Defensive spot up for grabs....

BigMart · Post: # 1175289Post **BigMart** » Wed 16 Nov 2011 4:21pm

Archer tests well over 20....for his size

gringo · Post: # 1175362Post **gringo** » Wed 16 Nov 2011 8:26pm

Max developed into a full back but played under Shanahan and then Penny and also at points had Voss etc. with him for the bigger guys. Max would not get away with his passionate crashes from behind these days either.

Sam Fisher is probably my impression of who Simpkin will replace long term. Ferguson would at least have the muscles for the big boys and has some skill as well but it's a huge jump from Sandy rookie to AFL full back.

plugger66 · Post: # 1175364Post **plugger66** » Wed 16 Nov 2011 8:30pm

gringo wrote:Max developed into a full back but played under Shanahan and then Penny and also at points had Voss etc. with him for the bigger guys. Max would not get away with his passionate crashes from behind these days either.

Sam Fisher is probably my impression of who Simpkin will replace long term. Ferguson would at least have the muscles for the big boys and has some skill as well but it's a huge jump from Sandy rookie to AFL full back.

Im unsure if you have seen Fergo but muscles is what he hasnt got.

PJ · Post: # 1175367Post PJ » Wed 16 Nov 2011 8:35pm

Ferg doesn't look too skinny from the pic at the start of this thread but photos can be deceiving.

plugger66 · Post: # 1175369Post **plugger66** » Wed 16 Nov 2011 8:41pm

PJ wrote:Ferg doesn't look too skinny from the pic at the start of this thread but photos can be deceiving.

He weighs just on 90kg and is about 195cm. Reckon he has about 5to 7 kg to go before he could play on a Cloke type. May never be that type of player anyway as he is more of a running HB even though he is very tall for that type of position.

PJ · Post: # 1175372Post PJ » Wed 16 Nov 2011 8:47pm

plugger66 wrote:
PJ wrote:Ferg doesn't look too skinny from the pic at the start of this thread but photos can be deceiving.
He weighs just on 90kg and is about 195cm. Reckon he has about 5to 7 kg to go before he could play on a Cloke type. May never be that type of player anyway as he is more of a running HB even though he is very tall for that type of position.

Interesting that Scwatters has mentioned him as a possible. Perhaps the backline could be in for a bit of a reshuffle. Your right though from all reports his development is good but not that good.

I guess then the question would be is his development ahead or behind the draftees that we are about to receive?

plugger66 · Post: # 1175378Post **plugger66** » Wed 16 Nov 2011 8:52pm

PJ wrote:
plugger66 wrote:
PJ wrote:Ferg doesn't look too skinny from the pic at the start of this thread but photos can be deceiving.
He weighs just on 90kg and is about 195cm. Reckon he has about 5to 7 kg to go before he could play on a Cloke type. May never be that type of player anyway as he is more of a running HB even though he is very tall for that type of position.
Interesting that Scwatters has mentioned him as a possible. Perhaps the backline could be in for a bit of a reshuffle. Your right though from all reports his development is good but not that good.

I guess then the question would be is his development ahead or behind the draftees that we are about to receive?

Dont get me wrong. He is developing very well and will be way ahead of the players we draft if it there first year in the AFL. I actually think with a bit of lucky with injury on his behalf he will be ungraded during the year as he really can play. He just isnt ready for FB in my opinion.

thirty-seven!? · Wed 16 Nov 2011 8:58pm

My understanding was that Ferg was more of a Gilbert style defender? Tall, wiry, but good by foot and with pace. Probably better suited to medium forwards, despite his height...

PJ · Post: # 1175418Post PJ » Wed 16 Nov 2011 10:18pm

If you can squeeze Ferg and say someone like Dowler our backline would then have 2 talls - 195 & 196 cm

gringo · Post: # 1175441Post **gringo** » Wed 16 Nov 2011 11:41pm

plugger66 wrote:
gringo wrote:Max developed into a full back but played under Shanahan and then Penny and also at points had Voss etc. with him for the bigger guys. Max would not get away with his passionate crashes from behind these days either.

Sam Fisher is probably my impression of who Simpkin will replace long term. Ferguson would at least have the muscles for the big boys and has some skill as well but it's a huge jump from Sandy rookie to AFL full back.

Im unsure if you have seen Fergo but muscles is what he hasnt got.

