Gram - we have lost the hunger

[markp]

The problem isn't really what he said, it's where he said it... it's another example of slipping discipline, and a bit 'me first'... something Aker might have done.

If he has the stones and something to say, then say it to their faces and away from the media spotlight.

Reflects a mindset that is part of the problem, I'd have thought, not the solution.

And Hayes (or Harves) would NEVER say anything like that.

[InkerSaint]

I think being 27, playing 120 odd games, a runner up best and farest.....means he is probably senior enough and good enough to critisise a poor effort?.....

Yep, and if he had simply stuck to that, Goddard probably would have backed him for a start.

[maverick]

I think being 27, playing 120 odd games, a runner up best and farest.....means he is probably senior enough and good enough to critisise a poor effort?.....

and don't forget (almost) equal Norm Smith Medalist
Agree completely.

[starsign]

on SEN.

- Blokes still thinking about 2 lost GF's
- need to get over it
- hunger to win not there
- RL told the group that there will be an injection of youth (hopefully Stanley, Jack and heyne at least)
- some players are just looking to play out their last year.

Pretty strong stuff.'

However on the past two performances, we wont even make the eight.

Do we have to go backwards this year to have a crack in 2012?

[starsign]

on SEN.

- Blokes still thinking about 2 lost GF's
- need to get over it
- hunger to win not there
- RL told the group that there will be an injection of youth (hopefully Stanley, Jack and heyne at least)
- some players are just looking to play out their last year.

Pretty strong stuff.'

However on the past two performances, we wont even make the eight.

Do we have to go backwards this year to have a crack in 2012?

Whoa!! Hold the wedding !

maybe we are all missing the point here!
Read the OP carefully !

It's purely ambiguous but for mine it reads like Grammy was possibly quoting RL HIMSELF!!

Joffas post in mere point form tells very little about who actually "said" these words
did Gram offer these sentiments as his own opinion or was he merely
reitterating what RL was spruking to the team after the game

This is quite significant to the whole argument that people then take up!!And how many peeps who have gone on bagging Grammy actually heard the SEN segment??
Joffa could well have set a few up here!! (and you wouldn't put it past the sly fox)

In the absence of important clarification from Joffa I would tend to think Grammy was only re-iterrating (don't know how to spell it) what the coach was actually on about and was referring to a general team attitude per se, and in some regard although the cap fitted for him he was only the messenger who all too many are quite quick and willing to shoot!!

I could well be barking up the wrong disappearing rainforest here , but it just doesn't quite add up

JB time for a little clarification M8!!

[sainter#4]

Maybe everyone will feel better after they read his tweet prior to the one in this thread...


gramsy_1 Pretty sure one 1 point lose, and 1 draw doesn't mean we are all over. We can and will turn it around very quickly
2 days ago

[Teflon]

Maybe everyone will feel better after they read his tweet prior to the one in this thread...


gramsy_1 Pretty sure one 1 point lose, and 1 draw doesn't mean we are all over. We can and will turn it around very quickly
2 days ago

Talk is cheap Grammy.

Interesting hearing Grant Thomas views on whether Gram has enough respect within the playing group to express those after game views - Thomas suggested he doesnt.

Put simply - I watched Gram pull out of a contest Friday, late in the game where I was really wanting to see him chuck the body in and give his all. He didnt, he squibbed with a "1 arm tackle" that wouldnt stop a poodle. Up till then I thought he'd gone ok.....but I havde to admit its not the first time Ive questioned Grams endeavour...

[defacto]

Maybe everyone will feel better after they read his tweet prior to the one in this thread...


gramsy_1 Pretty sure one 1 point lose, and 1 draw doesn't mean we are all over. We can and will turn it around very quickly
2 days ago

Talk is cheap Grammy.

Interesting hearing Grant Thomas views on whether Gram has enough respect within the playing group to express those after game views - Thomas suggested he doesnt.

Put simply - I watched Gram pull out of a contest Friday, late in the game where I was really wanting to see him chuck the body in and give his all. He didnt, he squibbed with a "1 arm tackle" that wouldnt stop a poodle. Up till then I thought he'd gone ok.....but I havde to admit its not the first time Ive questioned Grams endeavour...

thats the concerning part isnt it. he just doesnt want to put the effort in. he wants to coast through games.

[jmac101]

sure, gram might have been out of line a little and didn't play his best game on friday night.

BUT - he could have been a norm smith medallist in 2009. he really stood up that day.

also - i remember a 50-50 ball on the wing right in front of where i was sitting with about 10 seconds to go in GF1 where Gram went as hard as ever.

and in GF2 he got crunched early after the riewoldt goal square debarcle. he put his body on the line - was never the same after that in the game.

say what you want about him - he stood up on the big stage. grant thomas would do well to remember that.

[Johnny Member]

I have no problem with anyone saying anything about anyone! If it has a positive effect!

Gram can say what he likes, regardless of whether he's calling the kettle black - who knows he may have even been including himself.


