Sponsorship - St Kilda at rock bottom

[Dave McNamara]

So, if we had our own ground, in the suburb we are named after, with training facilities, and big stands for a boutique size crowd, we would then play games there and everything would be fine?

Hi HTB, not only 'fine', but if we properly tap into our suburb and all that it represents, and several examples are mentioned in various posts within this thread... we could eventually end up the best known footy club in Australia, and internationally(!) Sponsors and players would be lining up to be a part of it all.

We can do this!

(But, as Pluggs has now worked out, it doesn't have to happen overnight.)

The model Dave is after already exists, but instead of us being like Geelong I suggest we'd be like Carlton.
How many games are played at Princess Park? How much money upgrading a stadium that isn't used?

Carlscum are on the case. They want to get back to Poo Park.

Carlton wants to host matches for premiership points at its traditional Princes Park home again and will resume talks with the AFL about a project - already found by the league to be financially viable - that would convert it into a boutique stadium...

Carlton wants to host matches for premiership points at its traditional Princes Park home again and will resume talks with the AFL about a project - already found by the league to be financially viable - that would convert it into a boutique stadium...

The AFL commissioned research into the viability of re-inventing Princes Park as a home-and-away match venue about 18 months ago. Fairfax Media has been told that at least one member of the AFL commission was a supporter.

But while an architect's report showed the cost of bringing the Carlton ground up to scratch - and making it a 2 - was not insurmountable, transport assessments were poor. The idea was shelved as a consequence.

The Junction Oval does not have those transport issues. (How many people manage to attend the Grand Prick every year...?)

... Carlton clearly needs no convincing about the prospect of playing again on the ground that last held a home-and-away match in 2005.
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/b ... 2glfe.html

Carlscum, the Poodles, and maybe even the Tuggers have the potential to again play true home games. So do we!

However, we are the only ones who have the potential to tap into the allure that comes with St Kilda and surrounds. We are the mighty, irreverent, unconventional and utterly lovable enfant terrible of Australian sport. We are the mighty Saintas. And we do not do vanilla!


PS: Pluggs, that quiz question... still need a hint...?

[St Lenny]

While everyone points their finger at the club, AFL, media or what ever you choose to blame. How about the so called loyal fans take a look at themselves. Stop sprouting about how long you have followed the club, etc and take out a membership. Go to the games, buy some merchandise and support the Saints instead of complaining.

[Cairnsman]

Hey Dave don't take this the wrong way but I find your posts excessively long and busy and find myself skipping most of them these days. Just saying.

[plugger66]

So, if we had our own ground, in the suburb we are named after, with training facilities, and big stands for a boutique size crowd, we would then play games there and everything would be fine?

Hi HTB, not only 'fine', but if we properly tap into our suburb and all that it represents, and several examples are mentioned in various posts within this thread... we could eventually end up the best known footy club in Australia, and internationally(!) Sponsors and players would be lining up to be a part of it all.

We can do this!

(But, as Pluggs has now worked out, it doesn't have to happen overnight.)

The model Dave is after already exists, but instead of us being like Geelong I suggest we'd be like Carlton.
How many games are played at Princess Park? How much money upgrading a stadium that isn't used?

Carlscum are on the case. They want to get back to Poo Park.

Carlton wants to host matches for premiership points at its traditional Princes Park home again and will resume talks with the AFL about a project - already found by the league to be financially viable - that would convert it into a boutique stadium...

Carlton wants to host matches for premiership points at its traditional Princes Park home again and will resume talks with the AFL about a project - already found by the league to be financially viable - that would convert it into a boutique stadium...

The AFL commissioned research into the viability of re-inventing Princes Park as a home-and-away match venue about 18 months ago. Fairfax Media has been told that at least one member of the AFL commission was a supporter.

But while an architect's report showed the cost of bringing the Carlton ground up to scratch - and making it a 2 - was not insurmountable, transport assessments were poor. The idea was shelved as a consequence.

The Junction Oval does not have those transport issues. (How many people manage to attend the Grand Prick every year...?)

... Carlton clearly needs no convincing about the prospect of playing again on the ground that last held a home-and-away match in 2005.
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/b ... 2glfe.html

Carlscum, the Poodles, and maybe even the Tuggers have the potential to again play true home games. So do we!

However, we are the only ones who have the potential to tap into the allure that comes with St Kilda and surrounds. We are the mighty, irreverent, unconventional and utterly lovable enfant terrible of Australian sport. We are the mighty Saintas. And we do not do vanilla!


PS: Pluggs, that quiz question... still need a hint...?

Is the quiz question WTF are you saying because no sane person could answer that.

[Dave McNamara]

Hey Dave don't take this the wrong way but I find your posts excessively long and busy and find myself skipping most of them these days. Just saying.

