Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
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Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
St Kilda coach Scott Watters said his midfield had been beaten.
"[It was] probably one of the first times this year when I really think our midfield lowered their colours," Watters said.
"And that puts the rest of your game under enormous pressure.
HITOUTS
42 v 29
HITOUTS TO ADVANTAGE
14 v 6
INSIDE 50s
67 v 53
Let you decide which was which.
Is it fair to blame the mids?
"[It was] probably one of the first times this year when I really think our midfield lowered their colours," Watters said.
"And that puts the rest of your game under enormous pressure.
HITOUTS
42 v 29
HITOUTS TO ADVANTAGE
14 v 6
INSIDE 50s
67 v 53
Let you decide which was which.
Is it fair to blame the mids?
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
What he says in a press conference and what he means are two different things. I'd say he'd be disappointed with some of the centre clearance work, the defensive running and the use of the footy in the third quarter. But personally I thought we had losers on every line: Dal Santo, Montagna, Goddard, Milera, Saad, Koschitzke, Clarke, Gilbert, Riewoldt and Blake
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
I was thinking about the mids after the game. The defence wasn't super bad, yet we conceded over 130 points. A fair chunk of the responsibility must fall on the midfield. It's a far cry from the old days of defending from the front with forward pressure.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
No - not fair. The selectors need to take responsibility. Sipposs should be played unless he's injured. Simpkin too - Tom has done nothing wrong and didn't deserve to be dropped. It's strange how there seems to be a starting line-up so you have to play all senior players and some of the up and comers...
If you have to have 4 mainly small forward options...Out of Saad, Millera, Milne and Schneider, I don't think these guys helped in rotations like CJ or Fazza might have. Also...we needed CJ or Ray to be there today for the tagging job to restrict Wells or Swallow.
Blake and Raph and Gram all get a game because they're fit but was it the best option for the back half...the selectors also have to play Kosi (in their mind he only misses if he's unfit, but was it the best option against North Melbourne?) If Macca is first ruck and Stanley plays both ruck and forward, then why have all three big blokes? If you are not prepared to play Stanley for the whole match and if the plan was to sub him - then he shouldn't be a starter!!
If you have to have 4 mainly small forward options...Out of Saad, Millera, Milne and Schneider, I don't think these guys helped in rotations like CJ or Fazza might have. Also...we needed CJ or Ray to be there today for the tagging job to restrict Wells or Swallow.
Blake and Raph and Gram all get a game because they're fit but was it the best option for the back half...the selectors also have to play Kosi (in their mind he only misses if he's unfit, but was it the best option against North Melbourne?) If Macca is first ruck and Stanley plays both ruck and forward, then why have all three big blokes? If you are not prepared to play Stanley for the whole match and if the plan was to sub him - then he shouldn't be a starter!!
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Team effort. Whole team must wear it. In the horrible eighties, the players did not gel and there was reportedly lots of friction. Everyone needs to put there hand up. BTW Stanley apparently injured the hammy.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Defensively, the midfield was appalling.
The run that North had through the middle was extraordinary.
Clearance stats are merely one part of a midfields responsibilities. North zoned up really well through the middle, and none of our mids really tried to take them on and break a line. Defensively on the rebound, our mids didn't work hard enough and didn't tackle hard enough to stop their run.
The run that North had through the middle was extraordinary.
Clearance stats are merely one part of a midfields responsibilities. North zoned up really well through the middle, and none of our mids really tried to take them on and break a line. Defensively on the rebound, our mids didn't work hard enough and didn't tackle hard enough to stop their run.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
When the opposition kicks 20 goals you are not going to win many games of footy !!
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
The question is though, why did they kick 20 goals?
Game plan? Selection? Lack of ability? Midfield? Defence?
Game plan? Selection? Lack of ability? Midfield? Defence?
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Exactly.. Two games in a row where our mids and forwards just let their opponents run off and link up far too easily. This puts far too much pressure on the back line.Johnny Member wrote:Defensively, the midfield was appalling.
The run that North had through the middle was extraordinary.
Clearance stats are merely one part of a midfields responsibilities. North zoned up really well through the middle, and none of our mids really tried to take them on and break a line. Defensively on the rebound, our mids didn't work hard enough and didn't tackle hard enough to stop their run.
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Apart from about 4 players I'd suggest blaming the team as a whole.
I've never seen a bad St.Kilda player - that's just how they are.
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
67 inside 50s is why they kicked 20 goals. 3.5 to 1 is about a par score so they did slightly better than that, and that's because most of their shots were pretty easy ones. Why? Because the entries were quick and central.Johnny Member wrote:The question is though, why did they kick 20 goals?
Game plan? Selection? Lack of ability? Midfield? Defence?
Someone was allowing them all these inside 50s - the midfield. Having Gilbert in there doesn't help as he's not a midfielder and never will be. But zero inside 50s between Dal and Montagna is a pretty unlikely course of events. And while I thought Armo's game was OK, 3 contested possessions, 2 tackles and 56% disposal efficiency doesn't look great. CJ would have helped, no doubt.
Just a bad day? Or is this a sign of things to come?
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Too many players spellbound by "see ball, get ball". It's good in a way, but it hurt us badly yesterday. IMO too many of our guys were diving at the ball or flying in the air to spoil at the same time. We don't need 3 to jump at every marking contest.
North were smarter than us yesterday. They didn't commit too many numbers to the contests. They backed themselves to win the ball, and also had a bit of luck at times to win one on twos, and sometimes one on three contests.
When they won the ball our guys were left flat footed around the contest while they had players on the outside to create mayhem. It wont work all the time for them but it was devistating yesterday and made us look ordinary. They way we turnover the ball, by the way, makes the job even harder.
