Where is Nick Riewoldt?

[Cairnsman]

Did Roo snub your autograph at the airport one day Cairnsman? Some of your posts regarding him are bewildering to the say the least. A poor game by Roo is equivalent to a passable game by almost every player on our list. This crap about 'Roo needs to get over himself' What's that? You reckon he's hasn't played a decent game since 2009? Well he was BOG in the first 2 games of 2010 before ripping his hammy. He was also BOG in the prelim final in 2010, as well as tearing Harry Taylor a new one in the qualifying final the same year. No player has given more to this club in the past 10 years, and your comments are ignorant at best. If Roo continued yesterdays form for the next 2 years he wouldn't be half the player he was, but he still would be a more than competent CHF. Am I missing something? Is there a young Wayne Carey waiting in the wings whose spot Roo is taking? Wait till he misses a few games, (hopefully he doesn't) and then get back to us about how useless he is

Dry your eyes princess! I know it can be tough when your favourite action hero is under siege. But seriously what a load of horse dung you speak when you say that a poor game by Roo is equivalent to a passable game by almost every player on our list. I reject that completely in the context of where the team is at right now. If we are in rebuild mode then there should not be one player getting a game because of how he performed a couple of years ago. And if there isn't a player coming through the ranks to put pressure on one of the most important positions that is CHF then our rebuild is going to take muuuuuuuuuuch longer. Like Lyon said last year, we need to find some money in the cupboard to buy a forward because the reality is Roo was part of an era that has passed us by.

Who said anything about giving him a game because of what he did last year? Or any other year? YOU'RE the one basing your opinion of him on what he has done in the past comparing it to what he does now. I'm the one saying that sure, he's not as good as what he once was (the best player in the comp) but talk of dropping him smacks of stupidity, b/c he still more than earns his keep for the position that he plays.

Og course I love what he has done for this club in the past - but only a fool would keep giving him a game based on that. When he starts getting under 10 possessions a game and nil goals (which I think was Archer's last effort at CHF) then I will start questioning his position in the team. How about YOU start looking at him objectively. I think it is YOU that has stars in your eyes and have thrown the baby out with the bath water re Roo, b/c he no longer plays at the incredible standard he set for so long.

If Roo continues to play the way he did in 2011 and there isn't another player in the team that can challenge for his position then what can be done. We will be stuck with a player that probably isn't in the top 50 but is one of the highest paid players in the comp. Frustrating as that may be to some it is what it is. So how many bad games should he be allowed to play before being dropped. Has Watters got the nuts to drop a Roo if his form slump continues. Hypothetically, if Roo has a clean bill of health, then why can't he return to his 2009 form? Remember he really only hit that purple patch after Robert Walls had a crack at him and his excessive shoulder bandages. A week later he ripped them off and was a different player.

[Old Mate]

I'd say over the last 12 months Roo has dropped to our #2 forward behind Milne and in the whole team he falls behind the before mentioned, Fisher, Dal Santo and Goddard. He'd still be in our top 5 players based on output (says a lot about our list) however I don't believe we rely on him as much as far as our structure goes. When he's off the ground it's arguable that we are as good if not better because we become more unpredictable and don't seem to kick it to stupid positions like pockets and flanks where Roo always seems to lead too. Nothing better than when we move the ball quickly and bomb it to Milne one out - Who is extremely underrated one on one. Roo has become quite poor in this area and solely relies on getting space from his opponent. Like I mentioned he's still one of our best however far from the player who if fit for a whole season would be a lay down misere for the B & F. I hope we are planning 2013 and beyond for replacement because I'd be very surprised if Roo played past next year.

[Moods]

[If Roo continues to play the way he did in 2011 and there isn't another player in the team that can challenge for his position then what can be done. We will be stuck with a player that probably isn't in the top 50 but is one of the highest paid players in the comp. Frustrating as that may be to some it is what it is. So how many bad games should he be allowed to play before being dropped. Has Watters got the nuts to drop a Roo if his form slump continues. Hypothetically, if Roo has a clean bill of health, then why can't he return to his 2009 form? Remember he really only hit that purple patch after Robert Walls had a crack at him and his excessive shoulder bandages. A week later he ripped them off and was a different player.

