any Saints historians?

[Elvis]

Matty Lappin, bottom row, second from left

[loris]

Just love seeing piccies with the old grandstands in the background at the Junction Oval. Very evocative and stirs old memories for me of the joy of supporting the Saints at The Junction Oval.

The wooden stand where the Saints changeroom was under, the noise would be deafening when the team ran out and all the supporters stamped their feet on the wooden floor, in unison

Behind that stand was a van selling donuts............................ the best donuts in the world IMHO. The jam would scold my tongue, and I would be licking sugar from my fingers all match.

We kids would scout around for old cans to stand on to watch the match.

There used to be 2 rows of wooden bench seating around the ground. In the St Kilda members/supporters area, all the old grannies, who must have got up at sparrow fart, grabbed all the seats. They would sit there all day, knitting. They were a fierce, heroic mob those ladies. Would never hear a bad word against 'their boys'. It was usually red, white and black wool. So I imagine they were knitting scarves, beanies and gloves for loved family members.

I go back to the early 1950's and there we no such things as commercially made footy scarves then. Had to knit your own club gear

Mainly the purchased commercial club colours worn were, rosettes, little kewpie dolls with r. w & b ribbons, plus crepe paper steamers for throwing. Everything was so simple. Of course you could buy the club guernsey and footy socks. They were very coarse wool and rather itchy on small kiddies tender skins. Many a kid had home knitted footy jumpers though.................. knitted with plenty of love and passion by a mum, aunty or grannie.

Games started from about 9.00am in the morning - the Thirds, then the Seconds, during the last quarter of the Seconds the excitement would start to build for the main match. Real nail biting atmosphere would descend on the ground................... even though we hardly ever won a match.

Kids were allowed on the ground to kick footies. Mainly the big kids had leather Sherrins. Us little ones had footy records rolled and tied up with a piece of string to kick around. I was a 'tom boy' as a little girl, so I used to jump the fence and kick the footy too. Very few little girls used to engage in rough and tumble with the boys then....wasn't encouraged............ not this girl, my kicking and handballing & tackling skills were better than most boys my age & size, even if I not so humbly say so myself. Excellent stab pass I was, real low daisy cutters that never misssed their mark!!!!!! It was great showing off your skills to all the adult Saint supporters watching us kids, waiting for the main match to start.

When the umps walked out, the siren would sound and all the kids would clamber back over the fence to their spots. We were so well behaved, knew you would be in for a telling off from supporters if you didn't get off the ground immediately.

It was great to go out on the ground at 3/4 time and hear the coach rant & rave. Suprisingly some of the footy players smoked during the 3/4 time break!!

All so different to today, were everything is so controlled and stage managed and audio/visual systems are blasting advertising at you incessantly.

That's progress I guess.

[St Loxton]

You are a historian Loris, thanks for sharing those memories.

[avid]

Just love seeing piccies with the old grandstands in the background at the Junction Oval. Very evocative and stirs old memories for me of the joy of supporting the Saints at The Junction Oval.
.

Loris, this is a wonderful account of something most of us, sadly, never experienced -- St Kilda playing at its St Kilda Junction true home ground. (At least I saw the Saints there several times when it was Fitzroy's.)

I've been involved in architectural heritage for quite a long time. Twenty years ago I wrote a report to the St Kilda City Council recommending that ALL the remaining brick structures of the Junction Oval -- the surrounding wall, the gates, the old ticket booths and turnstiles,etc, and not just the two main grandsatnds -- should be heritage protected, so that the whole ground could be kept as the sort of 'sacred site' that your memories pay testiment to. -- Not just a couple of isolated stands plus one beautiful piece of turf, but a whole, 'ancient', gladiatiorial enclosure, a site that would bear witness to all the intricate footy culture that had gone on there for generations.

The Council thought otherwise, believing that the ground had to be "returned to the people" -- opened up so its walls would no longer "exclude" the public, and so it would be absorbed back into the surrounding parkland, for dog walking, "visual amenity", etc. (This despite the fact that people could already walk their dog into the ground through the open gates at any time.)

So Council allowed them to pull down all the old walls and almost all the other associated structures (there's one set of brick ticket booths still left) -- and opened the ground up so it could be traversed by casual stollers just like the rest of Albert Park.

A little while later they put up a 9 foot high cyclone wire fence all the way around it.

[avid]

And Loris I just love your description of yourself kicking those footy records around.

[mcadam05]

some more for you Loris

1953 team




late 50's Ian Synman

[White Winmar]

Thanks for those memories, Loris. For those of us too young to remember the Junction Oval days, it evokes a strong sense of longing. I know it's probably the mist of nostalgia clouding my judgement, but I'd give anything for an "old-fashioned" day at Moorabbin. Kick to kick on the ground, ressies in the build up, banter in the animal enclosure and slapping your heroes on the back after the final siren. Gone forever, unfortunately. Except in our memories.

[plugger66]

Thanks for those memories, Loris. For those of us too young to remember the Junction Oval days, it evokes a strong sense of longing. I know it's probably the mist of nostalgia clouding my judgement, but I'd give anything for an "old-fashioned" day at Moorabbin. Kick to kick on the ground, ressies in the build up, banter in the animal enclosure and slapping your heroes on the back after the final siren. Gone forever, unfortunately. Except in our memories.