I haven't seen him play live but he looks big on telly. Must be an optical illusion. He looked skilful and solid which was what I thought was going to be his strength. Delist him.

plugger66 · Post: # 1175457Post **plugger66** » Thu 17 Nov 2011 6:25am

gringo wrote:
plugger66 wrote:
gringo wrote:Max developed into a full back but played under Shanahan and then Penny and also at points had Voss etc. with him for the bigger guys. Max would not get away with his passionate crashes from behind these days either.

Sam Fisher is probably my impression of who Simpkin will replace long term. Ferguson would at least have the muscles for the big boys and has some skill as well but it's a huge jump from Sandy rookie to AFL full back.

Im unsure if you have seen Fergo but muscles is what he hasnt got.
I haven't seen him play live but he looks big on telly. Must be an optical illusion. He looked skilful and solid which was what I thought was going to be his strength. Delist him.

I am unsure what you are on about. I said he hasnt got muscles to play on the big guys so now I want him delisted. I actually reckon I am one of his biggest fans but that doesnt mean he has muscles that he hasnt got.

gringo · Post: # 1175682Post **gringo** » Thu 17 Nov 2011 11:56pm

plugger66 wrote:
gringo wrote:
plugger66 wrote:
gringo wrote:Max developed into a full back but played under Shanahan and then Penny and also at points had Voss etc. with him for the bigger guys. Max would not get away with his passionate crashes from behind these days either.

Sam Fisher is probably my impression of who Simpkin will replace long term. Ferguson would at least have the muscles for the big boys and has some skill as well but it's a huge jump from Sandy rookie to AFL full back.

Im unsure if you have seen Fergo but muscles is what he hasnt got.
I haven't seen him play live but he looks big on telly. Must be an optical illusion. He looked skilful and solid which was what I thought was going to be his strength. Delist him.
I am unsure what you are on about. I said he hasnt got muscles to play on the big guys so now I want him delisted. I actually reckon I am one of his biggest fans but that doesnt mean he has muscles that he hasnt got.

Sorry, I just wanted to Plugger you for once

Scollop · Post: # 1176093Post **Scollop** » Sat 19 Nov 2011 7:45pm

I loved the idea and thoughts from one of the posts discussing the likely replacements for Zac, and the comparison of Rhys Stanley with Fraser Gherig. The post mentioned that early on when Fraser joined West Coast, G was a backman and indeed played a fair bit at FB before he changed to the other end of the ground. Gtrain bulked up later on in his career and was perfect as a FF when he came to us, so the post also looked at the benefits to Rhys learning the art of being a FF, while his body grows. The same can be said for Simpkin or any other kid that Watters has faith in and decides that they have what it takes.

The other thing that balances out the relative risk regarding the inexperience of some of these guys that are being groomed to take over at FB, is the uncertainty that the change will bring to your direct opponent and to the opposition teams forwards and also the assistant coaches and the forward coaches planning on how to counter a certain opponent. The element of surprise and the uncertainty is going to be a distinct advantage for a certain amount of time, and if we can get enough wins under our belt, and if a player like Stanley or Simpkin gains a bit of confidence in the role, then he owns that position.

elphie · Post: # 1176178Post **elphie** » Sun 20 Nov 2011 9:31am

blake & dowler...blake & dowler...blake & dowler.

will be a great pick-up as a support tall floating cut-out full-back/back-pocket and is definitely on PELCHN'S radar.

blake is the only chance for a one-on-one body against the big, strong full-fwds ...say CLOKE. but even then he needs to improve in this area.

To the top · Sun 20 Nov 2011 12:41pm

Blake will be 31 years of age, is 189cm and weighs 90kg's.

Will be struggling to get a game this year past his 200th - which will be gifted to him.

If we are relying on Blake in any capacity, we are in big, big trouble.

AnythingsPossibleSaints · Sun 20 Nov 2011 1:01pm

I think you're being a bit harsh on him there. I don't think anyone is suggesting Blake will suddenly make AA at full back, but neither did Zac and we got by with him. I just don't see any other better options in front of us at this stage. Dowler may be, but that's a big maybe.
As for Blake's height and weight, he's been tall enough to play in the ruck and has filled in at FB before, so I don't see it as a problem. He may only weigh 90kg (which I would question), but lack of strength is not an issue with him, IMO.

samoht · Post: # 1176282Post **samoht** » Sun 20 Nov 2011 2:23pm

Zac is a very average negating FB ..who averaged 3 kicks and 7 (and some of those were under the pump/ desperate get teammates into trouble- because I'm a crap player who can't think my way through trouble and rely on my own ability) handballs and relied on a lot of assistance .. let's not suddenly turn him into a superstar.
So if our development department can't find/develop an adequate replacement we are really stuffed and don't deserve any success.

