Help a Yankee out

[SaintPav]

Tornateo, a little bit of history...the Saints and Hawks played off in the 1971 grand final. Up until then, both teams each had one flag. The Saints were in a golden era (similar to our era now but without the premiership to show for it). The Saints lost this game after being well ahead in the third quarter. It was considered the most brutal grand finals of all.

Thereafter, the fate of both clubs could not have diverged more. The Hawks went on to be a VFL/AFL powerhouse winning 7 premierships over the next 20 years. The Saints on the other hand missed finals from 1974 until 1991. The 1980s were one of the bleakest years for the club and it nearly went bust.

If you can get a copy of the DVD it is well worth a watch.

[Tornateo]

Here's a question, so as a new fan I've been reading up about the team, and history, and famous players and such but was wondering do the Saints have a major rival? I'm assuming we hate Collingwood (since pretty much everyone does!) But I was just wondering if there are any other rivals I should know about/teams I should develop a hatred for?

[Selhurst Saint]

Out of interest, have you posted on the Hawks and Dogs boards for them to plead a case too?

I have a friend who is a Dogs supporter, and he tried to sell me on his team (but I didn't want to pick a team purely because he told me to) So I started looking into mulitple teams. I did post on a Hawks forum asking basically the same thing I asked here. But in the end I felt...Hawthorn is just too successful for me to decide to be a fan of. Seems like they've won a lot of Grand Finals, and their fans seemed to think quite highly of the team.

Don't worry the fans of Hawthorn think highly of themselves as do their players.

Arrogant is the word that springs to mind.

Maybe I can help you turn against Hawthorn if I tell you their original nickname was "The Mayblooms" which they changed because they thought it was too sissy.

The Dorks were also called the "Mustard Pots" at one stage. Very intimidating.

A little quoted fact about the rancid colours of Hawthorn is that they actually killed one of StKilda's greatest players. Back in the 1930's Fred "Flops" Phillips left StKilda to captain/coach Hawthorn. The rancid dye in his Hawtorn footy jumper infected a sore on his body. He caught septacaemia and subsequently died. Ironically his coffin was adorned with a Stkilda Jumper and a Hawthorn Jumper.

[Dave McNamara]

...teams I should develop a hatred for?

This week it's the Poodles, next week it's the Jailbirds, then the Dreamons, then it's...





Actually I don't truly hate any of the other teams, but I do feel sorry for them and their pathetic, sordid, deluded existence(s).

[Tornateo]

Incidently, do you get much AFL on the Sports Networks over there?

There's one channel that shows a few games a week, but mostly I use a few websites to watch games. There's an AFL site that costs $20 a month, but has every game, offers replays and such.

[saint75]

Welcome aboard Tornateo!!!!

I can't believe that no one has mentioned Lenny in this thread!!!!!

Lenny Hayes is the life and soul of our great club and it is a privilege to watch him play every week! There is not a player or supporter of our great game that does not admire or love Lenny Hayes!!!!!

[Tornateo]

Welcome aboard Tornateo!!!!

I can't believe that no one has mentioned Lenny in this thread!!!!!

Lenny Hayes is the life and soul of our great club and it is a privilege to watch him play every week! There is not a player or supporter of our great game that does not admire or love Lenny Hayes!!!!!

I got that impression from watching replays of matches this season. Last night and today i've watched four Saints matches, and kept hearing the announcers rave about him haha

[3rd generation saint]

Well I'll forgive you for being a Philadelphia fan, being from New York State originally, I am a fan of the current Superbowl champions, and the Mets.
As for teams to hate, yes Collingwood, consider them the New York Yankees of the AFL.
You either follow them, or you hate them with a passion.
Carlton is another team we hate because they are very arrogant and they are the team that we have the worst record again, though over the last 20years, we have had the better of them by quite a bit.
Have happened to show any of your friends AFL, I tend to find most Americans really like the game because it has all the things Americans like, scoring, tackling, fast pace etc.
Now living in Idaho, do you follow Boise State? Or is there another college you owe your allegiance too?
Anyway, if you ever decide to make a trip downunder, my guess that there will be a few people happy to give accomadation, I for one would be happy too, and take you to a Saints game.