There were a few bad things at moorabbin as well. No cover from the rain, the toilets and if you stood scoreboard side and if a fight started up the top it would become a rolling fight and when you are 8 years old standing on your dads tubes he has drunk that can be quite scary.

[White Winmar]

Thanks for those memories, Loris. For those of us too young to remember the Junction Oval days, it evokes a strong sense of longing. I know it's probably the mist of nostalgia clouding my judgement, but I'd give anything for an "old-fashioned" day at Moorabbin. Kick to kick on the ground, ressies in the build up, banter in the animal enclosure and slapping your heroes on the back after the final siren. Gone forever, unfortunately. Except in our memories.

There were a few bad things at moorabbin as well. No cover from the rain, the toilets and if you stood scoreboard side and if a fight started up the top it would become a rolling fight and when you are 8 years old standing on your dads tubes he has drunk that can be quite scary.

That was my point P66. Nostalgia is all about selective memory. It's nice to reminisce, though. BTW, those toilets at Moorabbin should've been closed by order of the UN. May as well have just put a couple of troughs out in the open. That would've been more hygenic.

[st.byron]

Thanks for those memories, Loris. For those of us too young to remember the Junction Oval days, it evokes a strong sense of longing. I know it's probably the mist of nostalgia clouding my judgement, but I'd give anything for an "old-fashioned" day at Moorabbin. Kick to kick on the ground, ressies in the build up, banter in the animal enclosure and slapping your heroes on the back after the final siren. Gone forever, unfortunately. Except in our memories.

Me too WW. And yes thanks Loris for such a great post.
I haven't been to the footy for a couple of years now, but the commercialism and sanitisation of the modern game makes me irritated and sad. I too loved standing in the outer, probably on a couple of empty tins (make sure they weren't full of piss) or in later years, balancing on my motorbike helmet. All the other games going on at the same time and the progressive scores going up on the scoreboard and diligently marking down the scores in the record. Keeping an accurate count of all Saints scores in the record too. Shame if it rained too much, because stopping the record from going soggy was a challenge. And oh yes, kick to kick on the ground was essential.

I used to love standing near the forward pocket at Moorabbin, just around from the cheer squad goals. Great memories of going to the 'real footy'. No bloody ground announcer telling me the score the moment the siren sounds (I farkin well know the score you twat, I've been watching the game!!!!!) and blasting ads for Toyota, Maccas or any other shyte. Just the footy and everyone out for the afternoon enjoying the atmosphere.

And Loris, funny you should mention players smoking at 3/4 time. I also used to love going to the VFA on Sunday afternoons as a kid and teenager. We followed Waverley (red and black stripes) and one of my enduring memories of following them is watching Barry Allan, the captain and ruckman, covered in mud, with an orange slice in one hand and a fag in the other, listening to the coach's 3/4 time address. I used to love the VFA too. Grass roots footy. We used to go to all the different suburban grounds. Preston, Coburg, Dandenong, Port, Prahran - and as a kid from Glen Waverley it was like going to another city altogether.

[plugger66]

Thanks for those memories, Loris. For those of us too young to remember the Junction Oval days, it evokes a strong sense of longing. I know it's probably the mist of nostalgia clouding my judgement, but I'd give anything for an "old-fashioned" day at Moorabbin. Kick to kick on the ground, ressies in the build up, banter in the animal enclosure and slapping your heroes on the back after the final siren. Gone forever, unfortunately. Except in our memories.

Me too WW. And yes thanks Loris for such a great post.
I haven't been to the footy for a couple of years now, but the commercialism and sanitisation of the modern game makes me irritated and sad. I too loved standing in the outer, probably on a couple of empty tins (make sure they weren't full of piss) or in later years, balancing on my motorbike helmet. All the other games going on at the same time and the progressive scores going up on the scoreboard and diligently marking down the scores in the record. Keeping an accurate count of all Saints scores in the record too. Shame if it rained too much, because stopping the record from going soggy was a challenge. And oh yes, kick to kick on the ground was essential.

I used to love standing near the forward pocket at Moorabbin, just around from the cheer squad goals. Great memories of going to the 'real footy'. No bloody ground announcer telling me the score the moment the siren sounds (I farkin well know the score you twat, I've been watching the game!!!!!) and blasting ads for Toyota, Maccas or any other shyte. Just the footy and everyone out for the afternoon enjoying the atmosphere.

And Loris, funny you should mention players smoking at 3/4 time. I also used to love going to the VFA on Sunday afternoons as a kid and teenager. We followed Waverley (red and black stripes) and one of my enduring memories of following them is watching Barry Allan, the captain and ruckman, covered in mud, with an orange slice in one hand and a fag in the other, listening to the coach's 3/4 time address. I used to love the VFA too. Grass roots footy. We used to go to all the different suburban grounds. Preston, Coburg, Dandenong, Port, Prahran - and as a kid from Glen Waverley it was like going to another city altogether.

