... I only read English.

And I haven't heard many if any suggest Petracca is a once in a generation player and his testing wasn't that great. As you said he wasn't rated in the first 5 but had a great carnival where he didn't actually dominate but played very well.

In that case, might I suggest you have a chat with those clubs that are queuing up to put mega-deals to our Saintas for the Petracca-pick(?)

I have no idea who is the best player but to suggest McCartin may not make and Petracca is a once in a generation player is way over the top.

McCartin is unlikely to make it, period, IMHO. I will be very nervous if we recruit him. (Petracca would be good for 20 minimum and more like 30 goals per season, on top of what he can do as an on-baller... look at Port and what makes them such a threat... hint, it sure ain't Justin Worstoff) McOneTrick can only play full forward. That's an immediate big black texta line.

Then look at how he gets his goals... on the lead... in today's footy with all the flooding, how often will he find space... hmmmm, unless... he has some bull of a mid-fielder bursting out of the middle and banging it down before the opposition can flood back...

Petracca is a once in a generation player is way over the top.

I would sure hope so... if we trade-out our No 1 pick.

[bigred]

They want it, they pay overs..

Cameron wants out, which is why he won't extend his contract like they want him to. So we can get him for nothing in next year's PSD. Therefore, if they want Petracca, Cameron is put on the table as an act of 'goodwill'... then we start the horse-trading.

- Their first pick.
- All our remaining picks upgraded with their pick that they have before ours.
- Sheil.
- One other like Treloar or Whitfield.




Oh, and in the 2016 PSD we'll then just go and get Petracca back. (Watch 'em squeal when we do that! ) Christian would rather work and play in St Kilda, than be locked-up in some hell-hole gated community on the far fringes of civilization!. That should pretty much set us up for the 2018 run of flags.

Screw the GWoganS and their AFL largesse!

If Cameron is not included, as basically the steak knives...then they can get f***ed....

You want pick one...You pay for pick one.

not gonna happen, but cant hurt to be hard.

[MC Gusto]

I am definitely of the view that multiple picks in the top 20 is a more valuable play than pick 1 only.

To st Chris' point above I couldn't agree more. For too long we have had a small number of superstars with a bottom 6 (or even 12) that are just not good enough.
We need quality across the squad.
You never know what may pan out. Another club may trade or alternatively gws may offer a player or two for griffin and not the picks that have been touted.
There is also a chance that we trade out some players for picks as well. I thought pelchen was a bit evasive when asked about jack the other night and I reckon 1 of him or Armo could be done for the right price. I would be disappointed if we lost either but I sense the club is warning us up for something and they are the only 2 with currency

Plenty of time to go yet

[lefty]

Griffen would have been pushed no doubt its pretty obvious. Im sure that the blokes that need to know like Pelchen would have known Griffen was moving a week or two ago at least.

Not so sure on this one

He's 28 the WB are desperate for McCartin or White they have been rumored to be looking at ways to get hold of 2 or 3. Griffen was the obvious out.

Will the Woofers pass 4 &7 to us for 1? Remember they also have 6!

Can the woofers risk waiting to 4 and potentially missing both Wright and McCartin?

Maybe 4& 7 for 1? Sounds fair to me.

Woofers end up with 1 & 6. So essentially they just swap Griffen for 1.

Yeah, I think swapping 1 for 4 and 7 (if Carlton hand it to GWS, who hand it to the dogs), and then somehow trying to upgrade our pick 21 would work for me, and would work for the doggies too, like you said, swapped Griffen for Pick 1 is really good for them imo.

And we'd get 2 picks in the top 10, and we'd better try upgrade our 21 into a first rounder somehow.

[dragit]

I see no real damage. GWS will pay overs for Griffin, Doggies benefit. Our draft strategy this year doesn't pan out, we end up with Petracca & promising players (??) with picks 21 & 39 plus a decent player (?) from the PSD. Next year & 2016 we push for multiple top 20 picks, FAs & PSD selections...still on track for 2018.

No damage? Its the best thing that could happen. I hate the idea of downgrading picks to get more picks. Stars win you finals and you have more hope with higher picks. Multiple players is crap too IMO but it will happen as it seems its Pelchens way. To early to say if its the right or wrong way.

