Umpires stuff-up - Now it's official

philtee · Post: # 1087291Post **philtee** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 5:12pm

"THE AFL has admitted umpires made a mistake by not awarding a mark to St Kilda midfielder Dean Polo at a crucial stage of the Saints' loss to Collingwood".

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/u ... 6071716402

We can file this one with the Tom Hawkins' "goal" in the 2009 GF.

desertsaint · Wed 08 Jun 2011 5:22pm

cost us the game!

joking plugger!

Junction Oval · Wed 08 Jun 2011 5:30pm

That means they will give us a "freebee" against the Bulldogs this week .

degruch · Post: # 1087309Post **degruch** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 5:42pm

My gawd, that has to be a first...I had to read it twice to believe it. Maybe Geesh thinks Polo is still playing for the Tigers?

clarky449 · Post: # 1087311Post **clarky449** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 5:42pm

Couldnt really care personally, been worst mistake's, Wouldnt change the result.

degruch · Post: # 1087313Post **degruch** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 5:44pm

clarky449 wrote:Couldnt really care personally, been worst mistake's, Wouldnt change the result.

...like Monty's 80m deliberate. Maybe the bigger the cockup, the less likely we'll get a confession?

Mr Magic · Post: # 1087338Post **Mr Magic** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 6:14pm

degruch wrote:
clarky449 wrote:Couldnt really care personally, been worst mistake's, Wouldnt change the result.
...like Monty's 80m deliberate. Maybe the bigger the cockup, the less likely we'll get a confession?

I agree with the Geish on that one.
Ther is no doubt that Joey deliberately kicked the footy 50m to our forward line, in a way that would ensure it bounced at right angles and eventually rolled over rthe line.

Not a shodow of a doubt.

Sainternist · Wed 08 Jun 2011 6:16pm

Jeez, did they ever admit to the poster awarded a goal in the 2009 GF though?

degruch · Post: # 1087347Post **degruch** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 6:30pm

Mr Magic wrote:
degruch wrote:
clarky449 wrote:Couldnt really care personally, been worst mistake's, Wouldnt change the result.
...like Monty's 80m deliberate. Maybe the bigger the cockup, the less likely we'll get a confession?
I agree with the Geish on that one.
Ther is no doubt that Joey deliberately kicked the footy 50m to our forward line, in a way that would ensure it bounced at right angles and eventually rolled over rthe line.

Not a shodow of a doubt.

If Geesh wasn't a mind reader (I didn't know that), I would have said it was the worst decision ever, totally indefensible...now I know better.

ozrulestrace · Wed 08 Jun 2011 7:08pm

I was at the game so didn't see the telecast, but from what I understand the Channel 10 commentators were scathing in their comments.

And if the cameras were up close on that shot, what elese were they going to do but admit the umpires were wr... wr.. wr....... wro.........
Yes the umpires were wroooong, and yes it contributed to the final result.

plugger66 · Post: # 1087357Post **plugger66** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 7:10pm

ozrulestrace wrote:I was at the game so didn't see the telecast, but from what I understand the Channel 10 commentators were scathing in their comments.

And if the cameras were up close on that shot, what elese were they going to do but admit the umpires were wr... wr.. wr....... wro.........
Yes the umpires were wroooong, and yes it contributed to the final result.

If our side is that weak then we are introuble. You are right it contributed to the overall result because we would have lost by 6 points less.

degruch · Post: # 1087362Post **degruch** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 7:18pm

plugger66 wrote:
ozrulestrace wrote:I was at the game so didn't see the telecast, but from what I understand the Channel 10 commentators were scathing in their comments.

And if the cameras were up close on that shot, what elese were they going to do but admit the umpires were wr... wr.. wr....... wro.........
Yes the umpires were wroooong, and yes it contributed to the final result.
If our side is that weak then we are introuble. You are right it contributed to the overall result because we would have lost by 6 points less.

Even good teams can be rattled by bad decisions, or occurrences...Barry Hall incident of PF '05, ground invasion of PF '4 anyone? But would have to agree with p66's notion...in the 5 minutes of the game I witnessed, I saw enough of our own c**k-ups that effected the result just as much.

gringo · Post: # 1087366Post **gringo** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 7:26pm

umpires do stuff up the outcome of games, I would rather them play less though and miss some than give dumb ones that are technical. Momentum shifts when you work hard in close matches can really snuff the last of their enthusiasm.

plugger66 · Post: # 1087369Post **plugger66** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 7:29pm

gringo wrote:umpires do stuff up the outcome of games, I would rather them play less though and miss some than give dumb ones that are technical. Momentum shifts when you work hard in close matches can really snuff the last of their enthusiasm.

And when thet dont pay a free to us we will be first to start a thread on it. Obviously they didnt influence our last game because it wasnt close.

meher baba · Wed 08 Jun 2011 7:58pm

The argument that umpires make thousands of decisions per game and only get a few wrong is pitifully weak and should never be put forward.

Lots of professionals - doctors, judges, airline pilots, etc - are quite reasonably expected to make no mistakes whatsoever

I don't have a particularly wonderful TV set and the camera was zoomed out at the time and it was completely obvious that Polo had marked the ball. How on earth the three umps could have missed it I simply don't understand. Pitiful. And no excuse whatsoever.

plugger66 · Post: # 1087380Post **plugger66** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:00pm

meher baba wrote:The argument that umpires make thousands of decisions per game and only get a few wrong is pitifully weak and should never be put forward.

