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MC Gusto wrote:I have a feeling in this instance and by the behaviours and actions on display that Goddard is being honest and the club dishonest in that:
Goddard wants to stay
The club wants a trade
I have a similar view
I reckon Goddard wants to stay
The club, also keen to manage his external market value and fans, are happy to trade but can't be seen to being so.
I like Goddard's passion but there's 3 massive problems for him staying :
1 price - I'm sure we can't afford what he thinks his market value is
2 need - The club have KPP holes looming.... as others say, how vital is it to keep an outside mid?
3 timing - we are on the way down. Goddards not 24..... his market value from here only gets less.
If only GWS would take him as an uncontracted player, then we would get two picks for him. If we are only going to get one mid first round pick, then I would rather keep him.
Okay, someone with a better understanding of Free Agency may be able to explain this to me.
I get the bit about the Saints being able to match offers etc. But let's say we go through this process and at the end of it there are 3 offers. Let's say:
GWS -$ 800,000 pa
Freo - $ 700,000 pa
StKFC - $ 600,000 pa
Would Goddard be able to reject the highest offer as he doesn't want to go to play for a team that is going to be uncompetitive for the next few years? Would he then be able to take Freo's offer?
And if he didn't want to go to Sydney and then thought "can't be bothered going to Freo for an extra $100,000", could he simply accept the Saints low offer? I'm assuming he can do all of this because it's surely been set up to help the player get what he wants.
Bottom line of the question - does failing to match an offer automatically mean we'll lose the player?
Dr Spaceman wrote:Okay, someone with a better understanding of Free Agency may be able to explain this to me.
I get the bit about the Saints being able to match offers etc. But let's say we go through this process and at the end of it there are 3 offers. Let's say:
GWS -$ 800,000 pa
Freo - $ 700,000 pa
StKFC - $ 600,000 pa
Would Goddard be able to reject the highest offer as he doesn't want to go to play for a team that is going to be uncompetitive for the next few years? Would he then be able to take Freo's offer?
i don't really understand the process but i'm not sure anyone does. i think goddard gets to nominate one offer for the saints to match, so as far as i can tell, there would only be two offers, gws $800k and freo $700k. the saints don't offer until goddard has nominated one. if he nominates freo $700k then the saints can make their offer against it. not sure what happens if they choose to still offer $600k - i think maybe the system is set up so if we don't match it exactly then he has to go?
Dr Spaceman wrote:Okay, someone with a better understanding of Free Agency may be able to explain this to me.
I get the bit about the Saints being able to match offers etc. But let's say we go through this process and at the end of it there are 3 offers. Let's say:
GWS -$ 800,000 pa
Freo - $ 700,000 pa
StKFC - $ 600,000 pa
Would Goddard be able to reject the highest offer as he doesn't want to go to play for a team that is going to be uncompetitive for the next few years? Would he then be able to take Freo's offer?
i don't really understand the process but i'm not sure anyone does. i think goddard gets to nominate one offer for the saints to match, so as far as i can tell, there would only be two offers, gws $800k and freo $700k. the saints don't offer until goddard has nominated one. if he nominates freo $700k then the saints can make their offer against it. not sure what happens if they choose to still offer $600k - i think maybe the system is set up so if we don't match it exactly then he has to go?
no idea though. it's a brave new world!
The way I understood it (again, who knows) is that as a full free agent he can do whatever he likes. As a restricted free agent, if we match the offer, he has to stay. I don't think he is compelled to take the top offer though, I think he can chose to stay for less money if he wants.
The heavy metal artist formerly known as True Believer!
IF you look around the room and can't identify who the sucker is, then it's probably you!
I wonder if the club has sought from the AFL what type of pick we would get, otherwise it's a very dangerous procedure, we may get only get an end of first round pick - who knows… He hasn't featured that prominently in B&F's & probably hasn't been in the top 5 paid at our club, both of which will be taken into account.
Freo really need a key forward, not a loose backman, would be surprised if he ended up there.
When interviewed regarding free agency many months ago, Scott Watters stated that St Kilda "Will not be selling the farm" when it comes to trying to retain individual players offered huge money by other clubs. If this is still the club's position, then St Kilda will not pay over the odds to keep Goddard.
Melbourne, GWS, Gold Coast, and Fremantle appear to have the room in their cap to accommodate Goddard on a monster salary (750k +).
Our best compensation for losing him to free agency will be a pick immediately after our first round pick, assuming that Goddard comes under the restricted free agency category. I think this is the case, as unrestricted free agency requires a player to have COMPLETED 10 years service at his club. If he is categorised as an unrestricted free agent, then the best we can get is a pick at the end of the first round of the draft, which could be as high as pick 21, given Melbourne, Geelong, and the Bulldogs have compensation picks in round 1. This would be a pretty crappy return for such a highly rated player.
cwrcyn wrote:If he is categorised as an unrestricted free agent, then the best we can get is a pick at the end of the first round of the draft, which could be as high as pick 21, given Melbourne, Geelong, and the Bulldogs have compensation picks in round 1. This would be a pretty crappy return for such a highly rated player.
That would be disgraceful - pick 21, if that happens i will be livid.
cwrcyn wrote:If he is categorised as an unrestricted free agent, then the best we can get is a pick at the end of the first round of the draft, which could be as high as pick 21, given Melbourne, Geelong, and the Bulldogs have compensation picks in round 1. This would be a pretty crappy return for such a highly rated player.
