FT phantom draft

[thirty-seven!?]

Hey all, for interest's sake, I'm participating in a phantom draft on Footy Tragic and am drafting for St.Kilda. I have found there have been several pretty decent sliders so far, which has been interesting. Obviously, we are not dealing with club recruiters here, so presumably some players will be either rated higher or lower than they deserve.

So far I have used my first four picks and have drafted:

#25: Daniel Markworth

#35: Nick Haynes

#37: Michael Talia

#42: Jackson Merrett

Would be interested to hear your thoughts.

Obviously, I am yet to draft a ruckman, or a 195cm+ forward, but had my main alternatives for each selected before my picks I had wanted them for - Had Bolger gone before my 2nd pick and Paine and Tomlinson were both gone before my first. Possibly could have chosen Elton, but am happy with my selection of Haynes with the 2nd pick.

Anyway, if you're keen to check it out (with player descriptions), it is here: http://www.footytragic.com/blog/2011-ph ... mment-8376

[saintsfreak]

What about Dobosz?

[thirty-seven!?]

he was also gone by my first pick, which was a bit of a surprise. Not how I'd actually expect the draft to unfold TBH.

I rate Tomlinson as my first choice at #25, and whilst plenty of phantom drafts have him much higher (often going to GWS or Brisbane), I get the suspicion (and inside word) that he is not as highly rated by recruiters as he is on BF, etc. He IS still good though - great athleticism, 194cm and can play both ends - just what we need.

I also really like Paine.

Elton could also be a likely pick for us, but I didn't want to pass up on Markworth, who I rated higher. Assumed I could get a key tall later in the draft (Gordon, Roberts, Brown, or even Wilkes). Plus, I don't think out key tall worries as as bad as some think. I agree, they aren't amazing, but I still like the prospects of Stanley and Siposs, and to a lesser extent, Archer. Therefore, there is no point reaching with our first pick, like what I did here - ended up going best available (plus, outside speed and ball-use are still key needs for the Saints). Managed to get a 192cm HFF and a 195cm full-back with my 2nd and 3rd picks though, so feeling happy.

[Saints94]

Do you reckon Grigg will slip to us?

[thirty-seven!?]

Do you reckon Grigg will slip to us?

He could. In fact, I reckon Grigg will be one of the most interesting stories of this draft. As is the case in this phantom draft, Grigg was selected by Richmond - something that is certainly not unlikely in the real thing. He seems to be a player rated by some, hated by others. He is very good inside and has the added asset of a monster kick on him, which makes him equally capable outside the packs. He had a much better 2010 season than in 2011, which is why recruiters are worried.

Also, even if he does slip to our pick, I wonder whether we would take him. I don't think we are in as much need for inside midfielders, with all of Steven, Armo, Ledger and Curren showing good signs early. We would be much more likely to take an outside mid, tall forward or key back. There are probably no key backs really worth taking at #25 though, so they can wait to #35 or #37. I really like Boseley and Talia. Boseley LOVES competing one-on-one and has long gangly arms like Dustin Fletcher. Talia is probably the best true full-back in the draft, but the knocks on him are his speed and kicking. He is a great reader of the play though, so that makes up for his speed in some respects - see Michael Hurley (not as good though).

[saintsfreak]

I'd love for us to pick up Mansen at either 35 or 37 if he's still around. He probably has the most raw talent out of any KPF in the draft including Patton.

[jonesy]

No to Haynes...name is to similar to Nick Heyne,therefore he is no good

[thirty-seven!?]

No to Haynes...name is to similar to Nick Heyne,therefore he is no good

Haha, yeah, wouldn't want to read out the wrong number... oops.

Saintsfreak, I reckon Manson will go to either WCE or Freo. The talent is obvious, but I just can't see an interstate team pouncing on him, especially that early.

I mean, he hardly showed up to half his games at Claremont, so how would he go on the other side of the country?? Personally I would prefer to be picking a safer option. Someone who still has talent, albeit not as much as Manson, but someone who we won't be worried of losing back to the NT every second week.

[MCG-Unit]

You've done well - esp if Talia lasts till DP 37.....

Interesting how we look at the Saints needs, yes they need KPs and another ruck - I still reckon they need more in and under, bigger bodied mids, can't have too many of them - seem to have enough lighter running/outside types.

I'm hoping they draft mids like, Waldhuter, Grigg or Clay Smith and/or mature age mids Horsley or Salecic from the WAFL (or mature age Rookie)
Other KPs I like, Lockyer, Frost & Kersten.
2 KPs, 2 inside mids, 1 Ruck.

Of the BF Phantom Drafts, Snoop Dogs is the best outcome for the Saints IMO. Foj1 is incomplete but his 3 selections so far look great.

[thirty-seven!?]

