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barks4eva wrote:must be the drinking water over there
You're suggesting the board was on it when they gave Ross an option of a get-out clause? Or when they didn't extend his half completed contract part-way into a terrible season? Or when they sent Roo out to pour water on conjecture that RL had signed up for 2012?
Since Freo's going to win 3 premierships, starting 2012, and we're going to collect a fistful of wooden spoons, I don't see the point in wasting money on another coach...we can put the money towards a new board. Thank god for water filters.
SaintPav wrote:...the get out clause usually protects the club from a sh!t coach you want to sack.
Exactly...the club were probably getting ready to use it by April!
The notion that the St Kilda footy club said "Great to have you onboard Ross and, don't forget, if you don't like it at any stage, we've made sure we've built in a handy get out clause to allow you to leave" is hilarious. It was designed to protect us, not Ross.
I love Rooey but he does have a habit of falling in love with a coach, getting all upset when he gets the sack and then falling in love with the next coach and forgetting about the last guy. I wonder how long it'll take this time.
Last edited by suss on Sun 18 Sep 2011 11:55pm, edited 1 time in total.
barks4eva wrote:must be the drinking water over there
You're suggesting the board was on it when they gave Ross an option of a get-out clause? Or when they didn't extend his half completed contract part-way into a terrible season? Or when they sent Roo out to pour water on conjecture that RL had signed up for 2012?
Since Freo's going to win 3 premierships, starting 2012, and we're going to collect a fistful of wooden spoons, I don't see the point in wasting money on another coach...we can put the money towards a new board. Thank god for water filters.
Agree that Roo and BJ would have been instructed to tow the party line. I heard several interviews over the past few weeks with players confirming Ross had confirmed he was staying...players included Sam Gilbert, Jason Blake and Sam Fisher. Fisher in particular was emphatic. Rooey's statements have been somewhat misquoted. He confirmed that Ross did not say in black and white he was definately saying. But he certainly said enough a few weeks ago to the point that those players confirmed it in media interviews. It was around the time of the big links to Melbourne and he likely said "It's rubbish...no truth in it etc" So Rooey now saying Ross never said he was staying is technically correct.....But no point in Roo getting into a slanging match about it now. He will have been told to not inflame the situation any further and I think he did quite well showing good leadership.
Also regarding them not extending his half completed contract when things were going badly. It's funny how that has been skipped over in most peoples opinions. I totally agree with the board not agreeing to a 4 year unconditional contract (or conditional for that matter) back in the early stages of this year when things were looking really bleak. Its not like they were going to sack him, and he already had another year, but tying him up for another two beyond that when things were going so terribly would have been incredibly stupid and would have been viewed as such by the wider football community. We certainly can't afford massive payouts in the event of a disaster down the track....the early to mid parts of this season were certainly not the time to have been locking in to that extent, IMO.
The Hawks let Clarko (their premiership coach), run his contract all the way till nearly the end of the final year on his contract. While this was a little risky, there was certainly no hysteria in the industry about it. Yet people are saying we should have signed Ross up back in April/May and tied ourselves to a large money, longterm unconditional deal when we could barely win a game...crazy stuff.
barks4eva wrote:must be the drinking water over there
You're suggesting the board was on it when they gave Ross an option of a get-out clause? Or when they didn't extend his half completed contract part-way into a terrible season? Or when they sent Roo out to pour water on conjecture that RL had signed up for 2012?
Since Freo's going to win 3 premierships, starting 2012, and we're going to collect a fistful of wooden spoons, I don't see the point in wasting money on another coach...we can put the money towards a new board. Thank god for water filters.
