No 1 pick

[stinger]

Tom Hawkins (or, say, Roughead)

I would not bracket those together (pun intended )

Obviously I have the beneft of hindsight here but:

Hawkins is mainly a big forward that can mark....

Whereas Roughie can do that,
plus like a medium forward kicking good snap goals etc
plus play as second ruck..or even first ruck
plus even play like a tall mid to some extent.


Roughie is way, way WAY more valuable that Hawkins.

agree

[Zed]

We have a proven track record of building an (almost) premiership team from the draft. It's the long way but it is still a way and a higher percentage route IMO.

See I have a problem with this statement because circumstances have changed since we went down this path in the early 2000's. Firstly, we had a couple of priority picks that helped cushion the blow. One of those netted Kosi , the other X Clarke. Kosi in particular was good value. Secondly there were less teams - GWS and GC now thin out the talent pool - so instead of coming into the draft again at pick 17, 33, & 49- its now 19, 37 & 55 - which may not sound like much, but chips away at the quality available. Thirdly clubs have wisened up to the risk of losing players in the preseason draft. We picked up Powell and Voss through the PSD. Those 2 guys were head and shoulders better than almost every other #1 pick in the PSD since. Im not saying we couldn't snag equivalent talents, Im just saying it would be a lot harder these days - partly because players are locked up earlier due to the 4th factor - Free Agency. With big money on offer from top teams who are looking to have a crack at a flag, why would a player walk in the PSD when he can hang on to potentially play in a premiership contender eg James Frawley. As for GWS, I would be surprised if they allowed any of their guys to fall through to the PSD - they will find a way to negotiate a deal with a suitor - even if its not what they are looking for its still a bargaining chip. FA may work for us when we are back in the window - but thats not going to help our rebuilding now.

So its now a much much longer way to go and the success rate wont be what it once was. Having said all that - we are committed to doing the hard yards now, and I have been very happy with our recruiting in the last 3 years which has been generally good given the available talent.

[Cairnsman]

We have a proven track record of building an (almost) premiership team from the draft. It's the long way but it is still a way and a higher percentage route IMO.

See I have a problem with this statement because circumstances have changed since we went down this path in the early 2000's. Firstly, we had a couple of priority picks that helped cushion the blow. One of those netted Kosi , the other X Clarke. Kosi in particular was good value. Secondly there were less teams - GWS and GC now thin out the talent pool - so instead of coming into the draft again at pick 17, 33, & 49- its now 19, 37 & 55 - which may not sound like much, but chips away at the quality available. Thirdly clubs have wisened up to the risk of losing players in the preseason draft. We picked up Powell and Voss through the PSD. Those 2 guys were head and shoulders better than almost every other #1 pick in the PSD since. Im not saying we couldn't snag equivalent talents, Im just saying it would be a lot harder these days - partly because players are locked up earlier due to the 4th factor - Free Agency. With big money on offer from top teams who are looking to have a crack at a flag, why would a player walk in the PSD when he can hang on to potentially play in a premiership contender eg James Frawley. As for GWS, I would be surprised if they allowed any of their guys to fall through to the PSD - they will find a way to negotiate a deal with a suitor - even if its not what they are looking for its still a bargaining chip. FA may work for us when we are back in the window - but thats not going to help our rebuilding now.

So its now a much much longer way to go and the success rate wont be what it once was. Having said all that - we are committed to doing the hard yards now, and I have been very happy with our recruiting in the last 3 years which has been generally good given the available talent.

Whatever way we go I reckon we are going to need more than one number one draft pick...looks like we got one locked up and we are a fair chance to get another next year. After we've got a few number one DPs then we will need a decent smattering of first rounders...It's the only way poor clubs can put a premiership side together and also afford to compensate for the lack of budget we can throw at the football department and development. It's only going to get worse also in the next couple of decades so unless we can find a solution to poor revenue then we need to replicate or improve on what we did from about 1999 onwards...

[Con Gorozidis]

Agree with the sentiments expressed in the thread.
we are going to need more than two number 1 picks.
We need to be aiming for 6 to 8 new gun players in the next 2 or 3 years.

Two number one picks alone just replaces what we are about to lose.
won't even get us off the bottom.

[Kick-it-lace-out]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

[plugger66]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

Why would GWS do that though?

[Kick-it-lace-out]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

Why would GWS do that though?

Cannot possibly play Cameron, Patton and Boyd in the same forward line.....too top heavy. Therefore, offer them pick 1, which they can use on a player better suited to their needs. If Boyd doesn't start getting games soon for GWS he may look to get out anyway.

[plugger66]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

Why would GWS do that though?