So hang on - you are actually revealing you're underlying reasons why you want him dropped - and none of it has anything to do with Roo deserving to be dropped.

1) You don't think he deserves the huge salary he's being paid. You want to see him perform commensurate to what we pay him.
2) You actually think he's a bit of a primma donna, and that he can play a lot better than he currently is.


At least we're getting to the crux of the matter.

Point 1 is irrelevent I reckon. He was signed on to a long term contract. At the time I wasn't a huge wrap for that, especially after what happened with Hamill - but I don't recall reading too many objections from anyone. What he gets paid is his business and good luck to him. You don't drop a player because the pay doesn't match the performance. If that was the case Ablett would have walked out on the cats years earlier - he was only getting about 300k a year and was in the top 3 players in the comp.

Point 2 is your opinion of Roo and probably is biased to some degree regarding how you think a footballer and all round tough guy should conduct themselves. Roo isn't everyone's cup of tea. A lot of blokes prefer Lenny for instance b/c he appears more of a mans man. That's fine, but qualify your prejudices before you comment. Many supporters love the hard men in their team. The Wayne Carey's/Dermott Brereton types aren't always going to play CHF.

[plugger66]

[If Roo continues to play the way he did in 2011 and there isn't another player in the team that can challenge for his position then what can be done. We will be stuck with a player that probably isn't in the top 50 but is one of the highest paid players in the comp. Frustrating as that may be to some it is what it is. So how many bad games should he be allowed to play before being dropped. Has Watters got the nuts to drop a Roo if his form slump continues. Hypothetically, if Roo has a clean bill of health, then why can't he return to his 2009 form? Remember he really only hit that purple patch after Robert Walls had a crack at him and his excessive shoulder bandages. A week later he ripped them off and was a different player.

So hang on - you are actually revealing you're underlying reasons why you want him dropped - and none of it has anything to do with Roo deserving to be dropped.

1) You don't think he deserves the huge salary he's being paid. You want to see him perform commensurate to what we pay him.
2) You actually think he's a bit of a primma donna, and that he can play a lot better than he currently is.


At least we're getting to the crux of the matter.

Point 1 is irrelevent I reckon. He was signed on to a long term contract. At the time I wasn't a huge wrap for that, especially after what happened with Hamill - but I don't recall reading too many objections from anyone. What he gets paid is his business and good luck to him. You don't drop a player because the pay doesn't match the performance. If that was the case Ablett would have walked out on the cats years earlier - he was only getting about 300k a year and was in the top 3 players in the comp.

Point 2 is your opinion of Roo and probably is biased to some degree regarding how you think a footballer and all round tough guy should conduct themselves. Roo isn't everyone's cup of tea. A lot of blokes prefer Lenny for instance b/c he appears more of a mans man. That's fine, but qualify your prejudices before you comment. Many supporters love the hard men in their team. The Wayne Carey's/Dermott Brereton types aren't always going to play CHF.

Can i just comment on the second point. It really annoys me that people think Rooy is anything but one of the toughest footballers going around. Plays in the hardest position and goes for marks many wouldnt attempt even some of those apparent tough guys. I really think the blond hair has something to do with it. If someone can point one contest that Rooy hasever pulled out of I would be surprised. He is a tough as you will get on a footy field and I can assure you he isnt one of my heroes so there is no rose coloured glasses in that comment.

[spert]

Few players are as fearless as Roo, but there comes a time where years of being a battering ram takes its toll. We have a forward line which is relying on three players in the twilight of their careers, to be the core of the forward line- Roo, Kosi and Milne. There are no panic stations but we must start blooding another two forwards and one of those a key forward.

