Why the missed Premiership hurts so much

[chook23]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/s ... 1w5ku.html

[bigcarl]

Jake Niall wrote:

What is a problem for Collingwood is a blessing for a club that is no longer in premiership contention.

Let's wait until the season starts, shall we?

[dcstkfc]

That's actually a very good piece

[CJC]

Sensible article.... Have to agree.

[saintspremiers]

Jake Niall wrote:

What is a problem for Collingwood is a blessing for a club that is no longer in premiership contention.

Let's wait until the season starts, shall we?

Given our players are locked in for the whole of this season, the article refers to what happens from Trade Month onwards.

It would be fair to say this is our final crack with the Magnificent Seven (or six if you are Dools and remove Kozi!).

Would be exciting to watch a full rebuild by trading a couple of the elite.

[Con Gorozidis]

Agree with article 90%.
I still believe we can with the whole thing this year. But if we arent top 4 at Round 12 we are done.
So thats rebuild time. Everyone over 26 is trade bait.
If we cant win this year we need to look 5-7 years at a flag chance.
No point faffing around.

[plugger66]

Agree with article 90%.
I still believe we can with the whole thing this year. But if we arent top 4 at Round 12 we are done.
So thats rebuild time. Everyone over 26 is trade bait.
If we cant win this year we need to look 5-7 years at a flag chance.
No point faffing around.

Sometimes I wonder if you think before posting. So if we are 7th and one game and no percentage out of top 4 as of round 12 we are done. How does that work and what do we do then anyway. Tank and still finish 10th. All that acheives is a bad culture around the club. Also how did you get 26 years of age? Just about every player is tradable anyway if you get the right offer and why round 12.Say we lose our first 6. We obviously cant make it then so may as well tank then. It would be easier as we are obviously no good anyway.

If as I beleive we cant win it this year but will still make the 8 what would you suggest we do for the year?

[philtee]

"a club that is no longer in premiership contention."
Give me a break, Jake.

[bigcarl]

"a club that is no longer in premiership contention."
Give me a break, Jake.

Yeah, It seems to be the prevailing view in the media and general public. It may well be right, but I'm not ready to concede the season yet.

[gringo]

I can't believe the media have just decided based on no real evidence that we should pull up stumps and go home? Did we play a season while I was in a coma and we missed finals? Did we have all our stars playing and they weren't up to standard? I don't think it helps a teams psychology to be constantly told you will fail, but it may help motivate. The thing I liked about Freo was their enthusiasm last night, I hope we come out like we want a premiership and shut these c**k heads up. I don't care if we lose one early while adjusting to a new style but I want a motivated team not Melbourne.

[sainter#4]

players with less then 10 games = Jamie cripps(4), Tom Ledger(2), Tom Simpkin(2), Aarryn Sipposs(5), Rhys Stanley(9), Nicholas Winmar(2)
Players who have Yet to debut = Jimmy Webstar, Ahmed Saad, Seb Ross, Jack newnes, Terry Milera, Daniel Markworth, Jay lever and Sam Crocker.

Whilst i understand why some would wanna trade a gun or two for a higher pick, these players are invaluable to the teaching and learning of all the above listed players on our list.The reason Geelong haven't bombed out is simply because their kids have been around their stars learnt and been able to play their own game whilst being backed their guns.The potential mistakes our kids make onfield can be covered by the experience and talent our top end players provide. whilst i think we are one year behind on our development of these kids, by no means should we be writing ourselves off.

look at collingwood in 10' their kids were the difference from an also ran to the best of the best. mccaffer, wellingham, goldsack, reid etc were all kids who preformed next to their core. no one was traded. Until these kids can grow into their bodies or gain enough experience to know they belong in the league our guns are IMPORTANT.

The only time a complete rebuild is necessary is when the top end can no longer preform and the list has to be blown up and started over eg Richmond and Melbourne of the last 5-6 years.We are not in this boat.

so here is a big middle finger to any person who is writing us off before round 1. We should be the team that the top 4 certainties are shitting themselves over because and yes ill admit a big IF we get ourselves fit and firing then no one will want to play us, especially if watters game plan which is similar to the pies and dorks is a success with us.

that IF is dependent on the senior core getting back to and sustaining their best like 09/10, and if they do they are still better then any top end talent in any other team.

