St Kilda's blueprint to financial success

[Con Gorozidis]

Firstly citywest you are assuming the AFL will throw us 500k for every game we play in NZ.
Is there any reason to believe they would ?

Second I seriously think lloyd21 is on to something.
Everyone is looking at hawthorn and Tassie and then trying to join a dot with their success and us going to NZ. We may be barking up the wrong tree.

The real unspoken secret to financial success may be the pokies revenue.
Look at the rugby league sides. They live on die on the pokies.
It's sad I know but there is some truth in it.

If those pokies figures for Waverley and Caroline Springs are accurate that is some serious moolah.

[Dave McNamara]

Second I seriously think lloyd21 is on to something.
Everyone is looking at hawthorn and Tassie and then trying to join a dot with their success and us going to NZ. We may be barking up the wrong tree.

The real unspoken secret to financial success may be the pokies revenue.
Look at the rugby league sides. They live on die on the pokies.
It's sad I know but there is some truth in it.

If those pokies figures for Waverley and Caroline Springs are accurate that is some serious moolah.

Yes, serious moolah indeed, and look at the areas it's being sucked out of... generally communities that can least afford it. So I reckon that you're right on both fronts Con when you say "It's sad I know but there is some truth in it."

However, I also reckon that there's another way to look at it...

So, morally not good, but shifting to the pragmatics... not being a good look for the AFL can cause the 'practical' problem of damaging the image of the (weasel word alert)... 'brand'.

Hence...

The AFL announced overnight it wants to help its clubs wean themselves off poker machines. Speaking on the Nine Network’s The Footy Show, AFL CEO Andrew Demetriou said the AFL had made the move because of pressure from “AFL commissioners, possible changes to government legislation, anti-gambling lobbyists and exposure to massive debt by clubs through the gaming ventures”.

The AFL has now adopted a “strong social stance” on pokies and wants to act as a broker to help clubs divest themselves of machines, indicating it understands the Australian community sees poker machines as socially damaging and addictive, and that continuing to associate the code with this product is likely to damage the brand.


Carlton hypocrite Chris Judd demonstrated this in early May, when a court was told he had concealed a $500,000 stake in a pokies venture because he didn't want to be publicly associated with gambling.

http://www.crikey.com.au/2012/05/18/afl ... her=mobile

Recalling the figures from our last financial report, we make sweet FA from the one-armed bandits, so ditching them would overly impact our bottom line.

Doing the sums from said annual report (covered in a couple of previous threads around the time), we would have made a comfy million or so profit last year, if we had a home game financial set-up even fractionally as good as what the Hillbillies have created for their home games.

Hence the suggestion of looking for opportunities such as what has been offered to the Poodles... for the short term solution.
(EG, four 'selected' home games with the Hillbillies over three seasons,
that's 12 games at $750,000.
That's $9 million.
Then, factor in how much we'd have had to pay-out if those games were held at Docked lands...
We'd be in front a comfortable net $10 million in three years.
Hey, that's a figure that has a ring to it... )

Long term... the Junction. Iconic Suburb. Iconic Club. Iconic name.

I believe that we don't need poker machines!

Oh, and... if the AFL does end up moving away from poker machines,
what will become of some of these 'high flying' poker machine-addicted clubs,
that are in reality, currently are no more than glorified leeches upon the lower socio-economic parts of Melbourne...?


So morally, but also looking pragmatically at the bigger picture... I say no to poker machines.

[plugger66]

Second I seriously think lloyd21 is on to something.
Everyone is looking at hawthorn and Tassie and then trying to join a dot with their success and us going to NZ. We may be barking up the wrong tree.

The real unspoken secret to financial success may be the pokies revenue.
Look at the rugby league sides. They live on die on the pokies.
It's sad I know but there is some truth in it.

If those pokies figures for Waverley and Caroline Springs are accurate that is some serious moolah.

Yes, serious moolah indeed, and look at the areas it's being sucked out of... generally communities that can least afford it. So I reckon that you're right on both fronts Con when you say "It's sad I know but there is some truth in it."

However, I also reckon that there's another way to look at it...

So, morally not good, but shifting to the pragmatics... not being a good look for the AFL can cause the 'practical' problem of damaging the image of the (weasel word alert)... 'brand'.

Hence...