Fact is, we've been up for a long time. And on two occasions have given it everything and still come up short. Must be very tough to emotionally stay at 110% at this time of the year knowing that in the back of your mind, whatever you do, however hard you train and try - it just may not be good enough to win a flag!

That's what drives players generally. The belief that if they train hard, play hard, stick to team rules, use discipline etc. etc. then they will win the flag.

I reckon it's fair that that belief would be being tested within the team. they've done it twice and still they found that it wasn't enough.


If it takes a senior player (regardless of who it is) to come out and put a rocket up everyone to get the hunger back and switch the guys on, then so be it!


As a supporter, I feel emotionally tired too! I have the feeling of 'why show up this week when we know it doesn't matter. It only matters on Grand Final day!'.

[spert]

I find it hard to be a critic of Gram as he proved his mettle in the 09 and 10 finals, it's up to others to stand up a bit and not leave the workload to a few.

[Dr Spaceman]

Interesting hearing Grant Thomas views on whether Gram has enough respect within the playing group to express those after game views - Thomas suggested he doesnt.

My take on that was that Grant was giving his view on Grammy when he was coach.

Quite a few years have passed since then. When Grant last barked out his orders Gram was a 22 year old. Does he know how things currently sit? As others have pointed out, Gram has done very well when it has mattered over the last couple of years and maybe he does now have the respect of the playing group.

Either Grant or someone else on the panel should have clarified that point.

[SENsei]

Maybe everyone will feel better after they read his tweet prior to the one in this thread...


gramsy_1 Pretty sure one 1 point lose, and 1 draw doesn't mean we are all over. We can and will turn it around very quickly
2 days ago

Talk is cheap Grammy.

Interesting hearing Grant Thomas views on whether Gram has enough respect within the playing group to express those after game views - Thomas suggested he doesnt.

Put simply - I watched Gram pull out of a contest Friday, late in the game where I was really wanting to see him chuck the body in and give his all. He didnt, he squibbed with a "1 arm tackle" that wouldnt stop a poodle. Up till then I thought he'd gone ok.....but I havde to admit its not the first time Ive questioned Grams endeavour...

Exactly what I think. If you talk the talk, you've got to walk the walk. Best to say nothing if you can't back up your words.

[fingers]

Maybe everyone will feel better after they read his tweet prior to the one in this thread...


gramsy_1 Pretty sure one 1 point lose, and 1 draw doesn't mean we are all over. We can and will turn it around very quickly
2 days ago

Talk is cheap Grammy.

Interesting hearing Grant Thomas views on whether Gram has enough respect within the playing group to express those after game views - Thomas suggested he doesnt.

Put simply - I watched Gram pull out of a contest Friday, late in the game where I was really wanting to see him chuck the body in and give his all. He didnt, he squibbed with a "1 arm tackle" that wouldnt stop a poodle. Up till then I thought he'd gone ok.....but I havde to admit its not the first time Ive questioned Grams endeavour...

The thing that I find frustrating is that he showed what he is capable of in 2009 GF.

[oh when]

We've won one flag in 114 years of AFL - and he is not hungry! please excuse me for being angry!

[joffaboy]

on SEN.

- Blokes still thinking about 2 lost GF's
- need to get over it
- hunger to win not there
- RL told the group that there will be an injection of youth (hopefully Stanley, Jack and heyne at least)
- some players are just looking to play out their last year.

Pretty strong stuff.'

However on the past two performances, we wont even make the eight.

Do we have to go backwards this year to have a crack in 2012?

Whoa!! Hold the wedding !

maybe we are all missing the point here!
Read the OP carefully !

It's purely ambiguous but for mine it reads like Grammy was possibly quoting RL HIMSELF!!

Joffas post in mere point form tells very little about who actually "said" these words
did Gram offer these sentiments as his own opinion or was he merely
reitterating what RL was spruking to the team after the game

This is quite significant to the whole argument that people then take up!!And how many peeps who have gone on bagging Grammy actually heard the SEN segment??
Joffa could well have set a few up here!! (and you wouldn't put it past the sly fox)

In the absence of important clarification from Joffa I would tend to think Grammy was only re-iterrating (don't know how to spell it) what the coach was actually on about and was referring to a general team attitude per se, and in some regard although the cap fitted for him he was only the messenger who all too many are quite quick and willing to shoot!!

I could well be barking up the wrong disappearing rainforest here , but it just doesn't quite add up

JB time for a little clarification M8!!

Thought it was clear that from my perspective he was re-iterating what had been discussed by him and the playing group post game.

He was in the rooms when interviewed. He didn't point fingers at others but included the whole group, which I would supposed himself included.

This assasination of Gram and the whole hysteria misses the point which is.

-The playing group is talking about hunger and they need to get over GF in 2010.
- they need to pull their gingers out
-RL is looking to inject youth into the team to get the spark back

These were the issues raised, not if Gram squibbed it r not on a tackle FFS.

The team is not in a good mindset and it looks like trouble, but most here don't want to face the issues raised and look at irrelevant side issues.

Read the OP and relate it to where we are.