[plugger66]

Few players are as fearless as Roo, but there comes a time where years of being a battering ram takes its toll. We have a forward line which is relying on three players in the twilight of their careers, to be the core of the forward line- Roo, Kosi and Milne. There are no panic stations but we must start blooding another two forwards and one of those a key forward.

Of course we need to. I am sure the club knows that but we dont have one in the seconds this year. It will have to be the next draft and then it will still take 3 to 4 years for him to develop. It is going to have to be a different forward line for a couple of years.

[Cairnsman]

I just went back over my posts and I can't see where I questioned Roos courage. I also can't see where I said I want him dropped. What I did do is ask a question and that was how many games does Roo have to put in before he is dropped. Ok he was afforded some slack in 2011. If he doesn't improve on his 2011 perfomance then he has gone from one of the highest paid "elite" players in the comp to a "serviceable" player in a very short space of time. Now when it comes to players that fall under the category of "serviceable" then they aren't afforded too many bad games before being replaced. Roo isn't the only one that lowered his standard in 2011. So think of it as a broader question and for mine I think 2012 will be the year for stamping papers. We still haven't bottomed out IMO.

[plugger66]

I just went back over my posts and I can't see where I questioned Roos courage. I also can't see where I said I want him dropped. What I did do is ask a question and that was how many games does Roo have to put in before he is dropped. Ok he was afforded some slack in 2011. If he doesn't improve on his 2011 perfomance then he has gone from one of the highest paid "elite" players in the comp to a "serviceable" player in a very short space of time. Now when it comes to players that fall under the category of "serviceable" then they aren't afforded too many bad games before being replaced. Roo isn't the only one that lowered his standard in 2011. So think of it as a broader question and for mine I think 2012 will be the year for stamping papers. We still haven't bottomed out IMO.

So if he constantly in the top 10 players or between 8 and 12 he is obviously safe then. i havent seen him out of that bracket much if at all even last year.

[Cairnsman]

I just went back over my posts and I can't see where I questioned Roos courage. I also can't see where I said I want him dropped. What I did do is ask a question and that was how many games does Roo have to put in before he is dropped. Ok he was afforded some slack in 2011. If he doesn't improve on his 2011 perfomance then he has gone from one of the highest paid "elite" players in the comp to a "serviceable" player in a very short space of time. Now when it comes to players that fall under the category of "serviceable" then they aren't afforded too many bad games before being replaced. Roo isn't the only one that lowered his standard in 2011. So think of it as a broader question and for mine I think 2012 will be the year for stamping papers. We still haven't bottomed out IMO.

So if he constantly in the top 10 players or between 8 and 12 he is obviously safe then. i havent seen him out of that bracket much if at all even last year.

Not sure about your first sentence but it would appear the observation in your second sentence is accurate.

[plugger66]

I just went back over my posts and I can't see where I questioned Roos courage. I also can't see where I said I want him dropped. What I did do is ask a question and that was how many games does Roo have to put in before he is dropped. Ok he was afforded some slack in 2011. If he doesn't improve on his 2011 perfomance then he has gone from one of the highest paid "elite" players in the comp to a "serviceable" player in a very short space of time. Now when it comes to players that fall under the category of "serviceable" then they aren't afforded too many bad games before being replaced. Roo isn't the only one that lowered his standard in 2011. So think of it as a broader question and for mine I think 2012 will be the year for stamping papers. We still haven't bottomed out IMO.

So if he constantly in the top 10 players or between 8 and 12 he is obviously safe then. i havent seen him out of that bracket much if at all even last year.

Not sure about your first sentence but it would appear the observation in your second sentence is accurate.

So why wouldnt he be safe than? As Moods pointed out it must be because he earns a lot because any other player would be safe if they were in the top half of players which you have agreed he has been.

[BigMart]

There is the fact that we are paying him 900K to kick two goals and take half a dozen mark a game.....he needs to perform at a level that sits him in our top 6.

Not in our 7-12 region, we have players on 250K playing minor roles in that region.....he is our CHF and Captain...

