Great insights by David King
Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 258
- Joined: Sat 26 Apr 2008 11:30pm
- Location: Beaconsfield
- Been thanked: 5 times
- bigred
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 11463
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 7:39am
- Has thanked: 25 times
- Been thanked: 609 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Just look at that last example from Lonie....
"Now the ball is loose, it gives St. Kilda a rough chance. Black. Good handpass. Voss. Schwarze now, the defender, can run and from a long way".....
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 25303
- Joined: Tue 01 Feb 2005 4:25pm
- Location: Trump Tower
- Has thanked: 142 times
- Been thanked: 284 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Good article. Another nail in the Richo case.
0-4 and 54% against the Top 8 says it all.
In the scheme of things, three good ol’ floggings in the next 3 weeks makes Richo’s job untenable in the short term, which would expediate things nicely.
It would be ugly to watch, both on and off field, but would be for the greater long term good.
As Firey would say, I’m torn!
0-4 and 54% against the Top 8 says it all.
In the scheme of things, three good ol’ floggings in the next 3 weeks makes Richo’s job untenable in the short term, which would expediate things nicely.
It would be ugly to watch, both on and off field, but would be for the greater long term good.
As Firey would say, I’m torn!
i am Melbourne Skies - sometimes Blue Skies, Grey Skies, even Partly Cloudy Skies.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4241
- Joined: Fri 15 Sep 2006 10:35am
- Location: earth
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 1390 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Bomb it to the goal square is clearly a coaching instruction....totally dumb. WE've been howling abut it all year, and yet our multi-million dollar coaching team can't get it into their thick skulls that to is a useless, outdated, and self destructive strategy. You could pay a local thirds coach 20k a year to do the same, save a tone of money, and get the same outcomes.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 25303
- Joined: Tue 01 Feb 2005 4:25pm
- Location: Trump Tower
- Has thanked: 142 times
- Been thanked: 284 times
Re: Great insights by David King
But Richo on his Holman YouTube post match clips wants to be able to say “I thought we did really well to get more inside 50’s then <insert team>, we just failed to convert or keep it in there”cwrcyn wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 6:33am Bomb it to the goal square is clearly a coaching instruction....totally dumb. WE've been howling abut it all year, and yet our multi-million dollar coaching team can't get it into their thick skulls that to is a useless, outdated, and self destructive strategy. You could pay a local thirds coach 20k a year to do the same, save a tone of money, and get the same outcomes.
i am Melbourne Skies - sometimes Blue Skies, Grey Skies, even Partly Cloudy Skies.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 1075
- Joined: Thu 11 Mar 2004 5:59pm
- Location: Aisle 36
- Been thanked: 38 times
Re: Great insights by David King
My father contacted the club after the JLT series and vented his spleen about our constant bombing off the ball to the top of the square .
Asked the question what they had spent the summer working on?
To the clubs credit he received a reply stating that they had identified this as an issue and that it would be addressed before the season proper and that it was not the coaches instruction to do so.
Yet here we sit half a season later with the same issue, so if we take the response on face value and it is not the instruction from Richo then either the players are not listening or are not capable of lowering their eyes. Either way it is Richo's responsibility to have addressed and fixed the situation.
It is dumb football, Predictable and easy to defend against.
They need to start dropping repeat offenders or we are just accepting the behaviour , if I was coach I would tear strips of players who do this.
Metres gained is such a crap stat, should be metres gained and a team mate ends up with ball.
Savage, Ross and Newnes are all players who simply kick the ball long the majority of the time bombing it in, all would be high up in metres gained. White is another who despite looking like a lovely kick has a habit of just kicking it as far as he can.
Personally I find it hard to believe that this is not instructed as Sandy do the same thing.
Asked the question what they had spent the summer working on?
To the clubs credit he received a reply stating that they had identified this as an issue and that it would be addressed before the season proper and that it was not the coaches instruction to do so.
