Banking on the Draft

[st_Trav_ofWA]

just to Clarify ... we never gave Luke Ball away for nothing we were unable to reach a trade with collingwood for him and he then walked out into the draft and secondly Scotty never coached Tom Lee - Watters was the Subiaco coach Tom Lee is from Claremont

[bobmurray]

just to Clarify ... we never gave Luke Ball away for nothing we were unable to reach a trade with collingwood for him and he then walked out into the draft and secondly Scotty never coached Tom Lee - Watters was the Subiaco coach Tom Lee is from Claremont

Don't let the truth..................

[Scoop]

Why would you expect anything different now.

Because those in charge of our recruiting now are different from those we had for much of that time, especially the years under Peake, which look to have been a bit of a disaster.

I have a question? Why do you, when supporting the new administration, have to downgrade everything that went before?
What was a disaster, in getting, McEvoy, Steven, Simpkin, Stanley, Siposs, Ledger.?
Disappointing losing Cripps as I think he would of been reasonable.
Steven, Stanley, Siposs, Ledger and Simpkin were all taken late in drafts. We didn't have many early picks as we were plaing late in September. A few Grand Finals I think.
Yes there were mistakes made in trying to " top up" but that was done in an effort to win while the core group were at their peak.

I have an answer. I don't have to, hence my not doing so on this occasion.

As you may have noticed, I suggested that it was a "bit of a disaster", not a complete disaster and the parts that I consider to be disastrous, since you've asked, are mostly the fact that we have only one left on our list from the 2008 and 2009 national drafts combined. I read somewhere the other day that not only do we have no-one left from the 2009 national draft, but that all 10 that we picked up that year, whether it be from the national draft, PSD, rookie draft, or through trades, is still on our list, just 3 years later. I would suggest that that is a pretty bad year of trading and drafting.

It was far from all bad, as a result of those you named, but they are only 6, from 8 drafts (within the last 5 years) and that is well short of what most would consider a pass mark, I would imagine.

What Pelchen and co have done in the past two years is to try and redress the errors of 2008/09.

With Saad, Milera, Dunell, Shenton, Lee, Hickey, TDL all in the 21-24 age group, they have attempted to fill the void left by the disasters of 08/09. Add to this the multple picks/shuffling that came with the Saad/Milera, Lee, Hickey & Cripps trades, they have maximised the effectiveness of these trades by ensuring they still had enough picks in the 2011 and 2012 drafts, to also get the requisite number of kids.

So far I am very happy with the direction they are taking and the list management strategy they have adopted, which could see the disasters of 2008 and 2009 being virtually negated.

Only time (and the further trading/free agency pick ups over the next year or two and then the performance of these players) will tell if this is the case.

So far so good, I say.

[hayes66]

Just for the record, the disasters of '08 are, Stanley, Simpkin and Dawson (who were both rookied in season 08) and Ray traded. In the AFL record it will have 09 rookie draft as this years rookie draft is '13.
To illustrate the point Dawson played in the 09 Grand Final.
So, I have a point of difference. '09 was was worse than a disaster, it was catastrophic. '08 borderline average.

[bergholt]

And we have some genuine mysteries - milera could be a class finisher a cut above BJ in his prime.

I'm all for optimism, but that's verging on delusion. With luck Tezza will be a solid player for us, maybe a little better, but if he becomes half as good as Goddard then we've done amazingly.

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

What Pelchen and co have done in the past two years is to try and redress the errors of 2008/09.

With Saad, Milera, Dunell, Shenton, Lee, Hickey, TDL all in the 21-24 age group, they have attempted to fill the void left by the disasters of 08/09. Add to this the multple picks/shuffling that came with the Saad/Milera, Lee, Hickey & Cripps trades, they have maximised the effectiveness of these trades by ensuring they still had enough picks in the 2011 and 2012 drafts, to also get the requisite number of kids.

So far I am very happy with the direction they are taking and the list management strategy they have adopted, which could see the disasters of 2008 and 2009 being virtually negated.

Only time (and the further trading/free agency pick ups over the next year or two and then the performance of these players) will tell if this is the case.

So far so good, I say.

Agree. I think they've done a generally fantastic job so far (although leaving us with big holes at FB and back-up ruck this year was far from ideal) and that's part of the reason why I'm so optimistic about the likes of Lee and Hickey and the rest of those we drafted this year.

I'm not suggesting that those we've drafted and traded in in the past 14 months are better than those we got in around 10 years ago, but I have no doubt they are the best batch we've gotten in in a short space of time since then and not a moment too soon, as we surely would have tumbled down the ladder in a big way if we hadn't done some really astute drafting and trading in a big hurry.

[damienc]

just to Clarify ... we never gave Luke Ball away for nothing we were unable to reach a trade with collingwood for him and he then walked out into the draft and secondly Scotty never coached Tom Lee - Watters was the Subiaco coach Tom Lee is from Claremont

You Sandgropers are on to it. My apologies. Thanks for pointing that out. Right on all counts although I would struggle to completely agree with you on Luke Ball. I know I should but I just can't bring myself to see past him going to the filth, of all the clubs in the AFL, for nada.