Agree that Roo and BJ would have been instructed to tow the party line. I heard several interviews over the past few weeks with players confirming Ross had confirmed he was staying...players included Sam Gilbert, Jason Blake and Sam Fisher. Fisher in particular was emphatic. Rooey's statements have been somewhat misquoted. He confirmed that Ross did not say in black and white he was definately saying. But he certainly said enough a few weeks ago to the point that those players confirmed it in media interviews. It was around the time of the big links to Melbourne and he likely said "It's rubbish...no truth in it etc" So Rooey now saying Ross never said he was staying is technically correct.....But no point in Roo getting into a slanging match about it now. He will have been told to not inflame the situation any further and I think he did quite well showing good leadership.
Also regarding them not extending his half completed contract when things were going badly. It's funny how that has been skipped over in most peoples opinions. I totally agree with the board not agreeing to a 4 year unconditional contract (or conditional for that matter) back in the early stages of this year when things were looking really bleak. Its not like they were going to sack him, and he already had another year, but tying him up for another two beyond that when things were going so terribly would have been incredibly stupid and would have been viewed as such by the wider football community. We certainly can't afford massive payouts in the event of a disaster down the track....the early to mid parts of this season were certainly not the time to have been locking in to that extent, IMO.
The Hawks let Clarko (their premiership coach), run his contract all the way till nearly the end of the final year on his contract. While this was a little risky, there was certainly no hysteria in the industry about it. Yet people are saying we should have signed Ross up back in April/May and tied ourselves to a large money, longterm unconditional deal when we could barely win a game...crazy stuff.
SaintPav wrote:...the get out clause usually protects the club from a sh!t coach you want to sack.
Exactly...the club were probably getting ready to use it by April!
The notion that the St Kilda footy club said "Great to have you onboard Ross and, don't forget, if you don't like it at any stage, we've made sure we've built in a handy get out clause to allow you to leave" is hilarious. It was designed to protect us, not Ross.
I never said that. I heard form someone on the board that they wanted to lock him away and were worried about a big club coming along with a very big contract. Carlton was mentioned. That was in April so they were aware of it. I'm not sure what happened after that but the board blinked for what ever reason and Lyon baulked for what ever reason and the rest is history.
Last edited by SaintPav on Sun 18 Sep 2011 11:57pm, edited 1 time in total.
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
SaintPav wrote:...the get out clause usually protects the club from a sh!t coach you want to sack.
Exactly...the club were probably getting ready to use it by April!
The notion that the St Kilda footy club said "Great to have you onboard Ross and, don't forget, if you don't like it at any stage, we've made sure we've built in a handy get out clause to allow you to leave" is hilarious. It was designed to protect us, not Ross.
I never said that. I heard form someone on the board that they wanted to lock him away and were worried about a big club coming along with a very big contract. Carlton was mentioned. That was in April so they were aware of it. I'm not sure what happened after that but the board blinked for what ever reason and Lyon baullked for what ever reason and the rest is history.
You're not guilty, B4E is happily making statements to this effect.
SainterK wrote:Wonder why didn't the other clubs go for him?
Melbourne, Freo, Dogs?
Dogs have Leon Cameron. Dees may have respected the process or RL wasn't interested and Freo got their man.
I'm guessing.
I just don't get a vibe any of them were even interested.
the Dees spoke to Ross's management group and said if at any thime there is a likely hood let us know- See G Lyon on Footy show
Dogs would't have been able to afford would they?
Ross told management group to slow process 2 weeks ago-see C Kelly quotes- Friday football
headhunted was the correct term- Freo came with cash and 2013.
Thank YOu Freo for saving us $700,000 in 2012
saintnick12 wrote:Rooey's statements have been somewhat misquoted
as I stated on Page 1- Listen / watch the video- the articles do Not publish full sentences or quotes from either Nick or BJ-- one reason to listen for your selves.
and Ch nine have so far edited out comments from BJ- maybe intending to use them tomorrow night- FC
Last edited by saintbrat on Sun 18 Sep 2011 11:49pm, edited 1 time in total.
bark4eva; You really annoy the hell outta me. Move on man. Sure we thank him for trying and we think he is a great professional and he works hard...blah blah blah...The man couldn't inspire and lift the team to any great height could he? The jury will be out on whether he is a great senior coach until he can bag some silverware as a senior coach. My prediction is; that will happen when pigs can fly!!!!!