Whoever replaces Zac does not have big shoes to fill - let's get real and past the dud.

borderbarry · Sun 20 Nov 2011 2:35pm

Those figures for Blakey are taken from the Player List on the Saints site. That being the case they are probably the original figures from when he joined in 1990. I am under thye impression that he is now 191cm, same height as Simpkin, and he would be well into the mid 90 kgs.
They still show Stanley at 200cm, which he was at 17. He has been 202cm for a long while now.

AnythingsPossibleSaints · Fri 25 Nov 2011 10:37pm

thirty-seven!? wrote:
I suspect we may grab a mature-aged player in one of the drafts to perhaps fill the void... Another good option could be Claremont forward/defender Beau Wilkes. He had a couple of seasons on the Eagles' rookie list, but has been in the WAFL for the past couple of years, playing under our very own McPhee. He had a great year this year as a swing man between FB and FF and was a pivotal part in their flag. There are a few clubs sniffing around, but at about 195cm and at a decent build, he could certainly be a viable option, assuming we could grab him for cheap. Also, he isn't too old either, only 24 or so.

Good call, 37!?

elphie · Post: # 1178354Post **elphie** » Sat 26 Nov 2011 8:58am

blake will take the second tall defender..resting ruck, say
dowler will be rookied

to me the full-back role is between wilkes and dowler.

simpkin is another year to two- away with body strength

HitTheBoundary · Sat 26 Nov 2011 9:03am

elphie wrote:blake will take the second tall defender..resting ruck, say
dowler will be rookied

to me the full-back role is between wilkes and dowler.

simpkin is another year to two- away with body strength

I hope Blake play his 200th and spends the rest of the year in the Magoos, being a great clubman and helping the young blokes. This is not a criticism of Jason, more a wish on my part that a young bloke steps up and takes his place.

I agree about Simpkin, I don't think he's big enough for full back.

defacto · Post: # 1178370Post **defacto** » Sat 26 Nov 2011 10:41am

HitTheBoundary wrote:
elphie wrote:blake will take the second tall defender..resting ruck, say
dowler will be rookied

to me the full-back role is between wilkes and dowler.

simpkin is another year to two- away with body strength
I hope Blake play his 200th and spends the rest of the year in the Magoos, being a great clubman and helping the young blokes. This is not a criticism of Jason, more a wish on my part that a young bloke steps up and takes his place.

I agree about Simpkin, I don't think he's big enough for full back.

i agree. would be great to see a kid come through. blake can help the kids in the VFL.

its time for simpkin winmar geary to all step up or GTFO

Animal Enclosure · Sat 26 Nov 2011 11:00am

Simpkin is the same height at Max (191).

Height is not the be all & end all... if he's got good positioning skills (that Zac struggled with), spoiling skills (which Zac did have) and can read the play well (which Zac also struggled with) then he'll do ok.

Wilkes & Blakey are the muscle... Simpkin the agile defender, with Chips & Gilbo there for support.

Wouldn't be surprised if they still add Dowler so that Wilkes can be an option up forward. Having both on the list is good planning IMO.

AnythingsPossibleSaints · Sat 26 Nov 2011 11:39am

Animal Enclosure wrote:
Wilkes & Blakey are the muscle... Simpkin the agile defender, with Chips & Gilbo there for support.

What about that bloke with the funny looking hair? He goes alright and will hopefully be back from injury pretty early on in the season. There was talk a while back that he was only a couple of weeks behind Lenny and Lenny is apparently a chance for R1.

TD · Post: # 1178389Post TD » Sat 26 Nov 2011 12:46pm

defacto wrote:
HitTheBoundary wrote:
elphie wrote:blake will take the second tall defender..resting ruck, say
dowler will be rookied

to me the full-back role is between wilkes and dowler.

simpkin is another year to two- away with body strength
I hope Blake play his 200th and spends the rest of the year in the Magoos, being a great clubman and helping the young blokes. This is not a criticism of Jason, more a wish on my part that a young bloke steps up and takes his place.

I agree about Simpkin, I don't think he's big enough for full back.
i agree. would be great to see a kid come through. blake can help the kids in the VFL.

its time for simpkin winmar geary to all step up or GTFO

Why would they pick Blake up again to sit him at Sandy?? Its not going to happen, hes better than that.