This years Premiership is open for alot of clubs so we as supporters shouldn't be saying the year is over before its even started. Its a LONG LONG season and i feel we will be their or their abouts.

[plugger66]

I can't believe the media have just decided based on no real evidence that we should pull up stumps and go home? Did we play a season while I was in a coma and we missed finals? Did we have all our stars playing and they weren't up to standard? I don't think it helps a teams psychology to be constantly told you will fail, but it may help motivate. The thing I liked about Freo was their enthusiasm last night, I hope we come out like we want a premiership and shut these c**k heads up. I don't care if we lose one early while adjusting to a new style but I want a motivated team not Melbourne.

Lets face it there is a fair bit of evidence. Our practice form has been poor and unlike other sides we have had strong lists. Our form over the whole season last year was average but did get better late but a very poor effort in the finals. We also finished something like 5 games off top 4 and most of those sides having improving lists bar Geelong and ours is at best stable but realistically going backwards. To many there is a lot more evidence that we will go backwards than win an extra 4 or 5 games. I hope you are right though.

[sainter#4]

I can't believe the media have just decided based on no real evidence that we should pull up stumps and go home? Did we play a season while I was in a coma and we missed finals? Did we have all our stars playing and they weren't up to standard? I don't think it helps a teams psychology to be constantly told you will fail, but it may help motivate. The thing I liked about Freo was their enthusiasm last night, I hope we come out like we want a premiership and shut these c**k heads up. I don't care if we lose one early while adjusting to a new style but I want a motivated team not Melbourne.

Lets face it there is a fair bit of evidence. Our practice form has been poor and unlike other sides we have had strong lists. Our form over the whole season last year was average but did get better late but a very poor effort in the finals. We also finished something like 5 games off top 4 and most of those sides having improving lists bar Geelong and ours is at best stable but realistically going backwards. To many there is a lot more evidence that we will go backwards than win an extra 4 or 5 games. I hope you are right though.

round 1 geelong
round 2 richmond
round 6 adelaide
round 7 carlton

are all games last year we should have won. Thats an extra 14 points last year which takes us to 64 points. it would have had us 5th and playing against a broken essendon. What im also not able to factor is what changing those results would have done to the competition as a whole. We may have finished top 4 who knows?? the point is a little bit of luck and we were right their with the big boys. we are not finished yet - For whats its worth aswell, these results were achieved with roo as good as useless and no lenny, aswell as bj and others well done on their best.

[philtee]

I've figured it out - it's April First!
Tip my hat to you there, Jakey-boy, you had us going!

[plugger66]

I can't believe the media have just decided based on no real evidence that we should pull up stumps and go home? Did we play a season while I was in a coma and we missed finals? Did we have all our stars playing and they weren't up to standard? I don't think it helps a teams psychology to be constantly told you will fail, but it may help motivate. The thing I liked about Freo was their enthusiasm last night, I hope we come out like we want a premiership and shut these c**k heads up. I don't care if we lose one early while adjusting to a new style but I want a motivated team not Melbourne.

Lets face it there is a fair bit of evidence. Our practice form has been poor and unlike other sides we have had strong lists. Our form over the whole season last year was average but did get better late but a very poor effort in the finals. We also finished something like 5 games off top 4 and most of those sides having improving lists bar Geelong and ours is at best stable but realistically going backwards. To many there is a lot more evidence that we will go backwards than win an extra 4 or 5 games. I hope you are right though.

round 1 geelong
round 2 richmond
round 6 adelaide
round 7 carlton

are all games last year we should have won. Thats an extra 14 points last year which takes us to 64 points. it would have had us 5th and playing against a broken essendon. What im also not able to factor is what changing those results would have done to the competition as a whole. We may have finished top 4 who knows?? the point is a little bit of luck and we were right their with the big boys. we are not finished yet - For whats its worth aswell, these results were achieved with roo as good as useless and no lenny, aswell as bj and others well done on their best.

