BJ in right spot - now leave him there!

[doggerel]

We all know he is a great player whether he plays back, mid or forward. The back, mid and forwards coaches all want him and he has been getting shared around like a bong at a campfire.

The majority of us would probably say his optimal position for the team in a perfect world is across half-back setting up the play. Perfect world includes Riewoldt being fully fit of course.

But while he will be missed there and in the mid-field, his absence can be covered pretty satisfactorily.

Up forward it is a different matter. He is the only one to have shown he is really up to the task of filling some of the Riewoldt void. Given a full game in that position I reckon he can fill it very well.

He now has to play permanent forward in Rielwoldt's absence I think. Not with a run through the mid-field. Not with time down back being flogged to exhaustion. I want him peppy in the forward line, leading, demanding the ball, giving the team real confidence about going forward.

I hope this is what Ross meant went he promised not to continually shuffle backline through our forward line searching for a target. I really hope that BJ lines up in the named position and I don't find that CHF is filled by McEvoy and Gardiner all night.

[bigcarl]

you saved me from saying it again

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

+1. Beautifully put. Please forward it on to Ross & co.
Exactly what I'm hoping. They've been beating around the bush trying out pretty much any and everyone else and now they need to get serious.
He's the only one that's looked like doing a good job up there and there are definitely plenty that can do a good enough job down back and in the middle.
Unless we prefer losing and kicking 5 or 6 goals a game.

[rexy]

Really hope that the defence midfield and forward line all stand up and we have the luxury of using BJ as icing in many different positions on the ground. I know one thing, if we can keep him forward all night then we will have won comfortably, there is no way that RL will keep BJ forward if we are not getting the ball in often and effectively, IMO.

Dont get obsessed with play BJ forward thing people, more worrying things to fix b4 forward structure IMO.

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

That's all well and good, but there's not much point in getting it in there "often and effectively" if there's no-one up there that's good enough to get on the end of it and convert. Case in point, the 2009 Grand Final. It was an issue then and it's even more so now.
I'd put BJ forward and build the rest of the team around him, for the time-being. It's not about being "obsessed" with the idea, it's just that to us it's bleading obvious and has been for a long time. They keep avoiding doing it and how is that going?

[bigcarl]

there is no way that RL will keep BJ forward if we are not getting the ball in often and effectively, IMO.

getting it in to whom?

Dont get obsessed with play BJ forward thing people, more worrying things to fix b4 forward structure IMO.

the stats are pretty damning. the least efficient forward line in the competition since riewoldt went down. 15th for shots at goals per inside 50. 16th for goals per inside 50.

it is nick riewoldt we are trying to replace.

but i agree we have other problems, such as winning the clearances (i presume armitage has been brought in to help out) and regaining the tackling pressure we had last year.

[saintsRrising]

With all of Gram, Ray and Armo back to play midfield, BJ is freed up to mainly play asa forward again.

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

I sincerely hope so. Seriously. I really believe he would dominate up forward, if left to settle in there. That is a good thing, everyone, not something to be afraid of.
I really believe this would be the thing to take us from near a flag to a flag, if Roo comes back well, later in the year. I don't see us winning it, otherwise.
This is our "Joker". We need to play it. Not sit on it forever.

[Finna]

That's all well and good, but there's not much point in getting it in there "often and effectively" if there's no-one up there that's good enough to get on the end of it and convert. Case in point, the 2009 Grand Final. It was an issue then and it's even more so now.
I'd put BJ forward and build the rest of the team around him, for the time-being. It's not about being "obsessed" with the idea, it's just that to us it's bleading obvious and has been for a long time. They keep avoiding doing it and how is that going?

Great Post. Agree 100%

[rexy]

Its not going that badly, we are 29-5 since the start of 09, Goddard in that time has gone from being a very good footballer to an out and out star of the competition, it is his ability to win contested ball, rove off stoppages, run and carry, create and deliver that have made him into this.

Like I said, if we can keep BJ forward whilst Roo is out then that is great, it will mean that the rest of our midfield is standing up and covering his loss so he can do the same for Roo. If they cant though then we will have no option to get Goddard back around the ball, that is bleeding obvious to me.

A winning midfield can make C Mooney, N Ablett, T Hawkins, T Lonergan and even a 28 year old rookie from the VFL look like gun forwards for periods, even Tony Locket couldnt make poor midfields good enough to win lots of games.

I dont think many people doubt that BJ is our best option to add the class we have lost back to our forward line, but is not as easy as just put him there and leave him, it would be in neglect of RLs duties as coach of the club to leave BJ to get cold in the forward line if we were getting smashed in the centre square and hemmed in to our backline.

