Eight years of pain coming ...

[bigcarl]

According to Terry Wallet. That's how long he reckons it will take for us to play finals again.

I sincerely hope the club is taking a shorter-term view as I'm not sure the membership as a whole will tolerate consistent failure over that sort of period.

I reckon the trajectory has to be upwards be the end of next season of Watters may be in trouble,

[mullet]

According to Terry Wallet. That's how long he reckons it will take for us to play finals again.

I sincerely hope the club is taking a shorter-term view as I'm not sure the membership as a whole will tolerate consistent failure over that sort of period.

I reckon the trajectory has to be upwards be the end of next season of Watters may be in trouble,

Its funny isnt it. All the scribes say that it will take 8 years, etc, etc, and yet they know that no coach will be given that time frame.

How the hell did port turn it around so fast. I am starting to wonder if we should have got Hinkley, but we would prob need kochie as well

[CURLY]

Hearing this from Terry Wallace it gives me great hope. He forgets that not every list is managed by a clown like himself and the way he butchered Richmonds list is in no way a indication of other clubs list management.

[plugger66]

It certainly will be at least 5 years if not longer due to the huge gap in recruiting over the last few years. even the last couple seem to have got a few good players but will any be A grade.Time will tell.

[chook23]

It certainly will be at least 5 years if not longer due to the huge gap in recruiting over the last few years. even the last couple seem to have got a few good players but will any be A grade.Time will tell.

Agree

Our list (In total) is the worst in the league

Melbourne
Bulldogs
GWS

have more talent that is yet to be developed on their list

but they have more in the sysytem...........

our list still to bottom out

the other 3 already have

[satchmo]

Hearing this from Terry Wallace it gives me great hope. He forgets that not every list is managed by a clown like himself and the way he butchered Richmonds list is in no way a indication of other clubs list management.

Exactly!

Terry's got a football brain...it's just extremely over-inflated.

[Jacks Back]

Not only is it wallet who is saying this. I heard Robert Walls say something similar as well as KB on SEN.

It's a pity we couldn't do a Sydney or some of those other teams who didn't completely bottom out but then we wouldn't pick up very low draft picks. You're damned if you do and damned if you don't.

[plugger66]

It certainly will be at least 5 years if not longer due to the huge gap in recruiting over the last few years. even the last couple seem to have got a few good players but will any be A grade.Time will tell.

Agree

Our list (In total) is the worst in the league

Melbourne
Bulldogs
GWS

have more talent that is yet to be developed on their list

but they have more in the sysytem...........

our list still to bottom out

the other 3 already have

Exactly. People hoping for a quick fix need to compare us to GWS and GC. We will have only 5 or 6 players over 26 years of age in 3 years and none will be A graders. We will then have some guys from the current group of draftees who will have 3 years footy under their belt but none will be top 10 picks. We will have a few top 10 picks by then but none will have more than 30 games under their belt. The other 2 new sides and even WB and Melbourne will have about the same 26 year olds but will have many many top 10 picks with at least 60 to 80 games under their belt and will still get some top 10 picks over the next 3 years which will give them so much more depth than our side. The real pain starts next year and will continue to at least 2 more before we even start winning a group of games again.

[bigcarl]

It certainly will be at least 5 years if not longer due to the huge gap in recruiting over the last few years. even the last couple seem to have got a few good players but will any be A grade.Time will tell.

You reckon a proud club ... Collingwood for example ... would tolerate that sort of sustained failure? Not a chance and neither should we.

Five years is nowhere near ambitious enough. We need people who dare to dream, not ones who roll over and cop it.

[maverick]

It certainly will be at least 5 years if not longer due to the huge gap in recruiting over the last few years. even the last couple seem to have got a few good players but will any be A grade.Time will tell.

You reckon a proud club ... Collingwood for example ... would tolerate that sort of sustained failure? Not a chance and neither should we.

Five years is nowhere near ambitious enough. We need people who dare to dream, not ones who roll over and cop it.

So what's your plan then?

[plugger66]

It certainly will be at least 5 years if not longer due to the huge gap in recruiting over the last few years. even the last couple seem to have got a few good players but will any be A grade.Time will tell.

You reckon a proud club ... Collingwood for example ... would tolerate that sort of sustained failure? Not a chance and neither should we.

Five years is nowhere near ambitious enough. We need people who dare to dream, not ones who roll over and cop it.

