The New Structure

[saint patrick]

After a few weeks to think about it I think it's just imperative that we reinvent ourselves..not wholesale changes but a serious tweak or two.

These changes involve postional structure and system.We must work on our ability to take risks in setting up attacks.Although I didn't agree with all of Grant Thomas's assessment re our playing style I think he was on the money in that our defensive style has been the bench mark for several seasons but that in attack there was a tendancy to play safe and hold onto the ball and that this had somewhat stiffled the attacking instincts of the team as a whole.

Structurally I think our defence is very good but we need to ramp up the ability to break the lines from this part of the ground.

IN:Miles,R.Clarke Out:Baker ,Dempster

Both Bakes and Dempster have been great servants but their negating abilitys have not matched their ability in hurting teams going the other way with pace in recent times.

Mid field: In- Armitage and Steven...think these two will add enormous grunt to assist Lenny , Dal and Monty and both have great goal sense.

Forward: In :Goddard,Stanley,Walsh ? Out: Kosi and Macqualter.

After this finals series are convinced that Goddards true position is Centre Half Forward.Leave him there next year for the whole year and he could kick 80 plus.Stanley has shown enough this year that with a year in the gym he could become a pivotal player in our structure.Is quick and presents very well and despite his lean frame was good at the defensive stuff as well.

Rucks:Kosi must now be delisted,traded or play fulltime in the ruck.
Gardiner and McEnvoy to fight over the last postion.

Would also take Riewoldt away from the forward line and tell him to roam far and wide as a genuine ruck rover..

My lineup with these changes in mind early season would look like this

Backs Miles Dawson Gwilt
H/B Gram Fisher R.Clarke
C Montagna Armitage Dal Santo
H/F Schneider Goddard Gilbert
f Milne Stanley Steven

Rucks :Gardiner,Riewoldt ,Hayes


Inter:Kosi, Blake,Ray,Walsh

edited!!!

Just so important we have a new more mobile and attacking structure that eliminates our dependancy on Kosi and Roo forward and introduces some pace and x factor with Goddard ,Gilbert and possibly Walsh forward and some youthful legs midfield...its now or never boys

[chook23]

fisher?

BJ genuine utility...he is the roamer.....would be jumped on inthe hardest position on field CHF

Roo is a key fwd.

Not sure on Armo.......slow

[saint patrick]

fisher?

BJ genuine utility...he is the roamer.....would be jumped on inthe hardest position on field CHF

Roo is a key fwd.

How could I forget Fisher...been a long day

Still think Riewoldt would be great as ruck rover instead of being 3 teamed as a forward!

[Enrico_Misso]

Agree with BJ to CHF.
Maybe Roo to CHB to become our playmaker without the pressure of having to kick goals.

And that also puts Blake's spot in doubt particularly when you include Fish.

[#1GILL]

I would think that Jones holds his spot.

[chook23]

Why BJ to CHF......they will jump on him/double team etc

Roo has bulked up from the day he played on wing........

CHB dont think so

IS A GUN CHF/FF...has proved it over nearly 200 games

1st GF was very good

2nd struggled like many......very poor supply

[saint patrick]

I would think that Jones holds his spot.

Holy crap I've lost the plot..just a few reds and this is what happens!!!

Jones in and someone out...Reckon Geary would be in the mix as well.

Will have the team list in front of me next time

[#1GILL]

I would think that Jones holds his spot.

Holy crap I've lost the plot..just a few reds and this is what happens!!!

Jones in and someone out...Reckon Geary would be in the mix as well.

Will have the team list in front of me next time

All good. It's not that out of the question, and I wasn't having a go for leaving him out.
I just thought that he will hold his spot.

[FQF]

Opposition coaches would be absolutely licking their lips at this team.

1. Having Goddard in a set position is shooting ourselves in the foot. Many scream out for him to play one role, but as a roamer who plays in different positions every quater, let alone every game, he is virtually impossible to plan for. This is his weapon!!

