Are we fit enough?

[White Winmar]

From the round 1 fade out against the Gold Coast kids, to tonight's miserable finish, it seems we've had difficulty running out games. Even last week, we were nearly overrun by a Carlton team that was badly undermanned by the last quarter. It poses questions about our sports science and conditioning team. We didn't look as strong as the Suns, were brushed aside by the bombers, and have failed to run games out. Tonight was another glaring demonstration that the opposition was stronger and had greater endurance.

I know some will point out the fact that we have a number of youngsters, therefore we should expect to fade in games, especially on 6 day breaks. The truth is, however, is that the majority of our side is made up of mature bodies and is relatively experienced. Geary, Fisher, Gwilt, Dempster, Roberton, Dal, Joey, Lenny, Roo, Armo, Big Ben, Steven, Ray and Milne, all of whom bar one were out there tonight. Throw in the fact that Maister, Milera, Saad and Hickey are all mature age recruits, it makes the so-called "youth excuse", look pretty thin.

I've thought we've looked underdone right from the start. When you look at how full of run the young Port Power players have been, it just rubs salt into the wounds. Questions must be asked about the efficacy of the altitude training in Colorado, as well as the general fitness strategies that have been applied since. Thoughts?

[Teflon]

Tend to agree.

Without picking on him but I thought Milne looked fat coming into this year - I havent said that before and it was noticeable.

Youth certainly plays a part in fade outs - even 3-4 kids in the chain will drop away the side as others have to cover for their drop off but I do still question our overall fitness.

Shame cause weve been in every game bar Bombers.

[bigcarl]

Fair question, I've wondered the same myself.

[SainterK]

Milne should not wear sleeves in the away strip, should be charged with wardrobe unbecoming.

[Moorabbin Man]

I've worried about fitness levels all season. We are fading in most games and I am concerned about conditioning, even allowing for the fact we're playing a few kids.

[Greg T]

WW made some really interesting points.
If we are badly under done with fitness,who takes the responsibility for this?
Do the coaching staff or fitness staff take responsilbity ?

Why wouldn't we be as fit as any other AFL side ?
Being young or inexperienced shouldn't affect our fitness levels I would thought.

The one thing u notice about Geelong is they are big lads.thats how they recruit them.
We seem to be a lot smaller than in previous years IMO .

Still , have we got the training regime right ?

[battye]

Milne should not wear sleeves in the away strip, should be charged with wardrobe unbecoming.

I liked it, I'd buy that jumper if it was available.

[plugger66]

I would be surprised if any side is not within 5% fitness of any other side. We are young and they run out of legs. Look at all the other young sides like Melbourne and the Bulldogs. They usually struggle at the end of games or quarters.

[spert]

I would be surprised if any side is not within 5% fitness of any other side. We are young and they run out of legs. Look at all the other young sides like Melbourne and the Bulldogs. They usually struggle at the end of games or quarters.

I agree, though being fit is one thing, motivation is another thing and that's where the coach comes in.

[White Winmar]

I would be surprised if any side is not within 5% fitness of any other side. We are young and they run out of legs. Look at all the other young sides like Melbourne and the Bulldogs. They usually struggle at the end of games or quarters.

I think 5% at this level would be significant, if that was the case. I don't think we're that young either. We've got plenty of mature bodies. How do you explain the form of the cats this year? They have plenty of youth in their side, as do the Power. Something's not right ATM. Whether it is fitness, motivation or a combination of the two, or even something else, I can't say, but this team has under performed significantly to this point.

[Cairnsman]

We looked cooked after the first quarter. I noticed in the rooms during the half time break all of the players sitting or laying down on the ground with not much talk or enthusiasm. It looked like a jazz lounge bar, really cool and relaxed. Maybe too relaxed.

[Beno88]

In 1st halves this year we've outscored our opposition by 13 points.

In 2nd halves this year we've been outscored by 93 points.

Furthermore, if you exclude the GWS game, we've scored over 30 points in a 3rd or 4th quarter just once in 2013 (3rd qtr vs Rich). Our opposition has done this 8 times.

Falling off a massive cliff at half time it seems.

[saintspremiers]

In 1st halves this year we've outscored our opposition by 13 points.

In 2nd halves this year we've been outscored by 93 points.

Furthermore, if you exclude the GWS game, we've scored over 30 points in a 3rd or 4th quarter just once in 2013 (3rd qtr vs Rich). Our opposition has done this 8 times.

Falling off a massive cliff at half time it seems.

Good work.

Can you please do this analysis for Footscray also, I reckon they'd be rooted late in games like us.

[Beno88]

Can you please do this analysis for Footscray also, I reckon they'd be rooted late in games like us.

The dogs have been outscored by 106 in 1st halves and 150 in 2nd halves. But they do score more in second halves.

They have conceded over 60 points in their last 3 second halves.

[saintspremiers]

Can you please do this analysis for Footscray also, I reckon they'd be rooted late in games like us.

The dogs have been outscored by 106 in 1st halves and 150 in 2nd halves. But they do score more in second halves.

They have conceded over 60 points in their last 3 second halves.

So we should flog them unless consecutive 6 day breaks are a factor.

