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Jackson certainly looking fit...and filled out a bit over the last few months?
I already reckon Stanley is going to be tried down back in a Ben Reid type role, not convinced he is forward or ruck at all, and wouldn't be surprised if he lines up there in 2012.
Think Simpkin is the obvious person for FB. Dont think Fergo is ready and Archer would be way to slow. Stanley will play in the ruck as we have no other options at all.
Darch could do a part time role when needed on gorillas like Cloke or Dawes he knows how to make a contest even if he isn't a superstar. Simpkin or Rhys could do the regular position. Jackson is almost too stylish to play as a full back.
plugger66 wrote:Think Simpkin is the obvious person for FB. Dont think Fergo is ready and Archer would be way to slow. Stanley will play in the ruck as we have no other options at all.
I think Simpkin is the front of that queue. He will get first and second crack at it.
I am certainly not against Sainter K's idea of trying Stanley down back. We get 4 or 5 practice matches so im happy to use them to experiment by all means. Last time I looked they didnt hand out trophies in februray.
Last edited by Con Gorozidis on Tue 15 Nov 2011 6:04pm, edited 1 time in total.
plugger66 wrote:Think Simpkin is the obvious person for FB. Dont think Fergo is ready and Archer would be way to slow. Stanley will play in the ruck as we have no other options at all.
I think Simpkin is the front of that queue. He will get first and second crack at it.
I am certainly not Sainter K's idea of trying Stanley down back. We get 4 or 5 practice matches so im happy to use them to experiment by all means. Last time I looked they didnt hand out trophies in februray.
The problem with trying Stanley who by the way didnt look to comfortable in the backline for sandy is he plays there and we get an injury to Kosi or Ben and then we have to regig the backline and put Stanley back in the ruck. As you said Tom should get plenty of chances. Wasnt disgraced in the 2 games this year.
plugger66 wrote:Think Simpkin is the obvious person for FB. Dont think Fergo is ready and Archer would be way to slow. Stanley will play in the ruck as we have no other options at all.
I think Simpkin is the front of that queue. He will get first and second crack at it.
I am certainly not Sainter K's idea of trying Stanley down back. We get 4 or 5 practice matches so im happy to use them to experiment by all means. Last time I looked they didnt hand out trophies in februray.
The problem with trying Stanley who by the way didnt look to comfortable in the backline for sandy is he plays there and we get an injury to Kosi or Ben and then we have to regig the backline and put Stanley back in the ruck. As you said Tom should get plenty of chances. Wasnt disgraced in the 2 games this year.
You don't reckon we'll be getting a ruckman in the draft?
Simpkin may be tried down back anyway, with someone like BJ or Raph elsewhere.
Fresh coach, fresh ideas...a lot of things may change.
I just have a feeling about Stanley down back, that's all.
plugger66 wrote:Think Simpkin is the obvious person for FB. Dont think Fergo is ready and Archer would be way to slow. Stanley will play in the ruck as we have no other options at all.
I think Simpkin is the front of that queue. He will get first and second crack at it.
I am certainly not Sainter K's idea of trying Stanley down back. We get 4 or 5 practice matches so im happy to use them to experiment by all means. Last time I looked they didnt hand out trophies in februray.
The problem with trying Stanley who by the way didnt look to comfortable in the backline for sandy is he plays there and we get an injury to Kosi or Ben and then we have to regig the backline and put Stanley back in the ruck. As you said Tom should get plenty of chances. Wasnt disgraced in the 2 games this year.
You don't reckon we'll be getting a ruckman in the draft?
Simpkin may be tried down back anyway, with someone like BJ or Raph elsewhere.
Fresh coach, fresh ideas...a lot of things may change.
I just have a feeling about Stanley down back, that's all.
Of course we will get another ruckman and probably an older type but I think you need about 4. Stanley struggled down back in 2 games I saw this year but in his defence he was struggling everywhere this year. He could play there but I still think he is a ruckman or nothing. We will find out more in about 3 months.
Has Simpkin got the "toe" that very good full backs such as Max had?
His spoiling is adequate from what I have seen but I do question whether full back is a position for him.