It's just that Pluggs likes his 'i's crossed and his 't's dotted... and explaining to him that by convention it's the other way around, can take a bit of doing sometimes.

But no wuz CM. You read as much or as little as takes your fancy. For my part, I shall continue to enjoy your work.




PS: Pluggs, have you worked out yet which club other than the Hillbillies built up their ground - (almost) from scratch too?

[plugger66]

Hey Dave don't take this the wrong way but I find your posts excessively long and busy and find myself skipping most of them these days. Just saying.

It's just that Pluggs likes his 'i's crossed and his 't's dotted... and explaining to him that by convention it's the other way around, can take a bit of doing sometimes.

But no wuz CM. You read as much or as little as takes your fancy. For my part, I shall continue to enjoy your work.




PS: Pluggs, have you worked out yet which club other than the Hillbillies built up their ground - (almost) from scratch too?

No one as far as I know in the last 40 years.

[3rd generation saint]

Here's a reality check Dave, AAMI Stadium, a boutique stadium built for soccer and rugby cost $267.5 million dollars to build.
Now that price tag comes without training facilities which would add to it. Make no bones about, the Junction Oval would have to be totally rebuilt and I doubt anyone would fork out that sort of money for that sort of money.
Plus, there would be transport issues, the only public transport there is trams, no trains, the St.Kilda line has been closed for years.
Also parking would be worse than both Optus and Etihad put together, and you would still have to contend with the accessibility of the ground during the Grand Prix.
It is not going to happen in anyone's life time who are currently alive.

[Dave McNamara]

Here's a reality check Dave, AAMI Stadium, a boutique stadium built for soccer and rugby cost $267.5 million dollars to build.
Now that price tag comes without training facilities which would add to it. Make no bones about, the Junction Oval would have to be totally rebuilt and I doubt anyone would fork out that sort of money for that sort of money.
Plus, there would be transport issues, the only public transport there is trams, no trains, the St.Kilda line has been closed for years.
Also parking would be worse than both Optus and Etihad put together, and you would still have to contend with the accessibility of the ground during the Grand Prix.
It is not going to happen in anyone's life time who are currently alive.

Luckily I knew you were coming.

Cost:
The Hillibillies did it,
we don't have to do it overnight (as per with Rome),
we don't have to replicate the MCG or AAMI Stadium,
26000 watched the Community Cup only a couple of years back,
we are an AFL footy club and so should be able to use our connections to make it happen,
oh, and...,
we did it once before. (There's the quiz question answer for Pluggs btw. )

Public transport and Grand Prick:
Firstly, that event isn't held during the footy season.
Secondly, the huge crowds that make it to the Grand Prick proves conclusively that public transport, parking, people being able to get there, is most certainly not an issue.
Then there's the potential financial and membership and publicity/profile windfall opportunities that the Grand Prick would provide us if we were encamped at our Junction Oval.

(All of the above is contained in posts from several Saintsationalists earlier in this thread.)

Besides, how hard can it really be, I mean, if they can dig a giant drain under pretty much all of the inner north of the city...

[bergholt]

26000 watched the Community Cup only a couple of years back

You keep saying this. I "played" in that game so I have some memory of the day:

- there's no way it was 26000
- parking and public transport were horrible
- most of the crowd was standing or sitting on grass - not AFL quality facilities
- the changerooms were very poor
- not sure about the size but it feels pretty small to me, compared to Elsternwick Park anyway

I'm not sure that purported 26k is a good indicator.

[AccidentallyTim]

Very sad that a club which has played in finals in recent years, plus has been successful since 2004, can't get major name sponsors. Doesn't say much at all for the Westaway group, and really I think Butters would have done a much better job in this area..but it's all history now. Another good reason to get out of Seaford ASAP and develop a higher profile.

I wouldn't think it has anything to do with where our training base is located.

Rather instead I think our piss poor membership due to to many sooky supporters not buying membership reflects poorly on the club as a whole, while the distant past poor off field image has done a lot of damage imo.

To the general public we're still tarnished by the "St kilda school girl", "naked pics" & "dwarf burning" incidents.

What business would want to be associated with that humdrum when the benefit to said business is only exposure to less than 30k members or thereabouts?

You would need to be a supporter with your own business or a position of influence within marketing to make the leap to get in bed with us.

We need, imo, to drive membership hard which it seems the club are desperately trying to do, let on field results earn more prime time games and keep our noses clean off field.