Cannot possibly play Cameron, Patton and Boyd in the same forward line.....too top heavy. Therefore, offer them pick 1, which they can use on a player better suited to their needs. If Boyd doesn't start getting games soon for GWS he may look to get out anyway.

Well he has a year to go on his contract. That is true what you say but most people think the best players this year are talls. I think if they wanted to get rid of one of those they would want a player in exchange. We dont have any to offer apart from jack and then we wouldnt have one good experienced midfielder left apart from joey.

[Sobraz]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

Why would GWS do that though?

Cannot possibly play Cameron, Patton and Boyd in the same forward line.....too top heavy. Therefore, offer them pick 1, which they can use on a player better suited to their needs. If Boyd doesn't start getting games soon for GWS he may look to get out anyway.

Well he has a year to go on his contract. That is true what you say but most people think the best players this year are talls. I think if they wanted to get rid of one of those they would want a player in exchange. We dont have any to offer apart from jack and then we wouldnt have one good experienced midfielder left apart from joey.

So pick 1 and Joey for Boyd?

Joey would be great for GWS, and pick 1 would assure them Petracca. Realistic?

[plugger66]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

Why would GWS do that though?

Cannot possibly play Cameron, Patton and Boyd in the same forward line.....too top heavy. Therefore, offer them pick 1, which they can use on a player better suited to their needs. If Boyd doesn't start getting games soon for GWS he may look to get out anyway.

Well he has a year to go on his contract. That is true what you say but most people think the best players this year are talls. I think if they wanted to get rid of one of those they would want a player in exchange. We dont have any to offer apart from jack and then we wouldnt have one good experienced midfielder left apart from joey.

So pick 1 and Joey for Boyd?

Joey would be great for GWS, and pick 1 would assure them Petracca. Realistic?

I dont think they would get rid of Boyd after one year but we will see. Not sure Joey would want to go there. No hope of finals for at least 2 more years.

[Sobraz]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

Why would GWS do that though?

Cannot possibly play Cameron, Patton and Boyd in the same forward line.....too top heavy. Therefore, offer them pick 1, which they can use on a player better suited to their needs. If Boyd doesn't start getting games soon for GWS he may look to get out anyway.

Well he has a year to go on his contract. That is true what you say but most people think the best players this year are talls. I think if they wanted to get rid of one of those they would want a player in exchange. We dont have any to offer apart from jack and then we wouldnt have one good experienced midfielder left apart from joey.

So pick 1 and Joey for Boyd?

Joey would be great for GWS, and pick 1 would assure them Petracca. Realistic?

I dont think they would get rid of Boyd after one year but we will see. Not sure Joey would want to go there. No hope of finals for at least 2 more years.

Likely to play finals before us however.

[saintjake]

Well he has a year to go on his contract. That is true what you say but most people think the best players this year are talls. I think if they wanted to get rid of one of those they would want a player in exchange. We dont have any to offer apart from jack and then we wouldnt have one good experienced midfielder left apart from joey.[/quote]

So pick 1 and Joey for Boyd?

Joey would be great for GWS, and pick 1 would assure them Petracca. Realistic?[/quote]


I dont think they would get rid of Boyd after one year but we will see. Not sure Joey would want to go there. No hope of finals for at least 2 more years.[/quote]

Likely to play finals before us however.[/quote]

Joey doesn't really get a choice where he goes if we decide to trade him does he? (Putting aside the club legend status and the ineviatable argument of disrespecting him)
And secondly, does anyone else think that pick 1 AND joey is well and truly overs for Boyd?
Yeah he was drafted number 1 and has a lot of potential. But if we can convince him to say he wants out because of lack of opportunities or something. Surely our second pick and Joey is more reasonable.
I mean if GWS isn't even playing him because they prefer Cameron and Patton. Seems well and truly overs

[saintjake]

I mean, we are in rebuild mode obviously.
I can't see Pelchen giving away our number 1 pick and a player just for one player. He is all about getting two-for-ones.
I think we will trade pick 1, maybe with a player or a later pick for more picks. Possibly a top 10 and top 15/20
Especially with the top 10 being so open

[Zed]

I hope GWS are so keen on Petracca that they give us Boyd for pick 1 and then throw in another offer where they pay overs eg Tomlinson for our 3rd round pick.

[St Ick]

Trade pick 1 for Tom Boyd.

Why would GWS do that though?

Cannot possibly play Cameron, Patton and Boyd in the same forward line.....too top heavy. Therefore, offer them pick 1, which they can use on a player better suited to their needs. If Boyd doesn't start getting games soon for GWS he may look to get out anyway.

Well he has a year to go on his contract. That is true what you say but most people think the best players this year are talls. I think if they wanted to get rid of one of those they would want a player in exchange. We dont have any to offer apart from jack and then we wouldnt have one good experienced midfielder left apart from joey.