Who was Waverley's great FF. Was it Con Angelis or something similar. Kicked 22 in a game once. My best friends brother played for them as well, Steven Barnes. He was good solid rover.

[st.byron]

Who was Waverley's great FF. Was it Con Angelis or something similar. Kicked 22 in a game once. My best friends brother played for them as well, Steven Barnes. He was good solid rover.

Peter Angelis. He kicked 23 against Sunshine one afternoon. He was a barrel of a guy. Really strong and a good pair of hands. I wasn't there though - was in the early 80's I think.
Before Peter Angelis there was Brent Ziegler. Watched him kick 16 against Yarraville at Waverley one day. Yarraville were hopeless and their fullback was a guy called John Janes. Me and a bunch of other kids taunted him mercilessly all afternoon about having a girl's name and as the goals mounted our taunting became more and more intense. In the end during the fourth quarter he came right up to the fence to collect the ball to kick it in after a point. We were all standing against the fence and as he straightened up from picking up the ball he yelled 'Boo!!!" at us and we all jumped about 20 feet back. We were quiet after that.

My love of local footy has never dimmed. It must have been 2002 or 2003 I went to a Port Colts vs Spotswood game at Port. Micky Martyn was full back for Spotty and there was a Port guy standing right on the fence next to me giving him heaps. Micky came up to the fence, again to pick the ball up and grunted at him, "You wanna come out here and have a go or you want me to come out there and thump ya?" The look on the guy's face was priceless.

[loris]

some more for you Loris

1953 team




late 50's Ian Synman

Thanks mcadam05...................... lovely to see a piccie of another one of my favourites - 'Chesty' Mulhall - actually never knew what his first name was, may have been Ken. He is top row to the left of 'Coco' Roberts. Brian Gleeson to the right of 'Coco' was another of our Brownlow medalists. Roger used to wear his number on his guernsey. I'm going to have a great time putting names to faces, might take me awhile. I think it's Graham Minihan front centre.

Oh an Chesty Mulhall begat a great athlete.................. daughter.......... Gail Mulhall, an Olympian, shot putter.......... or was it discuss. Think it was the former.

[Majority]

Wrong team, but this was taken at the Junction Oval.
The Lake Premiership (St.Kilda v South Melbourne) brought out the people, the ground is packed to the rafters.
It would not be allowed today.

http://digital.slv.vic.gov.au/view/acti ... ePid2=true


looks as though it may be a dud link.......try this one, and scroll down the page to the link. (if anyone can post the photo..........go for it.)

http://trove.nla.gov.au/picture/result? ... kilda&s=60

[loris]

Just love seeing piccies with the old grandstands in the background at the Junction Oval. Very evocative and stirs old memories for me of the joy of supporting the Saints at The Junction Oval.
.

Loris, this is a wonderful account of something most of us, sadly, never experienced -- St Kilda playing at its St Kilda Junction true home ground. (At least I saw the Saints there several times when it was Fitzroy's.)

I've been involved in architectural heritage for quite a long time. Twenty years ago I wrote a report to the St Kilda City Council recommending that ALL the remaining brick structures of the Junction Oval -- the surrounding wall, the gates, the old ticket booths and turnstiles,etc, and not just the two main grandsatnds -- should be heritage protected, so that the whole ground could be kept as the sort of 'sacred site' that your memories pay testiment to. -- Not just a couple of isolated stands plus one beautiful piece of turf, but a whole, 'ancient', gladiatiorial enclosure, a site that would bear witness to all the intricate footy culture that had gone on there for generations.

The Council thought otherwise, believing that the ground had to be "returned to the people" -- opened up so its walls would no longer "exclude" the public, and so it would be absorbed back into the surrounding parkland, for dog walking, "visual amenity", etc. (This despite the fact that people could already walk their dog into the ground through the open gates at any time.)

So Council allowed them to pull down all the old walls and almost all the other associated structures (there's one set of brick ticket booths still left) -- and opened the ground up so it could be traversed by casual stollers just like the rest of Albert Park.


A little while later they put up a 9 foot high cyclone wire fence all the way around it.

Avid........................tell me about it, I've been a bit of an aggitator over the years for heritage listing in various tourism areas, so that tourism doesn't despoil the very things that attract tourists there in the first place.

And I have found some councils just don't get the concept of ' A Sense of Place'.

They think if they alter, tinker around with a significant place a little it will still retain that original 'sense of place' for the future generations to use it but, in a different manner. Goes against the concept totally.

Then as you highlight, they replace a meaningful structure, ie the surrounding brick wall with such wonderful heritage 'Hawthorn' bricks, with a cyclone wire fence So totally out of sympathy with the architectural site....so sad

I just hope those bricks were saved and not just crushed for landfill, that would have been real vandalism.

[Majority]

The Argus.
Saturday 13 June, 1925

NEW GRANDSTAND AT ST. KILDA FOOTBALL GROUND
The grandstand at the St. Kilda Football ground is now complete, and will shortly be opened officially.
It was used for the first time on Monday.


http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article ... tball+Club

[avid]

Just love seeing piccies with the old grandstands in the background at the Junction Oval. Very evocative and stirs old memories for me of the joy of supporting the Saints at The Junction Oval.
.