Lots of professionals - doctors, judges, airline pilots, etc - are quite reasonably expected to make no mistakes whatsoever

I don't have a particularly wonderful TV set and the camera was zoomed out at the time and it was completely obvious that Polo had marked the ball. How on earth the three umps could have missed it I simply don't understand. Pitiful. And no excuse whatsoever.

What about players then? Basketballers, netballers, cricketers.

stinger · Post: # 1087382Post **stinger** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:07pm

the one just before it was just as bad...also resulted in a goal to the filth.....bj was pinged for throwing the ball...he didn't...the maggot guessed because bj had the tops of his arms pinned..

...disgraceful....

plugger66 · Post: # 1087384Post **plugger66** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:09pm

stinger wrote:the one just before it was just as bad...also resulted in a goal to the filth.....bj was pinged for throwing the ball...he didn't...the maggot guessed because bj ad the tops of this arms pinned..

...disgraceful....

Stop posting. It is just wasting space and everyone ignores you.

BigMart · Post: # 1087385Post **BigMart** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:11pm

Really did give them momentum and confidence going into the second half....and did the reverse for us....

The goal straight after ht took coll to 3 goals up, not two as it should have been.....heads dropped, and game was over

meher baba · Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:13pm

plugger66 wrote:
meher baba wrote:The argument that umpires make thousands of decisions per game and only get a few wrong is pitifully weak and should never be put forward.

Lots of professionals - doctors, judges, airline pilots, etc - are quite reasonably expected to make no mistakes whatsoever

I don't have a particularly wonderful TV set and the camera was zoomed out at the time and it was completely obvious that Polo had marked the ball. How on earth the three umps could have missed it I simply don't understand. Pitiful. And no excuse whatsoever.
What about players then? Basketballers, netballers, cricketers.

Playing sport is about taking calculated risks to beat your opponent, so there will always be errors. Players haven't failed when they make an error.

Adjudicating sport is about getting it right. Every time you make an error, you fail.

Polo's mark was not a borderline call. It was a clear mark. The umps' failure to award it was as basic an error as would be giving a goal to someone who threw the ball between the posts. An umpire who cannot judge an obvious mark is no use as an umpire. If he was unsighted, he could have sought help from one of the others.

Eastern · Post: # 1087403Post **Eastern** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:31pm

Who was the umpire who stuffed up? And, have we drawn him this week? !!

plugger66 · Post: # 1087405Post **plugger66** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:32pm

meher baba wrote:
plugger66 wrote:
meher baba wrote:The argument that umpires make thousands of decisions per game and only get a few wrong is pitifully weak and should never be put forward.

Lots of professionals - doctors, judges, airline pilots, etc - are quite reasonably expected to make no mistakes whatsoever

I don't have a particularly wonderful TV set and the camera was zoomed out at the time and it was completely obvious that Polo had marked the ball. How on earth the three umps could have missed it I simply don't understand. Pitiful. And no excuse whatsoever.
What about players then? Basketballers, netballers, cricketers.
Playing sport is about taking calculated risks to beat your opponent, so there will always be errors. Players haven't failed when they make an error.

Adjudicating sport is about getting it right. Every time you make an error, you fail.

Polo's mark was not a borderline call. It was a clear mark. The umps' failure to award it was as basic an error as would be giving a goal to someone who threw the ball between the posts. An umpire who cannot judge an obvious mark is no use as an umpire. If he was unsighted, he could have sought help from one of the others.

Polo's mark was an obvious error but taking a mark 20 metres out dead in front and missing is the same. As for seeking help for a mark, I fail to understand how that would work. Does he blow his whistle 30 seconds after the event? With the packs around the ball these days I am amazed they can make correct decisions. This isnt an excuse for the Polo error but neither is pressure an excuse for missing 20 metres dead in front.

Life Long Saint · Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:50pm

plugger66 wrote:Stop posting. It is just wasting space and everyone ignores you.

If this is you ignoring a poster then you suck at it.

plugger66 · Post: # 1087412Post **plugger66** » Wed 08 Jun 2011 8:54pm

Life Long Saint wrote:
plugger66 wrote:Stop posting. It is just wasting space and everyone ignores you.
If this is you ignoring a poster then you suck at it.

Except me.

meher baba · Wed 08 Jun 2011 9:11pm

Plugger66. You ask me how the umpire who is unsighted would seek help from another umpire? The same way they do now, many times a game. You often see them glancing at each other seeking guidance.

It seemed to me at the time that the ump had a clear view of Polo's mark and wasn't a good enough judge to rule correctly. To be fair to Gieshen, he's pretty good at weeding out the umps who consistently fail to get that sort of call right. So I expect this bloke is on notice.

It was worse than someone missing from right in front: which happens at least once in most AFL games. It was more akin to a defender passing a ball backwards straight into the arms of the opposing full forward, which is a relatively rare event and one which, if the defender did it regularly, would see their AFL career come to an untimely end.

Umps are confronted with lots of judgement calls where there is no clear right or wrong, and are often unfairly criticised for those: eg, I don't agree with Stinger's interpretation of BJ's "throw". I thought it looked very borderline and can quite understand the ump awarding a free against him.

But blind Freddy could have seen that Polo clearly got his hands to the ball
first and then it was punched out. Yes, it happened quickly, but not that quickly. I'm sorry, but there is no excuse, no forgiveness, no leeway whatsoever. The ump who made the call should hang his head in shame.