You don't get it. Premierships are built around recruiting well and teaching well. Lyon fails on both fronts. The playing list before he got there was playing in pre-lims and was primed for a premiership tilt. He lacks the flair and pazzazz and inspiration and that's all there is to it.
Lyon didn't recruit at the end of last year in the best interests of the footy club. That is a fact. Self preservation and a total lack of development and future planning for the playing list is unforgivable. I'm so glad to see the back of this bloke. I want to see young guys get a go and I want to see the next Bazza or Plugga or Spider or Barks be given a go and be told by the senior coach that he trusts the kid to be a valuable member and a required palyer in the senior group.
We get on this forum and we are passionate about our footy team and that's great, but lets please not bitch and fight about the loss of a bloke who proved by his actions and by his words that he was not passionate about the Saints.
We are passionate about our players, because they are fundamentally the reason the club exists. Your username says what? oh that's right it says 'barks'!!! It doesn't say Jeans although he is a Legend and a hero to us all. Point is, half the usernames on here have something to do with great players that are currently on the list or have played for the Sainters in years gone by. The club lives and breathes solely based on the support and adulation and following of Saints fans and supporters who love their players. Our development of new stars has been shite.
In the five years that Lyon has been at our club, I have not seen a debutant been given a go by Lyon and told we will blood you as a forward. In the five years Lyon was -yes it's important to start using and emphasing was - at our great club he did not bring in a debutant and stick him in the backline and say; 'Son, I trust that you'll do a good job. I want you to be the next Spud Frawley at this club.'
I was bloody jealous of seeing Heppel and Rowan from the Swans and Isaac Smith and all the guys at the Demons and even at some of the other clubs where they'd bring in a young guy and just fully back them and give them lots of games in their first year. We've got a kid on our list for goodness sake that is Cuz's cuz. I want to see the kid play. That's right; I pay my membership and I want to see Nicholas Winmar get games. Now that this negative boring pr##k has gone I'll enjoy watching my team again.
SainterK wrote:Wonder why didn't the other clubs go for him?
Melbourne, Freo, Dogs?
Really? According to the media, the Dees were very interested in Ross.
not according to garry lyon...they didn't even speak to him.....they knew who they wanted and it wasn't judas.....
the point is that there was a perception that there was a lot of interest in Ross and that he had an out cluase in his contract. he ended up getting a $1.5 million contract out of the media frenzy becuae his mate like Walls kept talking and writing about it as well as dropping that he had a get out clause....dah...
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
Scollop wrote:bark4eva; You really annoy the hell outta me. Move on man. Sure we thank him for trying and we think he is a great professional and he works hard...blah blah blah...The man couldn't inspire and lift the team to any great height could he? The jury will be out on whether he is a great senior coach until he can bag some silverware as a senior coach. My prediction is; that will happen when pigs can fly!!!!!
You don't get it. Premierships are built around recruiting well and teaching well. Lyon fails on both fronts. The playing list before he got there was playing in pre-lims and was primed for a premiership tilt. He lacks the flair and pazzazz and inspiration and that's all there is to it.
Lyon didn't recruit at the end of last year in the best interests of the footy club. That is a fact. Self preservation and a total lack of development and future planning for the playing list is unforgivable. I'm so glad to see the back of this bloke. I want to see young guys get a go and I want to see the next Bazza or Plugga or Spider or Barks be given a go and be told by the senior coach that he trusts the kid to be a valuable member and a required palyer in the senior group.
We get on this forum and we are passionate about our footy team and that's great, but lets please not bitch and fight about the loss of a bloke who proved by his actions and by his words that he was not passionate about the Saints.