Loris, this is a wonderful account of something most of us, sadly, never experienced -- St Kilda playing at its St Kilda Junction true home ground. (At least I saw the Saints there several times when it was Fitzroy's.)

I've been involved in architectural heritage for quite a long time. Twenty years ago I wrote a report to the St Kilda City Council recommending that ALL the remaining brick structures of the Junction Oval -- the surrounding wall, the gates, the old ticket booths and turnstiles,etc, and not just the two main grandsatnds -- should be heritage protected, so that the whole ground could be kept as the sort of 'sacred site' that your memories pay testiment to. -- Not just a couple of isolated stands plus one beautiful piece of turf, but a whole, 'ancient', gladiatiorial enclosure, a site that would bear witness to all the intricate footy culture that had gone on there for generations.

The Council thought otherwise, believing that the ground had to be "returned to the people" -- opened up so its walls would no longer "exclude" the public, and so it would be absorbed back into the surrounding parkland, for dog walking, "visual amenity", etc. (This despite the fact that people could already walk their dog into the ground through the open gates at any time.)

So Council allowed them to pull down all the old walls and almost all the other associated structures (there's one set of brick ticket booths still left) -- and opened the ground up so it could be traversed by casual stollers just like the rest of Albert Park.


A little while later they put up a 9 foot high cyclone wire fence all the way around it.

Avid........................tell me about it, I've been a bit of an aggitator over the years for heritage listing in various tourism areas, so that tourism doesn't despoil the very things that attract tourists there in the first place.

And I have found some councils just don't get the concept of ' A Sense of Place'.

They think if they alter, tinker around with a significant place a little it will still retain that original 'sense of place' for the future generations to use it but, in a different manner. Goes against the concept totally.

Then as you highlight, they replace a meaningful structure, ie the surrounding brick wall with such wonderful heritage 'Hawthorn' bricks, with a cyclone wire fence So totally out of sympathy with the architectural site....so sad

I just hope those bricks were saved and not just crushed for landfill, that would have been real vandalism.

Very much my interests too! I've been dealing with the tourism / local authenticity conundrum for years. Sadly a 'a sense of place' is usually seen more as 'a sense of commercial opportunity'. I'd be interested to know how or where you've been "aggitating" Loris. These sort of things all seem really important to me. It's nice to know someone shares the same passions.

Are you an historian?

[loris]

some more for you Loris

1953 team




late 50's Ian Synman

Thanks mcadam05...................... lovely to see a piccie of another one of my favourites - 'Chesty' Mulhall - actually never knew what his first name was, may have been Ken. He is top row to the left of 'Coco' Roberts. Brian Gleeson to the right of 'Coco' was another of our Brownlow medalists. Roger used to wear his number on his guernsey. I'm going to have a great time putting names to faces, might take me awhile. I think it's Graham Minihan front centre.

Oh an Chesty Mulhall begat a great athlete.................. daughter.......... Gail Mulhall, an Olympian, shot putter.......... or was it discuss. Think it was the former.

Having difficulty putting names to faces here........... so long ago, and in my defence I was only 8 years old!!

Easy one is Coach: Col Williamson, also our great full-back and captain Keith Drinan to right of Col Williamson. He was the best exponent of the drop kick out from full-back that I have ever seen. So accurate, and would practically get to the centre of the ground each kick out.

Next to Keith Drinan, on his right is Jim McDonald (I think)

Back row second from the right is Bruce Phillips, next to Bruce Phillips on his left is Jim Ross.

And would you believe, I can't be sure about my heart -throb from those days, Peter Bennett (maybe I'm trying to block his image from my mind, because he never noticed this freckly faced little red-headed girl who used to continually pester him for his autograph ), but hazarding a guess, Peter is end man back-row, right of picture (next to Bruce Phillips).

Can't for the life of me recall the name of the player, second from the left, back row.................... on tip of my tongue but it's frustrating I can't spit it out!! Thought it might have been Brian Walsh, but the more I think of it he would have started playing with the Saints towards the latter part of the 1950's.

The earlier one's I mentioned Mulhall, Roberts, Gleeson & Minihan are definites. I'll get my sister Helen to look at the photo at the weekend, she's 5 years older than me so she will possibly recall the faces more than I can.

Stinger..................... you are a year younger than me and you used to go into the change rooms, can you recall any of them? Or were you living in Tassie in 1953?

If I had a list of the players who were playing in 1953, I'm sure I could put more names to the faces.

[mcadam05]

Going by the fact Gleeson was in his first year and he played 8 of the nine home games and in those 8 games Roberts only played in the same team five times we can place the pic before rd 1,7,11,13, or 16 once we work out the game we can name the whole team


here is the players list from '53

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/1953.html#15

[bergholt]

There were a few bad things at moorabbin as well. No cover from the rain, the toilets and if you stood scoreboard side and if a fight started up the top it would become a rolling fight and when you are 8 years old standing on your dads tubes he has drunk that can be quite scary.

Yeah, I used my first urinal at Moorabbin - luckily things have only improved since then!

And I saw my first few fights there as well. Good times.

