Illicit drug loophole - which club?

[joffaboy]

The loophole in the policy needs to be closed immediately. Any administrators found to be using the loophole need to be exposed and removed from the game. Any players using the loophole need to have any potential strikes added to their records. I think this whole sad story has now gone that far that the TRUTH needs to come out. To not allow/let the truth out now is only damaging the brands of the AFL and the Clubs !!

I dont believe this for a second.

If a club finds out a player is on the gear and that player fesses up, why should that confidence and truth be penalised?

Do you want players lying to their club and teammates?

The whole point of this recreational drug testing is to help young people not get too far into illicit drug taking, not to puinish them for things that, lets face it, 90% of society try at their age.

This vindictive rage and judgemental attitude is not the way to help kids on the Benny Cousins path.

You all sound like Herald Sun readers on a vengeful campaign.

[plugger66]

As long as it's not us then I don't care. Plenty of rumors going around people saying I saw this bloke and he looked off his head and so and so has big late night parties all the time at his apartment and blah blah. I have heard rumors about one of our players but the rest are about other clubs. Heard plenty of bogus rumors though so who really knows? Demetriou will cover up the big stories and stars he can't have another Benny Cousins, Brownlow winner and premiership player being found out as it sends the wrong message to the youth that you can be one of the best in the sport yet still take party drugs on the weekend or on the off season and still be one of the best superstars in the game. The Travis Tuck stories and Lawrence Angwin and those types of cases they'll blurt to the public but I highly doubt that they'll suspend superstars. But maybe one day it will all come out just like Lance Armstrong and them. Although it is a different scenario taking performance enhancers to party drugs.

Yep AD will cover it up. What about the other people who know? As if it wouldnt get out before they have retired. And thats the reason I dont beleive people who say they have seen footballers use. No way would they do it in front of strangers. And I also agree totally with JB. Sorry about that JB. People need to remember this is voluntary. Not many other sports do this type of testing. Even olympians are immune from this testing.

[bergholt]

The loophole in the policy needs to be closed immediately. Any administrators found to be using the loophole need to be exposed and removed from the game. Any players using the loophole need to have any potential strikes added to their records. I think this whole sad story has now gone that far that the TRUTH needs to come out. To not allow/let the truth out now is only damaging the brands of the AFL and the Clubs !!

There is no loophole. Read my first post in this thread.

[SainterK]

I reckon Andy has had a glimpse of the figures...

He is preparing us for a massive rise this year.

Probably because of the big fuss they've made of the fairly low failed tests until now.

[Eastern]

The "loophole" as I understand it is;

When the drug testers turn up to test for RECREATIONAL DRUGS (not performance enhancing drugs) the player tells them and or the club doctor that he may have "accidently" taken an illicit substance. This is called SELF-REPORTING. When this occurs there is NO DRUG TEST CONDUCTED and NO STRIKE RECORDED. There is NO LIMIT to the number of times a player can do this. What is being alleged (more privately than publicly) is that one particular club/group of players from that club have been using this to avoid being tested or having strikes recorded against them.

The AFL have a policy that has rules and sanctions in place on this issue. If a player/group of players/club use any clauses in these rules/policies then in my mind THEY ARE USING A LOOPHOLE to avoid DETECTION/SANCTION !!

[Moods]

I went out on the 21st of December. It's fair to say I know one club which has about 5-6 players on the gear!
And 2 of these players REALLY shocked me.

Can we clarify what 'On the gear' means? To me it means taking performance Enhancing drugs. I've always thought of it as steroids. Now if it means taking 'rec drugs', big deal! I have mates who party harder than they should sometimes, and they reckon every other AFL footballer they see out uses drugs. Some have even asked my mates if they are carrying any. It's all a bit of a scene apparently. It used to piss me off hearing the stories, regardless whether it involved saints players or not, but the sad reality is that this is how many of the young blokes and girls party these days. I'm a bit switched off to it all now, and are surprised at how surprised everyone is about it. Having said all that I have zero sympathy for any player, saints or not, who gets done on 3 strikes. They are professional athletes - they run that gauntlet, tough luck. Out of the game you deserve to go.

[joffaboy]

The "loophole" as I understand it is;

When the drug testers turn up to test for RECREATIONAL DRUGS (not performance enhancing drugs) the player tells them and or the club doctor that he may have "accidently" taken an illicit substance. This is called SELF-REPORTING. When this occurs there is NO DRUG TEST CONDUCTED and NO STRIKE RECORDED. There is NO LIMIT to the number of times a player can do this. What is being alleged (more privately than publicly) is that one particular club/group of players from that club have been using this to avoid being tested or having strikes recorded against them.