2. Roo is hands down the number one CHF in the league, possibly in the last decade. He would be an average rover at BEST. The way to deal with the double teaming is to play other forwards who demand close checking. That means, no Mcqualter and no Eddy in our forward 6!

[Zippy]

Regarding moving Reiwoldt, I'd like to suggest one of the key principles of assigning players to positions is the following:

When you have a four-time AA CHF, the best in the comp, you don't play him anywhere other than CHF.

What he needs is support and other credible targets - moving gilbert to the HFF will do that nicely.

Goddard's become one of the most valuable players in the comp in his current role - while I'd like to see him spend more time forward, I trust in the coaching staff's ability to move him where he's needed or let him write his own ticket as appropriate.

Kosi to the ruck I agree with - it'll get him into gqmes more, he can swing forward, and I'm optimistic about the results of King working with him over the summer.

I definitely like your pacing of Steven into the 22 - I have high hopes for him.

[saint patrick]

The way to deal with the double teaming is to play other forwards who demand close checking. That means, no Mcqualter and no Eddy in our forward 6!

Agree 100 % on this point !!!

[Teflon]

I agree with a key part of your post St Pat and that is we MUST break the over reliance on Riewoldt/Kosi for goals. We MUST get goals from midfield - this would be new for a St Kilda team and it has to start here.

Ive actually not minded Dal Santo fwd on occasion....reckon hes clever enough round goals to either kick it or set us up....

[vacuous space]

Kosi to the ruck is pretty likely, IMO. With the interchange rule changes it's pretty much got to be Blake, Kosi or Stanley as the second ruck or we blow our mid rotations.

I'd like to see us rotate our mids up front and vice versa. We had some success with Schneider in the middle this year. Milne had a nice cameo in finals running in off the wing. Eddy, Geary, Mini and Steven can all play there. Aside from keeping guys fresher off a shorter bench, it might give Joey and Dal a bit more time on the outside to create. It'd also keeps guys in the game. Starvation forward is a pretty tough gig.

Gilbert and Goddard to move around and create havoc. Blake, Dawson, Fisher and Gwilt to anchor the backline.

Eddy's GF spot disappears with the rule change. There's two spots in the backline for Baker, Dempster, Geary and Miles to fight over. Peake will have to hold off a host of players to keep his spot. There's probably one spot up forward for Mini, Steven or anyone else who might want to play there.

So when is the intrasquad already?

[SaintWodonga]

The way to deal with the double teaming is to play other forwards who demand close checking. That means, no Mcqualter and no Eddy in our forward 6!

Agree 100 % on this point !!!

+1

[Teflon]

Kosi to the ruck is pretty likely, IMO. With the interchange rule changes it's pretty much got to be Blake, Kosi or Stanley as the second ruck or we blow our mid rotations.

I'd like to see us rotate our mids up front and vice versa. We had some success with Schneider in the middle this year. Milne had a nice cameo in finals running in off the wing. Eddy, Geary, Mini and Steven can all play there. Aside from keeping guys fresher off a shorter bench, it might give Joey and Dal a bit more time on the outside to create. It'd also keeps guys in the game. Starvation forward is a pretty tough gig.

Gilbert and Goddard to move around and create havoc. Blake, Dawson, Fisher and Gwilt to anchor the backline.

Eddy's GF spot disappears with the rule change. There's two spots in the backline for Baker, Dempster, Geary and Miles to fight over. Peake will have to hold off a host of players to keep his spot. There's probably one spot up forward for Mini, Steven or anyone else who might want to play there.

So when is the intrasquad already?

Agree with much of that.

One comment from Collingwood and its not surprising you hear often - they have great rotations through the middle......perhaps us giving some of these guys more time through there will, as you say, enable the Joeys/Dals greater chance to create.

[bigcarl]

The way to deal with the double teaming is to play other forwards who demand close checking.6!

Agree 100 % on this point !!!

+2

Make their defenders worry more about shutting down our forwards.

[vacuous space]

One comment from Collingwood and its not surprising you hear often - they have great rotations through the middle......perhaps us giving some of these guys more time through there will, as you say, enable the Joeys/Dals greater chance to create.