What I don't get though is you saying that winning the spoon is no advantage because often the best player doesn't come at pick #1, but at the same time you don't want us to trade pick 1 for 4 & 7 (& a 20). Surely if the top pick doesn't guarantee you the best player then 2 players in the top 7 is a worthwhile bet?

Aren't you also saying that Petracca isn't a standout this year?

[st.byron]

Yeah, I think swapping 1 for 4 and 7 (if Carlton hand it to GWS, who hand it to the dogs), and then somehow trying to upgrade our pick 21 would work for me, and would work for the doggies too, like you said, swapped Griffen for Pick 1 is really good for them imo.

And we'd get 2 picks in the top 10, and we'd better try upgrade our 21 into a first rounder somehow.

4 and 7 for 1. They'd be nuts to do that. Would be a deal way in our favour.

[Austinnn]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

[bobmurray]

I'll go with Pelican's way, it's got to be a vast improvement on Lyin's way or Peakes way.

One top pick a year is never going to get you there, that's why they are trying to be bold, albeit, they maybe snookered by all the player unrest that's out there.

[plugger66]

Someone on another thread said that he went for the Fagpies

Hi mag, I didn't know Christian's issues were that serious!

However, I did know that he isn't a Saints supporter. I posted that he was, purely coz just like a JO reference...

And he's a Saint's supporter.

... works every time.

(Out of deference to Loris, I'm refraining from posting the sprung mousetrap pic.)

and secondly I hardly understood a word you wrote

Not sure I can help you there Pluggs... I only speak English.

I certainly would guess that the way you post if people thought McCartin was nearly a sure number then you would find more positives for him than Petracca.

Not sure I can help you there Pluggs... I only read English.

And I haven't heard many if any suggest Petracca is a once in a generation player and his testing wasn't that great. As you said he wasn't rated in the first 5 but had a great carnival where he didn't actually dominate but played very well.

In that case, might I suggest you have a chat with those clubs that are queuing up to put mega-deals to our Saintas for the Petracca-pick(?)

I have no idea who is the best player but to suggest McCartin may not make and Petracca is a once in a generation player is way over the top.

McCartin is unlikely to make it, period, IMHO. I will be very nervous if we recruit him. (Petracca would be good for 20 minimum and more like 30 goals per season, on top of what he can do as an on-baller... look at Port and what makes them such a threat... hint, it sure ain't Justin Worstoff) McOneTrick can only play full forward. That's an immediate big black texta line.

Then look at how he gets his goals... on the lead... in today's footy with all the flooding, how often will he find space... hmmmm, unless... he has some bull of a mid-fielder bursting out of the middle and banging it down before the opposition can flood back...

Petracca is a once in a generation player is way over the top.

I would sure hope so... if we trade-out our No 1 pick.

Issues.

[plugger66]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

I have read what you write and to come up with that crap surprises me. I thought you could think. Firstly why play to the crowd and secondly what has my idea of not lowing the picks for others picks got to do with me suggesting Dave has no idea on under 18 players? I sensible answer would be a fluke based on that stuff.

[Austinnn]

I see no real damage. GWS will pay overs for Griffin, Doggies benefit. Our draft strategy this year doesn't pan out, we end up with Petracca & promising players (??) with picks 21 & 39 plus a decent player (?) from the PSD. Next year & 2016 we push for multiple top 20 picks, FAs & PSD selections...still on track for 2018.

No damage? Its the best thing that could happen. I hate the idea of downgrading picks to get more picks. Stars win you finals and you have more hope with higher picks. Multiple players is crap too IMO but it will happen as it seems its Pelchens way. To early to say if its the right or wrong way.

I very much agree with your sentiments P66. I really don't believe having multiple picks this year, in what most experts (up until a day ago) were saying was a shallow draft. We need best available this year, next year & the year after, then we can get creative with draft picks, FA & PSD to suit our needs.

I find this attitude surprising, considering St Kilda's history of superstar players, but very little around them. Nowadays, more than ever, it's the top 30 guys on your list that gets you through a long season and on to glory.

I don't understand this Petracca mania either - 3 months ago he was rated around the 4-7 Pick mark, with KPP's like McCartin and Wright above him. All of a sudden he has a good couple of weeks at the U/18 Championships and he's the second coming?? The pressure on this kid for his whole St Kilda career will be crippling, given our messiah complex.

