GT: St Kilda players feeling sorry for themselves
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- Saintsational Legend
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GT: St Kilda players feeling sorry for themselves
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/v ... 6037538838
ST KILDA players feel sorry for themselves and are locked in a victim mentality.
Former coach Grant Thomas says the side's humiliating 52-point loss against Essendon on Sunday shows the club needs an emotional overhaul and players are clearly haunted by the premiership losses as well as off-field controversies.
"I think they're feeling very, very sorry for themselves," Thomas said yesterday.
With just two points from three matches and the bye this weekend, Thomas said St Kilda's form slump was all mental and must be acknowledged and redressed.
"It's got nothing to do with personnel, it's got nothing to do with strategy or tactics or game plans, it's got nothing at all to do with skill and ability, it is completely mental," he said.
etc
ST KILDA players feel sorry for themselves and are locked in a victim mentality.
Former coach Grant Thomas says the side's humiliating 52-point loss against Essendon on Sunday shows the club needs an emotional overhaul and players are clearly haunted by the premiership losses as well as off-field controversies.
"I think they're feeling very, very sorry for themselves," Thomas said yesterday.
With just two points from three matches and the bye this weekend, Thomas said St Kilda's form slump was all mental and must be acknowledged and redressed.
"It's got nothing to do with personnel, it's got nothing to do with strategy or tactics or game plans, it's got nothing at all to do with skill and ability, it is completely mental," he said.
etc
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- Johnny Member
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"Morale and spirit are at their highest when people believe that something is worthwhile achieving and they have the ability to achieve it."
This is the part that is most important.
Goddard's deflated response after the Draw in GF1 makes me think that the second part of the quote above is the issue.
He said immediately after the game when interviewed, something along the lines of "we gave it absolutely everything we had, and once again it just wasn't good enough".
It was spoken with a sense of resignation. Resignation that he no longer believed they had what it took to actually win the flag.
After 2 GF losses, I can understand the feeling of 'why bother? we're just going to come up short again anyway'.
I strongly doubt they no longer believe the reward is worthwhile. I reckon they are (perhaps subconsciously) finding it hard to put in what's required as they've done that for 4 years and still came up short.
The question is, can someone or something change that mindset?
Personally, I believe altering things on-field is required. A change is as good as a holiday, and moving Roo to an on-ball or a '3rd man up' defender role for a month or so may be the type of on-field change that's required to refresh the team.
That, in addition to some soul searching may just turn things around.
This is the part that is most important.
Goddard's deflated response after the Draw in GF1 makes me think that the second part of the quote above is the issue.
He said immediately after the game when interviewed, something along the lines of "we gave it absolutely everything we had, and once again it just wasn't good enough".
It was spoken with a sense of resignation. Resignation that he no longer believed they had what it took to actually win the flag.
After 2 GF losses, I can understand the feeling of 'why bother? we're just going to come up short again anyway'.
I strongly doubt they no longer believe the reward is worthwhile. I reckon they are (perhaps subconsciously) finding it hard to put in what's required as they've done that for 4 years and still came up short.
The question is, can someone or something change that mindset?
Personally, I believe altering things on-field is required. A change is as good as a holiday, and moving Roo to an on-ball or a '3rd man up' defender role for a month or so may be the type of on-field change that's required to refresh the team.
That, in addition to some soul searching may just turn things around.
- SaintPav
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I remember it differently and I can't remember him saying it like that...You're taking what he said out of context.Johnny Member wrote:"Morale and spirit are at their highest when people believe that something is worthwhile achieving and they have the ability to achieve it."
This is the part that is most important.
Goddard's deflated response after the Draw in GF1 makes me think that the second part of the quote above is the issue.
He said immediately after the game when interviewed, something along the lines of "we gave it absolutely everything we had, and once again it just wasn't good enough".
It was spoken with a sense of resignation. Resignation that he no longer believed they had what it took to actually win the flag.
After 2 GF losses, I can understand the feeling of 'why bother? we're just going to come up short again anyway'.
I strongly doubt they no longer believe the reward is worthwhile. I reckon they are (perhaps subconsciously) finding it hard to put in what's required as they've done that for 4 years and still came up short.
The question is, can someone or something change that mindset?
Personally, I believe altering things on-field is required. A change is as good as a holiday, and moving Roo to an on-ball or a '3rd man up' defender role for a month or so may be the type of on-field change that's required to refresh the team.