There's no doubt I'm playing follow the leader a bit here. I'm looking specifically at Didak and what he was able to do with less centre square responsibilities. Dal's silky left boot might be a little better if he's not gassed from doing the grunt work that Luke Ba- I mean, David Armitage - can do. Perhaps we ease up Jones' defensive responsibilities. He's really quite good in the centre when he's not holding somebody's leash.

[Teflon]

One comment from Collingwood and its not surprising you hear often - they have great rotations through the middle......perhaps us giving some of these guys more time through there will, as you say, enable the Joeys/Dals greater chance to create.

There's no doubt I'm playing follow the leader a bit here. I'm looking specifically at Didak and what he was able to do with less centre square responsibilities. Dal's silky left boot might be a little better if he's not gassed from doing the grunt work that Luke Ba- I mean, David Armitage - can do. Perhaps we ease up Jones' defensive responsibilities. He's really quite good in the centre when he's not holding somebody's leash.

Yeah I agree re Dal - I think hes looked very good fwd and dangerous as he can use it.

I agree overall we have to find that flexibility in the middle - Armitage to help Hayes is a must IMO. I will be very interested to see how Raph Clarke is used when coming back......hes a smoky up the ground for mine although Gwilt IMO could now also do this.......Gwilts new found confidence/foot skills could be handy out of centre square (though I admit we will lose a bit of his surety/skills down back)...he's also got a great frame to bustle through the middle....

[awesome_days]

May have posted this elsewhere but, we have a number of known quantites/vetrans that have a fixed performance level and a number of unknows that have a variable performance level.

Our improvement comes with our variable performers performing greater than our fixed performers.

We should start the year looking to play our 2nd, 3rd and 4th year draftees:

From GF1 team

Backs:
In: Miles, Clarke
Out: Dempster, Baker

B: Miles Dawson Fisher
HB: Gwilt Blake Clarke

Forwards
In: Gilbert* Goddard* Steven
Out: Koschitzke* Schneider* McQualter

HF: Goddard Gilbert Dal Santo
F: Milner Riewoldt Steven

Midfield:
In: McEvoy Armitage
Out: Gardiner Eddy

C: Gram Armitage Montagna
R: McEvoy Hayes Schneider

Bench: Jones Peake Koschitzke Ray

Overall:
In: McEvoy Armitage Miles Clarke Steven
Out: Gardiner Eddy Baker Demptster McQualter

Emergencies:
Variables: Stanley Walsh Gartener Lynch Simpkin Smith Heyne Winmar Geary
Knowns: Gardiner Eddy Baker Demptster McQualter

I would be happy with any of the "Ins" to be interchanged with the Variable squad or draftee if they impress over the pre-season.

The knowns can come in if our variables are found out to be non-performers.

Also be good to save Gardiner for a late season surge as he as run out of legs 2 years in a row now.

[Calais]

Here's my team - Something a little different ;



Woops, forgot Jones. Replace Ray with Jones

[Teflon]

May have posted this elsewhere but, we have a number of known quantites/vetrans that have a fixed performance level and a number of unknows that have a variable performance level.

Our improvement comes with our variable performers performing greater than our fixed performers.

We should start the year looking to play our 2nd, 3rd and 4th year draftees:

From GF1 team

Backs:
In: Miles, Clarke
Out: Dempster, Baker

B: Miles Dawson Fisher
HB: Gwilt Blake Clarke

Forwards
In: Gilbert* Goddard* Steven
Out: Koschitzke* Schneider* McQualter

HF: Goddard Gilbert Dal Santo
F: Milner Riewoldt Steven

Midfield:
In: McEvoy Armitage
Out: Gardiner Eddy

C: Gram Armitage Montagna
R: McEvoy Hayes Schneider

Bench: Jones Peake Koschitzke Ray

Overall:
In: McEvoy Armitage Miles Clarke Steven
Out: Gardiner Eddy Baker Demptster McQualter

Emergencies:
Variables: Stanley Walsh Gartener Lynch Simpkin Smith Heyne Winmar Geary
Knowns: Gardiner Eddy Baker Demptster McQualter

I would be happy with any of the "Ins" to be interchanged with the Variable squad or draftee if they impress over the pre-season.