Yet here we sit half a season later with the same issue, so if we take the response on face value and it is not the instruction from Richo then either the players are not listening or are not capable of lowering their eyes. Either way it is Richo's responsibility to have addressed and fixed the situation.
It is dumb football, Predictable and easy to defend against.
They need to start dropping repeat offenders or we are just accepting the behaviour , if I was coach I would tear strips of players who do this.
Metres gained is such a crap stat, should be metres gained and a team mate ends up with ball.
Savage, Ross and Newnes are all players who simply kick the ball long the majority of the time bombing it in, all would be high up in metres gained. White is another who despite looking like a lovely kick has a habit of just kicking it as far as he can.
Personally I find it hard to believe that this is not instructed as Sandy do the same thing.
A champion team will always beat a team of champions.
- SaintPav
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 18835
- Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
- Location: Alma Road
- Has thanked: 1568 times
- Been thanked: 1959 times
Re: Great insights by David King
I think you will find that the GWS offer of pick 4 and 7 for our pick one in 2014 is a counterfactual.
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Oh man, it's infuriating.Junior wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 7:54am My father contacted the club after the JLT series and vented his spleen about our constant bombing off the ball to the top of the square .
Asked the question what they had spent the summer working on?
To the clubs credit he received a reply stating that they had identified this as an issue and that it would be addressed before the season proper and that it was not the coaches instruction to do so.
Yet here we sit half a season later with the same issue, so if we take the response on face value and it is not the instruction from Richo then either the players are not listening or are not capable of lowering their eyes. Either way it is Richo's responsibility to have addressed and fixed the situation.
It is dumb football, Predictable and easy to defend against.
They need to start dropping repeat offenders or we are just accepting the behaviour , if I was coach I would tear strips of players who do this.
Metres gained is such a crap stat, should be metres gained and a team mate ends up with ball.
Savage, Ross and Newnes are all players who simply kick the ball long the majority of the time bombing it in, all would be high up in metres gained. White is another who despite looking like a lovely kick has a habit of just kicking it as far as he can.
Personally I find it hard to believe that this is not instructed as Sandy do the same thing.
As you say - they're either following the coach by doing it which is a disaster for Richardson. Or they've been ignoring him and doing it against his wishes for 2 years - and that's probably an even bigger disaster for him!
He's either a terrible strategist, or a terrible communicator and leader.
There have threads on here bumped that talk about this as early as April last year!
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 25303
- Joined: Tue 01 Feb 2005 4:25pm
- Location: Trump Tower
- Has thanked: 142 times
- Been thanked: 284 times
Re: Great insights by David King
I wonder if the bomb it Long inside 50 thing is an issue because the players either aren’t fit enough to run forward fast enough or simply don’t work hard enough when having to change from defence into attack mode?
i am Melbourne Skies - sometimes Blue Skies, Grey Skies, even Partly Cloudy Skies.
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8256
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1849 times
- Been thanked: 869 times
Re: Great insights by David King
I get tired of not just AR but other coaches too, all of them, who hang their hats on stats
(that rhymes!)
I imagine the 5 staff sitting in the coaches box, on laptops, are the ones crunching the numbers
and feeding the "35 inside 50's" and "25 pressure acts" etc
You could have a very messy bricklayer who lays bricks 25% faster than a guy on another building site,
but the messy guy's bricks are not even, they are all untidy, he has mortar dripping everywhere.
What's the point of quoting raw numbers without looking at the outcome?
Seriously?
(that rhymes!)
I imagine the 5 staff sitting in the coaches box, on laptops, are the ones crunching the numbers
and feeding the "35 inside 50's" and "25 pressure acts" etc
You could have a very messy bricklayer who lays bricks 25% faster than a guy on another building site,
but the messy guy's bricks are not even, they are all untidy, he has mortar dripping everywhere.
What's the point of quoting raw numbers without looking at the outcome?
Seriously?