[loris]

some more for you Loris

1953 team

Thanks mcadam05...................... lovely to see a piccie of another one of my favourites - 'Chesty' Mulhall - actually never knew what his first name was, may have been Ken. He is top row to the left of 'Coco' Roberts. Brian Gleeson to the right of 'Coco' was another of our Brownlow medalists. Roger used to wear his number on his guernsey. I'm going to have a great time putting names to faces, might take me awhile. I think it's Graham Minihan front centre.

Oh an Chesty Mulhall begat a great athlete.................. daughter.......... Gail Mulhall, an Olympian, shot putter.......... or was it discuss. Think it was the former.

Having difficulty putting names to faces here........... so long ago, and in my defence I was only 8 years old!!

Easy one is Coach: Col Williamson, also our great full-back and captain Keith Drinan to right of Col Williamson. He was the best exponent of the drop kick out from full-back that I have ever seen. So accurate, and would practically get to the centre of the ground each kick out.

Next to Keith Drinan, on his right is Jim McDonald (I think)

Back row second from the right is Bruce Phillips, next to Bruce Phillips on his left is Jim Ross.

And would you believe, I can't be sure about my heart -throb from those days, Peter Bennett (maybe I'm trying to block his image from my mind, because he never noticed this freckly faced little red-headed girl who used to continually pester him for his autograph ), but hazarding a guess, Peter is end man back-row, right of picture (next to Bruce Phillips).

Can't for the life of me recall the name of the player, second from the left, back row.................... on tip of my tongue but it's frustrating I can't spit it out!! Thought it might have been Brian Walsh, but the more I think of it he would have started playing with the Saints towards the latter part of the 1950's.

The earlier one's I mentioned Mulhall, Roberts, Gleeson & Minihan are definites. I'll get my sister Helen to look at the photo at the weekend, she's 5 years older than me so she will possibly recall the faces more than I can.

Stinger..................... you are a year younger than me and you used to go into the change rooms, can you recall any of them? Or were you living in Tassie in 1953?

If I had a list of the players who were playing in 1953, I'm sure I could put more names to the faces.

Thanks for the list of names mcadam:
Now some more faces I think I can marry up with those names.

Ray Houston back row, 6th to right beside Brian Gleeson.
Billy Linger, 2nd from right, centre row. Billy was a good little rover, from Tassie I think.
Neville Linney, end player, right hand side, centre row. He was a star, so polished. Great HBF, very fast, excellent kick into attack....... ala Aussie Jones.
Alan Le Nepveu, 2nd from left, back row (That was the name I was having trouble recalling)
Harold Davies, could be right side front row.
Bob Watt is either the fair headed bloke on the end, left side centre row, or he could be the fair headed fellow who sitting beside him. I think he is the former, as I can recall Bob Watt wearing a bandage on his knee all the time.

Can't pick up Bruce Mclennan in that side. Knew him very well in latter years, he was a detective in a same squad as my late husband. Saw Bruce in a cafe in Fremantle around 1997, we chatted on for agaes about the old days at the Junction Oval and our years at Russell Street Police Headquarters. Bruce left to play for Collingwood. I was absolutely shocked to read a couple of years ago that Bruce was convicted of rape of a minor (boy) many years earlier. As he was in advanced stages of dementia by the trial I think he ended up with a susppended or light sentence. Bruce had been a wonderful family man, just shows it's hard to pick pedaphiles. Can't place him in the photo so he may not have been playing.

Another name I can't match to the faces is Don Howell. I used to think he was OK, purely because he was a blood nut like me and had freckles!!!!!

Dave Bland is another name that rings loud in my mind, I can recall Dad saying he was Bland by name, but not bland with his footy smarts. Maybe these ones I remember but cannot find were not playing the day the photo was taken.

I'll keep focussing on the photo and see if any more of these names and faces can marry up in my possibly fallible memory.

Isn't it a pity one of Sainstational's long time original posters, Dougie passed away last year. He was more ancient than I, and had an incredible memory for players of that era. I always used to look forward to his posts of yesteryear.

[loris]

Very much my interests too! I've been dealing with the tourism / local authenticity conundrum for years. Sadly a 'a sense of place' is usually seen more as 'a sense of commercial opportunity'. I'd be interested to know how or where you've been "aggitating" Loris. These sort of things all seem really important to me. It's nice to know someone shares the same passions.

Are you an historian?

No not an historian avid................. 'though did a minor in history in a degree many moons ago!!!!!!

Spent many years of lecturing in TAFE's and Uni in Hospitality and Tourism Management, before retirement. Tourism Development and the Impacts of Tourism were my primary areas.

Yes an anti-tourism lecturer in Tourism Management Colleges................. students need a well rounded education IMHO...... as they do get a lot of the pro development perspective, so need the balance

I'm more into the environmental & social impacts of tourism development, than the built environment, however they are so intertwined it's impossible to disregard one area to the detriment of another.

A major 'aggitating' that started off for me personally over architectural heritage was in the township of Wandiligong (near Bright).

My late husband's ancestoral home was the first private brick building built in the Valley during the 1860's, plus we had concerns about the Old Library, how the land would be privatised and eventually sub-divided and sold for housing. Then what next, the primary school, the churches?