[bigcarl]

I dont think many people doubt that BJ is our best option to add the class we have lost back to our forward line, but is not as easy as just put him there and leave him, it would be in neglect of RLs duties as coach of the club to leave BJ to get cold in the forward line if we were getting smashed in the centre square and hemmed in to our backline.

riewoldt is the most important player in the team and to the structure. it is a massive gap to fill and without a potent forward i don't like our chances.

[Finna]

Its not going that badly, we are 29-5 since the start of 09, Goddard in that time has gone from being a very good footballer to an out and out star of the competition, it is his ability to win contested ball, rove off stoppages, run and carry, create and deliver that have made him into this.

Like I said, if we can keep BJ forward whilst Roo is out then that is great, it will mean that the rest of our midfield is standing up and covering his loss so he can do the same for Roo. If they cant though then we will have no option to get Goddard back around the ball, that is bleeding obvious to me.

A winning midfield can make C Mooney, N Ablett, T Hawkins, T Lonergan and even a 28 year old rookie from the VFL look like gun forwards for periods, even Tony Locket couldnt make poor midfields good enough to win lots of games.

I dont think many people doubt that BJ is our best option to add the class we have lost back to our forward line, but is not as easy as just put him there and leave him, it would be in neglect of RLs duties as coach of the club to leave BJ to get cold in the forward line if we were getting smashed in the centre square and hemmed in to our backline.

29-5 Since start of 2009 but also 9-5 since round 20 last year.

I think we need something different.

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

Its not going that badly, we are 29-5 since the start of 09, Goddard in that time has gone from being a very good footballer to an out and out star of the competition, it is his ability to win contested ball, rove off stoppages, run and carry, create and deliver that have made him into this.

Like I said, if we can keep BJ forward whilst Roo is out then that is great, it will mean that the rest of our midfield is standing up and covering his loss so he can do the same for Roo. If they cant though then we will have no option to get Goddard back around the ball, that is bleeding obvious to me.

A winning midfield can make C Mooney, N Ablett, T Hawkins, T Lonergan and even a 28 year old rookie from the VFL look like gun forwards for periods, even Tony Locket couldnt make poor midfields good enough to win lots of games.

I dont think many people doubt that BJ is our best option to add the class we have lost back to our forward line, but is not as easy as just put him there and leave him, it would be in neglect of RLs duties as coach of the club to leave BJ to get cold in the forward line if we were getting smashed in the centre square and hemmed in to our backline.

It is that easy. Just do it and commit to it. In my experience, if you commit to an idea and don't give up, the things you need will fall into place. It's when you don't fully commit and quit, when the going gets tough (which they invariably, if not always do), that things don't work out. Things just work when you genuinely commit to them. Try it, if you doubt it. It's an awesome feeling, especially when everyone doubts you can do whatever it is.
One problem I see is that when our midfield is down (when BJ isn't in there) they probably just expect that he'll be brought in there to "save" them. Maybe it's time to say "you're on your own" to those guys. Do it yourselves. I bet you they would learn to step up, instead of just waiting for BJ to do it for them.
Otherwise, I really don't see us competing with Geelong this year, unless they suddenly drop off unexpectedly. I think they're better overall and more potent up forward this year, while we're clearly no better. Collingwood also look much improved again.
We need a significant change to to step up to where they're at and BJ forward is the best, most obvious, straightforward answer I see.
And we may be going 29-5 since the start of last year, but what happened last year doesn't necessarily mean much. Just ask Adelaide. It's how we're going now, and how we go from now on that's most important to me.

[plugger66]

Please play BJ mainly on the ball otherwise with our lack on star onballers we will struggle to get good possesion up forward.

[SainterK]

I am so comfortable with him up there, he has the ability and more importantly the spark we need right now.

Everything's going to be OK

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

I like it!

[rexy]

Its not going that badly, we are 29-5 since the start of 09, Goddard in that time has gone from being a very good footballer to an out and out star of the competition, it is his ability to win contested ball, rove off stoppages, run and carry, create and deliver that have made him into this.

Like I said, if we can keep BJ forward whilst Roo is out then that is great, it will mean that the rest of our midfield is standing up and covering his loss so he can do the same for Roo. If they cant though then we will have no option to get Goddard back around the ball, that is bleeding obvious to me.

A winning midfield can make C Mooney, N Ablett, T Hawkins, T Lonergan and even a 28 year old rookie from the VFL look like gun forwards for periods, even Tony Locket couldnt make poor midfields good enough to win lots of games.

I dont think many people doubt that BJ is our best option to add the class we have lost back to our forward line, but is not as easy as just put him there and leave him, it would be in neglect of RLs duties as coach of the club to leave BJ to get cold in the forward line if we were getting smashed in the centre square and hemmed in to our backline.