So we should have won them .Was there any games we maybe were lucky to win. Yes we get Lenny back. That is a huge plus but after watching how fast and skillful sides seem to be this year I doubt the players on our list can match the big boys. I still contend that we have little hope of winning an extra 4 games. By the way how has our practice match form been with just about full lists? Doesnt fill me with confidence. Anyway we will now a bit more today. A good win will help especially with GC next week. A loss would already finish our season. Huge call I know but mentally players would be thinking the window has finally shut with nothing to show for it.

[saintspremiers]

I've figured it out - it's April First!
Tip my hat to you there, Jakey-boy, you had us going!

You are a fool not to understand that the article was fair dinkum.

[gunnsaint]

Having read the article this morning, my heart didn't like what I was reading, but my head was agreeing. I don't agree that our shot at a premiership is over, at least for this year, but after that we'll proabaly loose one or two senior players. We don't have to loose all of our best players though. This year's draft will be strong, so it may be a bit of blessing in disguise to loose a couple of players in hindsight (give it a few years). To me the most likely to move are Goddard and Dal Santo, and maybe Fisher. Who can blame them for wanting to play in a premeirship side.

[defacto]

we need to take in a full intake of kids this year in the superdraft.

i dont think any of the top 10 will be given up. instead we'll cull the fringe players who are 25+. as someone said you need your top line players to educate the younger players. it also shows loyalty. melbourne is a great example of what happens to your culture if you slash and burn your long serving players too quickly.

50/50 if milne hayes will go on. kozi, roo, fisher will go on. dal santo, montagna will stay for less $$$. goddard is 50/50 but i am leaning towards him staying for less $$$ that he would get else where. blake will retire. i cant see roo going beyond 2013. that will free up some cap for re-signing the younger players.

we just need to be positive and play hard ball. players either re-sign and show some loyatly or they go and we lock and load on picks in the super draft. we shouldnt cave in. its up to the player. brad scott said it best a couple weeks back.

[8856brother]

Not all footy experts, ex players and media are stupid. It's hard to read, but there is a pattern to what the so called experts expect of us this year. I to hope they are all wrong.

They are all wrong aren't they? Or is it a case of rose coloured gasses?

[bergholt]

Whilst i understand why some would wanna trade a gun or two for a higher pick, these players are invaluable to the teaching and learning of all the above listed players on our list.The reason Geelong haven't bombed out is simply because their kids have been around their stars learnt and been able to play their own game whilst being backed their guns.

i agree with you on this. however, if it was july and we were sitting 10th, and bj came to the club and said he was thinking about going to gws, i hope we wouldn't move heaven and earth to keep him. make him a very good offer - he's a very good player - but we can't and shouldn't pay him $800k. it just doesn't make sense at this point in our cycle.

but yeah, getting rid of too many experienced players could definitely be an issue. for example, i'd love to keep lenny around for another two years, as long as he's playing ok, because he sets such a good example in his training and preparation. it'd be amazing if he played 300.

[saintsRrising]

Flawed logic and yesterdays thinking....


And the trade example they give is Hays whom the Hawks knew had special problems, which their trade partner did not know about.
Dal, BJ etc do not have such flaws.

[whiskers3614]

Knowin our luck and based on past history WE would get the "special problems" end of the deal.
NO hang on a minute we already did (Lovett) even when the "special problems" were clearly evident before we got him!

[philtee]

I can see I can't use irony anymore.

[MC Gusto]

The article is well thought and written. You are fooling yourself if you think we are flag contenders this year.

[gringo]

Not all footy experts, ex players and media are stupid. It's hard to read, but there is a pattern to what the so called experts expect of us this year. I to hope they are all wrong.

They are all wrong aren't they? Or is it a case of rose coloured gasses?

Or do you wait and see based on several of our stars having off seasons and injuries to our best 3 -Roo, Lenny and Goddard all suffered from ailments that limited their output. Montagna was suspended then not right, Gram and Gilbert had horror years. Kosi missed the preseason and start of the year, we had dramas and fiascos we played some promising kids who all injured them selves. On that basis I hope we will see a more competitive team. Have we improved enough who knows, but I would be happy to wait and see.

February and march matter little we won't have to wait long to see if the writings on the wall. Maybe you should stop inhaling the rose coloured gasses in the meantime.