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤![🤍](//cdn.jsdelivr.net/gh/twitter/twemoji@latest/assets/svg/1f90d.svg)
and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23010
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 8902 times
- Been thanked: 3883 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Thanks for posting that video. I have referred to what Kingy said in several other threads, but it is so much better to see it first hand.One Eyed Saint wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 12:18am https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/david- ... e342d837f7
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 1360
- Joined: Sun 03 Oct 2004 8:45pm
- Has thanked: 93 times
- Been thanked: 93 times
Re: Great insights by David King
David King even liked that comment...
So, nothing doing... it's like bleating in the wild. They don't listen and don't care.
Obviously, those posts were done around Jul 15 and things got much worse.
Last edited by axcellence on Fri 25 May 2018 11:44am, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 681
- Joined: Tue 07 Feb 2012 1:03pm
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: Great insights by David King
All Richo had to do us drag any player that did not follow his instruction i have not seen that done.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 681
- Joined: Tue 07 Feb 2012 1:03pm
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: Great insights by David King
All Richo had to do is drag any player that did not follow his instruction i have not seen that done.
- Linton Lodger
- SS Hall of Fame
- Posts: 2467
- Joined: Mon 18 Aug 2014 2:07pm
- Has thanked: 86 times
- Been thanked: 256 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Yes, my recollection is that we made that offer and GWS knocked it back.
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8256
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1849 times
- Been thanked: 869 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Marshall kicked the ball to a Pies player or something,oh when the wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 11:43am All Richo had to do us drag any player that did not follow his instruction i have not seen that done.
Richo dragged him and took him behind the shelter sheds for a beating.
Richo said afterwards: "Marshall's probably our best kick, and I was disappointed that he didn't trust himself"
NEXT....
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤![🤍](//cdn.jsdelivr.net/gh/twitter/twemoji@latest/assets/svg/1f90d.svg)
and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 335
- Joined: Wed 21 Oct 2009 11:18am
- Location: Bendigo
- Has thanked: 23 times
- Been thanked: 8 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Maybe it was meant to be 'bomb it to long'saintspremiers wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 9:55am I wonder if the bomb it Long inside 50 thing is an issue because the players either aren’t fit enough to run forward fast enough or simply don’t work hard enough when having to change from defence into attack mode?
-
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 2508
- Joined: Tue 14 Jun 2005 9:11pm
- Location: Behind the goal, South Road end
- Has thanked: 32 times
- Been thanked: 38 times
Re: Great insights by David King
If I looked up and saw our forwards standing in the goal square and there was no-one else to give it to I'd probably bomb it long too. Lack of movement among the forwards is also a basic problem. And then of course there's spilling the ball when you are on a lead or missing the kick for goal when you didn't spill the mark.
- shrodes
- SS Life Member
- Posts: 3061
- Joined: Tue 12 Aug 2014 2:34pm
- Location: Melbourne
- Has thanked: 781 times
- Been thanked: 420 times
Re: Great insights by David King
It's not just a problem of no movement in the forward line. How often this season have we got the short kick out and mark then everyone just stands still. Then umpire calls play on and we bomb it up the boundary to a contest or outnumber.Superboot wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 12:59pm If I looked up and saw our forwards standing in the goal square and there was no-one else to give it to I'd probably bomb it long too. Lack of movement among the forwards is also a basic problem. And then of course there's spilling the ball when you are on a lead or missing the kick for goal when you didn't spill the mark.
What has happened to overlap or leading at the man? Have we been instructed to conserve energy to prevent the rebound goal by opposition, or just lazy?
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: Great insights by David King
I don't think anyone has an issue with kicking long to a contest inside 50 if there are no other options.Superboot wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 12:59pm If I looked up and saw our forwards standing in the goal square and there was no-one else to give it to I'd probably bomb it long too. Lack of movement among the forwards is also a basic problem. And then of course there's spilling the ball when you are on a lead or missing the kick for goal when you didn't spill the mark.