[Con Gorozidis]

26000 watched the Community Cup only a couple of years back

You keep saying this. I "played" in that game so I have some memory of the day:

- there's no way it was 26000
- parking and public transport were horrible
- most of the crowd was standing or sitting on grass - not AFL quality facilities
- the changerooms were very poor
- not sure about the size but it feels pretty small to me, compared to Elsternwick Park anyway

I'm not sure that purported 26k is a good indicator.

The 96 tram is pretty decent and there are the other ones down st kilda rd.
Pretty easy really. And the walk from Windsor train station is also pretty doable.

But most importantly tell us about your performance in the Community cup ?

[Spinner]

Has this thread really turned into building at Junction Oval?

Oh my....

[3rd generation saint]

Dave, you keep referring to the hillbillies, from which I assume you mean Geelong.
Big difference there was that Kardinia Park was already a functioning AFL ground that could hold 20,000+ and all they did was upgrade it bit by bit, they didn't build it from scratch. Have you seen the Junction Oval lately? The terraces are all gone, right now holding a district cricket games is all it is good for, we'll get back to that later.
Geelong also got a lot of help from the Geelong council, who have a very vested interest in it. Somehow I don't think the St.Kilda council will be so enthusiastic, nor the locals who will have to help foot the bill, remember 250 million plus.
Geelong also got a lot of help from the State Government, again vested interest due to a couple of marginal seats down there, not so marginal at St.Kilda, again 250 million plus to build a state of the art stadium that can hold 30,000.
The AFL would only be interested in a stadium of that size as well.
Now you said we did it once before when we went to Moorabbin, yeah piled some dirt up for terraces and built a couple of small grandstands. They built a ground where 95% of the crowd stood to watch the game, don't know if you have noticed people like to sit now, or they don't come.
I mean the reason we left the Junction Oval 50 years ago was because we had outgrown it, there was no room to expand and our supporter base had moved south.
Let's not forget you not only need to build a stadium, but a Social Club with all it's facilities, an administration wing, training facilities to include a full scale gymnasium, recovery and medical rooms, plus pool.
As I said the Grand Prix would severely interfere with access, not just for the four days, the four weeks Lakeside Drive is closed whilst they prepare the place for the event, and take it down.
Two other things you will need to make it a viable home, love them or hate them, poker machines for the social club. You are going to have fun getting the St.Kilda City Council to agree with that. Plus lights so you can play night games, again you have to get the council to agree to that.
Now here is the final nail in the coffin, the St.Kilda Cricket Club who play there, they will not move, plus right now Cricket Australia lease the ground and they are trying with not much success, to redevelop it to a 10,000 seat stadium in order to play Sheffield Shield games there.
Cricket runs the ground, we wouldn't be able to use the oval from October until late March, great for pre-season.
It's a nice fantasy, but that's where it belongs, in Fantasyland.

[bergholt]

But most importantly tell us about your performance in the Community cup ?

Not much to speak of unfortunately.

[Dave McNamara]

But most importantly tell us about your performance in the Community cup ?

Not much to speak of unfortunately.

That's BS Bergs!!! I very much doubt that any of the many, many strugglers who benefit from the work of The Mission/(and now) Reclink would agree with that assessment of your contribution. No players, no Community Cup! (Btw, are you Megahertz or one of Fred's Rock Dogs? )

As for the crowd, was definitely and officially 26000+. I was in one grand stand, the other wasn't able to be used. However, in the interests of transparency, I have acknowledged several times previously re the people sitting inside the fence and the OH&S issues. (Though it would have taken your good self to catch me out. A fellow Saintsationalist, he who only recently became convinced of the possibility of human flight, would never have known about that... )

I use the 26000 figure merely to give an idea of what can be achieved right now, let alone with some upgrading.
I also use that 26000 figure (along with GP attendance numbers) to show that public transport/access to the area is the least of our hurdles.
I also use that 26000 figure coz it sounds sooooooo impressive.



Hi 3GS. Your long, detailed and really well thought-out post is genuinely appreciated. Please forgive me if my response is delayed, but I may need a little time to formulate an attempt at a worthy reply.


(And CM, early warning... by necessity, said reply will prosabably be a tad lengthy, so feel free to keep scrolling. )

[Dave McNamara]

Round 1 the Hillbillies played (and won comfortably) their first home game for this season... another $850,000 profit. (And remember, they average a 26,000 crowd to achieve this.)

Last night against the Wogans was our first home game for the season. The crowd was 20,000.

So, how much is that going to cost us!?!

(Vs) Fremantle in Round 4 2009 drew 26,326. The Saints' bill for that Dockers game was $73,105.
http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/stadium ... 5710459768

Hi 3GS, no this is clearly not an answer to your questions re 'how', but it is a little 'thought grenade' lobbed in as to 'why'.

[plugger66]

Round 1 the Hillbillies played (and won comfortably) their first home game for this season... another $850,000 profit. (And remember, they average a 26,000 crowd to achieve this.)