Some of the housing construction in the valley in the 1980's was incongruent to the historical architecture remaining in this once significant gold mining area.
People were erecting revolting triple fronted brick veener houses, mainly holiday houses. Why did they want to bring boring suburbia to this valley? Truly some of the old inhabitants still living there at the time, I really think they didn't know the wheel had been invented!!! They kept thinking people would go away eventually and leave them at peace in their valley. We knew that would not happen as the nearby ski fields had been developing ad nauseum and Wandi was in the sights of many for it is a hop, step & a jump over the valley to Harrietville which was last town on the route to the ski fileds.

It took a bit of effort to get the locals united, at times our action group never thought compromise was attainable. You know the old divide, some didn't want the town changed, others could see their land and properties as a cash bonanza.

Upshot....... the whole valley is now registered with the National Trust as a classified landscape with registered historical buildings, with suitable, commonsense restrictions placed on inappropriate buildings and developments.

If you haven't been to that part of the Victoria................. worth a trip, only 6kms out of Bright.

Too many environmental stories to mention that I have been part of over the years. Claim to fame.............. I was padlocked with Bob Brown et al to a tree during the 'Gordon below Franklin' struggle. I found out what it was like to by bundled into the back of a paddy wagon Some how my summons never materialised.

Very much still part of an action group today in my current location in WA. Being in an old suburb, right on the Swan River within walking distance of Perth CBD, we monitor closely the Council's development policies & projects. As the gateway suburb to Perth (Burswood Casino area), developers are championing at the bit to bite into a little slice of our underveloped river vantage. So the battle never ends, only goes quiet for awhile.

Little battles we win are fantastic, ie saving our swimmng pool from being taken and turned into residential housing.

When we took the Council on over that one, I didn't realise the affection that not only locals had for that pool, but so many big movers and shakers in WA. It seems anyone who was anybody in WA learn't to swim at Somerset Pool. Many ex-olympians joined our battle, from interstate & overseas, and being an interloper (Eastern Stater) I hadn't truly understood the significance of this old aging outdoor 2 pool complex until we started our campaign.............. it sure was a 'sense of place' for so many different groups over it's history.

Sure we had to compromise and lost one of the ourdoor pools ( an historically significant one, not measured by metres but by yards), to one of those modern, barnish, indoor gym/water complexes. Filled with noisy music. OK, that suits the needs of many in our community.
However, we retained our delightful old fashioned 50 metre heated outdoor pool, with it's original tiling It's surrounded by the most magnificient old trees, that have all the native birds roosting there all the time, and providing a chorus to the rythmic sound of our slap, slap, splap on the water as we lap swimmers follow that black line up an down continuously. Every year we have families of duck's bring their ducklings to swim alongside us in the lanes. We don't mind the odd bit of duck poo, better than swimming inside where kiddies piddle when they hit the water. Then when swallows are nesting, they swoop around us all the time. Plus you can see the sunrise in the morning as you swim and the sunset at night. You seem to be at one with nature in this pool. To think this all could have been lost to residential housing and greedy developers would have been rubbing their hands all their way to the bank. It just takes a little bit of effort to get people power going. What could have been lost to a community is now a gain and a hub for a community.

I'd better put a halt to this avid..................... and try and remember some more names to go with the faces of that 1953 team.

Hey a good read for you, avid - Kate Grenville's 'The Idea of Perfection'.

It's a novel about an old wooden bridge in a country town in Australia that is dying. For the town to have a future some think tourists are its only hope. The bridge is what links the town and divides it. Some think that tourists will love this old authentic bridge, it only needs to be repaired. Other townsfolk want to tear it down and modernise the approach to the town. Has another element to the story, the female historian v's the male engineer. Opposing forces. Great read IMHO

[White Winmar]

Is the Wandiligong pub still packing them in on a Friday night, Loris?

[avid]

Very much my interests too! I've been dealing with the tourism / local authenticity conundrum for years. Sadly a 'a sense of place' is usually seen more as 'a sense of commercial opportunity'. I'd be interested to know how or where you've been "aggitating" Loris. These sort of things all seem really important to me. It's nice to know someone shares the same passions.

Are you an historian?

No not an historian avid................. 'though did a minor in history in a degree many moons ago!!!!!!

Spent many years of lecturing in TAFE's and Uni in Hospitality and Tourism Management, before retirement. Tourism Development and the Impacts of Tourism were my primary areas.

Yes an anti-tourism lecturer in Tourism Management Colleges................. students need a well rounded education IMHO...... as they do get a lot of the pro development perspective, so need the balance

I'm more into the environmental & social impacts of tourism development, than the built environment, however they are so intertwined it's impossible to disregard one area to the detriment of another.

A major 'aggitating' that started off for me personally over architectural heritage was in the township of Wandiligong (near Bright).

My late husband's ancestoral home was the first private brick building built in the Valley during the 1860's, plus we had concerns about the Old Library, how the land would be privatised and eventually sub-divided and sold for housing. Then what next, the primary school, the churches?