We are passionate about our players, because they are fundamentally the reason the club exists. Your username says what? oh that's right it says 'barks'!!! It doesn't say Jeans although he is a Legend and a hero to us all. Point is, half the usernames on here have something to do with great players that are currently on the list or have played for the Sainters in years gone by. The club lives and breathes solely based on the support and adulation and following of Saints fans and supporters who love their players. Our development of new stars has been shite.
In the five years that Lyon has been at our club, I have not seen a debutant been given a go by Lyon and told we will blood you as a forward. In the five years Lyon was -yes it's important to start using and emphasing was - at our great club he did not bring in a debutant and stick him in the backline and say; 'Son, I trust that you'll do a good job. I want you to be the next Spud Frawley at this club.'
I was bloody jealous of seeing Heppel and Rowan from the Swans and Isaac Smith and all the guys at the Demons and even at some of the other clubs where they'd bring in a young guy and just fully back them and give them lots of games in their first year. We've got a kid on our list for goodness sake that is Cuz's cuz. I want to see the kid play. That's right; I pay my membership and I want to see Nicholas Winmar get games. Now that this negative boring pr##k has gone I'll enjoy watching my team again.
pure gold mate...where have you been...this forum needs posters like you....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
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SainterK wrote:Wonder why didn't the other clubs go for him?
Melbourne, Freo, Dogs?
Really? According to the media, the Dees were very interested in Ross.
not according to garry lyon...they didn't even speak to him.....they knew who they wanted and it wasn't judas.....
the point is that there was a perception that there was a lot of interest in Ross and that he had an out cluase in his contract. he ended up getting a $1.5 million contract out of the media frenzy becuae his mate like Walls kept talking and writing about it as well as dropping that he had a get out clause....dah...
the dees had aklready selected their new coach when the news that judas had walked out on the saints broke.....the simple fact is that the dees were not interested in lyon.....have a look at the timing if you don't believe me......
i don't disagree on you comments about that prick walls though.....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
degruch wrote:
The notion that the St Kilda footy club said "Great to have you onboard Ross and, don't forget, if you don't like it at any stage, we've made sure we've built in a handy get out clause to allow you to leave" is hilarious. It was designed to protect us, not Ross.
B4E is happily making statements to this effect.
Man, no I am not saying anything of the sort.... you're seriously misunderstanding and assuming something I never actually even wrote!
The board inserted the get out CLAUSES
It is only fair that Ross Lyon in turn had the same option in the event he chose to leave once the board introduced them into the scheme of things!
I have no doubt whatsoever that the board inserted them so as to protect themselves BUT in the end it finished up backfiring on them!
you know what i think i think that 3 month cluase was due to GT when we sacked him. i think the board at that time was worried about what could happen with the next coach so they tried to hedge their bets.
By the way that first contract with that clause was not from this current board but with Butterrs. After that his next contract was just an extension of three years
bigcarl wrote:The shock's obviously still wearing off on Rooey. A bit of denial there.
Ask him again in another few months.
Yep, what would he know... most SS posters have a far better handle on events.
Riewoldt conceded that, in hindsight, it would have been ''great'' if the club had acted sooner to re-sign Lyon but understood why the deal wasn't done.
Teammate Brendon Goddard said he did not have a bad word to say about Lyon but admitted the way the coach left was disappointing.
''I don't think I'm hurt, I just think it's quite disappointing that it had to get to this stage … it's just sad that we had to get to this point and lose a quality coach and a quality person,'' he said on Channel Nine's Sunday Footy Show.
We've lost a great coach that we should've had contractually locked up, it seems he didn't technically break his contract, rather he exercised a (club inserted) get-out clause, yes he walked away and it was ugly and nasty, and seemingly unethical and mercenary in its execution, but there was obviously some serious friction between him and the board....
It's done, we move on... but let's not pretend this is a good outcome and we're well rid of him, or we couldn't/shouldn't have prevented it. It's a f**k up, plain and simple. Hope we don't follow it with another.