That would be disgraceful - pick 21, if that happens i will be livid.
cwrcyn wrote:If he is categorised as an unrestricted free agent, then the best we can get is a pick at the end of the first round of the draft, which could be as high as pick 21, given Melbourne, Geelong, and the Bulldogs have compensation picks in round 1. This would be a pretty crappy return for such a highly rated player.
That would be disgraceful - pick 21, if that happens i will be livid.
he is a restricted free agent
So possibly a pick around 14-15, given the priority picks activated?
MC Gusto wrote:I have a feeling in this instance and by the behaviours and actions on display that Goddard is being honest and the club dishonest in that:
Goddard wants to stay
The club wants a trade
I get the same feeling. Goddard has stayed pretty consistent in saying that he'd like to stay and is letting his manager and the club sort it out. But I think the club could have sorted it out a while ago if they really wanted to.
SainterK wrote:
People are already prepared to beat it by an awful lot though, if you believe what's reported.
Just inviting more people to the party now.
I think you are living in a fantasy world. The party is always finite as it has to be an AFL Club. Party will be small as many clubs would not have the salary cap room to bid high.
BJ will have had the same number of suitors regardless of whether or not the club had made any formal offer or not yet.
Other clubs can pay more...so the nub of the issue always has been whether or not BJ was willing to stay a Saint for less than market rates, and part of that would be just how high that market rate is.
I realise it's become quite a popular opinion to accuse me of occupying the fantasy world, but fail to see how I have done so here.
We already know GWS and Freo have tabled some kind of offers.
You're telling me that all of the Suns, Dogs, North, Richmond, Dons, Lions couldn't afford to table an offer and/or be interested?
MC Gusto wrote:I have a feeling in this instance and by the behaviours and actions on display that Goddard is being honest and the club dishonest in that:
Goddard wants to stay
The club wants a trade
I agree with this.
Sold him out a bit though IMO, he has been fiercely loyal all year in declaring his desire to stay a Saint.
Makes sense now if the rumour is true that BJ was hugely annoyed at Pelchen's little whack at him lasy week through the media when asked about BJ's not signing yet and he said 'you'd have to ask Dan Richardson about that'
If the club hasn't tabled an offer, and is hatching a plan to trade him....
Dr Spaceman wrote:Okay, someone with a better understanding of Free Agency may be able to explain this to me.
I get the bit about the Saints being able to match offers etc. But let's say we go through this process and at the end of it there are 3 offers. Let's say:
GWS -$ 800,000 pa
Freo - $ 700,000 pa
StKFC - $ 600,000 pa
Would Goddard be able to reject the highest offer as he doesn't want to go to play for a team that is going to be uncompetitive for the next few years? Would he then be able to take Freo's offer?
i don't really understand the process but i'm not sure anyone does. i think goddard gets to nominate one offer for the saints to match, so as far as i can tell, there would only be two offers, gws $800k and freo $700k. the saints don't offer until goddard has nominated one. if he nominates freo $700k then the saints can make their offer against it. not sure what happens if they choose to still offer $600k - i think maybe the system is set up so if we don't match it exactly then he has to go?
no idea though. it's a brave new world!
The way I understood it (again, who knows) is that as a full free agent he can do whatever he likes. As a restricted free agent, if we match the offer, he has to stay. I don't think he is compelled to take the top offer though, I think he can chose to stay for less money if he wants.
BJ doesn't have to stay if we match it, in the end he's got the final choice of what he wants to do regardless if we match any or all offers
saintbob wrote:BJ doesn't have to stay if we match it, in the end he's got the final choice of what he wants to do regardless if we match any or all offers
saintbob wrote:BJ doesn't have to stay if we match it, in the end he's got the final choice of what he wants to do regardless if we match any or all offers
Incorrect. As a restricted free agent he has to stay if we match it. If he was an unrestricted free agent he could do whatever he wants to do.
The heavy metal artist formerly known as True Believer!
IF you look around the room and can't identify who the sucker is, then it's probably you!
saintbob wrote:BJ doesn't have to stay if we match it, in the end he's got the final choice of what he wants to do regardless if we match any or all offers
Incorrect. As a restricted free agent he has to stay if we match it. If he was an unrestricted free agent he could do whatever he wants to do.
No he can still go, IF a trade can be worked out to that club.
saintbob wrote:BJ doesn't have to stay if we match it, in the end he's got the final choice of what he wants to do regardless if we match any or all offers
Incorrect. As a restricted free agent he has to stay if we match it. If he was an unrestricted free agent he could do whatever he wants to do.
No he can still go, IF a trade can be worked out to that club.
Trade or risk the draft, but can't go as part of free agency
Scott Watters has confirmed the St Kilda Football Club has made an offer to Brendon Goddard to extend his contract beyond this year, stating the club’s desire to keep the utility player for many seasons to come....
"We have three 300 game players at this football club in a 139 years of history. I’d like Brendon to be the fourth.”
I'd like him to be the 9th....
5/ Lenny Hayes........ 261 games - - - 2 more seasons to get to 300
6/ Stephen Milne...... 256 games - - - 2 more
7/ Nick Riewoldt....... 238 games - - - 3 more
8/ Nick Dal Santo.......236 games - - - 3 more
9/ Brendan Goddard... 203 games - - - 5 more
Last edited by Richter on Fri 24 Aug 2012 1:36pm, edited 1 time in total.
Hird... The unflushable one is now... just a turd...
Just on the positives about BJ - people like lethal have been bagging him as have the media in general. One massive positive is how resilient the guy is. We take it for granted - but he practically never gets injured.