Some of the housing construction in the valley in the 1980's was incongruent to the historical architecture remaining in this once significant gold mining area.
People were erecting revolting triple fronted brick veener houses, mainly holiday houses. Why did they want to bring boring suburbia to this valley? Truly some of the old inhabitants still living there at the time, I really think they didn't know the wheel had been invented!!! They kept thinking people would go away eventually and leave them at peace in their valley. We knew that would not happen as the nearby ski fields had been developing ad nauseum and Wandi was in the sights of many for it is a hop, step & a jump over the valley to Harrietville which was last town on the route to the ski fileds.

It took a bit of effort to get the locals united, at times our action group never thought compromise was attainable. You know the old divide, some didn't want the town changed, others could see their land and properties as a cash bonanza.

Upshot....... the whole valley is now registered with the National Trust as a classified landscape with registered historical buildings, with suitable, commonsense restrictions placed on inappropriate buildings and developments.

If you haven't been to that part of the Victoria................. worth a trip, only 6kms out of Bright.

Too many environmental stories to mention that I have been part of over the years. Claim to fame.............. I was padlocked with Bob Brown et al to a tree during the 'Gordon below Franklin' struggle. I found out what it was like to by bundled into the back of a paddy wagon Some how my summons never materialised.

Very much still part of an action group today in my current location in WA. Being in an old suburb, right on the Swan River within walking distance of Perth CBD, we monitor closely the Council's development policies & projects. As the gateway suburb to Perth (Burswood Casino area), developers are championing at the bit to bite into a little slice of our underveloped river vantage. So the battle never ends, only goes quiet for awhile.

Little battles we win are fantastic, ie saving our swimmng pool from being taken and turned into residential housing.

When we took the Council on over that one, I didn't realise the affection that not only locals had for that pool, but so many big movers and shakers in WA. It seems anyone who was anybody in WA learn't to swim at Somerset Pool. Many ex-olympians joined our battle, from interstate & overseas, and being an interloper (Eastern Stater) I hadn't truly understood the significance of this old aging outdoor 2 pool complex until we started our campaign.............. it sure was a 'sense of place' for so many different groups over it's history.

Sure we had to compromise and lost one of the ourdoor pools ( an historically significant one, not measured by metres but by yards), to one of those modern, barnish, indoor gym/water complexes. Filled with noisy music. OK, that suits the needs of many in our community.
However, we retained our delightful old fashioned 50 metre heated outdoor pool, with it's original tiling It's surrounded by the most magnificient old trees, that have all the native birds roosting there all the time, and providing a chorus to the rythmic sound of our slap, slap, splap on the water as we lap swimmers follow that black line up an down continuously. Every year we have families of duck's bring their ducklings to swim alongside us in the lanes. We don't mind the odd bit of duck poo, better than swimming inside where kiddies piddle when they hit the water. Then when swallows are nesting, they swoop around us all the time. Plus you can see the sunrise in the morning as you swim and the sunset at night. You seem to be at one with nature in this pool. To think this all could have been lost to residential housing and greedy developers would have been rubbing their hands all their way to the bank. It just takes a little bit of effort to get people power going. What could have been lost to a community is now a gain and a hub for a community.

I'd better put a halt to this avid..................... and try and remember some more names to go with the faces of that 1953 team.

Hey a good read for you, avid - Kate Grenville's 'The Idea of Perfection'.

It's a novel about an old wooden bridge in a country town in Australia that is dying. For the town to have a future some think tourists are its only hope. The bridge is what links the town and divides it. Some think that tourists will love this old authentic bridge, it only needs to be repaired. Other townsfolk want to tear it down and modernise the approach to the town. Has another element to the story, the female historian v's the male engineer. Opposing forces. Great read IMHO

Gee, you are an amazing trooper Loris!

We have quite a few parallels -- though I think you've done far better than me:
I once did a report on facilities for the future cultural tourism in Bright -- 6km from Wandiligong, as you say -- so I know the area vaguely. Same issues.
I've fought against the dumb commercialsation of a swimming pool too -- the St Kilda Sea Baths. Met with considerably less success!
My biggest campaign was saving the Espy Hotel. It's still pumping out rock'n'roll on the Esplanade in pretty good style, so we're reasonably happy with that one.
I'll have a look the Kate Grenville's book. Sounds like it's written about Barwon Heads!

Great to hear your reminiscences.
Have we just hijacked this post?


Back to those photos.
When did Eric Guy start playing? My dad always said he had legs like treetrunks.

[loris]

Gee, you are an amazing trooper Loris!

We have quite a few parallels -- though I think you've done far better than me:
I once did a report on facilities for the future cultural tourism in Bright -- 6km from Wandiligong, as you say -- so I know the area vaguely. Same issues.
I've fought against the dumb commercialsation of a swimming pool too -- the St Kilda Sea Baths. Met with considerably less success!
My biggest campaign was saving the Espy Hotel. It's still pumping out rock'n'roll on the Esplanade in pretty good style, so we're reasonably happy with that one.
I'll have a look the Kate Grenville's book. Sounds like it's written about Barwon Heads!

Great to hear your reminiscences.
Have we just hijacked this post?