-Slow
-Poor skills
-Mentally not switched on
-Game plan seems to be kick it to Riewoldt
-Lenny GONE

Face it - we are in more trouble than the early settlers. Dont frig about with side issues.

[joffaboy]

double post

[joffaboy]

We've won one flag in 114 years of AFL - and he is not hungry! please excuse me for being angry!

When did he say that?

Read the fkn OP

[SENsei]

Maybe then Gram was the wrong player to be saying it then.

And then Goddard refuted it on Ch10 later on I believe.

If Roo had've said it, it would be different.

[SainterK]

Not sure any of the football shows highlighted his comments because of his calls of injecting youth and grand final sadness JB.

It was because he said some old guys playing their last year were just going through the motions.

Edit

Someone else to add to the list distancing themselves from Grams comments.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/l ... 6033901203

Captain Nick Riewoldt, preparing for his 200th AFL game, refuted a suggestion by teammate Jason Gram that the psychological strain of two long and arduous failed premiership campaigns may have mentally wearied the group.

"If you had been a fly on the wall right over pre-season and seen the players the way they have functioned, the way they have attacked their training, what this group wants to achieve and the hunger and desire is well and truly still alive,'' Riewoldt said.

[Animal Enclosure]

Gram's interview reminded me of one that Travis Cloke did a few years back.

I don't think his brain was in gear & he just rambled with whatever came out of his mouth.

Gram, Montagna & Dal Santo are all potential elite players that always let us down when they are needed most. Put Steve Baker's commitment & ticker into any of those blokes & you'd have a superstar

[maverick]

Gram's interview reminded me of one that Travis Cloke did a few years back.

I don't think his brain was in gear & he just rambled with whatever came out of his mouth.

Gram, Montagna & Dal Santo are all potential elite players that always let us down when they are needed most. Put Steve Baker's commitment & ticker into any of those blokes & you'd have a superstar

Really, so the 2009 GF doesn't count.
This thread has become laughable.
Which part of WHAT Grammy said was incorrect?

[asiu]

lol @

Face it - we are in more trouble than the early settlers.

essendon will do us by 11 bloody goals

[Teflon]

Gram's interview reminded me of one that Travis Cloke did a few years back.

I don't think his brain was in gear & he just rambled with whatever came out of his mouth.

Gram, Montagna & Dal Santo are all potential elite players that always let us down when they are needed most. Put Steve Baker's commitment & ticker into any of those blokes & you'd have a superstar

Really, so the 2009 GF doesn't count.
This thread has become laughable.
Which part of WHAT Grammy said was incorrect?

Oh FFS to all those lauding Grams "great game in 2009" FFS its 2 years ago. He's had ferk all since and the gap between his best and worst after all this time is enormous - great players close that gap.

Grams long had questions asked about his attack on the ball - Ive seen and noted it a lot. He tackles 1 handed, rarely ever puts his head over a ball or lays a bone crunching EFFECTIVE tackle that includes putting his friggin shoulder into it. Its not about doing it once - this sorta commitment is expected. You dont have to ask Hayes or even Baker twice here.

I've no problem with what he actually said. Im more annoyed he felt he was the man to do it and Im not convinced he was including himself in that "informed opinion". Those sort of comments need to come from a player universally respected in and out of the team to have the right effect IMO - Gram aint that. TBH IF Cripps came good and could string together a few decent performances I had him sitting on Grams HBF.

All that aside he definately plays this week cause of nothing else he's just strapped an enormous expectation on his back that he now has to live up to.

[maverick]

Gram's interview reminded me of one that Travis Cloke did a few years back.

I don't think his brain was in gear & he just rambled with whatever came out of his mouth.

Gram, Montagna & Dal Santo are all potential elite players that always let us down when they are needed most. Put Steve Baker's commitment & ticker into any of those blokes & you'd have a superstar

Really, so the 2009 GF doesn't count.
This thread has become laughable.
Which part of WHAT Grammy said was incorrect?

Oh FFS to all those lauding Grams "great game in 2009" FFS its 2 years ago. He's had ferk all since and the gap between his best and worst after all this time is enormous - great players close that gap.

Grams long had questions asked about his attack on the ball - Ive seen and noted it a lot. He tackles 1 handed, rarely ever puts his head over a ball or lays a bone crunching EFFECTIVE tackle that includes putting his friggin shoulder into it. Its not about doing it once - this sorta commitment is expected. You dont have to ask Hayes or even Baker twice here.

I've no problem with what he actually said. Im more annoyed he felt he was the man to do it and Im not convinced he was including himself in that "informed opinion". Those sort of comments need to come from a player universally respected in and out of the team to have the right effect IMO - Gram aint that. TBH IF Cripps came good and could string together a few decent performances I had him sitting on Grams HBF.

All that aside he definately plays this week cause of nothing else he's just strapped an enormous expectation on his back that he now has to live up to.

Ypu do realise the 2009 GF was 1 year and 2 games ago, and he was injured all of last year?

Looks like we need a scape goat eh?

For a bunch of supporters that supposedly demand success, I can't believe we have a crack at the first bloke to agree, because he is not the hard man of the team.