The AFL announced overnight it wants to help its clubs wean themselves off poker machines. Speaking on the Nine Network’s The Footy Show, AFL CEO Andrew Demetriou said the AFL had made the move because of pressure from “AFL commissioners, possible changes to government legislation, anti-gambling lobbyists and exposure to massive debt by clubs through the gaming ventures”.

The AFL has now adopted a “strong social stance” on pokies and wants to act as a broker to help clubs divest themselves of machines, indicating it understands the Australian community sees poker machines as socially damaging and addictive, and that continuing to associate the code with this product is likely to damage the brand.


Carlton hypocrite Chris Judd demonstrated this in early May, when a court was told he had concealed a $500,000 stake in a pokies venture because he didn't want to be publicly associated with gambling.

http://www.crikey.com.au/2012/05/18/afl ... her=mobile

Recalling the figures from our last financial report, we make sweet FA from the one-armed bandits, so ditching them would overly impact our bottom line.

Doing the sums from said annual report (covered in a couple of previous threads around the time), we would have made a comfy million or so profit last year, if we had a home game financial set-up even fractionally as good as what the Hillbillies have created for their home games.

Hence the suggestion of looking for opportunities such as what has been offered to the Poodles... for the short term solution.
(EG, four 'selected' home games with the Hillbillies over three seasons,
that's 12 games at $750,000.
That's $9 million.
Then, factor in how much we'd have had to pay-out if those games were held at Docked lands...
We'd be in front a comfortable net $10 million in three years.
Hey, that's a figure that has a ring to it... )

Long term... the Junction. Iconic Suburb. Iconic Club. Iconic name.

I believe that we don't need poker machines!

Oh, and... if the AFL does end up moving away from poker machines,
what will become of some of these 'high flying' poker machine-addicted clubs,
that are in reality, currently are no more than glorified leeches upon the lower socio-economic parts of Melbourne...?


So morally, but also looking pragmatically at the bigger picture... I say no to poker machines.

Firstly dave JO will not happen because no one is going to build a 16k stadium for 200 million and play about 2 games there a year. We could only play interstate sides and only those that dont have a following. leaves GC and GWS. Or do you want games like the WB and us played there and 10K of our supporters dont get in and thats just forgetting the 200 million.

I have an idea. lets get our sponsorship in order and forget about moving games to Geelong, is that where you mean, because those names are very confusing. I have no idea who else got offerred that money but if its a side from the western suburbs it would make sense to offer that sort of money. If its a side from the south east they may offer us 50 cents and did you see his pitching arm the other night. Geelong make money on reserved seats and entry fees. We had 13K to GC at Etihad where dont have to reserve a seat unless you want to. Imagine the crowd an hour down the road where you have to reserve a seat and the game is on Foxtel. Im guessing 7k. As I said we will be offerred a rap singer who cant pitch a ball for that type of crowd. Now im happy for you to come back and at least try and prove what ive said is wrong but dont talk in riddles. I could dig up Frank Gorshin to do that.

[Sainternist]

Why would anyone bump their own thread from two years ago?

Come on, Citywest. This is unnecessary.

[citywest]

Why would anyone bump their own thread from two years ago?

Come on, Citywest. This is unnecessary.

I bumped it because it is appropriate considering our debt issues/woes.

[Dave McNamara]

Firstly dave JO will not happen because no one is going to build a 16k stadium for 200 million and play about 2 games there a year. We could only play interstate sides and only those that dont have a following. leaves GC and GWS. Or do you want games like the WB and us played there and 10K of our supporters dont get in and thats just forgetting the 200 million.

Firstly Pluggs, that's been addressed in several other threads... there are ways and means, especially if it's a joint submission with other supporting bodies... oh, and as you well know... Rome wasn't built in a day (nor did it need be.) Just think big Pluggs. I know you can.

I have an idea. lets get our sponsorship in order and forget about moving games to Geelong, is that where you mean, because those names are very confusing. I have no idea who else got offerred that money but if its a side from the western suburbs it would make sense to offer that sort of money. If its a side from the south east they may offer us 50 cents and did you see his pitching arm the other night. Geelong make money on reserved seats and entry fees. We had 13K to GC at Etihad where dont have to reserve a seat unless you want to. Imagine the crowd an hour down the road where you have to reserve a seat and the game is on Foxtel. Im guessing 7k.

It's not our problem how the Hillbillies make their money out of home games... if they are going to offer $750K per home game played down there... then that makes it their problem if we only get 7000 people turning up... and I reckon better 7000 turn up at Hillbilly Hoedown under that sort of deal, than 7000 turn up at Dockedlands under our current deal.