Waldhunter would be great! His attack on the footy is simply ridiculous!! For those who haven't seen him play, check out this footage:

And can't imagine Haynes or Talia lasting to our 2nd round picks (Talia is more of the chance than Haynes though). In fact, I reckon Haynes could go 1st round.

I would be happy to draft Horsley, in fact, in this phantom I plan to nab him with one of our last two picks. I also want to get Daniel Currie from Sydney. I think he is still competent, but just hasn't had his chances. His form in the reserves has been good, but just can't break into the lineup (after spending his first few seasons injured). He is big enough and ready enough to play AFL now, so could be a good backup for McEvoy. IMO, no point drafting Downie or Bolger if we think we need a 2nd ruck this year. Stanley would be bigger and heavier than those two! I will admit, we still need another developing ruckman, but this draft hasn't got too many appealing options. Hence, I'd prefer to draft Currie, try my luck in the rookie draft, then get a ruck in next year's draft, which is much more friendly to clubs wanting taller players.

[borderbarry]

You obviously dont believe we need another ruckman. Or were they all gone? Or are you going to use round 5 or 6 on same?

[MCG-Unit]

Clay Smith's attack on the man/footy is similar to Waldhuter, Snoop Dog likens him to Selwood/Ball. Watch No 8


Watters has mentioned both Kyal Horsley and Jason Salecic - but then I guess they would be looking everywhere......

I agree unless an outstanding young ruck is available at their DP, they might late pick/rookie list a developing type and take a mature age ruck. I reckon James Sellar is worth considering - can play KPF/ruck. 196 / 95 22 year old. And was behind Jacobs, Tippett, McKernon and Croweaters traded in Jenkins.

[thirty-seven!?]

You obviously dont believe we need another ruckman. Or were they all gone? Or are you going to use round 5 or 6 on same?

As I said above, there were two rucks I had my eyes on - Bolger and Downie. I really didn't want to use my first pick on a ruck though and Bolger didn't slip as hoped (but not that I expected he would). I actually expected Downie would be there at #42, but someone snapped him up just before then. My plan will now be to draft a ruckman later on, mainly looking at Daniel Currie as he is good to go this year if needed. I would then pick up a project tall in the rookie draft - there should be a couple there.

Honestly, I think the need for a ruckman of a short-term issue anyway, hence targeting Currie. Stanley will fill out before either of Bolger or Downie anyway. I am also of the opinion that we would be better taking a short-term fix in this draft (Currie), then if he doesn't work (and I actually think he could), I would trade for a ruckmen in next year's trade week, like so many other clubs look to do as rucks can be so speculative.

[thirty-seven!?]

Clay Smith's attack on the footy is similar to Waldhuter, Snoop Dog likens him to Selwood/Ball.
Watters has mentioned both Kyal Horsley and Jason Salecic - but then I guess they would be looking everywhere......

I agree unless an outstanding young ruck is available at their DP, they might late pick/rookie list a developing type and take a mature age ruck. I reckon James Sellar is worth considering - can play KPF/ruck. 196 / 95 22 year old. And was behind Jacobs, Tippett, McKernon and Croweaters traded in Jenkins.

Yeah Sellar an option too, although I gotta admit I'm not a fan. He is one of those players who always seems to run around the footy field with a look of confusion on his face... just looks lost. Can play defence though which is a bonus, whereas Currie can play forward pretty well.

I hadn't heard Watters mention those two - when did he do that?? I think that's great news as both would be good additions and could provide something NOW if needed. We could probably even snare one or both of them in the rookie draft too!

[MCG-Unit]

Clay Smith's attack on the footy is similar to Waldhuter, Snoop Dog likens him to Selwood/Ball.
Watters has mentioned both Kyal Horsley and Jason Salecic - but then I guess they would be looking everywhere......

I agree unless an outstanding young ruck is available at their DP, they might late pick/rookie list a developing type and take a mature age ruck. I reckon James Sellar is worth considering - can play KPF/ruck. 196 / 95 22 year old. And was behind Jacobs, Tippett, McKernon and Croweaters traded in Jenkins.

Yeah Sellar an option too, although I gotta admit I'm not a fan. He is one of those players who always seems to run around the footy field with a look of confusion on his face... just looks lost. Can play defence though which is a bonus, whereas Currie can play forward pretty well.

I hadn't heard Watters mention those two - when did he do that?? I think that's great news as both would be good additions and could provide something NOW if needed. We could probably even snare one or both of them in the rookie draft too!

Managed to find some footage of Clay Smith and edited my post above with a link - watch no 8.

I just can't manage to find the link to Watters interview after he was appointed where he mentions WA's Horsley and Salecic, sorry

[plugger66]

No to Haynes...name is to similar to Nick Heyne,therefore he is no good

Yep makes sense. Anyway I think we may draft Alex Woodward. Have heard rumours we are interested.