It is that easy. Just do it and commit to it. In my experience, if you commit to an idea and don't give up, the things you need will fall into place. Things just work when you genuinely commit to them. Try it, if you doubt it. It's an awesome feeling, especially when everyone doubts you can do it.
One problem I see is that when our midfield is down (when BJ isn't in there) they probably just expect that he'll be brought in there to "save" them. Maybe it's time to say "you're on your own" to those guys. Do it yourselves. I bet you they would learn to step up, instead of just having BJ do it for them.
Otherwise, I really don't see us competing with Geelong this year, unless they suddenly drop off unexpectedly. I think they're better overall and more potent up forward this year, while we're clearly no better. We need a significant change to to step up to where they're at and BJ forward is the answer I see.

I would have thought, when it came to AFL coaching, that RL had more experience than you. I do not know who you are though and if you are an ex AFL coach with more experience and a better win loss ratio than RL, I will take that back.

Once again I am not saying BJ is not a good option forward! James Hird was a good forward player but did not play exclusively there and played in a couple of premierships, same thing, best players need to be in the most important spots for the situation, especially those with the versatility of BJ.

[AnythingsPossibleSaints]

[quote="rexy"][/quote]
I'm talking about life experience, and I have plenty of that and some that I very much doubt Ross has had. Just as he would have had some that I haven't had. And life experiences can be applied to all situations. You certainly don't need to have coached in the AFL, or have done so previously, to be right about something that they're not getting right. And it certainly doesn't mean that you'd do a better job overall than they would. So you can chill out.
But as you said yourself, "I do not know who you are", so what idea do you have of the lessons I've learned, or what I'm capable of, or what anyone else is capable of?

[bobmurray]

I didn't realise how ordinary the forward line is without Reiwoldt....

that also tells me the rest of the forwards are basically GOP's.....i would point out that Milne is excluded from GOP status.....

The recruiters have a huge task in front of them this year...if we don't improve our depth soon then they should be labelled as GOR's...

Good Ordinary Recruiters....

[saintsRrising]

Please play BJ mainly on the ball otherwise with our lack on star onballers we will struggle to get good possesion up forward.

Personally I would play him as a CHF and rotating mid.

Also as a mobile CHF he will be pushing up in the midfield anyway.

[plugger66]

Please play BJ mainly on the ball otherwise with our lack on star onballers we will struggle to get good possesion up forward.

Personally I would play him as a CHF and rotating mid.

Also as a mobile CHF he will be pushing up in the midfield anyway.

Thats fine but dont anchor him at FF. He isnt a natural there and even worse we dont have a natural replacement in the middle.

[saintsRrising]

Please play BJ mainly on the ball otherwise with our lack on star onballers we will struggle to get good possesion up forward.

Personally I would play him as a CHF and rotating mid.

Also as a mobile CHF he will be pushing up in the midfield anyway.

Thats fine but dont anchor him at FF. He isnt a natural there and even worse we dont have a natural replacement in the middle.

Fully agree.

He needs to be were he can set up play as well as kick goals.

Kosi for FF.

[Calais]

We all would love seeing BJ play forward, there's no doubt about it. But I just see Ross putting him back into the middle soon after were losing the clearances.

[rexy]

I'm talking about life experience, and I have plenty of that and some that I very much doubt Ross has had. Just as he would have had some that I haven't had. And life experiences can be applied to all situations. You certainly don't need to have coached in the AFL, or have done so previously, to be right about something that they're not getting right. And it certainly doesn't mean that you'd do a better job overall than they would. So you can chill out.
But as you said yourself, "I do not know who you are", so what idea do you have of the lessons I've learned, or what I'm capable of, or what anyone else is capable of?

Im chilled brother, cool as ice.

Keep it on track, its a good debate, my point...... Ross Lyon is a good coach with a good record, when it comes to making good decisions about all things football related then all we can do is put our faith in him, sometimes we will disagree and we have the right to do so, just like others have the right to disagree with you.

Going around and around is not going to help us, not once have you aknowledged that I agree with every one of your points re why Goddard is a good forward player and that ideally we would play him there more often than not whilst Roo is out, can you not recognise though that if our mid field does not stand up without him, then he must go back in to the guts. Doesnt matter how much faith we put into the rest of our guys, he is the most talented guy on our list currently playing, Yes, more so than Lenny, Dal or anyone else we could throw up.

[degruch]

Please play BJ mainly on the ball otherwise with our lack on star onballers we will struggle to get good possesion up forward.

Personally I would play him as a CHF and rotating mid.

Also as a mobile CHF he will be pushing up in the midfield anyway.

Thats fine but dont anchor him at FF. He isnt a natural there and even worse we dont have a natural replacement in the middle.

100% bang on p66. Sending BJ to FF for the entire match will cost us more than it will gain us...RL knows that, hence the mix 'n' match recently. However, he also knows that mix 'n' match is costly for stability, hence, this week I feel he is trying to establish a new forward line.