I'd be signing up to the deal they offered the Poodles in a flash. And as part of the 'package', I'd make sure games were double headers, with Sandy/or Saint's ressies playing beforehand. (Development squad before all of them too... if we still have one.)

Play four home games a year there for three years and we'd be easily a net $10mil better off (figures in earlier posts in this and that thread I started). After that, we'll be on the rise again, and so will the number of our fair-weather supporters who start turning up to games... so won't need that Hillbilly Hoedown offer any longer.

As I said we will be offerred a rap singer who cant pitch a ball for that type of crowd. Now im happy for you to come back and at least try and prove what ive said is wrong but dont talk in riddles. I could dig up Frank Gorshin to do that.

Congratulations Pluggs. You're way, way ahead of me.

You have clearly worked our who the Hillbillies are (or was Geelong just a wild guess on your part )... whereas I have no idea what you mean by rap singers who can't pitch a ball...?

[plugger66]

Firstly dave JO will not happen because no one is going to build a 16k stadium for 200 million and play about 2 games there a year. We could only play interstate sides and only those that dont have a following. leaves GC and GWS. Or do you want games like the WB and us played there and 10K of our supporters dont get in and thats just forgetting the 200 million.

Firstly Pluggs, that's been addressed in several other threads... there are ways and means, especially if it's a joint submission with other supporting bodies... oh, and as you well know... Rome wasn't built in a day (nor did it need be.) Just think big Pluggs. I know you can.

I have an idea. lets get our sponsorship in order and forget about moving games to Geelong, is that where you mean, because those names are very confusing. I have no idea who else got offerred that money but if its a side from the western suburbs it would make sense to offer that sort of money. If its a side from the south east they may offer us 50 cents and did you see his pitching arm the other night. Geelong make money on reserved seats and entry fees. We had 13K to GC at Etihad where dont have to reserve a seat unless you want to. Imagine the crowd an hour down the road where you have to reserve a seat and the game is on Foxtel. Im guessing 7k.

It's not our problem how the Hillbillies make their money out of home games... if they are going to offer $750K per home game played down there... then that makes it their problem if we only get 7000 people turning up... and I reckon better 7000 turn up at Hillbilly Hoedown under that sort of deal, than 7000 turn up at Dockedlands under our current deal.

I'd be signing up to the deal they offered the Poodles in a flash. And as part of the 'package', I'd make sure games were double headers, with Sandy/or Saint's ressies playing beforehand. (Development squad before all of them too... if we still have one.)

Play four home games a year there for three years and we'd be easily a net $10mil better off (figures in earlier posts in this and that thread I started). After that, we'll be on the rise again, and so will the number of our fair-weather supporters who start turning up to games... so won't need that Hillbilly Hoedown offer any longer.

As I said we will be offerred a rap singer who cant pitch a ball for that type of crowd. Now im happy for you to come back and at least try and prove what ive said is wrong but dont talk in riddles. I could dig up Frank Gorshin to do that.

Congratulations Pluggs. You're way, way ahead of me.

You have clearly worked our who the Hillbillies are (or was Geelong just a wild guess on your part )... whereas I have no idea what you mean by rap singers who can't pitch a ball...?

Dave please speak English. And Geelong arent going to offer us that money for the reasons i pointed out. The stadium will never be built because of the reasons I pointed out. You continue to speak like the riddler. Please get out of fantasyland and at least go to disneyland.

[Sainternist]

Why would anyone bump their own thread from two years ago?

Come on, Citywest. This is unnecessary.

I bumped it because it is appropriate considering our debt issues/woes.

No, you didn't. You wanted to try and prove yourself as some kind of football Nostradamus.

Gotta say, I'm still not convinced that you're really a Saints man.

[Dave McNamara]

And Geelong (edit: Geelong? Do you mean the Hillbillies Pluggs?) arent going to offer us that money for the reasons i pointed out.

Oh yes they are... AFL is the problem... but hey, now we have 'our' man at the helm...
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/t ... 6600992429

As I said we will be offerred a rap singer who cant pitch a ball for that type of crowd. Now im happy for you to come back and at least try and prove what ive said is wrong but dont talk in riddles. I could dig up Frank Gorshin to do that.

Dave please speak English.