The AFL have a policy that has rules and sanctions in place on this issue. If a player/group of players/club use any clauses in these rules/policies then in my mind THEY ARE USING A LOOPHOLE to avoid DETECTION/SANCTION !!

But they have been detected, by their own admission. Do you honestly think a club would sit back and just allow this to be the case for players if it was constantly happening?

Anyway rec drugs are not performance enhancing. This hysteria about dropping a couple of ekkies or smoking a bit of dope in the off season is incredible.

Surely we have learnt that prohibition doesn't work on rec drugs. Look at society, how is the "War on Drugs" going? We are flooded with prohibited drugs from coke, to herion, ice, and tonnes of dope.

To take this hard nosed attitude will just create more Benny Cousins type addicts who can avoid detection and then ruin their lives.

Stop looking at this as a point scoring exercise against some football club you dont like. Personally I hope they all get on the gear on gameday before every game against the Saints up to and including the Grand Final.

[SaintPav]

Look at society, how is the "War on Drugs" going?

The good old war on drugs. I remember..Didn't we win that one?

It went about as well as the "war on terror". A war on anything is a subtext for something else; usually meddling and political interference.

[saintbrat]

Demetriou said one of the key issues the AFL, clubs and the Players Association had to get right was footballers' work-life balance. The league is considering whether a longer off-season may help alleviate pressure.

''The obsession to succeed now at a football club, from the CEO to the coach to the sports scientist to the players … is incredible.'' he said..

''So when they're not at the club it's no wonder they have this release. Even when they're supposed to be on breaks they still train, they have watches strapped to their wrists to find out whether they're running. Illicit drug use and binge drinking are byproducts of a very disciplined environment, and I don't think we've got the balance right yet.''

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/afl-m ... z2J7vBUzGC

[Eastern]

The "loophole" as I understand it is;

When the drug testers turn up to test for RECREATIONAL DRUGS (not performance enhancing drugs) the player tells them and or the club doctor that he may have "accidently" taken an illicit substance. This is called SELF-REPORTING. When this occurs there is NO DRUG TEST CONDUCTED and NO STRIKE RECORDED. There is NO LIMIT to the number of times a player can do this. What is being alleged (more privately than publicly) is that one particular club/group of players from that club have been using this to avoid being tested or having strikes recorded against them.

The AFL have a policy that has rules and sanctions in place on this issue. If a player/group of players/club use any clauses in these rules/policies then in my mind THEY ARE USING A LOOPHOLE to avoid DETECTION/SANCTION !!

But they have been detected, by their own admission. Do you honestly think a club would sit back and just allow this to be the case for players if it was constantly happening?

Anyway rec drugs are not performance enhancing. This hysteria about dropping a couple of ekkies or smoking a bit of dope in the off season is incredible.

Surely we have learnt that prohibition doesn't work on rec drugs. Look at society, how is the "War on Drugs" going? We are flooded with prohibited drugs from coke, to herion, ice, and tonnes of dope.

To take this hard nosed attitude will just create more Benny Cousins type addicts who can avoid detection and then ruin their lives.

Stop looking at this as a point scoring exercise against some football club you dont like. Personally I hope they all get on the gear on gameday before every game against the Saints up to and including the Grand Final.

Lets not get confused between the policy and the loophole. The policy is based on sound medical advice. The loophole that allows SOME to avoid what the policy was designed for needs to be fixed !!

[joffaboy]

Lets not get confused between the policy and the loophole. The policy is based on sound medical advice. The loophole that allows SOME to avoid what the policy was designed for needs to be fixed !!

lets not get confused also with the "purpose of the policy and the policy itself.

It was designed and sold to the players as one of helping the players not punishing them.

If a player admits to rec drug use, I believe all clubs are responsible enough to help those players. It is in line with the quote saintbrat published from AD above.

This is about making better citizens, not punishment and vindictiveness.

[Eastern]

Lets not get confused between the policy and the loophole. The policy is based on sound medical advice. The loophole that allows SOME to avoid what the policy was designed for needs to be fixed !!

lets not get confused also with the "purpose of the policy and the policy itself.

It was designed and sold to the players as one of helping the players not punishing them.

If a player admits to rec drug use, I believe all clubs are responsible enough to help those players. It is in line with the quote saintbrat published from AD above.

This is about making better citizens, not punishment and vindictiveness.

