This can be a positive..

[Teflon]

Im not talking tanking....but......if you really want toplay Demetrious and his cheating umps at their game....anyway...

Tonight we played Collingwoods BEST side. Make no mistake - Beams cr@ps on Ball now. We took on them and the green shyte and fell 1goal short with a side that has a number of new faces holding their own. Sure, we have to improve but we can at least walk away from tonight knowing we are not far from the so called "best sides" at all. We can rebound next year IMO and that ought be the focus.

Kosi -apart from 1 mark......you simply can not have a player get 2 posessions for a half and be a liability defensively. HAS to be replaced. Malthouse said pre game he was super suspect when the footy hits the deck.....he knows.

Suspect decision makers - once again when the games on the line they fail you. Jones......20 metres out in front...cant kick a goal. Geary (who was awesome) decides to centre a football that results in a turnover (but thats harsh cause he was v good) and ofcourse Gilbert had his usual few. Why did we look good early?????? cause Dal Santo/Goddard were delivering a lot of ball inside our fwd 50 and were potent, we became very hard to stop. We simply HAVE to imporve across this side ball use and decision making/poise IF in the heat of battle we are to prevail. Jack Steven really worries me here....EVERY time he burst from congestion you were left with your heart in your mouth as to where the ball was going...

MUST recruit a key defender MUST.

I thought McEvoy after half time was ok but he needs help...IF Stanley could only hold up a ruck/forward role we'd be very hard to beat.

I thought Goddard 2 weeks in a row started to look like a genuine midfielder again as opposed to a half back floater....much better fwd of centre delivering into 50.

Saad in a big game was good and Simpkin/Dunnel werent out of their depth. We have some real talent to come in.....IF Ross/Ledger could make the jump soon.....gee we'd improve.

Bring on 2013....and the draft.

[whiskers3614]

Goddard in the action makes us better,
Dal should be encouraged to go forward more.
Geary,Steven must improve decision making.

[OneEyedSainter77]

Well said teffers, agree with most, if not all of what you just said.

[battye]

Ah this is so disappointing. It's all but season over now. What is there to play for this season?
As for 2013... well, our stars are all a year older then. I really thought 2012 was the last roll of the dice... and performances like that show we can still take it to the top teams, but it all counts for nothing if we don't make the eight. The Port loss will make the difference come September.

[clarky449]

Really thinking about 2013, next year is going to be alot worst. No more finals for 5-7 years. But also a new era will start.

[Teflon]

Ah this is so disappointing. It's all but season over now. What is there to play for this season?
As for 2013... well, our stars are all a year older then. I really thought 2012 was the last roll of the dice... and performances like that show we can still take it to the top teams, but it all counts for nothing if we don't make the eight. The Port loss will make the difference come September.

Dont agree.

I remember going home after 2008 Semi Final I think (Harvs last game?) being pantsed by Hawthorn badly by 10 goals after missing in out alltogether in 07 and thinking......gee.......we are a long, long way off the pace.

I know our stars are older but I actually believe we are closer to top 4 sides now than then and Watters is already reducing our reliance on Roo/Hayes et al by playing kids and introducing a fwd line that is not just 1 player focussed...and that will extend Riewoldts career IMO.

Fishers young enough
Goddard
Dal Santo
Montagna

IF we complement them with another mid or 2, a ruck and tall defender....we can challenge as our famous bottom 6 is already looking healthier for mine. I think Stanley up fwd could be anything, Sippos will improve so too Dunnel, Milera.....a nice trade would also help.

[SainterK]

Ah this is so disappointing. It's all but season over now. What is there to play for this season?

Plenty.

Culture, the kids, experience.

If the senior players pack it in now, what does that teach the next generation of players.

You just keep playing to the best of your ability, and they will, I don't actually doubt it...

[HardSaint]

yeah, lets not tank and keep improving, lets strive to knock over a rampant Geelong, even if we know we cant make the finals

play as if we're still in the hunt, knowing competitive game time with the whole team on the way out this year,

is incredibly valuable for a confident pre season and big next season - the cattle's there IMO

[stinger]

we are not out of it yet...13 wins will get you a finals berth....

[Teflon]

yeah, lets not tank and keep improving, lets strive to knock over a rampant Geelong, even if we know we cant make the finals

play as if we're still in the hunt, knowing competitive game time with the whole team on the way out this year,

is incredibly valuable for a confident pre season and big next season - the cattle's there IMO

I think so too. Theres anough quality in that core of 26-30 yr olds......weve found a few 23-25's in Saad, Milera and now Steven/Aarmo stepped it upand Stanley

Next year Dunnel, Sipposs, Ledger (Im hopeful), Newnes ....some of these will be starting 22.