He is important, and the reason we were top 2 2009 and last year top 8 and this year probably bottom 6......he was so influential/brilliant we structured our entire teams around him...

You can only do that with all time greats......matthews, Whitten, Carey, Lockett.! Brown, Ablett,

[plugger66]

There is the fact that we are paying him 900K to kick two goals and take half a dozen mark a game.....he needs to perform at a level that sits him in our top 6.

Not in our 7-12 region, we have players on 250K playing minor roles in that region.....he is our CHF and Captain...

He is important, and the reason we were top 2 2009 and last year top 8 and this year probably bottom 6......he was so influential/brilliant we structured our entire teams around him...

You can only do that with all time greats......matthews, Whitten, Carey, Lockett.! Brown, Ablett,

That is true but that still doesnt mean you drop him. It means he gets a smaller contract next time. If he is dropped he still gets his money so if he is in the top 12 players he plays whatever he is earning. And it is one friggin game. Seriously I cant beleive some of the crap on this thread.

[gringo]

There is the fact that we are paying him 900K to kick two goals and take half a dozen mark a game.....he needs to perform at a level that sits him in our top 6.

Not in our 7-12 region, we have players on 250K playing minor roles in that region.....he is our CHF and Captain...

He is important, and the reason we were top 2 2009 and last year top 8 and this year probably bottom 6......he was so influential/brilliant we structured our entire teams around him...

You can only do that with all time greats......matthews, Whitten, Carey, Lockett.! Brown, Ablett,

That is true but that still doesnt mean you drop him. It means he gets a smaller contract next time. If he is dropped he still gets his money so if he is in the top 12 players he plays whatever he is earning. And it is one friggin game. Seriously I cant beleive some of the crap on this thread.

Stop being reasonable Plugger I'm finding myself agreeing with you too much. Your in your element now we're s*** again.

[Cairnsman]

There is the fact that we are paying him 900K to kick two goals and take half a dozen mark a game.....he needs to perform at a level that sits him in our top 6.

Not in our 7-12 region, we have players on 250K playing minor roles in that region.....he is our CHF and Captain...

He is important, and the reason we were top 2 2009 and last year top 8 and this year probably bottom 6......he was so influential/brilliant we structured our entire teams around him...

You can only do that with all time greats......matthews, Whitten, Carey, Lockett.! Brown, Ablett,

That is true but that still doesnt mean you drop him. It means he gets a smaller contract next time. If he is dropped he still gets his money so if he is in the top 12 players he plays whatever he is earning. And it is one friggin game. Seriously I cant beleive some of the crap on this thread.

Your are wrong. It isn't just one game. Roo bought his 2011 form to the Port game. The question remains, is this where it is at for Roo from here on in. 2012 will be interesting to say the least.

[Old Mate]

Roo will be lucky to get another contract (his contract finishes next year). I have doubts that his body can cope with the riggers of AFL football let alone that he'll be good enough.

[BigMart]

We certainly have been burnt

Luke Penny paid out
Aaron Hamill
Luke Ball
Andrew Lovett
Now Nick

Paid big money during their contracts with average or no return

I am loathed to say.....change his position if he cannot regain full movement

[Leo.J]

Rooey's knee or knees are gone, and so are we as a result.

I was hopeful, well still hoping this is not the case.

But after sunday I think his time has come.

[Old Mate]

We certainly have been burnt

Luke Penny paid out
Aaron Hamill
Luke Ball
Andrew Lovett
Now Nick

Paid big money during their contracts with average or no return

I am loathed to say.....change his position if he cannot regain full movement

And with the introduction of free agency clubs are offering more longterm deals. It's a good time to be a player.

[plugger66]

There is the fact that we are paying him 900K to kick two goals and take half a dozen mark a game.....he needs to perform at a level that sits him in our top 6.

Not in our 7-12 region, we have players on 250K playing minor roles in that region.....he is our CHF and Captain...