[Zed]

And we have some genuine mysteries - milera could be a class finisher a cut above BJ in his prime.

I'm all for optimism, but that's verging on delusion. With luck Tezza will be a solid player for us, maybe a little better, but if he becomes half as good as Goddard then we've done amazingly.

was referring to his finishing skills not his total game impact. That is , if we can get the ball in his hands , he will hit a target more often than most on our list. Agree that he is not going to pick up a game by the scruff of the neck like BJ could in his prime.

[Elvis]

.... and don't forget, we still have The Blake!

To all the naysayers and doom and gloomers... save that for when the sheet is really hitting the fan (which, in some way, shape or form it will). It's the off-season. Stay optimistic! Get a bit of cheer happening!!

Milney will kick a ton, Newnes will be All Australian, Armo Brownlow and Kosi will rise like a phoenix!

Go Sainters in 2013!!

[stinger]

.... and don't forget, we still have The Blake!

To all the naysayers and doom and gloomers... save that for when the sheet is really hitting the fan (which, in some way, shape or form it will). It's the off-season. Stay optimistic! Get a bit of cheer happening!!

Milney will kick a ton, Newnes will be All Australian, Armo Brownlow and Kosi will rise like a phoenix!

Go Sainters in 2013!!

i'm for that...

[hayes66]

2008: Anthony Corrie, Jarrod Blight, Luke Rounds, Leigh Brown, Tristan Francis, Johnny Bennell, Toby Thoolen & Scott Reed
2009: Simon Buckley, Tom Hunter, Jack Carter & Shae McNamara off the list
2010: Daniel Farmer, Kirk Ugle, Trent Stubbs, Tom Young, Tom Gordon, Declan Reilly, Jack Perham & Jye Bolton gone
For those complaining about our drafting have a look at what Colling wood have done over the last few years. All of those boys were drafted/rookie or traded (which was only a few) in the last couple of drafts.

[bergholt]

2008: Anthony Corrie, Jarrod Blight, Luke Rounds, Leigh Brown, Tristan Francis, Johnny Bennell, Toby Thoolen & Scott Reed
2009: Simon Buckley, Tom Hunter, Jack Carter & Shae McNamara off the list
2010: Daniel Farmer, Kirk Ugle, Trent Stubbs, Tom Young, Tom Gordon, Declan Reilly, Jack Perham & Jye Bolton gone
For those complaining about our drafting have a look at what Colling wood have done over the last few years. All of those boys were drafted/rookie or traded (which was only a few) in the last couple of drafts.

Don't you have to consider all of their picks? Every club has bad picks, it's about the ratio of good to bad.

In 2010 they got Fasolo and Seedsman, in 2009 Ball and Ben Sinclair, in 2008 Sidebottom, Beams, Blair and Keeffe, and Leigh Brown is a premiership player.

Plucking a few bad picks out of midair doesn't really prove anything.

[hayes66]

That's my point. People are complaining about 08 draft. We, amongst the mistakes selected, Simpkin, Dawson and Stanley. 09 poor but it was only one year.

[Scoop]

Just for the record, the disasters of '08 are, Stanley, Simpkin and Dawson (who were both rookied in season 08) and Ray traded. In the AFL record it will have 09 rookie draft as this years rookie draft is '13.
To illustrate the point Dawson played in the 09 Grand Final.
So, I have a point of difference. '09 was was worse than a disaster, it was catastrophic. '08 borderline average.

I'm happy to go with your catastrophic for '09, however, I can't go with "borderline average" for '08.

In '08, we drafted/traded 14 players (including rookies), and upgraded 2 rookies, as follows:

Trade: Ray
ND: Lynch, Stanley, Heyne, Smith, Cahill, Begley
Rookie: Dawson, Simpkin, Howard, Gaertner, Tungatulum, McGarry, McGrath
RU: Eddy, McQualter

Of those 16 players, only 3 are left!! So within 4 years less than 20% of those players remain, with only two of those gone still playing AFL, and only one a 'regular'.

Pathetic I would say....

[Dis Believer]

Just for the record, the disasters of '08 are, Stanley, Simpkin and Dawson (who were both rookied in season 08) and Ray traded. In the AFL record it will have 09 rookie draft as this years rookie draft is '13.
To illustrate the point Dawson played in the 09 Grand Final.
So, I have a point of difference. '09 was was worse than a disaster, it was catastrophic. '08 borderline average.

I'm happy to go with your catastrophic for '09, however, I can't go with "borderline average" for '08.

In '08, we drafted/traded 14 players (including rookies), and upgraded 2 rookies, as follows:

Trade: Ray
ND: Lynch, Stanley, Heyne, Smith, Cahill, Begley
Rookie: Dawson, Simpkin, Howard, Gaertner, Tungatulum, McGarry, McGrath
RU: Eddy, McQualter

Of those 16 players, only 3 are left!! So within 4 years less than 20% of those players remain, with only two of those gone still playing AFL, and only one a 'regular'.

Pathetic I would say....

Given that the average AFL career lasts just three years, that's probably above average then!!