Like Maguire, I think he is an outer line defender - and does not have the height (191cm) to play key forward - as Fisher (same height) has confirmed in regards height and playing forward.
I put on here (perhaps the season before last) that I was impressed by Stanley when he was put at CHB for some of the last quarter (v. N Melbourne at Docklands?).
I have had him marked for CHB since.
He was super impressive with his positioning and covering in that match - did not get a lot of the ball but did what good defenders need to do.
The premier defenders such as Fisher and Clarke, who are our best positioning and covering players, have this skill and it sets them apart.
Possibly Stanley could follow the Fraser Gehrig career path (positionally that is) - utilise athleticism as a tall defender whilst his body is still developing and then swing forward (combined with ruck in Stanley's case) for the second half of his career with a bit more size and smarts on his side.
The club have been excited about Ferguson for a while. He certainly has the height (about 195cm) and is very quick and agile. He wouldn't have less physical strength than Dawson. There's certainly an opportunity for him.
At 191cm, Simpkin is not very tall by today's standards, so he'll need to carve out a Sam Fisher type role for himself when the opposition have the 195cm+ forwards.
If Scwatters is keen on Jackson and no one else fills the void (Simpkin aside) we go for a rookie elevation. I think we need at least a couple vying for the spot.
I've never seen a bad St.Kilda player - that's just how they are.
The good thing is that everyone knows that there is a defined position available. Players can set themselves for it and the Coaches will be giving special attention to positional development.
The initial practice matches will show who is best suited. However, we may need to rotate Simkin, Ferguson and Stanley early on in the season
to find the best fit. My feeling is that Stanley will be set for a support ruck role, but he needs plenty of weight on first.
I like the point made about Maxy - he was only 191cm or so, so it shouldn't be outside the realms of possibility for Simpkin to fill the role well. He is certainly our most likely option. I like the idea of trying Simpkin there - a few clubs have tried swinging creative forwards into the backline (Collingwood with Reid, Hawks with Shoenmakers and Carlton with Henderson), all with varying degrees of success. I reckon we should give him a crack in the pre-season, but honestly I can't see him being strong enough through the core to hold his own at FB just yet. Ferg the same. Although, would very happily be proven wrong!
I suspect we may grab a mature-aged player in one of the drafts to perhaps fill the void. Tim Mohr was the best VFL full-back this year, but unfortunately GWS pre-listed him. Another good option could be Claremont forward/defender Beau Wilkes. He had a couple of seasons on the Eagles' rookie list, but has been in the WAFL for the past couple of years, playing under our very own McPhee. He had a great year this year as a swing man between FB and FF and was a pivotal part in their flag. There are a few clubs sniffing around, but at about 195cm and at a decent build, he could certainly be a viable option, assuming we could grab him for cheap. Also, he isn't too old either, only 24 or so.
thirty-seven!? wrote:
I like the point made about Maxy - he was only 191cm or so, so it shouldn't be outside the realms of possibility for Simpkin to fill the role well. He is certainly our most likely option. I like the idea of trying Simpkin there..... I reckon we should give him a crack in the pre-season, but honestly I can't see him being strong enough through the core to hold his own at FB just yet. Ferg the same. Although, would very happily be proven wrong!
I suspect we may grab a mature-aged player in one of the drafts to perhaps fill the void. Tim Mohr was the best VFL full-back this year, but unfortunately GWS pre-listed him. Another good option could be Claremont forward/defender Beau Wilkes. He had a couple of seasons on the Eagles' rookie list, but has been in the WAFL for the past couple of years, playing under our very own McPhee. He had a great year this year as a swing man between FB and FF and was a pivotal part in their flag. There are a few clubs sniffing around, but at about 195cm and at a decent build, he could certainly be a viable option, assuming we could grab him for cheap. Also, he isn't too old either, only 24 or so.
Yes Simpkin would be the most obvious internal replacement - plus Blake, not sure on Archer and still prefer Stanley R/F.
Beau Wilkes could be an option - also Mark Austin 22, 193/95, Michael Coad 28, 190/86, & Tom Collier 23, 192/86. These 4 are the pick of the delisted tall backs IMO
Also other WAFL, SANFL players
Last edited by MCG-Unit on Wed 16 Nov 2011 5:04pm, edited 1 time in total.
cwrcyn wrote:The club have been excited about Ferguson for a while. He certainly has the height (about 195cm) and is very quick and agile. He wouldn't have less physical strength than Dawson. There's certainly an opportunity for him.