The game will be won at the selection table IMO. It's up to Watters and the selection committee to determine who is flat and make several changes to freshen up the lineup.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

age is one thing the other is the ammount of games we have in the players lets put it this way :

James Gwilt : 99 games
Jarryn Geary: 80 games
Dylan Roberton : 44 games
Jack Newnes : 13 games
Arryn Siposs : 21 games
Terry Milera : 21 games
Rhys Stanley : 29 games
Tom Hickey : 15 games
Ben McEvoy : 77 games
David Armitage : 79 games
Jack Steven : 59 games
Sebastian Ross : 6 games
Jimmy Webster : 2 games
Ahmed Saad : 24 games
Beau Maister : 38 games

thats 15 under 100 games - 10 under 50 games ..... thats a heck of a lot of inexperiance and a lot of unseasoned bodys not yet accustomed to the physical demands of AFL footy so its almost understandable that after a half of giving it their all that the boys will fall into somewhat of a hole (factor in the travel and the six day break plus the crows training seesion against GWS last week )

all in all we are looking ok the signs are there that given some time blokes like Newnes Ross Webster Wright Saunders ect will become players for us . realistically this year and next year its not so much about the win/loss count but more about the development of the younger guys realistically we kept with the crows for a half so thats a possitive they kicked away in the eand and thats unfortunate but hey thats all part of rebuilding when we start getting games where we are never in the contest and where we are soundly beaten in every area (like the dogs, GC, GWS and Melbourne have copped this year) then i think its time to question the efforts but not now

[plugger66]

I would be surprised if any side is not within 5% fitness of any other side. We are young and they run out of legs. Look at all the other young sides like Melbourne and the Bulldogs. They usually struggle at the end of games or quarters.

I think 5% at this level would be significant, if that was the case. I don't think we're that young either. We've got plenty of mature bodies. How do you explain the form of the cats this year? They have plenty of youth in their side, as do the Power. Something's not right ATM. Whether it is fitness, motivation or a combination of the two, or even something else, I can't say, but this team has under performed significantly to this point.

I explain geelons form pretty simply. They won GF's and we didnt. Most of our older guys are mentally cooked. And who could blame them. geelongs young kids are playing with winners. And because our older guys are struggling then there is so much pressure on our younger guys. By the last part of quarters and games they have had enough. that is no excuse for the likes of Armo who seems to just fade out of games. he may have had his best game ever this season but I reckon he has also had 3 of his worst games.

[SainterK]

Milne should not wear sleeves in the away strip, should be charged with wardrobe unbecoming.

I liked it, I'd buy that jumper if it was available.

So do I, but all white does his little veteran body no favours

[matrix]

nope not fit enough

mentally and physically

it will take time i guess

[joffaboy]

I find it interesting that many ask for kids to be played and then complain when they aren't physically capable of running out a game.

Get used to this. Got nothing to do with "coaching" or "culture" per se.

Has everything to do with the state of the list, the size of the players, how the coach wants them to develop, and as P66 said the attitude of the senior players who know they will never win a flag with the Saints.

No use moaning. We just have to wait. Unfair? Well i feel ripped off we didn't land at least one flag in 09-10 but facts are we didn't.

Second fact is that Watters became senior coach with his eyes wide open, that the Saints list was in decline and emergency surgery needed to happen.

This year is a development year. We watch with interest the young players developing. Newnes, Wright, Roberton, Saunders, Webster, even Sipposs developing.

Watching Jack Steven and the Owl take the next step. Wating on Curren, Ledger, Wight, Markworth, and others to see if they have what it takes.

Waiting to see if Saad and milera can overcome second year blues.

At years end we will have a decent first draft pick, and have a stash of cash to chase a FA or a trade.

Optimistically we "may" challenge for a top eight next season if all went exactly according to plan.

Realistically we are looking at 2016 before we start thinking about top 4.

So the pressure is off. Results wont come our way for a few seasons. What we need to see is effort. What we need to see is development of our current crop. What we need is to draft and trade aggressively at years end.

just take a breath, watch the kids and enjoy the occasional win.

nothing else we can do as supporters, I'm afraid.

Oh and stick with Watters, we also need stability and to keep our nerve over the next 2-3 seasons.

[Stephen Theodore]

I would be surprised if any side is not within 5% fitness of any other side. We are young and they run out of legs. Look at all the other young sides like Melbourne and the Bulldogs. They usually struggle at the end of games or quarters.

I think 5% at this level would be significant, if that was the case. I don't think we're that young either. We've got plenty of mature bodies. How do you explain the form of the cats this year? They have plenty of youth in their side, as do the Power. Something's not right ATM. Whether it is fitness, motivation or a combination of the two, or even something else, I can't say, but this team has under performed significantly to this point.

I explain geelons form pretty simply. They won GF's and we didnt. Most of our older guys are mentally cooked. And who could blame them. geelongs young kids are playing with winners. And because our older guys are struggling then there is so much pressure on our younger guys. By the last part of quarters and games they have had enough. that is no excuse for the likes of Armo who seems to just fade out of games. he may have had his best game ever this season but I reckon he has also had 3 of his worst games.

I agree Plugger, especially the "mentally cooked" scenario.

I'm mentally cooked after the last 3 years, let alone the poor buggers playing the game.

[matrix]

Watters made the pointed remark on leaving Adelaide last night: "I don't want the supporters to be patient .... and I don't want us as a club to be patient."

lucky
i have none

[Teflon]

Plugger please explain to me how "mentally shot" Nick Riewoldt us again....Im fascinated

[plugger66]

Plugger please explain to me how "mentally shot" Nick Riewoldt us again....Im fascinated

Who said he was? I cant explain something that i dont see to be true. Maybe you know more because i have no idea why you asked me that question.

[The Redeemer]

Plugger please explain to me how "mentally shot" Nick Riewoldt us again....Im fascinated

He has turned into a somewhat happy-go-lucky player. I would suggest that he is mentally shot with direct reference to winning the comp.

It sucks but that is the way it is.