Port shows what can be done if....

[twirlyhair]

you have the right coach and the right fitness staff. Do we have both?

[BigMart]

And 5 years of top draft picks..... With good selection

[PJ]

And 5 years of top draft picks..... With good selection

Correct

[twirlyhair]

And 5 years of top draft picks..... With good selection

Ross Lyon wouldn't agree with you..and I suspect Hinkly wouldn't either

[dragit]

And 5 years of top draft picks..... With good selection

Ross Lyon wouldn't agree with you..and I suspect Hinkly wouldn't either

Why would they disagree? both have inherited lists laden with high end talent...

Without talented footballers you get nowhere.

[twirlyhair]

And 5 years of top draft picks..... With good selection

Ross Lyon wouldn't agree with you..and I suspect Hinkly wouldn't either

Why would they disagree? both have inherited lists laden with high end talent...

Without talented footballers you get nowhere.

And how do you know we don't have talented footballers? Why have you given up on them so soon?

[dragit]

I'll go out on a limb and say that we don't have any kids as good as Wines & Wingard... an 18 & 19 year old pulled their side over the line in an interstate final against a seasoned mature side.

[twirlyhair]

I'll go out on a limb and say that we don't have any kids as good as Wines & Wingard... an 18 & 19 year old pulled their side over the line in an interstate final against a seasoned mature side.

Mate, with respect, that is the typical St.kilda supporter loser mentality... The woe is me mentality. Even the coach disagrees with you when he says that we have "accepted mediocrity for too long"...tell me that we don't have players, that with the right coaching and fitness levels can't reach the heights that Port has..

[twirlyhair]

I'll go out on a limb and say that we don't have any kids as good as Wines & Wingard... an 18 & 19 year old pulled their side over the line in an interstate final against a seasoned mature side.

Mate, with respect, that is the typical St.kilda supporter loser mentality... The woe is me mentality. Even the coach disagrees with you when he says that we have "accepted mediocrity for too long"...tell me that we don't have players, that with the right coaching and fitness levels can't reach the heights that Port has..

Sorry, I got that quote wrong. It should read..."for too long our club has not aspired to ge great.." S Watters

[plugger66]

I'll go out on a limb and say that we don't have any kids as good as Wines & Wingard... an 18 & 19 year old pulled their side over the line in an interstate final against a seasoned mature side.

Mate, with respect, that is the typical St.kilda supporter loser mentality... The woe is me mentality. Even the coach disagrees with you when he says that we have "accepted mediocrity for too long"...tell me that we don't have players, that with the right coaching and fitness levels can't reach the heights that Port has..

What are you on about? We dont have young guys as good as Wines and Wingard. fact. Not a lose mentally at all. We havent had the picks to get those sort of players. yes you can good very good players at later picks but you will get many more failures with higher picks.

[twirlyhair]

So coaching does no matter at all in the development of players? Is that what you are saying?

[dragit]

I'll go out on a limb and say that we don't have any kids as good as Wines & Wingard... an 18 & 19 year old pulled their side over the line in an interstate final against a seasoned mature side.

Mate, with respect, that is the typical St.kilda supporter loser mentality... The woe is me mentality. Even the coach disagrees with you when he says that we have "accepted mediocrity for too long"...tell me that we don't have players, that with the right coaching and fitness levels can't reach the heights that Port has..

Loser mentality... yes very respectful if you.

There's no woe from me... it's pretty simple, though you seem to be struggling...

The teams with more talented lists are higher on the ladder, the genuine stars generally come from the first few picks if the draft, we haven't had those picks... Are list is shambles... It wouldn't matter his fit we got, our players miss more targets than our opponents.

It's not about accepting mediocrity, the reality is that our group of players is in the bottom few in the comp for talent. The current players aren't that good, so until we add talent we're not going to compete with the better sides.

I'm sure we could improve fitness, but if you threw Wines, Wingard & Westoff into our side we would look a lot better.

[plugger66]

So coaching does no matter at all in the development of players? Is that what you are saying?

No that is what you just said. Are you naive enough to suggest that a great coach will get players who arent good enough to be as good as Wingard or Wines? That will never happen ever. Its a fact that lower picks will over time get a side better players than higher picks and whilst i say a great coach cant make bad players good I do think a bad coach can make good players bad. Not sure we have had the picks to see where SW is at the moment.

[twirlyhair]

I'll go out on a limb and say that we don't have any kids as good as Wines & Wingard... an 18 & 19 year old pulled their side over the line in an interstate final against a seasoned mature side.