So we dont tolerate it. How does that help us move up the ladder? Explain how we can improve based on what we are seeing at the moment. We may finish the year losing 10 in a row. matter of fact that is a huge chance. Things will be worse next year because we wont improve. the sides around us must improve. Its the way of the AFL.

[dragit]

I reckon the trajectory has to be upwards be the end of next season of Watters may be in trouble,

You can't just say "I want us to be heading upwards by the end of next season" and click your fingers...

Our best 5 or so players will retire in a year, we are missing about a dozen good players in the 23 -27 year old 50 - 100 games area.

Thus list is in its second year (of at least 5) of a rebuild, our wasted years if drafting have set us up for big fall, that's just reality, don't be too diss appointed when we only win a handful of games for a few years.

[thejiggingsaint]

Oh well thats it then isn't it? might as well roll up the swag and hit the road! If Wallace and Walls are saying we're 8-10 years away from success then it MUST be true Of course Wallace would know all about recruitment blunders etc. this "career coach" had an unprecedented contract term with the Tigers FIVE years to get them ....WHERE? (MAN! did Sydney dodge a bullet when that man was overlooked for the coaches job there)
It was tough in the early part of the "noughties" 2000-2003 but we gradually gained ground, I have confidence that the current administration and coaching panel can maintain our progress. Patience, support and FAITH are needed NOW more than ever!
GO SAINTS!

[jonesy]

I think if you get it right in the draft the turn around comes at the click of the finger,but it usually comes with a minimum of three years of pain.

You seem to be going nowhere for 2-3 years even with all the prized young talent,people become impatient and start asking questions about the club, then once those kids get to about there third and fourth year,away you go!

Examples,Port,Gold Coast,Richmond even. All were questioned on where they were going,then suddenly the next day it happens.

We just have to ride it out, everyone knew it was coming,now it's here and people are jumping up and down in shock and horror. We will not win a flag by trying to stay competitive around 8-12th every year in the current climate. Only Sydney can do that and we aren't gifted an extra million. We want a flag,we need to go down for two at least, plain and simple. Two years of pain equal 5 of gain. Four years of pain equal 10 of dominance(unless your Melbourne,they are the only club to F*** up sustained top draft picks)

[saintspremiers]

Oh well thats it then isn't it? might as well roll up the swag and hit the road! If Wallace and Walls are saying we're 8-10 years away from success then it MUST be true Of course Wallace would know all about recruitment blunders etc. this "career coach" had an unprecedented contract term with the Tigers FIVE years to get them ....WHERE? (MAN! did Sydney dodge a bullet when that man was overlooked for the coaches job there)
It was tough in the early part of the "noughties" 2000-2003 but we gradually gained ground, I have confidence that the current administration and coaching panel can maintain our progress. Patience, support and FAITH are needed NOW more than ever!
GO SAINTS!

2000-03 period was different because we got a PP in that period plus you could pick up recycled players easily in the pre season draft. Free Agency probably won't help us much as we don't have many players with currency.

What gives you faith with our current admin - the ones that allowed RL's pathetic drafting and a terrible fitness guy into our club?

5 years of pain minimum. Blind Freddy can see that.

[thejiggingsaint]

What gives me faith with our current admin? The fact that they didn't crumble when Lyon did the off and instead went about appointing Scott Watters who (IMHO) is a future supercoach. RL's "pathetic drafting" in 2007-08 got us to back-to-back GF's (didn;t hear you complaining then ) SP, I agree to disagree with you (AND blind Freddy)

[wolfpup]

According to Terry Wallet. That's how long he reckons it will take for us to play finals again.

I sincerely hope the club is taking a shorter-term view as I'm not sure the membership as a whole will tolerate consistent failure over that sort of period.

I reckon the trajectory has to be upwards be the end of next season of Watters may be in trouble,

Hello

Am late to this but i disagree with wallace completely, to me its more a 2-3 year rebuilding phase, then we start heading back up the ladder. 7-8 year finals wilderness for the sainters we have not had since the dark days of the 80's and if that happens it will be the death of the club in this market.

SInce the 90's the saints have reached the finals in:

92,93
97,98
04,05,06,08,09,10,11

With 3 grand final losses and a gf draw and 3 prelim losses thrown in to that mix. So over half the time we are in the finals we reach at least the prelim.

Anyways, the point i think i am trying to make is that as a club we should learn from the watson and blight debacle and reduce the period between finals from 7 years (98 to 2004) to around 4 years. Dont forget the saints recruited aggressively when we got gehrig, hammil, etc so we need something like that as well in the next year or so. Its all about timing.