We still need some smart recruitment and good trading but theres a good shell there IMO.

[andrewg]

We were never going to win this year buuut we definitely hope now that we get the best picks possible because the inclusion of Stanley and xclusion of kosi + some good trading and drafting could have up in the top four very soon.
Unfortunately we have to wear this season of near misses for a tiltin 2013-14 making up the numbers in 8th spot doesn't do our drafting any good at all even thought I would have loved to beat the scum tonight.

[maverick]

Ah this is so disappointing. It's all but season over now. What is there to play for this season?
As for 2013... well, our stars are all a year older then. I really thought 2012 was the last roll of the dice... and performances like that show we can still take it to the top teams, but it all counts for nothing if we don't make the eight. The Port loss will make the difference come September.

Dont agree.

I remember going home after 2008 Semi Final I think (Harvs last game?) being pantsed by Hawthorn badly by 10 goals after missing in out alltogether in 07 and thinking......gee.......we are a long, long way off the pace.

I know our stars are older but I actually believe we are closer to top 4 sides now than then and Watters is already reducing our reliance on Roo/Hayes et al by playing kids and introducing a fwd line that is not just 1 player focussed...and that will extend Riewoldts career IMO.

Fishers young enough
Goddard
Dal Santo
Montagna

IF we complement them with another mid or 2, a ruck and tall defender....we can challenge as our famous bottom 6 is already looking healthier for mine. I think Stanley up fwd could be anything, Sippos will improve so too Dunnel, Milera.....a nice trade would also help.

I agree, dirty on tonight's result but agree.

[philtee]

Nice wrap Teflon.
A bizarre game, loaded with skill errors and woeful decision-making, from both sides.
Collingwood should have buried us in the 2nd quarter, but didn't - Buckley will be furious.
We should have sunk them in the first and third, but didn't.
Geary almost a one-man saviour, hurling himself to the footy time after time.
Geez, I'd like to name a few of our players who went MIA, or waited for the footy to come to them,
or would not chase, or were repeatedly out-foxed.
And since when is Clint Jones our go-to forward?
Must go and lie down...

[mad saint guy]

The only positive is that we'll get an earlier start to the pre season due to missing the finals because of umpires. Time to get old players who can't use the footy (Jones, Polo, Peake) out of the club and tell the young ones (Steven, Ledger, Cripps) they better learn fast or they're in trouble as well. Gram's form over the past couple of weeks may have saved him as he appears to finally putting a decent effort into contests rather than his usual shirk n' skirt routine.

Get Jones and Polo out of the team immediately, rest any senior players with injuries and give the kids some responsibility for the rest of the year. Siposs as the permanent third target, Dunell to play full games, Ledger in and give Milera/Cripps/Ross/Markworth a go if they impress at Sandy. Give Blake a send off game and only play Stanley if he is 100%.

Make no mistake, a top 6 side won't be in the finals because of incorrect umpiring. All we can do now is try to prepare for one last crack at a premiership in 2013 before we lose serious chunks of our core each year for a few years.

[Turbo]

Lot of upside in what I saw tonight. I'd like to see;
* If we could get a couple of players to be more disciplined
* Another couple to actually attack the ball/player instead of second guessing what's going to happen next.
* Increase our accuracy in front of goal

Then I think we have a reasonable future.
Really need a tall, strong fast fullback that doesn't give away free kicks and a good ruckman.
Not asking for much!

[mad saint guy]

Then I think we have a reasonable future.
Really need a tall, strong fast fullback that doesn't give away free kicks and a good ruckman.
Not asking for much!

Immediate future yes, medium-long term future is looking very concerning. Agree completely on the full back and ruckman. I love McEvoy but he really is a liability in the hitouts.

[battye]

Ah this is so disappointing. It's all but season over now. What is there to play for this season?
As for 2013... well, our stars are all a year older then. I really thought 2012 was the last roll of the dice... and performances like that show we can still take it to the top teams, but it all counts for nothing if we don't make the eight. The Port loss will make the difference come September.

Dont agree.

I remember going home after 2008 Semi Final I think (Harvs last game?) being pantsed by Hawthorn badly by 10 goals after missing in out alltogether in 07 and thinking......gee.......we are a long, long way off the pace.

I know our stars are older but I actually believe we are closer to top 4 sides now than then and Watters is already reducing our reliance on Roo/Hayes et al by playing kids and introducing a fwd line that is not just 1 player focussed...and that will extend Riewoldts career IMO.

