Tom Lee

[santazzi]

I adore Saintsational......I am still to figure out how a simple thread about a new player (in this case Lee) will do in 2013...slowly but surely mutates and evolves................into a titanic arm wrestle often about nothing of consequence.........between some of the real heavy weights of this forum........brilliant stuff......

[Gershwin]

I adore Saintsational......I am still to figure out how a simple thread about a new player (in this case Lee) will do in 2013...slowly but surely mutates and evolves................into a titanic arm wrestle often about nothing of consequence.........between some of the real heavy weights of this forum........brilliant stuff......

No not brilliant at all santazzi.
Too many people on this forum hide behind a computer and write things that they would never say to someone face to face.
It has lessened the pleasure to me of this forum but thats OK I have the choice to stay or go. I hope the majority of us ignore the minority and keep the the forum positive and friendly.

[dragit]

I adore Saintsational......I am still to figure out how a simple thread about a new player (in this case Lee) will do in 2013...slowly but surely mutates and evolves................into a titanic arm wrestle often about nothing of consequence.........between some of the real heavy weights of this forum........brilliant stuff......

No not brilliant at all santazzi.
Too many people on this forum hide behind a computer and write things that they would never say to someone face to face.
It has lessened the pleasure to me of this forum but thats OK I have the choice to stay or go. I hope the majority of us ignore the minority and keep the the forum positive and friendly.

Are you guys alright?
I didn't think this thread was going too badly, no personal abuse, just robust discussion on who will be getting games... Obviously we can't have 6 tall forwards playing each week, so in order to guess how many games Lee might get, we need to think about who will make way. I love Kosi, but I think he is about done at this level, nothing personal.

[SainterK]

The fact we didn't have depth and had to play the likes of Kosi and even Roo injured at times, well let's just be grateful they've rectified this.

[villasaint]

He has to earn his stripes but I would hope we could get at least 10-15 into him.

[evo]

I see Lee as a real full-forward who can lead hard, take a mark and kick a goal.
Who lines up next to him in the forward pocket is a different story and I'm hoping Hickey can do that and change with McEvoy giving us a strong Ruck for 100% of the game. Kossie is a back-up who will probably play at times.

Thats exactly as I see it, barring injury.

[matrix]

lee ff roo chf
id like to see that

good options coming up in the next few years

roo
rhys
lee
wilkes
milne
saad
milera

look good up front imo

[CURLY]

It worked well for a few seasons with Brad Ottens. Due to the fragility of his body the Pussy cats kept him in mothballs most of the season, then prior to finals he would be back playing. That happened 2 season before he retired. I think if Ottens hadn't been handled that way he wouldn't have been able to play out his last season IMHO. His last season he played more games if I recollect correctly that he had in the previous 3 seasons. Yet he was always ready to front up for the finals, and was fresh & did a good job each time.

Though I'm not suggesting Kosi is/was to the same elite standard as Ottens. But Ottens is just an example of a big man who was managed successfully and only played when needed at the end of the season.

The Bad News Bears did the same thing with Clark Keating in 02-03 - He only played 12 games in each of those years- but that included 2 grand finals (and 2 flags).

Some blokes simply cant play more than 12 good games of footy in a season (including finals). Kosi is one them IMHO.

If I was the coach id only be looking at playing Kosi in 8 games in the home and aways.

Both of these examples are simply untrue. Please I dont understand how people post these untruths.

[plugger66]

Im unsure how you could manage that. I think he plays if he is inform and if he isnt he doesnt play unless the options are worse.

Kosi is experienced enough to make a call on this himself.

How many times in the last 3 seasons has he played a stinker and then post match (even during the match sometimes) some rumour comes out about an illness or injury he was carrying.

If your'e sick or injured DONT PLAY - tell the coaches on Wednesday youre not available. Dont try and be a hero - when all you end up doing is hurting the team.

How about he puts the team before his match payments?

What match payments?

[bergholt]

I see Lee as a real full-forward who can lead hard, take a mark and kick a goal.

I see Lee as better than Plugger. Then I wake up and realise that he's never played an AFL game so there's more chance he'll turn out like Fergus Watts or Lucas Cook or Beau Dowler - or Kosi, for that matter. Maybe wait until you've seen him play before drawing conclusions on him?

[dragit]

I see Lee as a real full-forward who can lead hard, take a mark and kick a goal.

I see Lee as better than Plugger. Then I wake up and realise that he's never played an AFL game so there's more chance he'll turn out like Fergus Watts or Lucas Cook or Beau Dowler - or Kosi, for that matter. Maybe wait until you've seen him play before drawing conclusions on him?

There's your first mistake, waking up.

[Con Gorozidis]

What match payments?

the ones you get for playing matches.
or are you saying he is on a flat contract regardless of games played?

anyway. im tired of talking kosi.
im very bullish about lee. the dude is very quick off the mark. can kick. sticky hands and seems pretty athletic and agile for his height.
sure the wafl is a few steps down - but it is still probably the second best league in the country. he also did some damage against afl listed defenders .
throw in that he is not injury prone.

we have every reason to be positive at this stage.