[thejiggingsaint]

Good post! Very well articulated mate! LOVE the stats (apart from the results of the GF's that is )

[SainterK]

That worries me, he knows all about lean years

[plugger66]

According to Terry Wallet. That's how long he reckons it will take for us to play finals again.

I sincerely hope the club is taking a shorter-term view as I'm not sure the membership as a whole will tolerate consistent failure over that sort of period.

I reckon the trajectory has to be upwards be the end of next season of Watters may be in trouble,

Hello

Am late to this but i disagree with wallace completely, to me its more a 2-3 year rebuilding phase, then we start heading back up the ladder. 7-8 year finals wilderness for the sainters we have not had since the dark days of the 80's and if that happens it will be the death of the club in this market.

SInce the 90's the saints have reached the finals in:

92,93
97,98
04,05,06,08,09,10,11

With 3 grand final losses and a gf draw and 3 prelim losses thrown in to that mix. So over half the time we are in the finals we reach at least the prelim.

Anyways, the point i think i am trying to make is that as a club we should learn from the watson and blight debacle and reduce the period between finals from 7 years (98 to 2004) to around 4 years. Dont forget the saints recruited aggressively when we got gehrig, hammil, etc so we need something like that as well in the next year or so. Its all about timing.

All interesting but doesnt explain why Wallace is wrong and why will magically just go up the ladder. To do up others must come down. We are still on the way down. Those are facts. We wont reach the bottom until nearly all our AA players retire.

[Zed]

How much does attitude count ?

I watched the Port v Collingwood game and Port reminded me of how we used to play in 2009. Desperate, pressure footy. Full team defence. Last year they were pitiful. They added a couple of good youngsters in Wines & Neade but lost an experienced defender in Chaplin. For mine, their list hasn't improved that much since last year, but their attitude has. I look at Jake Neade who looks like a wafer compared to every other player on the field yet he contests like its the dying minutes of a Grand Final.

The Saints on the other hand look like a team that have lost their desperation and their belief. As soon as the opposition gets a run on, our heads drop and you can almost hear them say 'here we go again'. God help us when Melbourne start getting some desperation and belief , they will shoot past us at a rapid rate of knots.

Im not advocating for a change of coach yet - but we cant just keep plodding along like we are now otherwise our belief system will be so destroyed it will take a completely new list to change it. Melbourne proves that stocking up on top talent alone isn't enough. Some harsh pruning at the end of the year in both the coaches box and the player list is required. We need enthusiasm, fresh ideas and hope.

[dragit]

Examples,Port,Gold Coast,Richmond even. All were questioned on where they were going,then suddenly the next day it happens.

All 3 of those clubs have at least half a dozen top ten picks, GCS probably have over a dozen...

We can't expect to start competing against good sides until we bring in a load if new talent, it takes time.

Richmond were once a proud club, or so I am told, but they have only played finals once? in 30 years... Carlton, wealthy, loaded with high draft picks... Still struggling after more than a decade... It happens.

[thejiggingsaint]

People seem to overlook that first quarter yesterday when our intensity got us to be in a good position. Obviously it was disappointing to see that drop off, but I'm of the opinion (still) that we are not THAT far away from being a competetive force again in the coming seasons.

[plugger66]

People seem to overlook that first quarter yesterday when our intensity got us to be in a good position. Obviously it was disappointing to see that drop off, but I'm of the opinion (still) that we are not THAT far away from being a competetive force again in the coming seasons.

I think GWS led Hawthorn at half time in a game this year and have won exactly no games with a good chance of winning exactly no games. I like your positivity but I wish you could actually explain it to us guys who think we are stuffed for a fir few years. By the way i hope it doesnt top people following us and barracking strongly for us even when we are down. It certainly doesnt worry me going all the way down. I am used to it. It may worry the now generation which really worries me. You can tell their age by their posting on here. Calling for sacking and the clubs a disgrace and so on.

[mr six o'clock]

Hearing this from Terry Wallace it gives me great hope. He forgets that not every list is managed by a clown like himself and the way he butchered Richmonds list is in no way a indication of other clubs list management.

agree
wallace is a flog of the highest order !
I have no idea why the media think he is so fantastic .
In 12 seasons of coaching he coached the dogs to 2 victories in finals , and the tigers never played finals !
WOW !!!!!! what a supercoach !