[Old Mate]

Where did Elton slip too? I would of thought he'd go top 15 or so in the ND. He's similar to Drew Petrie and exactly what we need, a ruck/forward.

This would be ideal IMO:

#25 - Todd Elton (ruck/forward)
#35 - Devin Smith (small forward/quick mid)
#37 - Shane Nelson (quick mid)
#42 - Josh Waldhuter (inside mid)
#60 - Marley Williams (outside mid)
#68 - Tom Curran (tall defender)

I would also look at Bolger, Grigg, Clay Smith, Downie, Woodward and Talia.

[thirty-seven!?]

Where did Elton slip too? I would of thought he'd go top 15 or so in the ND. He's similar to Drew Petrie and exactly what we need, a ruck/forward.

This would be ideal IMO:

#25 - Todd Elton (ruck/forward)
#35 - Devin Smith (small forward/quick mid)
#37 - Shane Nelson (quick mid)
#42 - Josh Waldhuter (inside mid)
#58 - Marley Williams (outside mid)
#60 - Tom Curran (tall defender)

I would also look at Bolger, Grigg, Clay Smith, Downie, Woodward and Talia.

In this draft Elton slipped to 26- pick after mine. I don't mind him, but the issue was his lack of improvement this year. Would still b good for us, but there is definitely some better talls out there in Tomlinson, Paine and McInnes. I have a couple of mates who do some recruiting and their general consensus on Elton was 'he's a bit meh.'

[MCG-Unit]

No to Haynes...name is to similar to Nick Heyne,therefore he is no good

Yep makes sense. Anyway I think we may draft Alex Woodward. Have heard rumours we are interested.

Alex Woodward Sandringham Dragons 179 / 79 Inside Mid, a fierce tackler, and is quick. (from BF)
2 of the better phantom drafts on BF have him going at 27 & 44

Good to hear they are looking at inside mids, can't have too many of them. Have you watched him play?

[plugger66]

No to Haynes...name is to similar to Nick Heyne,therefore he is no good

Yep makes sense. Anyway I think we may draft Alex Woodward. Have heard rumours we are interested.

Alex Woodward Sandringham Dragons 179 / 79 Inside Mid, a fierce tackler, and is quick. (from BF)
2 of the better phantom drafts on BF have him going at 27 & 44

Good to hear they are looking at inside mids, can't have too many of them. Have you watched him play?

Yep I have 3 or 4 times. Actually think he struggles a bit but being an inside mid is obviously always under pressure so hard to really rate him. Others howver with a lot more knowledge than me rate him and I know as fact a couple of Saints people were asked to really look out for him.

[Old Mate]

Where did Elton slip too? I would of thought he'd go top 15 or so in the ND. He's similar to Drew Petrie and exactly what we need, a ruck/forward.

This would be ideal IMO:

#25 - Todd Elton (ruck/forward)
#35 - Devin Smith (small forward/quick mid)
#37 - Shane Nelson (quick mid)
#42 - Josh Waldhuter (inside mid)
#58 - Marley Williams (outside mid)
#60 - Tom Curran (tall defender)

I would also look at Bolger, Grigg, Clay Smith, Downie, Woodward and Talia.

In this draft Elton slipped to 26- pick after mine. I don't mind him, but the issue was his lack of improvement this year. Would still b good for us, but there is definitely some better talls out there in Tomlinson, Paine and McInnes. I have a couple of mates who do some recruiting and their general consensus on Elton was 'he's a bit meh.'

What are those other tall forwards like? I think we need to target three talls (back, forward and ruck), with the other three selections being mids.

[MCG-Unit]

No to Haynes...name is to similar to Nick Heyne,therefore he is no good

Yep makes sense. Anyway I think we may draft Alex Woodward. Have heard rumours we are interested.

Alex Woodward Sandringham Dragons 179 / 79 Inside Mid, a fierce tackler, and is quick. (from BF)
2 of the better phantom drafts on BF have him going at 27 & 44

Good to hear they are looking at inside mids, can't have too many of them. Have you watched him play?

Yep I have 3 or 4 times. Actually think he struggles a bit but being an inside mid is obviously always under pressure so hard to really rate him. Others however with a lot more knowledge than me rate him and I know as fact a couple of Saints people were asked to really look out for him.

That's good enough for me on Woodward - very keen on them to take more inside mids.
Gather you would have seen some of the following Sandy Dragons players (in order of how they seem to be rated) What are your thoughts?

Liam Sumner (can't believe he is only 70kg, yet rated top 10 DP)
Alex Woodward, Jackson Paine, Sam Frost
Then Anastasio, Roberts, Richards & Coleman

[plugger66]

No to Haynes...name is to similar to Nick Heyne,therefore he is no good

Yep makes sense. Anyway I think we may draft Alex Woodward. Have heard rumours we are interested.