[CURLY]

What match payments?

the ones you get for playing matches.
or are you saying he is on a flat contract regardless of games played?

anyway. im tired of talking kosi.
im very bullish about lee. the dude is very quick off the mark. can kick. sticky hands and seems pretty athletic and agile for his height.
sure the wafl is a few steps down - but it is still probably the second best league in the country. he also did some damage against afl listed defenders .
throw in that he is not injury prone.

we have every reason to be positive at this stage.

What about the story you made up about Clarke Keating?

[plugger66]

What match payments?

the ones you get for playing matches.
or are you saying he is on a flat contract regardless of games played?

anyway. im tired of talking kosi.
im very bullish about lee. the dude is very quick off the mark. can kick. sticky hands and seems pretty athletic and agile for his height.
sure the wafl is a few steps down - but it is still probably the second best league in the country. he also did some damage against afl listed defenders .
throw in that he is not injury prone.

we have every reason to be positive at this stage.

Of course he is a flat contract as are about half the side. To hard to do your salary cap if the whole side was on match payments. As for Lee have no idea about him. Lets see what happens in the practice games.

[Con Gorozidis]

What match payments?

the ones you get for playing matches.
or are you saying he is on a flat contract regardless of games played?

anyway. im tired of talking kosi.
im very bullish about lee. the dude is very quick off the mark. can kick. sticky hands and seems pretty athletic and agile for his height.
sure the wafl is a few steps down - but it is still probably the second best league in the country. he also did some damage against afl listed defenders .
throw in that he is not injury prone.

we have every reason to be positive at this stage.

What about the story you made up about Clarke Keating?

What about it? Are you just following me around nitpicking? Awesome fun!

[Con Gorozidis]

What match payments?

the ones you get for playing matches.
or are you saying he is on a flat contract regardless of games played?

anyway. im tired of talking kosi.
im very bullish about lee. the dude is very quick off the mark. can kick. sticky hands and seems pretty athletic and agile for his height.
sure the wafl is a few steps down - but it is still probably the second best league in the country. he also did some damage against afl listed defenders .
throw in that he is not injury prone.

we have every reason to be positive at this stage.

Of course he is a flat contract as are about half the side. To hard to do your salary cap if the whole side was on match payments. As for Lee have no idea about him. Lets see what happens in the practice games.

I am genuinely surprised players are on flat contracts. I thought they had a base payment + games + extras.
No wonder Kosi is so happy with life.

[CURLY]

quote="Con Gorozidis"]

What match payments?

the ones you get for playing matches.
or are you saying he is on a flat contract regardless of games played?

anyway. im tired of talking kosi.
im very bullish about lee. the dude is very quick off the mark. can kick. sticky hands and seems pretty athletic and agile for his height.
sure the wafl is a few steps down - but it is still probably the second best league in the country. he also did some damage against afl listed defenders .
throw in that he is not injury prone.

we have every reason to be positive at this stage.

What about it? Are you just following me around nitpicking? Awesome fun![/quote]

Just asking why youd lie?

[BigMart]

Players are definitely on performance based contracts

With B&F results, number of games and other incentive based clauses.....

And I understand there are match payments....

[plugger66]

Players are definitely on performance based contracts

With B&F results, number of games and other incentive based clauses.....

And I understand there are match payments....

There are match payments. I dont think anyone said there wasnt. And most of the performance based contract are out the door now that Matthew Drain has gone.

[Gershwin]

I see Lee as a real full-forward who can lead hard, take a mark and kick a goal.

I see Lee as better than Plugger. Then I wake up and realise that he's never played an AFL game so there's more chance he'll turn out like Fergus Watts or Lucas Cook or Beau Dowler - or Kosi, for that matter. Maybe wait until you've seen him play before drawing conclusions on him?

Wow, thats not even glass half empty outlook, its 'lifes a bitch and then you die' attitude.
Lighten up a bit mate.
He is 21-22 and performed very well in WAFL. Take a look at his highlights on youtube and put a smile on your dial.

"Summertime and the livings easy ... "

[BigMart]

Is that right Michael Nettlefold?!

Mate, how the f*** would you know how or what individual player payment structure involves... You don't and Don't pretend otherwise!

Match payments are written into their agreement.

[The Redeemer]

Considering what we gave up for him, he better be good.

This goes for Hickey as well.

I am not for one stating that they both have to come in and dominate from game one however in 10+ years we need to look back and judge them as close to A grade talents and players as possible

[Con Gorozidis]

Just asking why youd lie?

oh here we go!
what did i lie about?

[Con Gorozidis]

Players are definitely on performance based contracts

With B&F results, number of games and other incentive based clauses.....

And I understand there are match payments....

There are match payments. I dont think anyone said there wasnt. And most of the performance based contract are out the door now that Matthew Drain has gone.

so there or arent match payments plugger?
u said there wernt or you just said kosi wasnt on them?
just be clear

[dragit]

Pretty sure the guys on bigger contracts don't get 'match day payments' they are more for the younger & lesser lights... Performance payments are a different kettle.

Not much point paying players like roo & Lenny extra for getting a game, it's not like they are at risk of being dropped.