He is important, and the reason we were top 2 2009 and last year top 8 and this year probably bottom 6......he was so influential/brilliant we structured our entire teams around him...

You can only do that with all time greats......matthews, Whitten, Carey, Lockett.! Brown, Ablett,

That is true but that still doesnt mean you drop him. It means he gets a smaller contract next time. If he is dropped he still gets his money so if he is in the top 12 players he plays whatever he is earning. And it is one friggin game. Seriously I cant beleive some of the crap on this thread.

Stop being reasonable Plugger I'm finding myself agreeing with you too much. Your in your element now we're s*** again.

I dont get your last statement. i posted just as much if not more when we won 19 in a row and I also sticking up for players. Being s*** certainly doesnt thrill me in the slightest. 2009 was one of the great years to be a saints fan.

[gringo]

My impression of you is of a grumpy old bastard that hates any ones view point except the AFL and the umpires. I may be wrong but you appear a negative type.

[Moods]

My impression of you is of a grumpy old bastard that hates any ones view point except the AFL and the umpires. I may be wrong but you appear a negative type.

I find this a strange comment. Easiest two institutions to bag out are the AFL and the umpires. Dare I say doesn't take much courage. I don't agree with everything P66 writes, but I actually don't disagree with much he says either. The conspiracy theories re the AFL are great to make yourself feel better at night (everyone loves to feel persecuted - John Northey based an entire coaching career on it!) The clueless Sam Newman (when it comes to footy matters) spends most of his time bagging umpires because sadly he doesn't know what else to talk about re footy.

AS for Roo - Cairnsman, I never said you questioned his courage. The truly ignorant only ever do that, and I don't put you in that catagory. What many blokes I know don't like about Roo, and I'm getting the impression you're one of them, is his, lets call it, metro sexual traits.... I wouldn't imagine he's been in too many punch ons in his life for instance. I certainly don't hold that against him, in fact I respect him him for that. He's not one to crash through packs lilke a Carey or G. Ablett Snr. Why would he? He doesn't have that physique, but that doesn't stop ppl labelling him as a fairy. It's the Johnno Browns of this world that many blokes like to associate themselves with.

Not sure why we would drop a player b/c he's not playing as well as he did 3 years ago. You yourself said forget about past form - it's now that counts. Last year he was no where near getting dropped. He finished 8th in our B&F. That's 8th out of 42 players on our list. Not a great return for a bloke on $900k, but certainly not worth dropping him either. As P66 said, if he does get another contract and he's playing at this level, he just gets a much smaller one. I'm sure he will cope.

[plugger66]

My impression of you is of a grumpy old bastard that hates any ones view point except the AFL and the umpires. I may be wrong but you appear a negative type.

Well you couldnt be more wrong. I am one of the funniest guys you will meet and never grumpy. Love a laugh and a good time and even more a drink. Also I aint negative. People think that because i dont bag umpires and just about everything else and are honest about the saints that I am negative. That I dont agree with but each to ther own.

[gringo]

My impression of you is of a grumpy old bastard that hates any ones view point except the AFL and the umpires. I may be wrong but you appear a negative type.

Well you couldnt be more wrong. I am one of the funniest guys you will meet and never grumpy. Love a laugh and a good time and even more a drink. Also I aint negative. People think that because i dont bag umpires and just about everything else and are honest about the saints that I am negative. That I dont agree with but each to ther own.

Maybe it's the drink that speaks:)

[plugger66]

My impression of you is of a grumpy old bastard that hates any ones view point except the AFL and the umpires. I may be wrong but you appear a negative type.

Well you couldnt be more wrong. I am one of the funniest guys you will meet and never grumpy. Love a laugh and a good time and even more a drink. Also I aint negative. People think that because i dont bag umpires and just about everything else and are honest about the saints that I am negative. That I dont agree with but each to ther own.

Maybe it's the drink that speaks:)

Dont drink during the week so that isnt an excuse.

[8856brother]

Won't be reading any of your weekend posts then Plunger.