Fishers young enough
Goddard
Dal Santo
Montagna

IF we complement them with another mid or 2, a ruck and tall defender....we can challenge as our famous bottom 6 is already looking healthier for mine. I think Stanley up fwd could be anything, Sippos will improve so too Dunnel, Milera.....a nice trade would also help.

We are closer to making finals now - in a year when we could finish 10th or 11th and lost to powerhouses like Port Adelaide and North Melbourne - than a year when we made the semis and lost to the eventual premiers and had the stars best yet to come. I do not agree with that.

[saintkev]

Put Kosi down back. He starred there when he was a youngster. He has the strength and leaping ability to match it with big fellas like Cloke. He goes missing too much in the forward line. In the back line he'll be accountable.

[SaintPav]

Really thinking about 2013, next year is going to be alot worst. No more finals for 5-7 years. But also a new era will start.

I know it's hard, but you should really try and form your own opinion on these matters.

[Teflon]

Ah this is so disappointing. It's all but season over now. What is there to play for this season?
As for 2013... well, our stars are all a year older then. I really thought 2012 was the last roll of the dice... and performances like that show we can still take it to the top teams, but it all counts for nothing if we don't make the eight. The Port loss will make the difference come September.

Dont agree.

I remember going home after 2008 Semi Final I think (Harvs last game?) being pantsed by Hawthorn badly by 10 goals after missing in out alltogether in 07 and thinking......gee.......we are a long, long way off the pace.

I know our stars are older but I actually believe we are closer to top 4 sides now than then and Watters is already reducing our reliance on Roo/Hayes et al by playing kids and introducing a fwd line that is not just 1 player focussed...and that will extend Riewoldts career IMO.

Fishers young enough
Goddard
Dal Santo
Montagna

IF we complement them with another mid or 2, a ruck and tall defender....we can challenge as our famous bottom 6 is already looking healthier for mine. I think Stanley up fwd could be anything, Sippos will improve so too Dunnel, Milera.....a nice trade would also help.

We are closer to making finals now - in a year when we could finish 10th or 11th and lost to powerhouses like Port Adelaide and North Melbourne - than a year when we made the semis and lost to the eventual premiers. I do not agree with that.

We have a new coach adjusting in youth to a new game plan andwill just miss finals after losing by a goal to a supposed powerhouse with their BEST side on the park all year.

In 2008 Lyon had at least had a chance to settle andw wegot spanked.........how many times we been spanked this year?. 2007 in his first year he didnt get us to finals.

Why not compare apples?????

Time for a bex and a lie down ?

[clarky449]

Put Kosi down back. He starred there when he was a youngster. He has the strength and leaping ability to match it with big fellas like Cloke. He goes missing too much in the forward line. In the back line he'll be accountable.

Would get destroyed down there. Not an option. Kosi is ALOT Older, Slow, not agile.

[battye]

Dont agree.

I remember going home after 2008 Semi Final I think (Harvs last game?) being pantsed by Hawthorn badly by 10 goals after missing in out alltogether in 07 and thinking......gee.......we are a long, long way off the pace.

I know our stars are older but I actually believe we are closer to top 4 sides now than then and Watters is already reducing our reliance on Roo/Hayes et al by playing kids and introducing a fwd line that is not just 1 player focussed...and that will extend Riewoldts career IMO.

Fishers young enough
Goddard
Dal Santo
Montagna

IF we complement them with another mid or 2, a ruck and tall defender....we can challenge as our famous bottom 6 is already looking healthier for mine. I think Stanley up fwd could be anything, Sippos will improve so too Dunnel, Milera.....a nice trade would also help.

We are closer to making finals now - in a year when we could finish 10th or 11th and lost to powerhouses like Port Adelaide and North Melbourne - than a year when we made the semis and lost to the eventual premiers. I do not agree with that.

We have a new coach adjusting in youth to a new game plan andwill just miss finals after losing by a goal to a supposed powerhouse with their BEST side on the park all year.

In 2008 Lyon had at least had a chance to settle andw wegot spanked.........how many times we been spanked this year?. 2007 in his first year he didnt get us to finals.

Why not compare apples?????

Time for a bex and a lie down ?

Not getting walloped doesn't make us premiership contenders.

[Teflon]

On one thread you reckon making 8 has us as contenders now we arent? make up ure mind

For the record make the 8 or not I KNOW we arent right now.....

[Johnny Favier]

I'm sure Pelchen, Elshaug and Watters have already earmarked exactly the guys they want to recruit, and I'm pretty confident they'll make the right decisions to grow our list.

The next few years are going to very interesting, but I don't think we're in for quite as much pain as some people expect...

[sainter104]

put Kosi down back hmmmm how about put kosi to retierment should not play again