Pluggs, you're writing in English, but I still can't follow what you mean by "a rap singer who can't pitch a ball..." Are you referring to their idea of live music at The Mckinnon maybe...?

[Austinnn]

Who the Dickens are the hillbillies? Poodles? These teams already have nicknames, enough with your own special code, enough with all the emoticons, enough with the mental colours you put on your text that don't work with a black background, enough with your over elaborate multi-signature, enough with all the nonsense, Dave.


Enough.

[plugger66]

And Geelong (edit: Geelong? Do you mean the Hillbillies Pluggs?) arent going to offer us that money for the reasons i pointed out.

Oh yes they are... AFL is the problem... but hey, now we have 'our' man at the helm...
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/t ... 6600992429

As I said we will be offerred a rap singer who cant pitch a ball for that type of crowd. Now im happy for you to come back and at least try and prove what ive said is wrong but dont talk in riddles. I could dig up Frank Gorshin to do that.

Dave please speak English.

Pluggs, you're writing in English, but I still can't follow what you mean by "a rap singer who can't pitch a ball..." Are you referring to their idea of live music at The Mckinnon maybe...?

Dave that article doesnt even slightly suggest they are going to offer us any money and probably for the exact reasons i said. 13k at Etihad IMO equals 7k at geelong. No point at all apart from to piss off the 6k who wont go that far plus one happy person though for the good Doc.

Agree totally with Austinn. Your writing was reasonably funny early but its anooying with stupid nicnames and the bloody coloured writing.

[st.byron]

Who the Dickens are the hillbillies? Poodles? These teams already have nicknames, enough with your own special code, enough with all the emoticons, enough with the mental colours you put on your text that don't work with a black background, enough with your over elaborate multi-signature, enough with all the nonsense, Dave.


Enough.

+1

[Austinnn]

Here Dave, I'm sorry for picking on you. Truth is I'd rather read your thoughts than some on here, it's just the peripheral stuff that's annoying. As someone who also has a tendency to write too much, I can't really criticize you for that, but I do wish you'd strip it back a bit. We've all got our own style I suppose.

[asiu]

i'm glad someone remembered to tell him we love him regardless
... we'd be the poorer without his contributions .

well done A.

[Dave McNamara]

Here Dave, I'm sorry for picking on you. Truth is I'd rather read your thoughts than some on here, it's just the peripheral stuff that's annoying. As someone who also has a tendency to write too much, I can't really criticize you for that, but I do wish you'd strip it back a bit. We've all got our own style I suppose.

No worries Austinnn. And even if I'd scored a 'foeing', your writings would remain on my "I'd rather read" list. (Conciliatory smiley face emoticon.)



PS: I'm sure you've easily worked out which club is constantly referenced in the Essendope thread, let alone threads re the filth... Pluggs has too. (Wink.)

PPS: Thanks to you too Gaz. (Big smiley.) Awwwww, stuff it...

[plugger66]

Here Dave, I'm sorry for picking on you. Truth is I'd rather read your thoughts than some on here, it's just the peripheral stuff that's annoying. As someone who also has a tendency to write too much, I can't really criticize you for that, but I do wish you'd strip it back a bit. We've all got our own style I suppose.

No worries Austinnn. And even if I'd scored a 'foeing', your writings would remain on my "I'd rather read" list. (Conciliatory smiley face emoticon.)



PS: I'm sure you've easily worked out which club is constantly referenced in the Essendope thread, let alone threads re the filth... Pluggs has too. (Wink.)

PPS: Thanks to you too Gaz. (Big smiley.) Awwwww, stuff it...

Over the top. dave. Please just write in English or at least SS.Toooooooooooooohat ever that means and the essendope and the hell is pluggs? no one is must reading on here its just some are less likely to not read.

[Dave McNamara]

Over the top. dave. Please just write in English or at least SS.Toooooooooooooohat ever that means and the essendope and the hell is pluggs? no one is must reading on here its just some are less likely to not read.

Hi Pluggs, I reckon I've finally worked it out(!)

You don't actually type-in your posts. You post using voice-recognition software.







PS: Congratulations on your 40,000 milestone.

[plugger66]

Over the top. dave. Please just write in English or at least SS.Toooooooooooooohat ever that means and the essendope and the hell is pluggs? no one is must reading on here its just some are less likely to not read.

Hi Pluggs, I reckon I've finally worked it out(!)

You don't actually type-in your posts. You post using voice-recognition software.







