Jack Bytell Spine.

[shanegrambeau]

See the comment on the AFL website. It’s always interesting, but often frustrating, to get different points of view when you do a web search about health science etc.

I noticed a lot of websites stating that these kinds of problems can be fully recoverable and that 90% of athletes, if managed properly, can fully recover in performance. However, looking at Jumping Jack Hawkins’s story from Geelong in 2013, trusty Dr. Larkins had this to say, (Jack was 25 then)

"At his age, it's not great to have because it means he's always going have a weakness in his back as he gets older.”

Larkin’s went on to say that it can be a chronic sort of thing and that,” you can’t put toothpaste back in the tube, all grapes become raisins” etc. as he related the disk scenario to the common man like me,( St Kilda’s preeminent Ruckman of the ‘70s.)

We have picked up a lot of wounded soldiers in this draft.What is your take on this kind of injury?

[fugazi]

Jack Bytel seems to have had lumbar end plate fractures followed by a disc bulge/s(?)....not a great combo, as you have reduced integrity from both the vertebra and the disc.
It largely depends on the extent of it....minor bulges are very different to major ones.

Usually those injuries have a fair bit to do with shearing stress across the low back, torque or rotational forces.
Often see it prematurely in squash players for instance or on tradies doing lots of shovelling while they twist...the back hates it. Kids who sleep face down and are twisted the whole night often are prone to these sorts of injuries also young fast bowlers with mixed actions .

I'm sure they will go to town on young Jack and a combination of retraining habits, core strengthening and physio/ chiro will give him the best chance.
Calculated risk though as extracting the footy from clearances is exactly the combination of flexion and rotation ( while being tackled) that stresses the low back.

[SaintPav]

Up until last week, he was working at a pub pulling beers, probably changing kegs over etc so it can’t be that bad...

[shanegrambeau]

Up until last week, he was working at a pub pulling beers, probably changing kegs over etc so it can’t be that bad...

Actually given Fugazi’s comment, it makes it worse if worse is what you are looking for.
Anyway, no more kegs for Jack, that’s for sure.

[DJ Higgins]

Jack Bytel seems to have had lumbar end plate fractures followed by a disc bulge/s(?)....not a great combo, as you have reduced integrity from both the vertebra and the disc.
It largely depends on the extent of it....minor bulges are very different to major ones.

Usually those injuries have a fair bit to do with shearing stress across the low back, torque or rotational forces.
Often see it prematurely in squash players for instance or on tradies doing lots of shovelling while they twist...the back hates it. Kids who sleep face down and are twisted the whole night often are prone to these sorts of injuries also young fast bowlers with mixed actions .

I'm sure they will go to town on young Jack and a combination of retraining habits, core strengthening and physio/ chiro will give him the best chance.
Calculated risk though as extracting the footy from clearances is exactly the combination of flexion and rotation ( while being tackled) that stresses the low back.

But not a risk we needed t take, We didn't need another inside mid let alone a broken one. Could be a costly mistake again

[magnifisaint]

Jack Bytel seems to have had lumbar end plate fractures followed by a disc bulge/s(?)....not a great combo, as you have reduced integrity from both the vertebra and the disc.
It largely depends on the extent of it....minor bulges are very different to major ones.

Usually those injuries have a fair bit to do with shearing stress across the low back, torque or rotational forces.
Often see it prematurely in squash players for instance or on tradies doing lots of shovelling while they twist...the back hates it. Kids who sleep face down and are twisted the whole night often are prone to these sorts of injuries also young fast bowlers with mixed actions .

I'm sure they will go to town on young Jack and a combination of retraining habits, core strengthening and physio/ chiro will give him the best chance.
Calculated risk though as extracting the footy from clearances is exactly the combination of flexion and rotation ( while being tackled) that stresses the low back.

But not a risk we needed t take, We didn't need another inside mid let alone a broken one. Could be a costly mistake again

Let's wait and see.
No such thing as reward without risk

[CQ SAINT]

I hope this kid gets his fitness right. Looks a very good footballer. From his highlights, he reminds me a bit of Greg Burns. Strong, good decision maker, finds time and uses it well.