The knowns can come in if our variables are found out to be non-performers.

Also be good to save Gardiner for a late season surge as he as run out of legs 2 years in a row now.

Id go along with all that makes sense.

We have to improve thems the facts IMO Eddy/Mqualters/Bakes/Dempster aint gonna get us that.

Hope a variable or 2 really stands up to put pressure on.

[gringo]

I am of the opinion that it isn't our team structure but game plan that needs the overhaul.

I would try a more attacking game through quick ball use and really have them spread a lot quicker for the ball carrier.

I think our real achilles heal is the dour ball movement going forward. I think the way the pies play a more traditional press and unmanned zone are going to mean we need to adapt to them as well That means less tagging and more winning your own ball.

It will be therefore harder to get a game for guys like mini unless he can re invent himself, guys that can kick midfield goals would be good so big preseasons from Steven and Armo are needed.

[rodgerfox]

Look, the big issue is the coach.

He's a good coach, and had a very good year last year.

It seems that his philosophy is one that will ensure we're a very good team for an extended period of time, and pretty much every week will be in the game.

We're very consistent, due to the philosophies of the coach.

Now most will see that as a positive, and in most aspects they are right.


However the theory that 'if we keep making the top 4 then the law of averages says we'll win a flag' is quite frankly - a crock of shiit.

To win the GF, you need to be the best, stand out team on GF day. The only way you can pinch a flag by being 'consistently good' as opposed to 'a stand out team on the day' is if your opponent falls over.


The way we play, and with the players recruited and selected - we won't be that stand out team.
We'll most likely be a top 4 team for another couple of years. But we won't win a GF.

People will say 'but we were close two years in a row'. And this is true - but close isn't good enough.

Geelong were able to turn it on in the last 15 minutes and break the game open.

We nearly pinched it against Collingwood in week 1 this year, because they nearly tripped over. Once they regrouped the week after, our consistently uncreative style of football got blown away by a stand out team.


The Sydney approach has been the same. The only reason they won a flag was (as I touched on earlier) that the teams around them tripped up. Had Geelong and us not broken down in 05, then West Coast lose key players before and during that GF - their method and Paul Roos' coaching career would have gone down in history as a failure.


So basically, we will not win a flag until our structure and system becomes more flexible, to allow us to not just 'be in the top 4 teams in the comp', but to utilise the freak talent we have in the top half of the list to make us capable of being a stand out team.


In racing terms, we've been trained from a potentially brilliant stayer with a great turn of foot, to a dour 2 miler that will still be plugging away in the straight - but will always meet some up and comer that can sprint.

[fugazi]

Out: Peake, Baker, Eddy, Dempster, McQualter

In: Steven, Miles, Stanley, Armitage, Raph

Kosi to 2nd ruck

Goddard wing/HFF - need him around the 50m arc causing turnovers and setting up forwards

Will add significant pace, and difficult for defences to rebound against a forard line like that.

[samoht]

We have an iffy/one dimensional and unproductive forward line - with one key go to target and too many small forwards that don't handle the finals pressure too well.
We need to find/develop a couple of mid sized, agile goal kicking forwards/midfielders... to replace our small forwards.
How - where do we find them ? .. that's the difficult part.
Collingwood's forward line isn't any better - as far as their forward six is concenred .. but they have a lot of mid sized goal kickers and midfielders that help kick goals... and they don't have small forwards that get pushed around.

We need more quality midfielders too - Lenny is carrying our midfield almost singlehandedly whereas Collingwood has Sidebottom, Shaw, Thomas, Didak who gather possessions and provide run and midfield support to Pendlebury, the mercenary Ball and Swan.

Game plans cannot overcome our structural deficiencies - we will probably finish a distant second next year.