PS: Congratulations on your 40,000 milestone.

Thanks. Would have 50k if I wasnt banned so often. No idea when I wrote that crap but im sure I was pissed. Anyway just try England from now on and dont use colours. have you worked out the maths regarding playing at the JO yet. I think we lose something like 10 million a game if we play 2 games there.

[saintbrat]

we're not making a fortune from our machines
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/a ... 7102811873

wonder why the digital editor put Hawthorn mid table when is should be at the top?

[RW&B]

wonder why the digital editor put Hawthorn mid table when is should be at the top?

The table is in alphabetical order, Bratty.

[Dave McNamara]

we're not making a fortune from our machines
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/a ... 7102811873

wonder why the digital editor put Hawthorn mid table when is should be at the top?

So, the Skid Marks gouged $18.5 million from lower socio-economic areas... Caroline Springs and Wavo' Gardens.

(Safe bet that the new more 'upmarket development' on the old VFL Park side doesn't contribute too many poker machine players. And I don't see an address anywhere in Boroondara listed amongst the Piss n' Poo's gouging venues. )


And they have the nerve to call themselves the 'family club'. Disgraceful!

[ace]

Three home games per year in New Zealnd, but not against Sydney or Brisbane. Either GCS, GWS, FREO, WC, ADL, PA.
Four home games at Docklands.
Four home games at the MCG.

Sometime the solution is so easy that no one can see it. Kind of like the fact that you can't see the trees due to the forrest.

Homes games in New Zealand are only profitable if someone pays for those games.

Home games at the MCG are determined by AFL scheduling.
It all comes down to crowd size.
The AFL wants to maximise revenue, that means the best drawing games get played at the MCG.
St Kilda does not draw large crowds.

But you are right that financial success is simple.
Everyone who has never earned more than they spent has been a financial failure, lets call them Labor.
Everyone who has earned more than they spent has been a financial success, lets call them Peter Costello.
Everyone who has blustered about how they will be financially successful and never followed through has failed, lets call them Wayne Swan or Joe Hockey.

[ace]

The real unspoken secret to financial success may be the pokies revenue.
Look at the rugby league sides. They live on die on the pokies.
It's sad I know but there is some truth in it.

If those pokies figures for Waverley and Caroline Springs are accurate that is some serious moolah.

I always wondered where the taxes I pay ended up.
Now I know it is in poker machines where the morons, imbeciles and idiots from the lower socio economic groups put the money.
Morons IQ 51 to 70
Imbeciles IQ 21 to 50
Idiots IQ 0 to 20
Poker machine IQ smarter than Morons, Imbeciles and Idiots.

[Dave McNamara]

But you are right that financial success is simple.
Everyone who has never earned more than they spent has been a financial failure, lets call them Labor.
Everyone who has earned more than they spent has been a financial success, lets call them Peter Costello.
Everyone who has blustered about how they will be financially successful and never followed through has failed, lets call them Wayne Swan or Joe Hockey.

Sorry Ace, but I can't agree with you on that one... it's not that simple at all.

Costello earned nothing... he just was lucky enough to be Treasurer during ten years of near all-time record global economic boom.

Under Treasurer Swan, the ALP government 'had' to spent-up... to save the national economy from a near all-time record global economic melt down. (Big difference.)
And not only did Swan succeed in doing that...
but the Australian economy actually grew during the GFC... and, by the same percentage that it did under Costello's 'charmed' period as Federal Treasurer.
(And Sloppy Joe even admitted to the Kiwis that there was no resulting debt crisis, and the you-beaut Aussie economy was, well, you know... you beaut. )

Growing the economy is far more important than posting a meaningless Budget surplus...
Menzies knew that... not one budget surplus in 23 years, yet the economy grew significantly...
and yet, the accumulated federal debt was... reduced significantly.


So, from that list above, we're just left with Sloppy Joe's blustering.

[Dave McNamara]

Back on topic...

I'm very proud that our beloved Saintas are not one of the parasitic clubs feeding off the vulnerable lower socio-economic demographic! Onya Saintas!

Next step (as discussed recently in another thread the title of which I've forgotten) is to either...
- tighten up how our venue operates so as to make sure no one is losing more money than they can afford (maybe we already are doing this?),
- or, just ditch the machines altogether, as a great PR move when we return to Funky Town.

I can see strong and valid arguments for both courses of action.