Mate, with respect, that is the typical St.kilda supporter loser mentality... The woe is me mentality. Even the coach disagrees with you when he says that we have "accepted mediocrity for too long"...tell me that we don't have players, that with the right coaching and fitness levels can't reach the heights that Port has..

Loser mentality... yes very respectful if you.

There's no woe from me... it's pretty simple, though you seem to be struggling...

The teams with more talented lists are higher on the ladder, the genuine stars generally come from the first few picks if the draft, we haven't had those picks... Are list is shambles... It wouldn't matter his fit we got, our players miss more targets than our opponents.

It's not about accepting mediocrity, the reality is that our group of players is in the bottom few in the comp for talent. The current players aren't that good, so until we add talent we're not going to compete with the better sides.

I'm sure we could improve fitness, but if you threw Wines, Wingard & Westoff into our side we would look a lot better.

Sorry if I hurt your feelings, but one thing I know in life is that losers find reasons to be unsuccessful, whilst winners will simply find a way, no matter what thy are faced with. As a saints supporter, I am sick of talking about why we can't be successful.

[PJ]

Twirly your argument seems to swinging to extremes. Coaching is a crucial element but the talent identification process is so thorough these days that draft order is more a science than guess work. Surely you're not arguing that just because player x was picked by st.kilda and coach y was as well that we have formulae for success by virtue of faith.

[dragit]

We will be successful, but it takes time...

Sulking like a toddler doesn't make it happen any faster.

Essendon & Carlton fans demand success apparently... Hasn't helped them much over the last decade.

Your main point 'good coaching & fitness are important elements to success' I agree with, a couple of other things need to happen in conjunction... Like adding 5-6 super stars.

[twirlyhair]

Twirly your argument seems to swinging to extremes. Coaching is a crucial element but the talent identification process is so thorough these days that draft order is more a science than guess work. Surely you're not arguing that just because player x was picked by st.kilda and coach y was as well that we have formulae for success by virtue of faith.

No not swinging to extremes at all. Just a fundamental belief that discipline and culture and good processes will always win out over purely relying upon getting high draft picks, in fact our club proves that over the last decade, no flags but many many high draft picks. Of course we woul all like to have higher drft picks, but to say that you can't improve your team because of the assumed skill sets of te players is nonsensical.

[Spinner]

And 5 years of top draft picks..... With good selection

Exactly right. They have been building for five years - While everyone asks where they came from and what a fast dramatic rise!

[twirlyhair]

We will be successful, but it takes time...

Sulking like a toddler doesn't make it happen any faster.

Essendon & Carlton fans demand success apparently... Hasn't helped them much over the last decade.

Your main point 'good coaching & fitness are important elements to success' I agree with, a couple of other things need to happen in conjunction... Like adding 5-6 super stars.

Sulking like a toddler would be to accept mediocrity. Something you are doing my friend

[PJ]

I haven't said that all. I've said it's a combination.

[aaron82]

Coaching can only get you so far. In fairness to Watters we are yet to have top draft picks until this season. Port have been ordinary since playing the GF in 2007. We are in our 2nd year of rebuilding, around 2016-2018 is when we will be doing what Port are providing we recruit well.
I have a lot of faith in Pelchen. Our list still has more holes than a crumpet but last season I believe we picked some good talent with high picks. At a guess I believe we will pick midfield types this season. Josh Kelly is likely at 3.

PATIENCE, something we have struggled with is the key. Watters can coach, we are doing a full rebuild and more pain will come but when we come out the other side I have no doubt he could be up with the best. Very much like Clarkson.

[jays]

Very true

[PJ]

Barring Wines and couple of others this is the same port team as last year that finished where??

Hinkley must be a genius. Quick sack Watters and get him straight away.

[dragit]

We will be successful, but it takes time...

Sulking like a toddler doesn't make it happen any faster.

Essendon & Carlton fans demand success apparently... Hasn't helped them much over the last decade.

Your main point 'good coaching & fitness are important elements to success' I agree with, a couple of other things need to happen in conjunction... Like adding 5-6 super stars.

Sulking like a toddler would be to accept mediocrity. Something you are doing my friend

Sure thing champ, so if we get a good coach next year & improve fitness... there's no reason we shouldn't win the flag.

You seem to have a really good grasp on the game.

[Dis Believer]

Barring Wines and couple of others this is the same port team as last year that finished where??

No it's not. They have twenty odd more games and another preseason into them......