I think when the story breaks you will find that it is a small number of players who have used this loophole on multiple occasions. I would think that was closer to encouraging the players than it was to helping them. This added to the fact that it can the player and the club doctor ONLY that know of the self-reporting. And, we all know that the better the player the more protection they are afforded by their club !!

[satchmo]

Lets not get confused between the policy and the loophole. The policy is based on sound medical advice. The loophole that allows SOME to avoid what the policy was designed for needs to be fixed !!

lets not get confused also with the "purpose of the policy and the policy itself.

It was designed and sold to the players as one of helping the players not punishing them.

If a player admits to rec drug use, I believe all clubs are responsible enough to help those players. It is in line with the quote saintbrat published from AD above.

This is about making better citizens, not punishment and vindictiveness.

I think when the story breaks you will find that it is a small number of players who have used this loophole on multiple occasions. I would think that was closer to encouraging the players than it was to helping them. This added to the fact that it can the player and the club doctor ONLY that know of the self-reporting. And, we all know that the better the player the more protection they are afforded by their club !!

Are you saying that if a player self reports for recreational drugs they are not tested for performance enhancing drugs?

[Eastern]

satchmo, testing for recreational drugs is conducted by Dorovitch Pathology for the AFL and is a voluntry policy agreed to by the AFLPA. Testing for performance enhancing drugs is conducted by ASADA, is compulsory and is controlled by the Government. Its the recreational drug debate that is the current topic, where a player can self-report to the club doctor as many times as they like and NOT be tested or have a strike recorded against their name under the AFL's 3 Strike Policy. Testing for performance enhansing drugs is a lot more rigid. They are two completely different systems !!

[StevieSaint]

Hey Plugger Mr Demetriou has lied before in reference to tanking before saying that it doesn't happen. He is running a business and having your best superstars using recreational drugs and winning premierships and brownlows is not good for business.

Let's say hypothetically that Dane Swan and Buddy are busted using recreational substances...is the image of the game going to be damaged at all? Just like the game has been hurt with allegations of tanking? This whole recreational drugs thing would be far worse as it would send the wrong message to the youth. Personally I think that it is not unlikely for AD to do what he needs to do to protect his business.

[plugger66]

Hey Plugger Mr Demetriou has lied before in reference to tanking before saying that it doesn't happen. He is running a business and having your best superstars using recreational drugs and winning premierships and brownlows is not good for business.

Let's say hypothetically that Dane Swan and Buddy are busted using recreational substances...is the image of the game going to be damaged at all? Just like the game has been hurt with allegations of tanking? This whole recreational drugs thing would be far worse as it would send the wrong message to the youth. Personally I think that it is not unlikely for AD to do what he needs to do to protect his business.

They are completely different. He didnt lie about tanking, it was his opinion it didnt happen. If you have 3 strikes it would be lying to say you havent. Do you honestly think he would be the only person in the AFL to know someone had 3 strikes. I doubt that very much so as with just about everything, it would get out and then the AFL would be laughing stock of the whole sporting world.

[joffaboy]

I think when the story breaks you will find that it is a small number of players who have used this loophole on multiple occasions.

So you know the full story? Who the club and players are? And how many times?

And if it is the case that only the player and Dr knows and a story is going to break, does that mean that there is a breach of doctor patient confidentiality?

Does the doctor realise they are breaking this confidentiality?

Are you suggesting that a story will break in which a club or clubs have a doctor ordoctors who are willfully covering rec drug use by the same player or players over multiple occasions and are not doing anything about this multiple use?

[saintsRrising]

It’s not my fault I have a predilection for women's lingerie and enjoy wearing high heels and stockings while reading Saintsaitional.

Is that you Ian ??

[bungiton]

A certain player from the club not mentioned turned up to his home town footy club presentation and dropped party biscuits in front of a number of people, only drama I have with it is when he was offering it to my then 15 yo daughter

[saintspremiers]

A certain player from the club not mentioned turned up to his home town footy club presentation and dropped party biscuits in front of a number of people, only drama I have with it is when he was offering it to my then 15 yo daughter

Which club?

[bergholt]

A certain player from the club not mentioned turned up to his home town footy club presentation and dropped party biscuits in front of a number of people, only drama I have with it is when he was offering it to my then 15 yo daughter

He didn't offer one to you first? Horrible manners, age before beauty.

[matrix]

so everyone thinks pies
i was more on the hawks myself

[StevieSaint]

Believe it or not I actually heard it was Geelong...of course it is one of those stories "My mate works down in Geelong and his Mrs works at the pub where these guys go and blah blah blah"

[plugger66]

I heard it was GWS 2 years ago.

[StevieSaint]

LOL!