That, in addition to some soul searching may just turn things around.
Don't put quotation marks around what you think someone said then attribute it to that person.
GT also when on to say that we would make the eight....fool.
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
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Hey I thought that we should have kept going with GT, but he wasn't tactics personified was he. If you had something other than kick it to your forwards and hope they score, you may have more credibility. The biggest failing of the Saints this year has been when we expose our backline by changing up our attack. I wouldn't be surprised if Lyon is showing the team the importance of playing as a unit by exposing them to the consequence of not playing team defence. We need to find a way to get some forward pressure back, I hope Mini has got some motivation to look more damaging and plays like he did in 09 because at the moment, our forwards are as flat as a tack- 1 forward 50 tackle against Essendon. Or bring in Big Willy Johnson!
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I reckon .. it's not just mental and it has a lot to do with personnel - our forwards.
The backline has been carrying the side for too long - the forwards (apart from not kicking enough goals) don't put enough forward pressure in our forward line - when the ball hits the deck eight times out of ten it comes out again under little pressure and sets up another easy build up for the opposition.
That's the most disappointing part.
The result is
- our backline has to deal with another entry that could and should have otherwise been prevented.
So our jaded backline just can't hold sides to 8 goals anymore to make up for the incompetence of our forwards. They don't just have the opposition forwards to worry about - they have to deal with our forwards too, and it's taking its toll !
The backline has been carrying the side for too long - the forwards (apart from not kicking enough goals) don't put enough forward pressure in our forward line - when the ball hits the deck eight times out of ten it comes out again under little pressure and sets up another easy build up for the opposition.
That's the most disappointing part.
The result is
- our backline has to deal with another entry that could and should have otherwise been prevented.
So our jaded backline just can't hold sides to 8 goals anymore to make up for the incompetence of our forwards. They don't just have the opposition forwards to worry about - they have to deal with our forwards too, and it's taking its toll !
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- markp
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Re: GT: St Kilda players feeling sorry for themselves
Our belief cloud has evaporated?"It's got nothing to do with personnel, it's got nothing to do with strategy or tactics or game plans, it's got nothing at all to do with skill and ability, it is completely mental"
What bollocks.
- Johnny Member
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I agree to a point.
We've certainly dropped off mentally. Some would say that cracks are appearing.
Body language, discipline on-field and off, and on-field effort clearly shows we're not 100% mentally switched on.
Whether that is solely the reason for us being winless and so insipid last week, I'm not sure. But I firmly believe it's a big part of it.
We've certainly dropped off mentally. Some would say that cracks are appearing.
Body language, discipline on-field and off, and on-field effort clearly shows we're not 100% mentally switched on.
Whether that is solely the reason for us being winless and so insipid last week, I'm not sure. But I firmly believe it's a big part of it.
Well, silly as it sounds, at least it is what it is.
Would you rather we'd been like say the Dogs, and a couple of flat track bully performances and we'd have been wallpapering over the cracks?
Someone should show the boys the footy OTC of when in 2009, they first discsussed this amazing 'forward pressure' that the Saints had introduced to the game. Showed footage of the boys playing against the Cats and the Dogs, and I'd even almost forgotten how switched on our guys were back then.
Would you rather we'd been like say the Dogs, and a couple of flat track bully performances and we'd have been wallpapering over the cracks?
Someone should show the boys the footy OTC of when in 2009, they first discsussed this amazing 'forward pressure' that the Saints had introduced to the game. Showed footage of the boys playing against the Cats and the Dogs, and I'd even almost forgotten how switched on our guys were back then.
Dont know how you could not think it is a part of it.Johnny Member wrote:I agree to a point.
We've certainly dropped off mentally. Some would say that cracks are appearing.
Body language, discipline on-field and off, and on-field effort clearly shows we're not 100% mentally switched on.
Whether that is solely the reason for us being winless and so insipid last week, I'm not sure. But I firmly believe it's a big part of it.
Thomas is paid to comment, and I think his comments are obvious for all to see.
They aren't really earth shattering in their controversy.
Lance or James??
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
- markp
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Disagree.joffaboy wrote:I think his comments are obvious for all to see.
Of course it's likely going to be part of the problem.
He's saying it's the entire problem, full stop. Nothing else is contributing.