[saintkellerm]

Nah, she is prob the only one! She wouldn't even watch that crap.

[The Craw]

Okay then, time to bring out the big guns (literally )

But she is wearing a saints top

[Austinnn]

In terms of rivalries, whenever it's Rivalry Round or whatever it's called we seem to always get the Bulldogs, but that's because we are in the left overs with no obvious one rival.

Here's my uneducated view of the clubs feeling towards the other clubs.

Adelaide - because of the 1997 GF pretty much, plus the Melbourne/Adelaide city rivalry spices things up, especially when we play there.

Brisbane/Fitzroy - not really, maybe the Riewoldt tears and the Lenny Fence episodes of shame.

Carlton - like a smartarse older brother who was always beating you up, in recent years we have turned the tables. Their club has been directly and openly disdainful of us in the past and their fans love to remind us that they've won so many premierships. We like to remind them that they got caught bending the rules to gain significant advantage for many years. I think in recent times, Saints supporters have broken into their ground at night to stick loads of wooden spoons in their ground the year that they finished on the bottom, (a 'wooden spoon' is a theoretical medal for last place). Beating them is always a pure joy, and their failure is revelled in with the Red, White and Black.

Collingwood - notoriously stupid and backward fans, unbelievably and undeservedly popular, now very well run and moderately successful, everyone hates these guys. The only direct hatred we have is from our only premiership, where we beat them by one point, and the 2010 GF, plus they famously racially abused one of our star players in the 80s, which ended up being a catalyst of real change in the game. Recently they poached another one of our stars which they did very well out of, making us look like mugs. Also their previous coach personally insulted our little champ Stevie Milne. I don't mind them, and even I hate them, so you can imagine what most Saints feel towards them. Put it this way, the worst thing you could personally do would be to announce that you've changed your mind and become a Pies fan. We hate other teams as much as them, but its the fact that they already have so much money and support that really hurts.

Essendon - they beat us in the 65 GF and they have handed out thrashings to us along the way. Another Big 4 club from the opposite end of town from us and with open distain for our club, (I remember when the Blight sacking was in the news, their CEO at the time suggested that the club was a rabble and all the supporters should become Bombers fans - what an idiot), they do get under our skin. We pinched Milney from their rookie list but I don't think there's much else rather than a mild haves vs have nots thing. I know lots of folk here hate the club, though I don't personally have much of a problem with them.

Fremantle - One of the very few teams to have won less premierships than us, but they have only been around for 17 years! We were growing together in the recent era, and our games seemed to always be tight, or controversial or both. Watching them become more successful is like watching your little brother run off with your girlfriend. We ridicule their silly song and their old colours, but we don't truly hate them.

Geelong - not a historical rival, but certainly a recent one. Since the early 2000s we have grown together and scrapped together, then they surpassed us, which is like watching your twin brother run off with your girlfriend! They beat us in the GF that we should have won in 2009, they have been the team to beat recently and we have done alright against them, but I don't think there's a real hatred there like there is for Carlton or the Pies.

Gold Coast and GWS - just started in the last couple of years, the only rivalries they have are the ones cunningly manufactured by the AFL in their home states, in fact this was the only reason why they were created.

Hawthorn - earlier posts give you an idea of the distain we have for their uniform, their upper class fans and their success, they beat us in the 71 GF and pretty consistently since, they were at their strongest when we were rock bottom so you can imagine... We shared the same ground for a while and they have a lot of their former players involved in media positions to look down on us. Also Allan Jeans, who was a Saints player, ended up becoming a Saints coach which he stayed as for a remarkable 16 years. In that time, he coached 322 games, including 3 Grand Finals, only one of which was a premiership. Then he retired. 5 years later, he became a coach for the Hawks for another 9 years and coached in 6 Grand Finals, 3 of which he won. We don't resent Yabby for anything, but those Hawks fully deserve our bitterness and hate for taking so much success from our clutches.