Back to those photos.
When did Eric Guy start playing? My dad always said he had legs like treetrunks.

'avid'................................ before I get to the Eric Guy question..................... Thanks for the trooper compliment, think I'll get out my ABBA collection and flounce around to 'Super Trooper'

However, I'm sure I have many decades of age over you. You'll catch up and pass my 'playing record' in the fight to retain a modicum of authenticity with our links to the past, to slow the 'juggernaut of progress' from careering at times out of control too much ove cultural values and icons.

Wow some very impressive projects you have been involed on. Agree - sad about the St Kilda Sea Baths. I 'dips me lid' to you on the Espy.

WE needed your talents here a number of years ago. There is a wonderful old art deco pub (The Raffles) on a bend on the banks of the Swan River. Occupying a fantastic site, looking back down the river to Perth's skyline........ a truly magnificient view. Again, the Raffles Hotel is an institution, I think most home grown Perthites had their initiating drink at the Raffles. For years the battle raged over re-development of Raffles and the site. Developers could see nothing but $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Most of the facade of this magnificient art deco pub remained which is a real blessing. However the interior, retains no charm, all gentrified, one could be in any modern bar anywhere............ that bland sameness.

To add insult to injury to this grande ole dame of a pub, on the remaining land, a multi-storied phallic symbol block of multi-million dollar appartments were developed now tower over the Raffles.....................architectual vandalism

Further reading for you.............. your mention of Barwon Heads reminded me of another wonderful writer who hails from down the south-west coast of Victoria.

His name is Gregory Day. He's fighting the good fight, via his novels, of awaking in residents the need to maintain vigilance over their elected representatives on what changes they will accept when trying to lure tourism to their towns. The novels are a trilogy, however can be stand alone. All set in a coastal town, that is increasingly having to face the problems of the popularity of their once sleepy hollow to tourism.

The first novel is: 'The Patron Saint of Eels', delightful little read, I leanrt so much about eels and their life cycle from this novel. Essentially its about the Council wanting to dredge the river mouth to the sea for a marina to attract more affluent tourists in launches, yachts. The impact this has on eels is the main issue of the novel. I was totally captured by this book. Day is an artist, poet, and songwriter so you can imagine his writing style invokes all your senses.

The second novel is: 'Ron McCoy's Sea of Diamonds', same town, same townsfolk. This one is more about a local farmer & neighbouring farmer. At different stages in their life cycles, hence differing needs. Farms located on beautiful part of the town, looking down the hills onto the ocean. Enter stage right........... the local real estate agent - you know what he can envisage!! This novel perceptively examines the differing value systems in small town life, guilt, greed and coping with change. On finishing the book, I thought what an appropriate title.

The third novel is: 'The Grand Hotel'............................... here is a bit from the backcover blurb: ' Robbed of his vest for life by the absurb innovations of his local council, including knocking down the only pub in his beloved home town and roofing over a section of the creek to protect swimmers from the rain...........'

Now 'avid', isn't that just what you would get your teeth into with your modus operandi?

This book is very witty, bawdy and blokey. All about reviving the pub and fighting the council and other powerful agencies they have as allies.

'Avid', Gregory Day is a real gem of a writer and a very passionate person about cultural authenticity. I got to chat to him for quite some time last year at The Perth Writers Festival, he was so illuminating.

There is a delightful part of 'The Grand Hotel' - the 'Irridex' - it is introduced in a very novel way by a talking urinal in the gents dunny. It's the main character's way of educating locals about the subtle impacts of tourism on their town. Every time a bloke peed in the urinal it would start up, broadcasting to the 'pisser' the Index of Local Irritation by Tourism.

Oh if anyone else other than 'avid' is reading this post.....this is a bit of Tourism 101 for you.... the 'Irridex' is the 5 stages that locals go through when a tourists start finding the local's town/country/culture etc. something desirable.

The stages are : Euphoria -------------> Apathy ------------> Irritation -------------->Antagonism-------------> Resignation

Now 'avid' to return to Eric Guy Can't recall when he actually started but I would hazard a guess at about the late 1950's, possibly 1959.

Your Dad was correct, he did have legs like tree trunks........... knarled old oak trees.............. but very bent. He was as bandy as all get out.............. a pig could run right through his legs.

He would just run in a straight line for the ball. Lo and behold anyone who got between him and the ball. As Bobby Skilton found out with Ecca's infamous shirt front on him. Skilts nearly didn't have to be taken off on a stretcher, the shirtfront practically knocked him straight off the ground into the changerooms. It sends a shudder through my mind thinking of it now. There was complete silence when it happened, then the crowd errupted. Still it was all in the laws of the game.

He had a thatch of dead straight fair hair that would bob up and down on his head, getting quicker as the momentum of his run increased.

#19............. a true blue Sainter. A Yabby Jean's saying about Eric Guy was, "Guy was tougher than a piece of boarding house steak".

Now I suppose there are some younger posters here that wouldn't even know what a boarding house is........................ boarding houses are also now nearly relics of the past.

Do you think that can be my next project 'avid'? Something to keep me active in my dotage, a drive to .................... bring back authentic boarding houses