I really thought this was our year to pull something off that would be huge. We finally had some currency, something that everyone wanted, that wouldn't walk out the door the first chance it got. It's really difficult to "win" pick 1 with the like of Melbourne lurking around. Even this year we could have lost it going into round 23, which would have seen us drop to 3 with their compo pick.

On the back of Jaxons "hints" yesterday, I was thinking something along the lines of 3 inside 10, which, with 3 inside 20 last year, is the core of your side for the next decade.

Surely, whether its a strong draft or a weak one, it's better to have more picks near the top. I'd much rather be making my 4th selection with 21, than your 2nd.

I agree. This Griffin bombshell doesn't have to be a deal killer, in fact who's to say it's not all part of the plan. Maybe Pelican is the Ghost Whisperer, unsettling Capt. Bulldog to get a decent deal off doggies once they've got 3 top 10 picks.

Even Jaxons didn't specify that this was a negative thing, just that it changed a lot.

I'm happy to wait and see, hot a feeling we'll be smiling at the end.

[gringo]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

I have read what you write and to come up with that crap surprises me. I thought you could think. Firstly why play to the crowd and secondly what has my idea of not lowing the picks for others picks got to do with me suggesting Dave has no idea on under 18 players? I sensible answer would be a fluke based on that stuff.

At least Aussie got told he was smart....I get "you have no idea about football" .

[plugger66]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

I have read what you write and to come up with that crap surprises me. I thought you could think. Firstly why play to the crowd and secondly what has my idea of not lowing the picks for others picks got to do with me suggesting Dave has no idea on under 18 players? I sensible answer would be a fluke based on that stuff.

At least Aussie got told he was smart....I get "you have no idea about football" .

My brother, my mate, may friend ,my dead grandmother told me that you are wrong.

[Austinnn]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

I have read what you write and to come up with that crap surprises me. I thought you could think. Firstly why play to the crowd and secondly what has my idea of not lowing the picks for others picks got to do with me suggesting Dave has no idea on under 18 players? I sensible answer would be a fluke based on that stuff.

Ok, I apologise.

So in summary, you think we should hold onto pick one, but you don't think that the popular choice for pick one is much better than the popular choice for pick 2. Or do you think we should get McCartlin with pick 1?

Or were you just having a go at Dave for spouting his opinion with such certainty despite knowing precisely jack squat, which is of course totally different from you and I and 99.9% of the posters here?

Either way, I'm not looking for an argument, so I'm sorry to everyone for derailing the convo, and I'm looking forward to seeing what we'll do with this window. Could set us up for a dynasty!

[Bunk_Moreland]

Dont worry Austinn, P66 has more positions than the Kama Sutra

[plugger66]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

I have read what you write and to come up with that crap surprises me. I thought you could think. Firstly why play to the crowd and secondly what has my idea of not lowing the picks for others picks got to do with me suggesting Dave has no idea on under 18 players? I sensible answer would be a fluke based on that stuff.

Ok, I apologise.

So in summary, you think we should hold onto pick one, but you don't think that the popular choice for pick one is much better than the popular choice for pick 2. Or do you think we should get McCartlin with pick 1?

Or were you just having a go at Dave for spouting his opinion with such certainty despite knowing precisely jack squat, which is of course totally different from you and I and 99.9% of the posters here?

Either way, I'm not looking for an argument, so I'm sorry to everyone for derailing the convo, and I'm looking forward to seeing what we'll do with this window. Could set us up for a dynasty!

It isn't that hard to explain. Dave has no idea who is the best players. that's obvious and it isn't having a go at Dave. All of us have no idea. We don't watch enough games. I have been quite consistant on what I think we should do. Keep pick one, whoever that is, unless we can get a potential star as a pick. Don't trade one pick for multiple picks. Dave suggested Petracca was a star and McCartin may struggle to play AFL footy. Sorry I suggested that was crap. It makes so much sense from a guy who never watches under 18. Anyway Austin im glad im gone from a guy you respected to a guy you don't especially after you illogical rant.

[matrix]

I'm nearly over it.
When's the draft?
Get it over with ffs.

[SuperDuper]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

I have read what you write and to come up with that crap surprises me. I thought you could think. Firstly why play to the crowd and secondly what has my idea of not lowing the picks for others picks got to do with me suggesting Dave has no idea on under 18 players? I sensible answer would be a fluke based on that stuff.

Ok, I apologise.

So in summary, you think we should hold onto pick one, but you don't think that the popular choice for pick one is much better than the popular choice for pick 2. Or do you think we should get McCartlin with pick 1?