Melbourne - despite its history, a bit of a nothing club, with mildly interested supporters and inconsistent levels of achievement, they never quite get there. We were at the bottom together for a few years so we got lumped together, but a bit like our relationship with Freo without the controversy.

North Melbourne - I have personally always hated this team. When I came into the game, they were top dogs, with an impossibly arrogant marquee star player and miserable hard-arse coach and players and fans who seemed more suited to Rugby League. When all that gloriously fell apart, they became ice-cream for many years, now they are just starting to get some of their steel back, though like Melbourne, they never quite get there. Historically, we had the famous match in the 30s which was essentially a Last Man Standing bloodfeud, then there was the Prelim final in 1997 where 2 of our players gang tackled their star ruck man and dislocated his shoulder. They are boring, usually consistent for better or worse, and make a big deal about their supposed Shinboner Spirit, whatever that is. Wankers.

Port Adelaide - another Johnny come lately team who are a rabble now, but always manage to pull off a win against us, despite our relative strength or form. They beat us in the Prelims in the year they won the GF by a goal or something like that and that was the year that we really should have won the lot, now consigned to the dustbin. Their feral hometown supporters are like an interstate Collingwood with added points for patriarchal goldfish bowl mentality when we play there. Another really boring team, the only thing to like about them is that they always argue with Collingwood over their club colours and name. Having said that, do we hate them with a passion? No.

Richmond - somehow still one of the Top 4, despite years of disfunction. Their fans are notorious for eating their own, in-fighting and mismanagement only bettered by the Australian Labour Party have blighted their last 30 years. I wouldn't say that we have a direct rivalry with them, they are probably many people's second team if you like, but you wouldn't want them to become successful before us.

Sydney - this team was once South Melbourne, our direct rival historically when it was just a State League. At that time and for most of the early years I believe we were fierce rivals. Since their move to NSW, we've had 2 of our better players strip the black from their uniforms and take off to further success in the Emerald City. We moved from Moorabin as we suspected there was a trap door under the floor that opened up at Moore Park. They also denied us recently in the year they became premiers, another year when we could have easily won. Possibly one of the stronger of our interstate rivalries.

West Coast - They won their first premiership 6 years after they formed, then another one 2 years later, while we... lets not go there. Their club is notoriously parochial, but beyond that there's no reason to hate them. I quite like them actually, especially since they changed the bright blue and canary yellow in their club colours to navy and gold! They have a bit of a bogan image and they live in the most isolated city in the world but you wouldn't really say we have a history. We got a couple of great players (Gehrig and Gardiner) from them too for pretty much nothing.

Western Bulldogs - Like us they have won 1 premiership, they have been close to extinction for many years, they have a tendency to shoot themselves in the foot when presented with success and they have red and white in their colours. However, unlike us, they haven't got countless wooden spoons, they haven't had nearly the same amount of interesting characters play for them or excitement, they are known for their dour, scrappy game and it seems that we are always the ones to knock them out of the finals. One of the (if not THE) finest Saints player Robert Harvey won his first Brownlow Medal (kind of a MVP awarded by umpires) in the year that one of their few heroes Chris Grant got more votes, but was ineligible due to a suspension. For that reason I expect that they hate us, but we've usually had their measure so what's to hate? (s*** did I just jinx the weekend's result?)

So make of that what you will! Basically, it changes depending on who is above or below us in a certain era. It seems that Carlton, Collingwood and Essendon are pretty much always hated in general wherever we and they are.

[Dave McNamara]

Many thanks once again Austinnnnnnnnnnn for yet another great read!

Boring and wankers are such appropriate and accurate terms to use when describing other clubs.

[Pwoit]

p.s. You all have been a lot more helpful and welcoming than those on the Hawks forum I posted on. So thanks for that!

It's probably because we haven't won a great deal in our history we will thrive and live on anything positive about our club. This thread being one of the so all good at present.

Following for 45years and yet to witness a Flag - seen 4 attempts go begging