Last night against the Wogans was our first home game for the season. The crowd was 20,000.

So, how much is that going to cost us!?!

(Vs) Fremantle in Round 4 2009 drew 26,326. The Saints' bill for that Dockers game was $73,105.
http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/stadium ... 5710459768

Hi 3GS, no this is clearly not an answer to your questions re 'how', but it is a little 'thought grenade' lobbed in as to 'why'.

Dave you know a ground built similar to geelong could never hold more than around 10k at the junction and you do realise those grandstands are heritage listed. Based on that we may make 200k a game. yep better than losing but we get 2 million off the AFL because of that. It will take a long time to pay off 200 million based on a 200K profit a game. I thinking 100 years but then there is interest on 200 mIllion of about 12 million a year so we will actually lose around 10 million a year.

[spert]

The Geelong ground has been developed on questionable debt and questionable business/ state government dealings- all will come back and bite them on the bum in a few years time. The St Kilda Cricket Club will move to wherever they get a good deal..may not be the Junction Oval. Any business with a long-term view would look at developing Junction Oval along with support from state government and business interests. The Seaford days are numbered for the Saints

[3rd generation saint]

The Geelong ground has been developed on questionable debt and questionable business/ state government dealings- all will come back and bite them on the bum in a few years time. The St Kilda Cricket Club will move to wherever they get a good deal..may not be the Junction Oval. Any business with a long-term view would look at developing Junction Oval along with support from state government and business interests. The Seaford days are numbered for the Saints

There is simply not enough room there, and if Cricket Australia, who have the support of the AFL because the AFL want to free up the MCG in March, then there is no way.
If we are to move anywhere from Seaford, it would be back to Moorabbin, providing we get a good deal from the council.
But, by the time we do this, many of our players may be living down on the Peninsula and therefore moving back to Moorabbin may be incredibly inconvenient.

[stinger]

Hey Dave don't take this the wrong way but I find your posts excessively long and busy and find myself skipping most of them these days. Just saying.

been telling him the same thing for months...he's not listening unfortunately.....

[Dave McNamara]

Hey Dave don't take this the wrong way but I find your posts excessively long and busy and find myself skipping most of them these days. Just saying.

been telling him the same thing for months...he's not listening unfortunately.....

And the same answer to you Sting that I gave to CM.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=84886&view=unread#p1444320

[BarryGrogan]

But hey?

We're not in a precarious position I was told?!

Honestly, I think we are a couple of bad decisions, or poor luck away from extinction.... It's a long way back. 18 spots in fact!

Our slide on and off the field has been scary.... And even Demetriou said straight out
"Of course I'm concerned about St Kilda"

We cannot withstand a sustained period at the bottom, we are not a big club!

Well whaddya know.

5 years later...heaps of bad decisions and we're still kickin'.


Oh by the way, I thought 2009 was the last time you <edited by mods> with worry over the club's shitness?

<1 week ban for commenting negatively on a poster >

[Yorkeys]

Sponsers want a return, clearly. At the moment we can't offer big exposure - e.g. no Friday nights. Win regularly and sponsorship will take care of itself. First step was to remove Coach Richardson because he lacks charisma and was not good at his job. We have some exciting marketable players - Marshall, Battle, Clark, Coffield, Steele; all have rock star potential and a smart sponsor would get in now at a bargain price because those men are going to be marketing gold from 2020 on. I'd suggest development Victoria take us on as a sponsored project ("from 14th to 4th in 1 year" - project management at its best without pesky tendering); we would be ideal for a renewable energy company at this point in our cycle and Deloitte Access Economics should take us on - a case study on how to manage a huge debt; we should be the darlings of the finance industry (with due nod to Pepper).

[freely]

Sponsers want a return, clearly. At the moment we can't offer big exposure - e.g. no Friday nights. Win regularly and sponsorship will take care of itself. First step was to remove Coach Richardson because he lacks charisma and was not good at his job. We have some exciting marketable players - Marshall, Battle, Clark, Coffield, Steele; all have rock star potential and a smart sponsor would get in now at a bargain price because those men are going to be marketing gold from 2020 on. I'd suggest development Victoria take us on as a sponsored project ("from 14th to 4th in 1 year" - project management at its best without pesky tendering); we would be ideal for a renewable energy company at this point in our cycle and Deloitte Access Economics should take us on - a case study on how to manage a huge debt; we should be the darlings of the finance industry (with due nod to Pepper).

You may be right. Perhaps we should ditch footy and go into the boyband business!

[Special]

When will we get a name brand sponsor?

We attract the unknown brands - even shyte clubs like Norf and Footscray get known brands