I say it's probably a mix of all things he lists as having 'nothing' to do with it, plus the mental side.
- Johnny Member
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I was responding to Markp's post.joffaboy wrote:Dont know how you could not think it is a part of it.Johnny Member wrote:I agree to a point.
We've certainly dropped off mentally. Some would say that cracks are appearing.
Body language, discipline on-field and off, and on-field effort clearly shows we're not 100% mentally switched on.
Whether that is solely the reason for us being winless and so insipid last week, I'm not sure. But I firmly believe it's a big part of it.
Thomas is paid to comment, and I think his comments are obvious for all to see.
They aren't really earth shattering in their controversy.
I was agreeing with your post.Johnny Member wrote:I was responding to Markp's post.joffaboy wrote:Dont know how you could not think it is a part of it.Johnny Member wrote:I agree to a point.
We've certainly dropped off mentally. Some would say that cracks are appearing.
Body language, discipline on-field and off, and on-field effort clearly shows we're not 100% mentally switched on.
Whether that is solely the reason for us being winless and so insipid last week, I'm not sure. But I firmly believe it's a big part of it.
Thomas is paid to comment, and I think his comments are obvious for all to see.
They aren't really earth shattering in their controversy.
Lance or James??
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
- Johnny Member
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Ok then.joffaboy wrote:I was agreeing with your post.Johnny Member wrote:I was responding to Markp's post.joffaboy wrote:Dont know how you could not think it is a part of it.Johnny Member wrote:I agree to a point.
We've certainly dropped off mentally. Some would say that cracks are appearing.
Body language, discipline on-field and off, and on-field effort clearly shows we're not 100% mentally switched on.
Whether that is solely the reason for us being winless and so insipid last week, I'm not sure. But I firmly believe it's a big part of it.
Thomas is paid to comment, and I think his comments are obvious for all to see.
They aren't really earth shattering in their controversy.
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Players just need a treatment of "Harden the f*** Up"
Sometimes things don't work out through no fault of your own, a bad bounce, a toe poke, an umpire swallowing his whistle, sometimes s*** just doesn't go your way, doesn't mean you weren't/aren't good enough.
Premierships are difficult to win and a lot of the time luck can come into it.
What matters is putting yourself in the position to take advantage of that luck if it comes your way.
Sometimes things don't work out through no fault of your own, a bad bounce, a toe poke, an umpire swallowing his whistle, sometimes s*** just doesn't go your way, doesn't mean you weren't/aren't good enough.
Premierships are difficult to win and a lot of the time luck can come into it.
What matters is putting yourself in the position to take advantage of that luck if it comes your way.
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Exactly.Dr Spaceman wrote:Keeping players switched on after successive Grand Final losses is something GT never had to deal with himself
Heard a story the other day about a bloke who lunched with GT at Vlados, shared a few sherbets with him, eventually, when the booze kicked in, they got talking about THAT season and THAT prelim v Port Adelaide. Question was asked of GT 'You had a great side that year, could have won it given how Brisbane were travelling, but you just could implement a Plan B to stop the rot when Port charged. What was the thinking?"
Thomas said: "Listen, mate. Anyone who reckons anyone's got a Plan B is a f***** idiot. There is no Plan B's. Never was.'
I vote for true.
"The inches we need are everywhere around us. They're in every break in the game. Every minute, every second. On this team we fight for that inch. On this team we tear ourselves and everyone around us to pieces for that inch. We claw with our fingernails for that inch. Because we know when we add up all those inches that's gonna make the f***in' difference between winning and losing! Between living and dying!'
- Johnny Member
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Paul Roos and Leigh Matthews believe the same thing. As does Mark Thompson.Thinline wrote:Exactly.Dr Spaceman wrote:Keeping players switched on after successive Grand Final losses is something GT never had to deal with himself
Heard a story the other day about a bloke who lunched with GT at Vlados, shared a few sherbets with him, eventually, when the booze kicked in, they got talking about THAT season and THAT prelim v Port Adelaide. Question was asked of GT 'You had a great side that year, could have won it given how Brisbane were travelling, but you just could implement a Plan B to stop the rot when Port charged. What was the thinking?"
Thomas said: "Listen, mate. Anyone who reckons anyone's got a Plan B is a f***** idiot. There is no Plan B's. Never was.'
I vote for true.