North were smarter than us yesterday. They didn't commit too many numbers to the contests. They backed themselves to win the ball, and also had a bit of luck at times to win one on twos, and sometimes one on three contests.
When they won the ball our guys were left flat footed around the contest while they had players on the outside to create mayhem. It wont work all the time for them but it was devistating yesterday and made us look ordinary. They way we turnover the ball, by the way, makes the job even harder.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
in the context of the match, when the mids were actually winning ball and delivering it forward properly... we were on top
it's hard to blame the KP forwards when they get no decent delivery.
that being said, Kosi was poor and Roo beaten but with quick ball movement, we were kicking goals from general play
it's hard to blame the KP forwards when they get no decent delivery.
that being said, Kosi was poor and Roo beaten but with quick ball movement, we were kicking goals from general play
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
How many times did we see that? Is there any cohesion? talk? FFS so often "all up" all fall down.....Nth ran off with it.....just Auskick style of play at the elite level FFS...8856brother wrote:Too many players spellbound by "see ball, get ball". It's good in a way, but it hurt us badly yesterday. IMO too many of our guys were diving at the ball or flying in the air to spoil at the same time. We don't need 3 to jump at every marking contest.
“Yeah….nah””
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
HITOUTS TO ADVANTAGEJohnny Member wrote:Defensively, the midfield was appalling.
The run that North had through the middle was extraordinary.
Clearance stats are merely one part of a midfields responsibilities. North zoned up really well through the middle, and none of our mids really tried to take them on and break a line. Defensively on the rebound, our mids didn't work hard enough and didn't tackle hard enough to stop their run.
14 v 6
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Areas Jones excels in...hopefully his absence enables the other midfielders recognise there deficiencies.Johnny Member wrote:Defensively, the midfield was appalling.
The run that North had through the middle was extraordinary.
Clearance stats are merely one part of a midfields responsibilities. North zoned up really well through the middle, and none of our mids really tried to take them on and break a line. Defensively on the rebound, our mids didn't work hard enough and didn't tackle hard enough to stop their run.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
We've lost our one strength, that run off half back we could always rely on a couple of years ago.
Remember when Gilbert, Goddard, Fisher, Gwilt were each getting their 20 -25 possessions plus and running and bouncing or kicking the ball well clear and setting play up.
Let's hope we can get it back soon.
Also agree with Ray definitely needing to be recalled. Ray seemed to be getting back to his best this year.
Remember when Gilbert, Goddard, Fisher, Gwilt were each getting their 20 -25 possessions plus and running and bouncing or kicking the ball well clear and setting play up.
Let's hope we can get it back soon.
Also agree with Ray definitely needing to be recalled. Ray seemed to be getting back to his best this year.
Last edited by samoht on Mon 02 Jul 2012 12:28pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
our problems begin and end in the spread. our mids do not run hard enough in the change of transition which hurts us even more when turn overs occur.
how many goals did north kick because their mids were able transition better!!!!
how many goals did north kick because their mids were able transition better!!!!
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Those players where able to get 20-25 possessions because of the pressure being put on further up the ground leading to rushed forward entries they could pick off. Midfield pressure needs to lift.samoht wrote:We've lost our one strength, that run off half back we could always rely on a couple of years ago.
Remember when Gilbert, Goddard, Fisher, Gwilt were each getting their 20 -25 possessions plus and running and bouncing or kicking the ball well clear and setting play up.
Let's hope we can get it back soon.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Agree. I don't call it transition though. North have plenty of "front runners". The little squib Harvey is the best in the comp at it, and has been for years. Looks fantastic when you're up and going. Wont always look so good when they lose clearances or don't get some lucky ones like they did yesterday. That's why their form is all over the place. We were ordinary and still kicked 100 points against them.defacto wrote:our problems begin and end in the spread. our mids do not run hard enough in the change of transition which hurts us even more when turn overs occur.
how many goals did north kick because their mids were able transition better!!!!
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Midfield pressure does have something to do with it too, I'm not discounting that, and maybe our lack of midfield leg speed didn't help vs North. The will may be there but the leg speed isn't.
but -
If we had that old dash off halfback (plus the 120 possessions we used to get just from Fisher, Gwilt, Gilbert, Goddard), then maybe our mids would in turn be spreading to receive and running just a little harder too.
Our halfbacks were our springboard.
Our springboard has snapped in two.
but -
If we had that old dash off halfback (plus the 120 possessions we used to get just from Fisher, Gwilt, Gilbert, Goddard), then maybe our mids would in turn be spreading to receive and running just a little harder too.
Our halfbacks were our springboard.
Our springboard has snapped in two.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
If midfield pressure suffers from lack of leg speed/spread.......then get nervous cause Bombers speed/fast ball movement is slicker than Nths........this could get ugly..
“Yeah….nah””
Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
I guess the idea of the thread was a discreet way of saying is it the ruckman? ![Sad :(](./images/smilies/icon_sad.gif)
![Sad :(](./images/smilies/icon_sad.gif)
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Essendon have proven that even as a bottom of the ladder team, they could still blitz us with their pace.Teflon wrote:If midfield pressure suffers from lack of leg speed/spread.......then get nervous cause Bombers speed/fast ball movement is slicker than Nths........this could get ugly..
Prepare for the worst and hope for the best.
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Re: Scott blames the mids, is that entirely fair?
Its a massive worry...Scott alluded to it in the presser I thought...did not look happy with ruck.......I fear we have a ruck rover in a 200cm frame who cant win a tap to save himself.......round the ground is nice........but you canet concede hit outs to advantage every week to try and make it upr round the ground cause u are always reacting and not taking initiative.SainterK wrote:I guess the idea of the thread was a discreet way of saying is it the ruckman?
“Yeah….nah””