But the issue is, that repeatedly, over an 18 month period, probably longer, there have been better options and they get ignored - only to 'bomb it' to a congested and predictable area which was once upon known as the 'hot spot'. It was called the hot spot, because once upon a time forwards went one on one with their opponent and this part of the ground was particularly dangerous for defenders.
However since probably 2009, it hasn't been a 'hot spot'. It's actually the easiest part of the ground to defend. Defenders gather there in numbers, so a contested mark is nigh on impossible. And further to that, teams train to rebound from the 'hot spot'. So not only do you have very little chance of scoring if you kick it there - you actually open yourself up badly to the opposition rebounding and hurting you the other way.
The 'bomb it in' strategy can be dangerous, if used at the correct time. If you see a one on one or a mismatch then go for it. It's also great as a 'get out' for players that are under extreme pressure and just have to throw it on their boot. It's a reasonable Plan B.
But it should never be Plan A.
It's just utterly ridiculous that we're even still talking about this 18 months later.
Last edited by rodgerfox on Fri 25 May 2018 2:59pm, edited 1 time in total.
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: Great insights by David King
The other reason I think they often stand in the goal square, is that they know that that's where the ball is going. Just like every defender on the ground! It's clearly a strategy of Richardson's to have a tall in the hot spot to make a contest. If they lead, like McCartin regularly does, they just get ignored and have to watch the ball sail over their head to the waiting arms of defenders standing in the hot spot.Superboot wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 12:59pm If I looked up and saw our forwards standing in the goal square and there was no-one else to give it to I'd probably bomb it long too. Lack of movement among the forwards is also a basic problem. And then of course there's spilling the ball when you are on a lead or missing the kick for goal when you didn't spill the mark.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23208
- Joined: Sat 13 Mar 2004 11:44pm
- Has thanked: 735 times
- Been thanked: 1776 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Yup
He’s clueless
Deadly cocktail ....
Unskilled dumb players + dumber coach
He’s clueless
Deadly cocktail ....
Unskilled dumb players + dumber coach
“Yeah….nah””
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8256
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1849 times
- Been thanked: 869 times
Re: Great insights by David King
as a Perth resident, went to the Rd 8 clash, we were lucky enough to be seated above the forward pocket
as the boys kicked those 3rd qtr goals.
Those goals came from being creative and opening up the forward line-
remember Gresh delivering to just in front of Stuv, it was a BRILLIANTLY precise kick,
because Stuv did not break stride; and was able to brush aside TWO dockers.
The corridor was open wide. It happened right in front of 300-500 screaming Sainters. Unforgettable.
as the boys kicked those 3rd qtr goals.
Those goals came from being creative and opening up the forward line-
remember Gresh delivering to just in front of Stuv, it was a BRILLIANTLY precise kick,
because Stuv did not break stride; and was able to brush aside TWO dockers.
The corridor was open wide. It happened right in front of 300-500 screaming Sainters. Unforgettable.
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤![🤍](//cdn.jsdelivr.net/gh/twitter/twemoji@latest/assets/svg/1f90d.svg)
and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
- Wayne42
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4911
- Joined: Mon 24 Jun 2013 10:27pm
- Has thanked: 619 times
- Been thanked: 558 times
Re: Great insights by David King
Who is Stuv ?WellardSaint wrote: ↑Fri 25 May 2018 6:46pm as a Perth resident, went to the Rd 8 clash, we were lucky enough to be seated above the forward pocket
as the boys kicked those 3rd qtr goals.
Those goals came from being creative and opening up the forward line-
remember Gresh delivering to just in front of Stuv, it was a BRILLIANTLY precise kick,
because Stuv did not break stride; and was able to brush aside TWO dockers.
The corridor was open wide. It happened right in front of 300-500 screaming Sainters. Unforgettable.
The Saints are under review, will it make any difference to the underachievers ?