[shanegrambeau]

Greg Burns!! Love it. As Fugisa says, (seems like u know ur stuff Mr Fug!) it seems like a less-than-ideal injury to have, and he was loading kegs in a pub off a truck, it sounds exactly like the kind of injury Fugisa mentions tradies and ditch diggers. I hope it wasn’t a case of an immature body trying to a mans work to be “one of the men” etc. Anyway, fingers crossed. I think I am not alone in thinking that risk-taking is just something we are gonna do because of our lowly status.

[saintspremiers]

I prefer to fantasise about new draftees every December and assign appropriate nicknames.

Jimmy Bytell will be the next Bartel because they have similar sounding names of you replace Jack with Jimmy

Please wake me when we are 0-6

[Sainter_Dad]

Please wake me when we are 0-6

When did we start listing losses before wins in a win/loss ratio???? Is it because it is cricket season and you are used to Overseas cricket scores of 400/8??

[guitars4]

I hope this kid gets his fitness right. Looks a very good footballer. From his highlights, he reminds me a bit of Greg Burns. Strong, good decision maker, finds time and uses it well.

I like his highlights too but I really don't like his injury status . Chronic back injuries are very difficult to overcome so I'm not convinced that it was a good pick . I hope he prove me wrong.

[Scollop]

We are talking about his spine. This is not a muscle injury or a tendon injury, which in themselves can be career ending.

The medical staff need to put this kid on a program to repair and strengthen his back and the leadership team need to instruct him ( including Lethlean, Richardson, Finnis and Geary) to forget about 2019 as year in which he targets playing footy...i.e treat it like an acl or treat it like a 12 month injury and do not put any more pressure on that spine

Lots of AFL Clubs invest 3-4 years on some guys and they turn out to be fizzers or they just can't get over their injuries. If Jack has potential I don't want our club stuffing up his chances of a full recovery. The kid might think he's invincible and he can get over the pain or the short term issues, but he needs to be told by his new employer that he has no option but to rehab and make sure that he gains enough strength before he tries to start thinking about competitive footy

And no more lifting heavy objects pleas FFS

[Devilhead]

Can anyone recall any other AFL players who have had a similar injury and whether t severely affected their playing career?

[chico2001]

Put Garry Lyon out of the game, he had a bulged disc. He had already played over 200 games though. He had the op but I think it got him in the end.

[SuperDuper]

I hope this kid gets his fitness right. Looks a very good footballer. From his highlights, he reminds me a bit of Greg Burns. Strong, good decision maker, finds time and uses it well.

I love the Greg Burns comparison. Spot on. Burns was a strong bodied midfielder who could turn onto either leg. The way they turn and their running styles of short steps just have something similar about them.

[shanegrambeau]

I love the Greg Burns comparison..... The way they turn and their running styles of short steps just have something similar about them.

And it is precisely the turn that I think Dr. Fugisa is alluding to, causing torsion strain. If cricketers (Seamers) also get it, many seem to work through it and continue their career. Look at Lillie, Thommo etc., who kept playing at a slower pace, and even Steven Waugh, who was a sharp bowler for a while, and returned post-injury into a gentle but clever medium pacer. So hoping quick turns is not the only thing Jack brings.

[ace]

Don't rush him just because the coaches job is on the line.

[samoht]

Don't rush him just because the coaches job is on the line.

"coach's" .. we injuneers are all the same.

[ace]

https://www.spine-health.com/video/herniated-disc-video

It is a Napoleon problem. A hernia (bulging) of the squishy bit that keeps the spinal bones apart.

[samoht]

https://www.spine-health.com/video/herniated-disc-video

Hopefully it's not a herniated disk .... according to this excerpt, it's worse than a bulging disk?

"Herniated disks are also called ruptured disks or slipped disks, although the whole disk does not rupture or slip. Only the small area of the crack is affected. Compared with a bulging disk, a herniated disk is more likely to cause pain because it generally protrudes farther and is more likely to irritate nerve roots."

Sounds like "herniated disk" is the next phase?

I've had sciatica (pressure on the sciatic nerve) ... and, apart from the pain, I couldn't even stand up for more than a minute, at its worst. Your legs can't hold your weight (both my legs were affected at the time).
It subsided after a week - but I have to constantly watch my back, and not twist, etc..

[chico2001]

He is a young buck and will get the best medical attention but it might take a while for him to get playing again.