Alex Woodward Sandringham Dragons 179 / 79 Inside Mid, a fierce tackler, and is quick. (from BF)
2 of the better phantom drafts on BF have him going at 27 & 44

Good to hear they are looking at inside mids, can't have too many of them. Have you watched him play?

Yep I have 3 or 4 times. Actually think he struggles a bit but being an inside mid is obviously always under pressure so hard to really rate him. Others however with a lot more knowledge than me rate him and I know as fact a couple of Saints people were asked to really look out for him.

That's good enough for me on Woodward - very keen on them to take more inside mids.
Gather you would have seen some of the following Sandy Dragons players (in order of how they seem to be rated) What are your thoughts?

Liam Sumner (can't believe he is only 70kg, yet rated top 10 DP)
Jackson Paine, Sam Frost
Then Roberts, Richards & Coleman

I have a bais with Liam as he is a friend of my Daughters. His attitude worries me. A good time guy but good skills and can run. No hope for us. Hadnt seen Paine till the finals as he hardly plays because of school footy. Looks good and could be close to a first rounder for us. That is about where he will go. Frosty is from my club, Ormond. He has the pace but had a poor finals series. Will go in the top 40 and is a risk. Fletcher Roberts was a rookie at best before the GF. Will still go as a rookies IMO. A short ruckman or a reasonably sized tall forward. Coleman will go as a rookie. Overaged player which helps at this level. Richards may go but is slow. Looks and plays exactly like his brother. I wish our club would take the punt with Anastasio but no club will. Port Melbourne for him next year.

[thirty-seven!?]

Good assessment Plugger, thanks. From what I've heard, although you would probably know more, Sumner will likely be heading to GWS with one of their first 14 picks.

Woodward sounds like a good leader and very determined to learn and get better. The downside on him is his pace and ball-skills. Still, you don't need to be a speedster or a jet with your feet to be a good inside mid.

Also, MCG Unit, I found that article you were trying to find for me:

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/sport/ ... fl-offers/

"The WAFL has been an outstanding contributor of talent to the AFL, so whether it's a Kyal Horsley that jumps up (I'm not sure)," Watters said. "I've always really rated Jason Salecic as a player as well. There's so much mature-age talent in the WAFL."

[thirty-seven!?]

Where did Elton slip too? I would of thought he'd go top 15 or so in the ND. He's similar to Drew Petrie and exactly what we need, a ruck/forward.

This would be ideal IMO:

#25 - Todd Elton (ruck/forward)
#35 - Devin Smith (small forward/quick mid)
#37 - Shane Nelson (quick mid)
#42 - Josh Waldhuter (inside mid)
#58 - Marley Williams (outside mid)
#60 - Tom Curran (tall defender)

I would also look at Bolger, Grigg, Clay Smith, Downie, Woodward and Talia.

In this draft Elton slipped to 26- pick after mine. I don't mind him, but the issue was his lack of improvement this year. Would still b good for us, but there is definitely some better talls out there in Tomlinson, Paine and McInnes. I have a couple of mates who do some recruiting and their general consensus on Elton was 'he's a bit meh.'

What are those other tall forwards like? I think we need to target three talls (back, forward and ruck), with the other three selections being mids.

Paine is a real high-leaping forward - his strength is his marking and ability to always take the ball at it's highest point. The slight on him is his speed (that said, he is NOT slow either), but IMO not ALL key forwards need to be speedsters. Still, he is pretty athletic and bounces around the forward line and has a great work-rate. Also an elite finisher in front of goal. LOVES to tackle, loves the tough stuff - played through the TAC Grand Final with a broken thumb (which subsequently kept him out of the combine).



Tomlinson's key asset is his athleticism and his flexibility. He's 192cm and can play back or forward, although spent most of the champs in the backline. Recorded some good times at the carnival and showed some very good form late in the year. Has a good mark and pretty good by boot too - up forward his athleticism shines as he is great at giving repeated leads. Many have him as a top-20 pick, although others I have spoken to have suggested he could still be around in the 2nd round... So will be one to watch. Will take a bit of time, but plenty to work with.



McInnes is the tallest of these 3 boys at 197cm and is another capable of playing either back or forward. Again, he is a real athlete and has even spend some time playing on a wing. He is a good kick and also good at using his big frame in marking contests. Currently he is a bit of a rake, but has the right body shape to suggest he will fill out pretty nicely. Probably a bit more speculative than the other two, but just as highly rated for skill and potential.


Elton has a lot of the tools to make it, but 2011 was a real inconsistent year for him. Had some good games, but some where he hardly turned up. He is the best of the true Full Forwards in this draft (the boys above are more likely Half-forwards, capable of playing in the square, ala Riewoldt) - tall, can take a grab, knows how to use his body and decent user of the ball. It is just his form-line that is a bit worrying. Has the tools to make it, but we've seen so many players pass through our doors whom we have said that about...