At 191cm, Simpkin is not very tall by today's standards, so he'll need to carve out a Sam Fisher type role for himself when the opposition have the 195cm+ forwards.
.
i agree simpkin probably needs another cm or 2.
but i see him as a traditional fullback or maybe nothing.
james frawley is1 93cm. if u are strong and good at body positioning and play smart u can give away a couple of cms.
max wasnt that tall. and gwilt is only 189cm (although he does get monstered in marking contests when he plays on talls).
lets see how simpkin goes.
and with stanley - who the hell knows. he has been a jekkyl and hyde character so i guess we will learn a lot more this year.
I have heard that we are talking to Will Thursfield, encouraging him to come out of retirement. Ex-Full Back at Richmond. Had some good form early in his career before injuries ruined his past two seasons. Has been in and out of the side because of it and retired this year. Still only 25 though, so not too old either. Was one of those players to show some really good signs early in his career, only to very rarely deliver consistently as time went on. Not a bad idea I guess, who would cost very little. But certainly a player who could be a good pick-up if he can prove to be decent back-up for our defensive woes.
From what i've seen of Simpkin he's more of a stopper - doesn't win many possessions himself.
The better FB's these days also get the ball and even run and carry on occasion or link up with other team mates - does Simpkin do that ?
The FBs get help these days anyway from their team mates - so it's probably best not to look for just a stopper.
Gwilt is not tall enough and is probably not our best option but on the plus side he's also been avergaing about 20 valuable possessions - he doesn't just try to stop an (often bigger) opponent... he wins plenty of the ball.
So if Stanley finds form and starts finding the ball he might become our best option - given his height and athleticism. A big if I know.
A good fullback should end up with 12-15 kicks as well as stop his opponent .. we don't need another specialist stopper.
thirty-seven!? wrote:I like the point made about Maxy - he was only 191cm or so, so it shouldn't be outside the realms of possibility for Simpkin to fill the role well. He is certainly our most likely option. I like the idea of trying Simpkin there - a few clubs have tried swinging creative forwards into the backline (Collingwood with Reid, Hawks with Shoenmakers and Carlton with Henderson), all with varying degrees of success. I reckon we should give him a crack in the pre-season, but honestly I can't see him being strong enough through the core to hold his own at FB just yet. Ferg the same. Although, would very happily be proven wrong!
I suspect we may grab a mature-aged player in one of the drafts to perhaps fill the void. Tim Mohr was the best VFL full-back this year, but unfortunately GWS pre-listed him. Another good option could be Claremont forward/defender Beau Wilkes. He had a couple of seasons on the Eagles' rookie list, but has been in the WAFL for the past couple of years, playing under our very own McPhee. He had a great year this year as a swing man between FB and FF and was a pivotal part in their flag. There are a few clubs sniffing around, but at about 195cm and at a decent build, he could certainly be a viable option, assuming we could grab him for cheap. Also, he isn't too old either, only 24 or so.
You would think that since Mcphee would know all about him, if Wilkes is availabe and mcphee thinks he is good enough, he could most likely get picked up by us. Pelchen did say that ithey would look at instate sides for fullbacks
I feel this thread is suffering from a Jason Blake deficiency. He's clearly not ideally as quick as you'd want, but Dawson also has his weaknesses and we got by with him. We know we can reply on Jason to do a job and I imagine he'd be the first one I'd try there, especially if we're still hoping to contend, as it appears we are.
I'd also have question marks over Simpkin's speed, height and overall strength, to be playing FB. To me, he seems best suited to a back pocket, as Maxy ideally was. Maxy was able to then perform extremely well at FB, but he was an exceptional example. It's a lot to expect Simpkin to be as exceptional as Max and I'd say Max was quicker, which is very, very useful at FB.
Beau Dowler may be an interesting option, too, but I don't remember having seen him play before, so I'm not going to comment on his physical attributes and likelihood of succeeding at FB in an AFL team.