Or were you just having a go at Dave for spouting his opinion with such certainty despite knowing precisely jack squat, which is of course totally different from you and I and 99.9% of the posters here?

Either way, I'm not looking for an argument, so I'm sorry to everyone for derailing the convo, and I'm looking forward to seeing what we'll do with this window. Could set us up for a dynasty!

It isn't that hard to explain. Dave has no idea who is the best players. that's obvious and it isn't having a go at Dave. All of us have no idea. We don't watch enough games. I have been quite consistant on what I think we should do. Keep pick one, whoever that is, unless we can get a potential star as a pick. Don't trade one pick for multiple picks. Dave suggested Petracca was a star and McCartin may struggle to play AFL footy. Sorry I suggested that was crap. It makes so much sense from a guy who never watches under 18. Anyway Austin im glad im gone from a guy you respected to a guy you don't especially after you illogical rant.

a. Preferring pick #1 over, for example, #4&#7, is an irrational, gut feel response... Any rational assessment of the situation will tell you that #4+#7 is better than #1, based on the past 10 years drafting....

b. Each year is somewhat unique although it is hard to tell until 5 years later exactly the standard of the draft. But the recruiting team watch a lot more forty than us.... so if they assess that, this year, #4 + #7 is better value than #1 ... then they know more than us

I find it a bit odd that Plugs has a go at Dave for spouting a preference a certain player, as Dave does not have enough knowledge... But then spouts his own preference for a trading strategy based in similarly insufficient knowledge.

[plugger66]

P66 chastises Dave McNamara for saying that Petraccoon is much better than McCartlin, but then moans about trading pick one for lower picks.

Basically takes the contrary position no matter what. I can see why it grates on people's nerves from time to time.

I have read what you write and to come up with that crap surprises me. I thought you could think. Firstly why play to the crowd and secondly what has my idea of not lowing the picks for others picks got to do with me suggesting Dave has no idea on under 18 players? I sensible answer would be a fluke based on that stuff.

Ok, I apologise.

So in summary, you think we should hold onto pick one, but you don't think that the popular choice for pick one is much better than the popular choice for pick 2. Or do you think we should get McCartlin with pick 1?

Or were you just having a go at Dave for spouting his opinion with such certainty despite knowing precisely jack squat, which is of course totally different from you and I and 99.9% of the posters here?

Either way, I'm not looking for an argument, so I'm sorry to everyone for derailing the convo, and I'm looking forward to seeing what we'll do with this window. Could set us up for a dynasty!

It isn't that hard to explain. Dave has no idea who is the best players. that's obvious and it isn't having a go at Dave. All of us have no idea. We don't watch enough games. I have been quite consistant on what I think we should do. Keep pick one, whoever that is, unless we can get a potential star as a pick. Don't trade one pick for multiple picks. Dave suggested Petracca was a star and McCartin may struggle to play AFL footy. Sorry I suggested that was crap. It makes so much sense from a guy who never watches under 18. Anyway Austin im glad im gone from a guy you respected to a guy you don't especially after you illogical rant.

a. Preferring pick #1 over, for example, #4&#7, is an irrational, gut feel response... Any rational assessment of the situation will tell you that #4+#7 is better than #1, based on the past 10 years drafting....

b. Each year is somewhat unique although it is hard to tell until 5 years later exactly the standard of the draft. But the recruiting team watch a lot more forty than us.... so if they assess that, this year, #4 + #7 is better value than #1 ... then they know more than us

I find it a bit odd that Plugs has a go at Dave for spouting a preference a certain player, as Dave does not have enough knowledge... But then spouts his own preference for a trading strategy based in similarly insufficient knowledge.

I find it strange that you are having a go at me and both me and Dave are suggesting keeping pick one. By the way can you prove your statement correct about 4 and 7 even though neither are on the table and its fanciful stuff. Im having a go at dave for telling me that things he has no idea about. I know I have no idea about the players. How many times can I say that?

[Rosco]

My guess is that you'll have to say it at least 10 more times.

[magnifisaint]

Looks like we may hold onto pick 1

[Kernal75]

With the mooted deal between GWS and the Dogs seemingly inevitable, does anyone now see a way for us to get 3 picks inside 22? I remember the Pelchen had a similar question on Twitter the other night and was confident it could be done without trading Pick 1?