A player like McCartin may suit their forward structure moreso than a Boyd or other fwd. Its unlikely, but they may prefer the fact that Paddy isnt a 200cm giant, perspnally cant see it but I'm not the GWS list manager.

[remboy]

I mean, we are in rebuild mode obviously.
I can't see Pelchen giving away our number 1 pick and a player just for one player. He is all about getting two-for-ones.
I think we will trade pick 1, maybe with a player or a later pick for more picks. Possibly a top 10 and top 15/20
Especially with the top 10 being so open

Pelchan was adamant he wouldn't trade pick 3 last year. I think he'd feel the same way this year. It would take something incredible to change that.

[plugger66]

Well he has a year to go on his contract. That is true what you say but most people think the best players this year are talls. I think if they wanted to get rid of one of those they would want a player in exchange. We dont have any to offer apart from jack and then we wouldnt have one good experienced midfielder left apart from joey.

So pick 1 and Joey for Boyd?

Joey would be great for GWS, and pick 1 would assure them Petracca. Realistic?[/quote]


I dont think they would get rid of Boyd after one year but we will see. Not sure Joey would want to go there. No hope of finals for at least 2 more years.[/quote]

Likely to play finals before us however.[/quote]

Joey doesn't really get a choice where he goes if we decide to trade him does he? (Putting aside the club legend status and the ineviatable argument of disrespecting him)
And secondly, does anyone else think that pick 1 AND joey is well and truly overs for Boyd?
Yeah he was drafted number 1 and has a lot of potential. But if we can convince him to say he wants out because of lack of opportunities or something. Surely our second pick and Joey is more reasonable.
I mean if GWS isn't even playing him because they prefer Cameron and Patton. Seems well and truly overs[/quote]


Of course Joey gets a choice. Even if he was uncontracted he gets a choice but having a contract means he just stays if he doesnt want to go to the club we may want him to go to. And do you honestly think pick 20 and Joey would get a second year contracted player? No not ever. If we are going to talk trades people need to be realistic.

[ROLS-LEE]

Pick 1 should never be traded unless we get an unbelievable offer like a ready made near elite player plus a top 10 pick. Otherwise let's just shoot ourselves in the foot and show the afl world that we really are a basket case.
Let's keep pick 1 and pick Petracca, If we get a priority pick like 2 then get McCartin and get Mitch Clark PSD. All other picks fast outside mids and hope 1 turns out ok.
If we get no priority then no McCartin and pick the best fastest outside mids.

[cwrcyn]

The only tradable player in my view is Gilbert. GWS will not give up any of Boyd, Cameron, and Patton. Our only hope is that an uncontracted midfielder will want out of GWS or some other team

[ROLS-LEE]

The only tradable player in my view is Gilbert. GWS will not give up any of Boyd, Cameron, and Patton. Our only hope is that an uncontracted midfielder will want out of GWS or some other team

True.

Gilbert circa 2010 = late 1st round. Gilbert post school girl saga = late 3rd round.

[lewdogs]

Pick 1 should never be traded unless we get an unbelievable offer like a ready made near elite player plus a top 10 pick. Otherwise let's just shoot ourselves in the foot and show the afl world that we really are a basket case.
.

Completely agree. Pick 1 should only be traded for a star. It's pick 1 ffs, the best young player in the country. Don't trade it.

[stinger]

Pick 1 should never be traded unless we get an unbelievable offer like a ready made near elite player plus a top 10 pick. Otherwise let's just shoot ourselves in the foot and show the afl world that we really are a basket case.
.

Completely agree. Pick 1 should only be traded for a star. It's pick 1 ffs, the best young player in the country. Don't trade it.

+1,000,000

[Old Mate]

From what I know we really rate McCartin. Unsure how we compare him against Boyd if that opportunity arose. If we have pick 1 I believe we will keep pick 1 and select McCartin. If we end up with pick 2 then that pick might be on the table.

[borderbarry]

Maybe trade our No.1 Pick with Gold Coast, for their two lst round picks, at this stage about 11 and 14, maybe they can throw in their 2nd round pick , about 30. Then trade pick 14 and an older player to GWS for O'Rourke, who has not resigned yet and apparently wants to return to Victoria, and their second round pick (21 at this stage) and 3rd round pick (40 ). Then we would have 11, 20, 21, 30 39 and 40 etc. having gained 11, 21, and 30, 40, plus O'Rourke for 1. plus an older player.

[Griggsy]

Haven't seen any play but read a bit. Going with mccartin myself. Don't fancy wrights ruck/forward thing. And others have slid like Goddard and Durdin. So for top 5 candidates it's either him or petrecca IMO for our pick.